Big Buck Hunter Pro

[Jeff AMN]

Has anybody played this yet? It's getting really favorable reviews on RGP, and a lot of people are saying that it's quite a challenging pin. I'm going to try to sneak out of work today and head down to one of our local distributors to see if they have it. I imagine Xiaou2 has already played it and probably has one on order, however.

Seriously though, has anybody here tried it?

[JeepMonkey]

I just read on RGP that there is one on location in the KC area.  Next time I am in that part of town I hope to check it out.

It does seem to be getting some good reviews so far.

[Jeff AMN]

It's actually the elk that is snapping off. The deer is supposedly quite solid.

Looks like Orbit has a new protector to build.

[Q*Bert_OP]

No location pinball in the state of Texas so I'll never see it.

I'm not likely to get it. I have only played it 10 times so far, but the game seems very unbalanced, shot wise. There's nothing to shoot for on the left, and that deer is like the hole on Monster Bash...shoot hole/deer, shoot hole/deer, shoot hole/deer, over and over again...

Then again, I didn't like 24 when it came out...

[Xiaou2]

Raise your hands:

 Whos excited to play a single layer, yokel themed pinball?

Features:

 Annoyingly tells you what to do every 15 seconds,
 has no charm, comedy, or personality at all in its godawful voice work
 boring, poor flow, single layer play field
 single toy which will probably fail catastrophically in 4 weeks of play
 Probably the most generic cheesy look ever created 

 Woah!  I want 50 of them!


(( Inspired and sponsored by Raw Thrills.  Sellouts who create games that
brainwash people.  (Target Terror = EVERYONE is a terrorist, and your
job to kill every neighboorhood citizen) ))

 Man, ya gota Luv these Punks.

[Pinball Wizard]

I can finally say I agree with PinballJim.

[Jeff AMN]

For once I completely agree with Xiaou2.

The Raw Thrills remark was a bit stupid though.

[nostrebor]

Meh. I'd play one. It's always fun to play something new.

[Pinball Wizard]

I'll agree that I'm willing to try one but nothing will compare to the 74 mile drive I'll go once in awhile to a sub shop to go play Revenge From Mars and a Williams Indiana Jones. I get a sub there to so I guess its not that I'm obsessed right? I can call it lunch right? </therapy>

I'll try any game from anyone but I'm not optimistic. I try to approach it with a somewhat open mind and, from what I've heard is going to be hard to do.

[Jeff AMN]

I don't know why I bothered to ask here, to tell the truth. I've seen good comments from every other site for the most part. I keep forgetting that pretty much everybody here hates everything.

[smartbomb2084]

Jeff my man, I'm with you on this one.  Pinball is supposed to be fun and yet everyone around here seems to drink too much HATERADE.  This game sucks for that reason. That game sucks for this reason. Let's have some positive thinking for once.  I'm not the biggest STERN/SEGA/DATA EAST fan either but any game in good working condition to me is a good game regardless of theme or era of production.  Can you say ELECTRO-MECHANICAL?  I'm sure any player with some extended time on this planet has been asked by a friend or family member... What's your favorite game?  I always answer:  Any game that works good.  Are there some games we prefer over others?  Sure, but that is no reason to hate the ones that we don't prefer.

 As far as BIG BUCK is concerned, I got to play it pretty much brand new out of the box for abot 45 Minutes with two other players.  It wasn't terrible, and it didn't GRAB me either.  If I was to make a critical remark it would be about the 3/8 of an inch groove going across the width of the playfield and how long this groove would stay divot free and start adversely affecting game play.
   

[Xiaou2]

So, if they released a black and white movie, using non-hidden strings and no
bluescreen / cgi, in glorious MONO sound... with almost no script to speak of...
would you be Excited to see it?  Would you exploding with glee?

 Personally, there are games older and have less depth than Sterns new
pin that I would rather own, including EM machines.  In fact, I actually like
some EM machines, because the gameplay style is different from the modern
pins.

 That said, it wouldnt get much applause from me to see an EM style pin
popped out in todays era.  The technology should be advancing, not retreating.
And so yes, there is anger because of the sub par standards today.

how long this groove would stay divot free and start adversely affecting game play.

 Anyone would know this... And yet, the Geniuses at Stern saw no reason
to add anything to slow or prevent this damage.

 I pretty much would bet that anyone pegging BBH as Good, is a person who:

1) Is a fake reviewer (Company employee created review)
2) Is a person who has very little experience with pinball at all.
3) Has no 'taste' whatsoever.

"I always answer:  Any game that works good."

 Thats the most generic ---smurf-poo--- Ive ever read.

