Yet another... COCKTAIL - the quick, quiet, cheap, couth, cock cab

[xefned]

Another cocktail cab. I know, just what the world needs. But Saint's book recommends documenting builds for the benefit of the community, so I'll focus on the specific traits that characterize this project:

CHEAP - One income, three kids necessitates this point.
QUICK - Can't float a full time hobby.
COUTH - It must reside in a living space, and meet spousal approval. (No man cave here.) Relatively quiet would also be nice.
The laws of "fast, good, inexpensive, pick two" make this design technical impossible. So we'll see what gives.

Since I don't know diddley about Mame or Windows, I'll carefully document the computer setup for others wary of diving in without the prerequisite knowledge. That's probably the most valuable potential contribution I can make - cocktail builds otherwise being relatively run-of-the-mill.

When I first found this group (though bluemini's youtube videos,) I immediately noticed builds typically go over a grand and often stretch into several years. I cannot afford either. Also, I don't wanna be featured on crapmame. So what do you think? Am I attempting the impossible?

I'm starting with a $30 sheet of 4x8 plywood from menards (on sale!), and 20 ft. of T-molding from gamemolding.com.  I'll skip over the luxurious bling that makes the builds around here so impressive. (Not that I have those skills anyway.) So no ambient lighting, no light-up pushbuttons, no subwoofer, no side laminate, etc.

My first question, can I use this 3/4" birch plywood just sanded and stained? Or will that look like crap? The grain is nothing to write home about.

[popsicle]

I like the sanded and stained wood look, and also used 3/4 birch ply.  No paint to mess with, and meet's spousal approval requirements.

The biggest expenses for my smallish cocktail were the 2 spinners ($75 each), then the monitor (HP LP2065 online for $100), then the custom tinted glass ($40).   $25 can get you a 2.1 pc speaker setup, which is plenty of oomph.   Add an encoder for another $30 or so, and then shop joysticks around what games will be played (4-way verticals?).  The wood and t-molding you already have, and I assume you already have a computer to gut.   Do you have access to a router w/slot cutting bit?

[xefned]

OMG - Popsicle, that is fookin' gorgeous!    So glad I posted. I'll check out your thread.

You clearly have some skills that I do not, but I'd like to emulate that finish. That's exactly the look I'm picturing. I'll have to read up on wood finishing before I go any farther.

I like the shape too. If I hadn't borrowed my neighbor's circular saw this afternoon to make my first cut, I'd almost start over just to copy your design. The open top solves the stick height conundrum I'm dwelling on.

Do you know the Starlight Mints "Popsickle" by any chance? Hella catchy.
For power-pop fans:

[popsicle]

Thanks, but I doubt if I am more skilled than you.  I cut the whole thing with a jigsaw, and only used a router for the slot cutting.  The wiring on the inside is a mess, and I did a lot of improvising while building the thing as far as mounting the monitor, sloping the sides, and using part of the t-molding to hold down the glass on top.  The initial idea was to keep the top of the joys low enough to add a flat top to the thing so it would double as a 2 player board game or card table (I haven't done this yet). 

Whatever you do, leave space for the players knees/legs, give a *slight* angle of the CP for comfort, and sit the players as close to the monitor as possible.  I think most people here will agree that a custom build should be centered around the size and shape of your monitor.

[drventure]

+1 on popsicles comments. You can definitely build a 2 player cocktail for pretty cheap. the spinners and trackballs will get you, if you go that route. Also, if you want the most flexibility for sticks, it's hard to beat Ultimarc U360's, but they're not cheap.

You can get regular sticks, but then, you'll have to decide whether you want 4way or 8 way, or go with something like a magstick plus that you can switch by just rotating the stick knob.

And by the way, Popsicle, that build IS freakin' sweet! Nice job 

[xefned]

Man, popsicle - I love that it's ALL screen, with a nice wide control panel. Considering the importance of leg-room and ergonomics, I may just start over with measurements closer to yours. The standard cocktail just looks boxy by comparison, with a stubby little awkward control panel. +1 on your $1 computer.

