Tube TV recommendation?

[jasonbar]

Howdy-

I'm looking to pick up a used tube TV, probably 21" in size (not too small but not too heavy to lug upstairs & put in a small bedroom). It needs to have an S-video input, as pretty much all of my consoles are modded for S-video. Stereo inputs & speakers are also required.

Is there any recommendation or standard for a good gaming TV to fit my needs? (For 2600, A8, INTV, TG Duo, NES, SNES, N64, SMS, Gen, Saturn, DC, 3DO, PS1, & PS2).

Thanks,
-Jason

PS--I'm in Los Angeles, in case anybody local has one for sale/trade.

[Howard_Casto]

Whatever you can find that fits those requirements.  CRT televisions have dropped off the face of the earth except for the ones you find at second hand shops and those rarely have anything good like s-video.  Seriously my mame cab now has a 16:10 lcd monitor in it simply because I could no longer find crt televisions with high-end connectors at a reasonable price.

Also you'll be hard pressed to find svid on anything smaller than a 24 inch.  It was on "high end" tvs and right up until lcd tvs came out anything smaller than 24 inches was considered a "budget" television because the 24+ inchers were just so cheap. 

Hopefully we can find somebody to trade with you, because that's about your only hope.

[Furry131]

Check Craigslist. I just picked up a Sony 24 inch for 20 bucks.  Like this. 
http://www.amazon.com/Sony-KV-24FS120-24-Inch-Trinitron-WEGA/dp/B00021XQIA/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top


If you look on CL you shouldn't pay over 40-50.  A lot of times they are free.

Good luck

[ChadTower]

Whatever you can find that fits those requirements.  CRT televisions have dropped off the face of the earth except for the ones you find at second hand shops and those rarely have anything good like s-video. 

Not in my area.  They are EVERYWHERE here.  They aren't in stores, of course.  I see 10 of them a week on Freecycle.  Every single week you can drive by a bunch of them on trash day.  Everybody I know seems to have at least one or two in their house somewhere still.  People offer them to me all the time because I'm "into old equipment and might have a use for it".   It's all types and sizes, too.  I see as many 32" WEGAs as I do 19" Symphonics.  About a month ago someone offered up a 40" WEGA CRT on my Freecycle group.  I didn't know they ever made them that big.

A CRT TV now can be had all day long for free.  You might have to wait a bit, or pay a token amount for a specific model, but they are ridiculously easy to find for now.

[danny_galaga]

Whatever you can find that fits those requirements.  CRT televisions have dropped off the face of the earth except for the ones you find at second hand shops and those rarely have anything good like s-video. 

Not in my area.  They are EVERYWHERE here.  They aren't in stores, of course.  I see 10 of them a week on Freecycle.  Every single week you can drive by a bunch of them on trash day.  Everybody I know seems to have at least one or two in their house somewhere still.  People offer them to me all the time because I'm "into old equipment and might have a use for it".   It's all types and sizes, too.  I see as many 32" WEGAs as I do 19" Symphonics.  About a month ago someone offered up a 40" WEGA CRT on my Freecycle group.  I didn't know they ever made them that big.

A CRT TV now can be had all day long for free.  You might have to wait a bit, or pay a token amount for a specific model, but they are ridiculously easy to find for now.

+1 for http://www.freecycle.org . Just check them out in your area to see if they are active or not. I picked up 2 x 68cm CRT's via them. Granted, not S-video, but ya just gotta ask (",)

The funny thing is, while you still see them on the side of the road on hard trash weeks, I am pretty confident that collectors will be paying for the same, say ten years from now for their consoles. I have 6 CRT's in my 2 bedroom unit now, but if I had a house and a nice big shed, I'd just fill it up with them! Not for speculation mind you, that would be retarded. just so I never have to pay for one, and to give away when like minded people need them...

[ChadTower]

I haven't met any CRT collectors yet.  I have met people who hoard CRTs for their games, of course.  Nobody that collects CRT televisions for the joy of CRT televisions themselves, though.

The arcade community really needs to solve the vector tube problem.  Every passing year it is getting harder and harder to find vector monitors.  Now even black and white tubes are almost unobtanium even though those can usually be swapped straight from a TV.

[danny_galaga]

I haven't met any CRT collectors yet.  I have met people who hoard CRTs for their games, of course.  Nobody that collects CRT televisions for the joy of CRT televisions themselves, though.

The arcade community really needs to solve the vector tube problem.  Every passing year it is getting harder and harder to find vector monitors.  Now even black and white tubes are almost unobtanium even though those can usually be swapped straight from a TV.

Oh, I actually meant console collectors! I think if there are people collecting TVs (and there would be) then 70's or earlier would be more appealing, whereas for us, what we want is something with AV inputs of some type...

It's a damn shame that Atari guy (the one making the Star Wars yolks) couldn't hold his ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- together, since at one stage he had claimed he was getting a factory in Mexico to make colour vector monitors. If that were true, and he managed to pull it off, that would have been brilliant!

[Howard_Casto]

Yeah, as I illuded to (but I guess didn't spell out plainly enough), finding a crt tv is fairly easy, but nobody wants to give away their good tv with s-vid or component inputs, they want to git away their $179.99 when new, rca with... well.... rca inputs only.  Even if you do find a tv with svid it's generally on it's last legs at this point so you'd have to rebuild it.  I've got a wall of 6 crts over at my grandma's and only one  of them has useable inputs.  We just got her a 60" led to replace her 10 year old rear-projection 52" so those are probably going to make room for the 52", save that good one and maybe a spare 19 incher for swapping out tubes in arcade monitors. 

Those are going through the roof btw unless you go second hand.  The arcade industry has moved on to lcds, so they are becoming a "rare part" as well. 

