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Author Topic: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2  (Read 3179 times)

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fallacy

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Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« on: March 23, 2014, 02:41:40 pm »
Anyone else picking this up, just bought mine. Full range of sitting head motion now. It was a good idea using a camera for that, just think only a year ago they had no idea on how they could accomplish it.







Quote
Announcing the Oculus Rift Development Kit 2 (DK2)

Since the launch of the Oculus Kickstarter, we’ve been focused on building the best virtual reality platform. The original development kit was a strong starting point that showed the world a glimpse of presence, but its shortcomings prevented it from delivering great VR.

Almost exactly one year after shipping the original dev kit, we’re pleased to announce DK2, the second development kit for the Oculus Rift!

Oculus Rift Development Kit 2
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The second development kit features many of the key technical breakthroughs and core elements of the consumer Rift including a low-persistence, high-definition display and precise, low-latency positional head tracking.

DK2 isn’t identical to the consumer Rift, but the fundamental building blocks for great VR are there. All the content developed using DK2 will work with the consumer Rift. And while the overall experience still needs to improve before it’s consumer-ready, we’re getting closer everyday -- DK2 is not the Holodeck yet, but it’s a major step in the right direction.
 



Like the Crystal Cove prototype, DK2 uses a low persistence OLED display to eliminate motion blur and judder, two of the biggest contributors to simulator sickness. Low persistence also makes the scene appear more visually stable, increasing the potential for presence. The high-definition 960x1080 per-eye display reduces the screen-door effect and improves clarity, color, and contrast.

DK2 also integrates precise, low-latency positional head tracking using an external camera that allows you to move with 6-degrees-of-freedom and opens up all sorts of new gameplay opportunities like peering around corners, leaning in to get a closer look at objects in the world, and kicking back on a virtual beach.
 


Precise positional tracking is another key requirement for comfortable virtual reality; without it, an enormous amount of your real world movement is lost. We’re looking forward to seeing the new experiences the community creates now that positional head tracking is a core element of the platform.

We’ve also included updated orientation tracking, a built-in latency tester, an on-headset USB accessory port, new optics, elimination of the infamous control box, a redesigned SDK and further optimized Unity and Unreal Engine 4 integrations.
 


All in, DK2 delivers a massive leap forward in terms of the quality of the VR experiences you’re able to create and enjoy. The consumer Rift will be another major step beyond that, but in the meantime DK2 brings the world closer to great consumer virtual reality than ever before.

Even with all these changes, we’ve tried to keep the price as low as possible. DK2 will be $350 at launch and you can pre-order the hardware, reserving your spot in the queue, starting today at www.oculusvr.com/order. We expect to begin shipping the first batch of DK2s in July, and we’ll ramp up production based on interest.
 
GDC 2014

We’re debuting the second development kit this week at the Game Developers Conference in San Francisco with EVE: Valkyrie by CCP, UE4 Elemental Defense by Epic, and a new demo, UE4 Couch Knight!
 


Couch Knight was built by the team at Epic Games to showcase the positional tracking and basic avatars in a setting with shared presence. The tech demo juxtaposes a realistic scene with two cartoon knights, controlled by the players, who burst to life and battle throughout the room on couches, shelves and even the players’ avatars.

The players’ head movements and position are actually mapped to the avatars using UE4’s inverse kinematic system, which makes for a taste of a social experience.

A huge thank you to the team at Epic for bringing Couch Knights to life! If you’re at the show this week, be sure to swing by the booth and check it out.
 
What’s Next?

We’re deep into development on the consumer Rift. We have a lot more planned, including improvements to comfort, resolution, tracking, software, ergonomics, optics, industrial design, and the overall experience.
 


Virtual reality is going to continue to evolve rapidly in the coming years. There’s no cutting corners or ‘good enough’ when it comes to VR; the consumer Rift needs to be perfect and we’re dedicated to getting it right. We’re moving as fast as possible and promise it’ll be worth the wait.

The passion of the VR community is what has made all this possible, from the Kickstarter campaign to the hundreds of games and experiences we've seen so far. And this is still just the beginning.

We truly believe virtual reality will change the world -- Thanks for being part of the journey with us.

-- The Oculus Team

Flip_Willie

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2014, 03:42:24 pm »
I pre-ordered one on Wednesday. I'm really hoping to try some development for it. If I'm lucky, the buy-in price will motivate me. ;D

Felsir

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2014, 06:29:20 am »
I have access to the Oculus Rift Devkit 1 (we have it at, the company I work for). We did a couple of proof of concept demos for clients. The feel for scale is something that a regular screen (or 3D projection) cannot compete against.