Dr.Venture, thanks for the thoughts. I'll probably go with a cheaper stick, until I realize I'm addicted and start on my 2nd build next year haha. Hell yeah on the spinner. Wizard of Wor and Tac/Scan are calling.

[xefned]

A rough start with a rough cut



We're in real beginners territory here.
Because my neighbor was waiting around for me to finish with his saw, I did the cuts quick to give it back. My wife scolded me, "do the job right, he doesn't mind waiting."   Next job is figuring out how to straighten these edges. I may try a planer.     

The on-sale $30 birch plywood is back to it's regular $50 price. So I'll probably go ahead with the bog-standard design. But maybe I can modify the control panel to be higher and angled like the popsicle cocktail. I'll see if I can collude the two designs into something more legroomy.

[Le Chuck]

I would recommend getting your own saw, even a cheap one, and spending some time making a saw board and learning how to make clean straight cuts.  This is key because at this stage you're building a foundation.  If the basics are wobbly the whole project will be wobbly, only moreso as you'll be compounding shortcuts on top of shortcuts.  Are you able to snap a straight line along that edge and recut later?  If not you may need to set that piece aside until you find something you can cut out of it.   

If your neighbor was worth his salt and knew you were inexperienced with the tool and saw you making those cuts he would have taken a few minutes to help you get good cuts out of your wood. 

You don't want to be fighting your lines this early on.  Mistakes will be made later that are patchable but jagged unstraight edges will leave you fighting uphill the whole way.  A good cab takes a bit longer to build but the process of doing it is extremely valuable.   

[yaksplat]

Also, make sure that you're using the right kind of blade for the job.  I'm not sure what kind of saw you were using on that board, but i'd guess jigsaw based on the wobble and partially angled cut. 

If it is a jigsaw, buy a set of various blades.  Some will be great for curves, other for fast straight cuts.  Buy a piece of low quality wood to practice on.  Cut some straight lines, some curves, and take your time.  Extra time spent now will save you a lot of aggravation later.

A plane will only straighten out thouse cuts if you're really skilled and have a sharp plane.  Otherwise you'll just create other problems and become highly skilled at making dust.

Feel free to keep asking questions, there's plenty of people around here that'll help you out.

[jmike]

I'm with Le Chuck,
                           circular saws are pretty cheap. Here's a Craftsman Evolv 7 inch saw for $30.

http://www.sears.com/craftsman-18780-evolv-12-amp-corded-7-in/p-00918780000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1

Of course there are better ones but are definitely more expensive. I have a craftsman and it works great.
BTW you should be using a circular saw for long cuts, definitely not a jigsaw.

 

[emb]

I'm with Le Chuck,
                           circular saws are pretty cheap. Here's a Craftsman Evolv 7 inch saw for $30.

http://www.sears.com/craftsman-18780-evolv-12-amp-corded-7-in/p-00918780000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1

Of course there are better ones but are definitely more expensive. I have a craftsman and it works great.
BTW you should be using a circular saw for long cuts, definitely not a jigsaw.

 

Consider purchasing a router and flush trim bit if you are having troubles with straight cuts. Rough cut it, then route a nice straight line with a flat-edge and a router. I suck with cutting strait square edges with a circular saw, even with a jig. This has worked pretty well for me.

Keep in mind that this is only one way to do it, there are many different ways to cut a perfect edge.

[Ond]

Welcome on board xefned, don't worry about your first wonky cut, it's no big deal.  You are going to need to get clean straight cuts at 90 degrees to your panel surfaces before getting too much into your build though.  All the tools recommended here by others can be run along a straight edge.  A straight edge can just be a (straight!) 2 x 4 clamped down.  If you are super new to power tools I'd recommend starting off with a circular saw and straight edge and add a jigsaw when you can.  Once you have a bit of power tool confidence a router and flush trim bit really can’t be beat for all round usefulness and accuracy.  That piece you've cut already? Practice on it to get a clean straight edge before committing to your cab panels.  Stained timber can look really nice as you've seen.  One small thing with stains, you need to avoid inadvertently sealing the surface near joins with glues as stain won't penetrate those areas as well (produces a lighter blotchy look) as raw timber. Just sand everything well before staining to avoid that problem.