[ChadTower]

I don't think anyone actually believed that Dave was ever going to have those monitors made.  I'd be surprised if he actually did have manufactured the things he produced.  I keep expecting that sooner or later we're going to find out he discovered some old warehouse stash and was slowly pushing parts of it out as part of his scams.

[Howard_Casto]

Yeah there's just no market and they are exceedingly expensive to produce in small quantities.

I think vector collectors are just going to have to find some other solution to the problem.  I *think* newer led monitors are fast enough to actually draw on the fly like vector monitors did.  Some sort of hardware box would have to be made to translate the beam directions into pixels, and add a fade/flicker though. 

[ChadTower]

Yeah there's just no market and they are exceedingly expensive to produce in small quantities.

I think vector collectors are just going to have to find some other solution to the problem.  I *think* newer led monitors are fast enough to actually draw on the fly like vector monitors did.  Some sort of hardware box would have to be made to translate the beam directions into pixels, and add a fade/flicker though.

The VectorVGA Pro looks interesting.  Probably costs way too much but the featureset sure does look capable.

[rCadeGaming]

Don't listen to Howard.  Newer (early 2000's) CRT TV's in great shape with component inputs are readily available on Craigslist and such.  Goodwill is also good place to check, and other stores like that.  I have several in my garage.

As stated above, they're very cheap; don't pay over $50.  Many of the ones I got were free.  The vast majority of people who had these TV's are just getting rid of them because they've upgraded to LCD's.  They don't play classic games, and they just don't want a heavy, bulky TV anymore, so they're getting rid of them even though many of them are still in excellent shape.

A good CRT is still the best possible option by far for 240p gaming.  Just look for a TV with component (or RGB SCART, depending on your territory) inputs, and be sure it does NOT work with 480p or higher.  If it does, it will likely upscale lower resolutions, meaning it won't display real 240p.

[Howard_Casto]

Don't listen to Howard.  Newer (early 2000's) CRT TV's in great shape with component inputs are readily available on Craigslist and such.  Goodwill is also good place to check, and other stores like that.  I have several in my garage.

DO listen to Howard.  If you are in the CA area, sure craiglist is a good option, but guess what?  The nearest CL forum in my area is Cinn Ohio... a full 8 hours away!  Not everybody lives near a major city.  Also most Goodwills are now refusing to accept crt televisons.  How do I know?  Because I called and asked.  Long story short, your individual area will vary GREATLY.... for most of us, getting a quality crt televion, in the proper size, with the proper inputs, is becoming a bit of a chore. 

[rCadeGaming]

For most of us?  I don't think so.  A simple understanding of population density will inform you that the majority of US citizens live in or near a major city.  I myself live in a rural area, and there are still plenty of listings within a few miles of me.  If Craigslist isn't popular in your area, there is likely something else that is.

Why discourage people from trying?  Totally unhelpful.

[ChadTower]

The highway depot / recycling center / electronics dropoff / whatever a given small town calls it is a great place to find CRTs.  Wherever people have to drop them off for recycling or the town puts them after picking them up.  They will usually let you take a TV as long as you don't try to open the thing up on site.  For them that's increasing their profit since they took the recycling fee but now they don't have to pay one to the company that takes it from them.

[jasonbar]

Howdy again-

Thanks for all of the helpful input. I picked up this 20" Sony PVM-20N2U yesterday for $40: http://losangeles.cr...3486377467.html

For sound, I'm going to use a pair of powered PC stereo speakers & attach them to the sides of the case (assuming the tube's case is shielded well enough that the speakers don't distort the picture--if so, I'll move them farther away).



I am finding one small issue, however.

I've tried my S-Video modded 2600 & S-Video modded SMS & 2 different S-Video cables & both of the Y/C (S-Video) inputs & they look swell except for one issue that persists always. I believe that it's called "ghosting." When there are very light pixels to the left of dark (but not black) pixels, then the white pixels cast a bit of a shadow towards the right. Attached pics show 2600 Pitfall.

Any ideas on how to fix this issue?


I just ordered some RCA female-to BNC male gold-plated adapters & will try composite & RGB next. (My SMS has both composite & S-Video out, for an easy back-to-back comparison).


Thanks,
-Jason

[rCadeGaming]

Nice, that should be a very nice monitor.  I think that trailing effect could be caused by both the source and the monitor though. 

First, for the source, be sure to always use the RGB inputs where possible.  I think the Sega Master System should be able to output RGB without modding, you just need proper cabling:

http://members.optusnet.com.au/eviltim/gamescart/gamescart.htm#megamstr

I don't mean you need to use SCART connectors, just use those pinouts of the consoles to get your cabling in order in your preferred method.

For the monitor, see if you can get some brightness, contrast, and color test patterns displayed on it to calibrate it.  I you have any newer consoles, they are great for this as you can transfer picture files of test patterns from your PC to them.  I use a PS3.  Just make sure you're displaying them in RGB for the best calibration.

[jasonbar]

I tried out composite input with my SMS today. The banding that showed with S-Video wasn't there with composite. Good deal. I'll soon have the bits needed to try out RGB. Can't wait!

Thanks,
-Jason

PS--here's a fun thread on the Sony PVM: http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showthread.php?238415-CRT-Fetish-Thread

[jasonbar]

Added powered speakers, ran all speaker wires inside the monitor case, skinned the case with used Centipede sideart (thanks to Fly from the KLOV forum!), added stereo RCA audio input jacks to the back panel, & am gaming! Still working on getting the RGB to work.

http://s242.beta.photobucket.com/user/infernolab/library/Sony_PVM-20N2U

Thanks,
-Jason