Q:   Whats your favorite food?
A:   Anything that isnt Poison.

 If you have no taste-buds, Im sure EVERYTHING is GREAT. (to you)
But ya know... some of us actually DO Taste things, and we can differentiate
between  sweet, sour, delicious, Nasty...etc.

 We all dont have to be "Happy Happy Joy Joy"  over McDonalds.  Some of us
prefer a cut of Fillet Mignon.  As in Pinball, there are plenty of Juicy Tender
Delicious cuts out there... And BBH is the dollar level Cheese Burger in the pack.

[pinballwizard79]

BYOAC secret rule #44: PBJ & Xiaou's pinball opinions do not count

Jeez, lighten up all you Francis types....its a fun game. I played it @ the PHOF a few weeks back & we all know what kind of person goes there (insert 3 self righteous stereotypes). Anyway the deer is neat, the shells on the PF are a nice touch, the pops are on FIRE & it says funny redneck stuff like "What you got gainst womens" or something to that effect.

Word

[Jeff AMN]

Don't mind Xiaou2, he's a joke character anyway.

[smartbomb2084]

I still say any good working pinball is a good game simply because there aren't enough good working games to go around. 

   We have location coin-op pinball around here and the biggest operator does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to maintain his games once they get to the location. He has a MEDIVEAL MADNESS one the route dirty as hell, severely leaning to the left,  so the ball won't drain down the the middle after it is ejected from the castle moat. A LORD OF THE RINGS with no genearal illunination and a useless right flipper.  A MONSTER BASH with Frankenstien COMPLETELY gone from the playfield and Dracula disabled.  NONE of his location games have any backbox lighting whatsoever---gotta save a buck somehow. Oh what fun it is to play these so called GREAT games in their awesome condition.

   Sure I would rather have steak than hamburger but if my steak is burned to a crisp and my burger is perfectly cooked and juicy, I would take the burger anytime. Sometimes you have to eat what is available or you starve.        HATERADE anyone?
 

[nostrebor]

So my daughter goes to bowling league on Tuesdays. They have one pin, "High Roller Casino" at 50 cents a pop. It's "sorta clean" so I load up a buck.

The pops are dead, one drop target will not drop even if you drop an a-bomb on it. Slings are super weak, half the switches won't register hits. I can easily "hate" this experience because the game was screwed up. It took all the fun out of it.

Conversely, playing any good working pin is satisfying because you can learn something about the pin and come to a conclusion if it is more fun or less fun as Jim stated. Who produced it never crosses my mind. I get to spend a few pennies to do something I enjoy, and NO pin is so bad that you can't have a fun moment of discovery playing it.

To simply decide something is bad because of who produced or designed it, is narrow-minded at best.

[Xiaou2]

I still say any good working pinball is a good game simply because there aren't enough good working games to go around.

 You are saying, that because a game is New, that it Solves the problem
of Good -vs- Bad simply because its New?!

 I know what you mean.. but that is a joke man.

 A new pin can break down just as fast as a 20yr old pin.   Ive seen brand new
pins last mere months before failure of some sort...  Way before they have managed
to pay themselves off.

 An OP has no time to try to tear apart Pins to fix all the problems.  And that IS
a reason why Pinball is just about dead.  Manufacturers Have to design them
to be more durable.

 Given the choice to play a broken M.Madness, and a perfect
Ripleys... Id play NEITHER.
 
 Pinball is not just about what Works.  Its about what is GOOD as well.

 A) Go get Nasty burger
 B) Go get burned Steak
 C) Forget about both, and grab a Sub down the street.

 Option C is what most people are going to choose. 

(basically, spending money on Other forms of entertainment, OR buying their
Own machines and playing them instead)


 And even IF some people choose to try BBH... do you REALLY think they will
repeatedly pump money into it over and over again?  Nah.  Its lame.  The
only thing Sterns have going for them, is initial curiosity...  And that level
of income is not going to keep Ops buying pins... and is Not going to get home
buyers to plunk down their fist fulls of cash.

"What you got gainst womens"

 

 Woah... Thats HILARIOUS!  (not)

[smartbomb2084]

We need to read the posts people.  I never said anything about NEW being better.  I'm the guy that asked: "Can you say electro-mechanical?"  If you would rather not play a game because it is beneath your standards then I wouldn't want you to lower yourself.  I am not as worried about the theme or manufacturer of a game as I am worried about its physical playable condition.  If you can't play a perfet RIPLEY'S because it appalls you, fine, send all the perfect RIPLEY's my way and I will gladly play them.  It's only pinball folks.  I thought it was about having fun. Sometimes having fun is making the best of what you've got. If all I have is ROLLERGAMES ( UGH! ) I would turn down the sound, crank up the stereo, and hope the flippers are in good shape.  In other words I try to have fun PLAYING pinball not CRITICIZING it.  HATERADE anyone?