Plenty of help here available keep us updated with your progress.

[xefned]

Thanks for the support guys. You are the men. It's a big confidence boost to have advice from people who've been there.

Yaksplat, it was a circular saw. I was freehanding.  And when my reach was extended so far I could no longer see my line, I restarted from the other side and met my line in the middle, offset of course. 

Le Chuck, jmike, circular saw purchased! Thanks for pointing out that bargain. Earlier in the day I went searching at Menards and the cheapest they had was $50. "Tool Shop" brand. The Craftsman was a no-brainer. Despite being their entry level model with a rubberized plastic body, the guard is metal and the overall saw is very heavy. It feels solid.

emb, thanks for the suggestion. I didn't realize you could actually cut a board with a router. I actually have a router that's only been used a couple times in 10 years so I'll be putting it to good use. If it still works.

Ond, I clamped a 4 ft. level to the board, a voila, a straight cut!
Of course, despite painstaking measuring and re-measuring, the end result was 1/8" too short. But hey, it's worthwhile practice. I've still got enough stock to try again, and this board can be cut down for the base and control panels.

I'll keep you guys posted. Thanks for the interest. I'll check out all of your builds and try to learn a thing or two...

Pre-cut preparation:

[TopJimmyCooks]

Of course, despite painstaking measuring and re-measuring, the end result was 1/8" too short.

Wise carpenter always say: "measure twice, cut three times"

Wise carpenter's wife say:  "ya cut it three times and it's still too short"

[emb]

In regards to the router: you will still want to rough cut your wood with a jigsaw or table saw and then trim/smooth it off with a flush trim bit and straight edge.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Le Chuck]

That's more better!  Keep after it   

[jmike]

 
     Nicely done. Not sure if you looked into it but as Le Chuck suggested you should try and make your own saw guide.
Here's a link. This will help you better than that level cause it shows you exactly where the blade will be.

How to Build a Simple Circular Saw Guide for Straighter Cuts:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home/reviews/4283497



 

[yotsuya]

Good pick up there with the tool. When I started doing this, I had a circular saw, a jigsaw, and a drill. I've since picked up a table saw, a router, a cordless drill, a palm and an orbital sander, and an angle grinder. All have come in handy.

[yaksplat]

and an angle grinder

I've got to ask, where did the angle grinder come in handy?  It's one of the few tools that i don't own and I want one.
I'm assuming that were removing metal of some form...

[yotsuya]

Home Depot. I bought it to grind down some rough metal panels I had plasma-cut for me. I also used it to cut adobe tiles for a walkway. Get the one with the trigger in the handle- it's easier to manage.

[Nephasth]

and an angle grinder

I've got to ask, where did the angle grinder come in handy?

Directly hobby related, I've used mine to modify joystick mounting plates. I installed a cutting wheel on it and made short work of the cuts to make my Kinect mount for my TV stand...


One of those tools that when you own one, you come up with plenty of uses for it.

[yotsuya]

I also used it to cut off some welded posts on a control panel I'm refurbishing.

[xefned]

Pops, what's the game in the screenshot?

[Le Chuck]

^ D&D Shadow over Mystara if I'm not mistaken

[popsicle]

Le Chuck gets a cookie. 

[xefned]

How to Build a Simple Circular Saw Guide for Straighter Cuts:
http://www.popularmechanics.com/home/reviews/4283497

Great tip jmike!
As a non-woodworker, my initial thought is it's too much for an occasional woodworker; I'd use it once and then it would sit unused in the garage.

I tried the router with flush bit which was good practice. But I ended up with a lapful of sawdust, and when my clamped straightedge flexed under pressure in the midsection, I had some deviant gouges.

And then the next thing you know...

[xefned]

I built the jig. My cuts are straight. So thank you for the suggestion.

It turns out I had some 4' long particle board that was here when I moved in 4 years ago. And some 4' 1x4's left over from repairing some rotted deck boards. They were gonna continue taking up space in the garage for unforeseen years to come anyway; might as well attach them with screws.

So friends, it took me two weeks to learn how to cut a straight line. But persistance paid off. I thank you again for the constructive comments and support.