I'm waiting for the consumer version while also keeping an eye on the PS4 VR project. The Devkit is very good at showing what VR can be. Unless you are a developer with plans to create VR stuff (Unity support for the device is great and easy to implement) I would recommend to wait for the consumer version.


fallacy

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2014, 01:22:29 pm »
Ya I passed on the Devkit 1 to wait for the consumer, but if it is going to take another year before the consumer is shipped than it is totally worth it. Especially now that there is more content to play around with.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2014, 06:34:25 pm »
Was really hoping it was an Onion article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/26/technology/facebook-to-buy-oculus-vr-maker-of-virtual-reality-headset.html?_r=0


My hope for Oculus just dropped quite a bit. I can't see how this could ever be good...

Howard_Casto

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2014, 06:44:55 pm »
Yeah I hate to keep telling you guys I told you so, but Kickstarter is NOT geared towards starting a business.  It's a widget funder.... pay x dollars, get one widget.  If the OR was a fork or knife or something that would be fine... it works by itself, but much like the Ouya, the OR will need a strong software support system... which thus far it doesn't have. 

If the facebook acquisition didn't kill it, the announcement that Sony has their own 3D system on the way certainly has.  Think about it... Sony is pretty ruthless when it comes to killing potential competition... I've got to think that any ps4 title with support for their 3d goggles will have to sign an exclusivity agreement keeping the software away from the OR.  I would also like to think that considering it's a display device and Sony kind of makes display devices (tvs, and computer monitors), it would be trivial for them to make PC drivers for the thing. 

I would wait because at this point there is doubt if the consumer version will ever get released... forget about the time tables. 

fallacy

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2014, 09:48:12 am »
Partnership pretty much insures the Oculus platform is coming. Then again I was sure it was coming the week they launched it on kick starter and had some of the top game designers of the industry backing it.

lilshawn

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2014, 10:55:57 am »
i'm guessing Fallacy does not know about the facebook fiasco yet??

devs are furious, and consumers are flipping their...sh-tuff.

it's the xbox one all over again...mark my words.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2014, 11:03:17 am »
Like you said, Howard, replace Occulus Rift with Ouya... we've heard this song before.  :cheers:
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

spoot

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2014, 11:04:05 am »
I expect John Carmack isn't pleased either.

lilshawn

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2014, 11:20:09 am »
i'm sure he is heartbroken.


spoot

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2014, 12:17:25 pm »
He doesn't need the money.

And Notch already said he's dropping support which I find amusing.

lilshawn

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2014, 12:28:35 pm »
facebook is a disgusting company with it's own idea of how things should be run. sure, the "sheeple" piss and moan about their "policy changes" but in the end cave in and continue to use it. I ditched facebook when I reviewed their access requirements for their android app update... "allow the app to read SMS messages stored on your phone or SIM card regardless of content or confidentiality".

no. thank. you. i can understand accessing your storage for uploading photos...i can understand access to your contacts to keep them updated....I can even understand accessing your calendar and datebook to keep you informed of friends birthdays... but take copies of my text messages? all they are is a data collection company.

"1080p? No, xbox facebook users don't need 1080p. we will just use upscaled 720p, that's good enough, and it's cheaper too."

spoot

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2014, 01:05:44 pm »
He doesn't need the money.  (And does he get a cut?  Does he have ownership/partnership/stocks?)

And Notch already said he's dropping support which I find amusing.

Howard_Casto

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2014, 02:47:22 pm »
Well I hate to beat the dead horse that is the OR, but all this industry support is non-exist atm. 

Yes many big name developers came out and said they liked it.  They didn't, however, confirm that they were making any games for it.  They were literally the exact same people that came out and said they liked the last VR device in the 486 days.  When that device finally came out it was still grossly over-priced and only had support for half a dozen games.  You'll excuse me if I forget the name of the thing, but this was a while back. 

Long story short a few key guys isn't enough.  When you are introducing a brand new peripheral you need at least 2 dozen AAA games in the works for the device lined up.  Mostly because half of them are going to bail half-way through.  Even if it's successful that might be all the games you ever get produced for it because optional gaming accessories do not do well.  I mean even accessories by big, mainstream companies.  The zapper only had 5-10 games, even fewer for the super scope.  The multi-taps might have gotten 4 games a generation.  The sega 6 button gamepad only had half a dozen games that actually required the thing.   The sega 3d goggles?  Most people don't even know they exist and maybe 3 games supported them.