[Pinball Wizard]

... and is Not going to get home buyers to plunk down their fist fulls of cash.

Most home buyers (not collectors) that are looking to just add a machine to their basement will indeed buy it. The home market (again not collectors) are not looking at how the game plays or sounds, they look at how it looks and if the theme is good. Say Batman, a game that has a well known theme, is going to appeal to the average joe finishing off his basement even if the machine is good or bad (played it once at a tournament, can't speak to much about the playability) more so than buying a Monster Bash. Batman is more recent and more appealing theme.

I dunno, before I was a collector, I was perfectly content to play games that were dirty and probably weren't working 100%.  Didn't know any better and they were still fun.

 

I'll agree with you on that. Even as a collector I still go to the local arcade and play games that are dirty, complete features missing, weak flippers, broken plastics, not working solenoids (I played a Big Guns for 20 minutes on an already free game because the center post was stuck up), etc. These games maybe in really bad shape but it's cheap entertainment and really truly a fun thing to do. I mean crap food and $5 of pinball will vs. movies at now 10.50, I'll choose the pinball. It'll be longer, I'll be interactive, and might even win a few bets at games.

[Xiaou2]

Most home buyers (not collectors) that are looking to just add a machine to their basement will indeed buy it.

 I seriously Doubt that.

 Pinball isnt a hobby like painting, or RC cars.  You talking 2(used) to +$3000 here.
A person spending that much money on a game, is not going to be making
sheer impulse buys.  They are going to play it, and, check out other machines
as well.  Its called Research.

 And just like anything... Looks count.

 Pinball is supposed to be a work of art.  Not a generic photoshop nightmare
printed with a super low-res dot pitch.

 Half the price of a cheap car Remember?!  The thing should stand out like a
Lamborghini in the middle of the City.  It should Oooze beauty in every last detail.

 And yes, Sound DOES count.  Especially at the home, where there isnt a
buttload of background noises to hide the hideous low quality mono samples.

 In fact, its proven that good sounds can improve the Worst media.  And bad
sound, can make the Best media unbearable.

 
 To date, I dont think Anyone has made a good Batman pinball machine.
And theme isnt merely the issue.  Indiana Jones (Williams) is an excellent
game.  Probably one of the few movie games that is actually good.

 Put BBH (licensed theme) next to a Theatre of Magic (creative Non-Licensed theme).  Lock out the game, so people cant play... but only LOOK at the machines.

 Ask which game they would prefer to own based on mere looks.  Theatre of Magic, even re-made today, will outsell BBH 200 to 1.   And I would also make that bet, that even if you gathered people who never played either machine, would still buy
the Theatre's 200 to 1. Actually, Id be surprised if Anyone picked the BBH... even if
the BBH cost $1000 less.

 Things of Artistic Beauty always sell better... even if they are not well
known.  Hard to believe... but years ago... people actually had creativity and
imagination... and created ORIGINAL things!  *GASP* 

 Theatre isnt some Photoshop photo-nightmare.  Its intricately shaded ink
work by professional artists... and it shows.  If Stern were to make it
however... it would be something like a bunch of generic photos of Chris Angel...
and some horribly generic line work.  I wont even comment on the sounds and
music.  And the cabinet "art"... to puke over!

 Be real.  Stern has No competition, and they still are in the Death rolls.  Its not
because Pinballs wont sell.  Its because they try to sell Crappy pinballs... and
most people just are not having it.

[Xiaou2]

I dunno, before I was a collector, I was perfectly content to play games that were dirty and probably weren't working 100%.  Didn't know any better and they were still fun.

 I started out a video guy, and after getting dissapointed playing pins
that always were broken, was nearly turned off to pinball forever.  Personally,
I couldnt stand playing a game when an important feature was broken.

 The best example was Black Knight 2000.  I LOVED that game when it showed
up at the arcade.  Fast, great flow, awesome tunes...  And plopped half
my wallet every visit.  However, when the left flipper became underpowered...
and you could not make it up to the 2nd level... the game lost all of its flow and
gamplay.  It was no longer any fun to play... and I refused to play it again.
Instead of fixing it... the idiots simply removed it from the gameroom, probably
thinking it was fine... but that people just didnt want to play it cause it sucked.
 