P.S. for anyone building a straight line jig, I later found a dual design on page three of this PDF for a router cut on one side and circular saw on the other.

[xefned]

Two modifications to my original plans:

Popsicle, after reading Apfelani's comments about ergonomics, I'm  • angling the control panel slightly downwards, attempting to mimic the approximate angle of your CP. (Superimposing your pic onto the stock Midway-style design, and drawing new lines.) It seems like it should work.    We'll see.

As much as it pains me to drop the trigger stick, I'm • reducing the # of sticks per Awesome face!'s suggestion to avoid the ungainly Frankenpanel. It's clearly the practical thing to do for space economy.

Slight angle: (dark black lines)



Single stick:

[popsicle]

Making progress 

Have you done a mockup to see if your left wrist hits the joystick while using the spinner? 

Can I assume you decided on keeping 4 buttons (instead of 3) for a few select must have games?

[xefned]

Have you done a mockup to see if your left wrist hits the joystick while using the spinner? 

I gave it zero thought. Thank you.
My actual-size printout indicates, yes, my pinky would probably smack all over the stick. I'll schooch it over.

I nabbed some curbside throwaway panels my neighbor scrapped from some flatpack ikea/target-style entertainment center. So I'll use that to build a mockup first.

Can I assume you decided on keeping 4 buttons (instead of 3) for a few select must have games?

No. Almost no thought there either. I could probably get away with 2 buttons. I'll do an inventory of my roms (around 50 or so) to see what's necessary. I downloaded Romlister but have yet to successfully spit out any lists. I see it can isolate games into lists by # of buttons. Just need to spend some time figuring it out.  My method thus far is to go to google images and search on, say, "Burgertime control panel" and count the buttons.

One thing I know for sure - Defender has 5 buttons. One of which barely ever gets used. I can probably map that one to a start button or 'joystick left' or something.

Other than that, I'm a dig dug, joust, donkey kong, tempest, tapper kind of guy. Very few buttons needed. Overkill you think? Would three be better?

[thefuture]

Definitely check out romlister.  I was amazed at the number of games that were good for cocktail and 3 buttons or less.  I think that's the sweet spot, but to each their own. I settled on 3 buttons each for my build. Even some neo geo games work, as they might not use the 4th button.

[xefned]

Great, thanks for that feedback! 

Four buttons just *looks* too cluttered on my CP. I'll probably go with my gut, and your suggestion, and cut back to 3.

In a pinch, I can use a player 1 / player 2 start button for a rogue control. I'm even hoping to sneak in some up/down action on the spinner, so there's 2 stealth buttons right there.  If only I could sneak a couple buttons onto my joystick, I'd be swimming in secret controls no one could figure but me.

I'd better become hella adept at mapping buttons on a game-by-game basis.  So much yet to learn....

Is anyone else bummed that it's suddenly too cold to work comfortably in the garage??  I've got wood to form!


2014 Update
Wish I could update this project without unnecessarily bumping it to the top of the forum. So I'll modify this post instead.

Thanks BlueMini! I will plan to make a video if it's ever properly "finished."

Well 2 years have gone by, and this cocktail has been finished, unfinished, broken, redesigned, etc. It's basically turned into a learning machine. The ancient Samsung 4:3 LCD crapped out. The computer inside was repurposed for the kids. The monitor was replaced with another of the same model, which recently became fuzzy. 

I'm currently trying to find a CRT that will fit the 20" diagonal opening in the table top. When I find a suitable monitor, I'll get this back in service. Meanwhile, I've started an upright cabinet, even though I hate starting a new project with another unfinished. What can you do?  (I suppose I should visit the Goodwill store and craigslist everyday for the right size CRT.)

[Drnick]

Is anyone else bummed that it's suddenly too cold to work comfortably in the garage??  I've got wood to form!

Yeah, no forming wood in the cold 

Just wrap up warm, as long as it's dry its doable.  It's painting in the cold, now that's no fun

[bluemini17]

good progress so far ! keep up the good work. Im glad you found this forum, once your done be sure to post a vid to my youtube page 

I would go for 2 buttons, perhaps 3 max per player

bluemini17 aka David