And these were accessories that were pretty cheap.  The OR will be 200+ dollars.  I'm absolutely not saying that we'll never get a mainstream VR headset.  I'm just saying that the OR probably isn't it. 

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2014, 06:05:18 pm »
actually now that the DK has been out for a while, there is a couple of programs that make the rift compatible with several game engines. All the configuration you had to do was run the program and the game was "distorted" accordingly as the data come out of the engine. making the OR "compatible" with other engines just meant writing a config out for the engine.

I think the thing people mainly wanted (read as "looking forward to") was NATIVE oculus support PRE-processing instead of having a 3rd party program have to to post-processing...which would have cut down the system requirements considerably.

we can only hope things will go as good as old money bags Luckey makes it out as to what's going to happen, but a VAST majority of us are preparing for the worst.

Howard_Casto

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2014, 07:21:28 pm »
Yeah right now it's all sort of hackish, like something we'd do in our community.  Only you don't want to have that kind of limited support with a full-fledged commercial project.

In addition to it being faster, dedicated support means that the game design itself can be tweaked to work better with the device.  Sort of like how they do 3d films now, you can accentuate certain key elements by exaggerating the 3d depth on certain objects, or make the HUD more 3d-friendly, ect....  You can't really do that when you are just hacking the engine to do two viewports.   

I get the feeling sometimes you guys think I don't keep up with this stuff. ;)

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2014, 01:29:47 am »
I think Oculus is more a concept than a practical product.  I wasn't impressed with it's capabilities at CES and I'm sure when there is better software support, it will evolve into a great consumer product.

I looked at the Durovis Dive and it seems to be more practical device, especially for those with Galaxy Note2, as long as it doesn't have the optigrab effect.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2014, 11:41:35 am »
I think Oculus is more a concept than a practical product.  I wasn't impressed with it's capabilities at CES and I'm sure when there is better software support, it will evolve into a great consumer product.

I looked at the Durovis Dive and it seems to be more practical device, especially for those with Galaxy Note2, as long as it doesn't have the optigrab effect.



I think you are looking at the Rift as a finished product, where it really is not. R&D really makes a good product. It takes a lot of R&D to make a good product. The fact you are getting to see it first hand - as it happens- is off putting to you and see it as a failure on the part of the creators. But in the real world, behind closed doors...the exact same things happen. it takes time... prototypes... testing... experimentation. Oculus didn't have a bunch of time and money to dump into R&D, so they did the next best thing...took a pile of their money they got from kickstarter and made a bunch of "better than proof of concept" units... put a bunch out there for people to start making stuff with, experimenting, and see what works, what doesn't... and make those necessary changes and try again.

I find the OR a good practical product...with a few tweaks it could be even better. For example,  a video passthrough on the Rift box itself so you don't have the clone tearing issue you get with windows duplicating displays.

Where I find the Duovis/vrAse/altergaze etc etc etc. type of smartphone VR hardware to be a gimmick product aimed at cereal boxes. I'm just not seeing it. Mind you I've never tried it, but truth be told, with a smartphone display, you aren't going to get great quality due to the fact...

1: smartphone displays are not made equal they vary in size and quality considerably.
b: smartphones themselves are not made equal and vary considerably in performance.
4: and as great as smartphone games can be, they aren't even close to the level you can get with PC.

VR is aimed at gaming...always has. I see facebook looking at this as a possible social aspect spin that can be applied to it, but other than online multiplayer games...gamers aren't exactly the most social people. Maybe it will work, maybe it won't.

I'm mainly concerned for the developers (vrChat for example) who already have good programs who won't sell out to facebook and getting their work stolen from them. (like we have seen Facebook do in the past when they don't get what they want) Or even worse, they end up with a system where they must "submit" their programs to them for approval where they can be rejected before they can be used with the Facebookulus Rift.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2014, 01:48:36 pm »
I agree with both sentiments and that's sort of the problem.  I'm sure some people who "invested" in the device understood this going in, particularly the real developers, but I feel that the majority did not.  They didn't understand that when all is said and done they sold essentially a proof of concept unit and they'd most like have to buy the device again once or if it's ever officially released.  So people are going to get really pissed en-mass and it's unfortunate because as a whole kickstarter is a very positive thing, if used properly. 

Like a good example would be the 90's Arcade Racer.  It's a relatively small project that didn't ask for a lot.  A working demo was in place before any money was even raised.  Basically you are pre-ordering the game for what the game will cost when it comes to retail.  Worst case scenario you bought a bad game. 

On the same flip of the coin, Tim Schauffer's  abuse of the system is a prime example of how not to use kickstarter.  He asked for a relatively modest sum, got way more and decided to use the money to do a whole different game... then decides he needs MORE money, and that development will take much longer as he's decided to split this new game into two games. 

Then you've got the OR guys, you essentially used kickstarter to fund their company and then sold the company before they delivered the things they promised.  Yes the "reward" for donating was a dev kit, but it was done under the understanding that they'd be putting profits towards completing the production model, not selling out and dumping the project on someone else.

Kickstarter should have mandatory caps, so that you can't raise too much money and it should have a more rigid contract system in place, so once project starters get the money, they can't do whatever the hell they want with it. 

fallacy

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2014, 03:23:06 pm »
You think Facebook paid two Billion with a B so they can get a project dumped on them and let it die? Certainly FaceBook is the company that it is today because that is how they do business, clearly there track recoded suggest this to be true.

Most people bought dev kit because they wanted to experience an actual working VR display, $300  being chump change for that. Oculus team have been working hard, kept everyone updated and met all promises and demands; they don’t owe anyone anything. Not that any of that matters with all this funding the final product will probably be even better than without it.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2014, 10:41:49 pm »
Michael Abrash just joined OR.

Articles are also claiming that Facebook has a policy of leaving acquisitions to run themselves as they see fit (citing Instagram as an example). I don't know how true this is but Abrash jumping ship from Valve seems to point to some sort of confidence with this relationship.

*However* in the face of SOny, Microsoft and others having their own versions of this.... it makes it much more difficult for OR to compete.
NO MORE!!

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #22 on: March 28, 2014, 11:49:55 pm »
I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo doesn't have something similar lying around as well.  They aren't like the other gaming companies..... crazy secretive on some of the strangest things.  Remember the insane rumors before they announced the Wii?

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #23 on: March 29, 2014, 04:23:36 am »
*However* in the face of SOny, Microsoft and others having their own versions of this.... it makes it much more difficult for OR to compete.
Except now they have  the cash to be able to compete. I'm guessing Sony and Microsoft are putting a couple of million dollars in projects as these. OR now has $400 million in cash. That's quite an impressive budget for R&D and I wouldn't be surprised if that surpasses the budget Sony and Microsoft have allocated.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #24 on: March 29, 2014, 05:06:15 am »
Which doesn't really matter at all.  Sony and Microsoft have brand recognition.  They also have such a significant market share that they can force game companies to sign exclusively agreements preventing them from developing for other hardware (at least for a time). 

The quality of end product really doesn't have anything to do with the big game company's leverage. 


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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #25 on: March 29, 2014, 06:13:40 am »
You have a point... Eve Valkyrie was closely tied to OR... Until it popped up in the PS4 Morpheus announcement.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #26 on: April 03, 2014, 11:32:24 am »
I still own my OR DevKit 1 and I've gotten great use out of it.  For me it was a blast.  I've seen what it can do with Eve and Star Citizen demo reels and even had a chance to play with those on my OR DK1.  I have not bought a DevKit2 because OR seems to be going in a different direction than what they had originally envisioned during the first kickstarter campaign (Amazing what money does).  So time will tell.

As far as VR in mainstream, I never figured it would but I have disposable money now and Like reliving the 80/90's for me.

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #27 on: April 04, 2014, 02:43:26 pm »
i've gotten lots of use out of mine, but the problem I see is this...

I haven't found a game yet that when I play it with the rift, makes me say "YES, this is a game that is made for VR."

it's hard to explain. the first person shooters, okay, but not bad. racing cars...meh not quite. Minecraft is okay. but, there is still a disconnect happening. It's not resolution,lag,framerates, whatever... i think it's the games itself. but there again, i can't say what kind of game would make this experience.

In the 80's flying a jet or racing a f1 car or driving a tank would be unheard of. so VR was huge for that kind of experience. now a days, you can ACTUALLY do those things, and it's not a big deal. maybe that's the problem. maybe we need to make games of things we can't actually do.  :dunno

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2014, 05:28:58 pm »
i've gotten lots of use out of mine, but the problem I see is this...

I haven't found a game yet that when I play it with the rift, makes me say "YES, this is a game that is made for VR."

it's hard to explain. the first person shooters, okay, but not bad. racing cars...meh not quite. Minecraft is okay. but, there is still a disconnect happening. It's not resolution,lag,framerates, whatever... i think it's the games itself. but there again, i can't say what kind of game would make this experience.

In the 80's flying a jet or racing a f1 car or driving a tank would be unheard of. so VR was huge for that kind of experience. now a days, you can ACTUALLY do those things, and it's not a big deal. maybe that's the problem. maybe we need to make games of things we can't actually do.  :dunno

VR is like the 3D TV.  Nice concept, short lived, not practical.  I say that as an active developer and researcher of visual interfaces.  VR is very important at this stage - as it is a segway to more exciting technology where you don't need prosthetics to enjoy the same experiences.  I give it three years, tops. 
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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #29 on: April 05, 2014, 01:09:24 am »

I agree completely, let me elaborate:

The problem with the OR in particular (and many similar devices) is that it's NOT 3d, it's stereoscopic vision.  The whole point of the version 2 dev kit is to add some motion tracking and other junk in to actually make it a 3d headset where you can organically look around, thus simulating a 3d experience a little better. 

But that still isn't enough.  You can't see your own hands, if you try to touch an object, you can't feel it... if you are holding a controller you can't see it, ect....

These are fundamental problems with the whole concept of a VR headset.  To do it right you need augmented reality implementation (so you can see your hands/controllers), a wiimote like control, some sort of a treadmill and a harness system.  Now the OR guys were working on this stuff.  Honestly though all the gear required to get this working becomes overtly expensive and convoluted. 

So if you were wanting things to jump out at you like some god awful 3d movie, then the future is now.  If you want a fully immersive experience, the future was probably 7 years ago with the Wii/ ps move.  Immersive controls are far more important than immersive vision and if you want 3d on top of that... well a 3d tv is a lot less cumbersome than some goofy headset that obscures your vision.

About the only thing I could see a VR headset working with is sims, and it'd have to have some additions.  If you've got a racing sim cockpit/flight cockpit then you've already solved two problems, namely you sit down and you have the specialized controls needed for immersion.  You'll also need head tracking to control the view (look around the cockpit, to see the inside of the car/plane, rear view mirrors ect) and either some sort of sophisticated hand tracking or again, augmented reality so that you can see what you are doing when you try to reach the controls.  It would STILL be convoluted and expensive, but these are sim people... convoluted and expensive is their bread and butter.  ;)

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #30 on: April 11, 2014, 05:28:33 pm »

I agree completely, let me elaborate:

The problem with the OR in particular (and many similar devices) is that it's NOT 3d, it's stereoscopic vision.  The whole point of the version 2 dev kit is to add some motion tracking and other junk in to actually make it a 3d headset where you can organically look around, thus simulating a 3d experience a little better. 

But that still isn't enough.  You can't see your own hands, if you try to touch an object, you can't feel it... if you are holding a controller you can't see it, ect....

These are fundamental problems with the whole concept of a VR headset.  To do it right you need augmented reality implementation (so you can see your hands/controllers), a wiimote like control, some sort of a treadmill and a harness system.  Now the OR guys were working on this stuff.  Honestly though all the gear required to get this working becomes overtly expensive and convoluted. 

So if you were wanting things to jump out at you like some god awful 3d movie, then the future is now.  If you want a fully immersive experience, the future was probably 7 years ago with the Wii/ ps move.  Immersive controls are far more important than immersive vision and if you want 3d on top of that... well a 3d tv is a lot less cumbersome than some goofy headset that obscures your vision.

About the only thing I could see a VR headset working with is sims, and it'd have to have some additions.  If you've got a racing sim cockpit/flight cockpit then you've already solved two problems, namely you sit down and you have the specialized controls needed for immersion.  You'll also need head tracking to control the view (look around the cockpit, to see the inside of the car/plane, rear view mirrors ect) and either some sort of sophisticated hand tracking or again, augmented reality so that you can see what you are doing when you try to reach the controls.  It would STILL be convoluted and expensive, but these are sim people... convoluted and expensive is their bread and butter.  ;)

All good points but there are already products out there that do what you're saying.

The Myo wristbands have been demoed with the OR to have the ability to show your hands and even finger movements.


The Omni is a virtual treadmill that allows you to walk.


There's even a video that shows someone who's already combined the Oculus Rift, a VR walking surface, and two WiiMotes to be able to go into the Skyrim world, walk around, and use the WiiMotes as a bow and arrow.


All this costs money but the more R&D goes towards this, you know the price will go down tremendously. Who would have thought that 1080p like the Oculus could be $300?

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Re: Virtual Reality Development Kit 2
« Reply #31 on: April 11, 2014, 05:46:29 pm »
Who would have thought that 1080p like the Oculus could be $300?
I've seen projects be kickstarted and cost more one the product was open to the general public

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