 Im guessing you had played the earlier era games, (considering your current
games list)  which hardly have any features at all... let alone ones that effected
the game in a huge way.   Most modern pins just dont play well at all
when one of their features isnt working.

[Hoopz]

Pinball isnt a hobby like painting, or RC cars.  You talking 2(used) to +$3000 here.
A person spending that much money on a game, is not going to be making
sheer impulse buys. 

Yes, they are.

PBJ is entirely correct here.  It happens every day with people who have a lot of disposable income.  There's a mindset that is much different than for most of us. 

A common phrase that we used when I was in the financial sector was that someone had to inherit their money because they wouldn't throw it away if they had actually worked for it.

[Flake]

The only thing Sterns have going for them, is initial curiosity...  And that level
of income is not going to keep Ops buying pins... and is Not going to get home
buyers to plunk down their fist fulls of cash.

I have a SWT that is in great shape and plays perfectly.  I enjoy the game, I think its fun, the rule set is plenty deep and theme (IMO) cant be beaten.  Now its a Sega but I suppose Sega/Stern is interchangeable within the pinball community.

Point is, I'm not a collector per se, the only other machine I own is a Cyclone, but I threw down some cash for a newer Sega/Stern and quite honestly I'm perfectly happy with it.  Is it of lesser quality?  Yea probably, its certainly lighter than the Williams games I've moved around.  I dont quite understand the whole issue everyone has with Sega/Stern sound.  Yea there is only one speaker in the backbox but I really dont notice any difference in sound quality between the DM I used to own vs. the SWT.  I dont crank the damn thing up to insane levels but who really does this on a pinball machine? 

Anyway, my $.02.

My only complaint with Stern is that they dont have any unlicensed themes anymore.  But I suppose they must do what they have to to sell machines.  I guess nobody wants to purchase an original themed pinball machine anymore.  If thats the case, you cant blame Stern for providing the market with what they desire. 

[pinballwizard79]

Quick Xiaou....tell Tim Arnold how right you are

Edit: yeah thats every Stern ever made

[Q*Bert_OP]

Quick Xiaou....tell Tim Arnold how right you are

Edit: yeah thats every Stern ever made

Nope. He's missing Sharkey's Shootout, Striker Xtreme/NFL, and High Roller Casino...maybe others...

[WareWolF]

Xiaou2 is 100% correct.  Stern sucks and should die.  Nobody will miss them.

[Jeff AMN]

Xiaou2 is 100% correct.  Stern sucks and should die.  Nobody will miss them.

Yeah, the pinball world would be SO MUCH better without Lord of the Rings, Spider-Man, Simpsons Pinball Party, or any other of their games that are generally accepted as great. Thanks for looking out for the hobby!

[shardian]

I just love how every pin thread devolves into fanboy crap here. Is this byoac or rgp??

Crap like this is why I've decided to cease posting my pin projects here. Carry on.

[nostrebor]

I just love how every pin thread devolves into fanboy crap here. Is this byoac or rgp??

Crap like this is why I've decided to cease posting my pin projects here. Carry on.

Just use the ignore feature. I for one, love to see what other pinheads are working on. Even if it's a Stern!

[Jeff AMN]

I just love how every pin thread devolves into fanboy crap here. Is this byoac or rgp??

Crap like this is why I've decided to cease posting my pin projects here. Carry on.

Just use the ignore feature. I for one, love to see what other pinheads are working on. Even if it's a Stern!

Why would I use the ignore and turn my head away from the train wrecks that are Xiaou2's posts?

[Xiaou2]

PBJ is entirely correct here.  It happens every day with people who have a lot of disposable income.  There's a mindset that is much different than for most of us.

A common phrase that we used when I was in the financial sector was that someone had to inherit their money because they wouldn't throw it away if they had actually worked for it.

 Im not going to deny that there are in fact Some wealthy people who
drop major cash without any thought whatsoever... However,  that
number is a minority for sure.

 I know many well-to-do people, and most of them are very frugal
with how they spend their money.  They are also very picky, and
pretty well read up on what they intend to buy.

 Just because someone makes a New car, does not mean that a wealthy
person is going to buy it.  In fact, many cases, they will go to an auction
to buy a restored and or souped up classic.  But if they are buying a new
car, its probably going to be something they have researched very well.
 Something loaded with features, sexy, etc.   Not a generic Van.

 The only Pin Stern made that even comes close to this analogy is
LOTR... which might be comparable to a 911 Porsche with engine
problems and blown Kmart speakers.  ...where as Theatre of Magic,
would be more comparable to a Lamborghini. Most all the rest of Sterns
are more comparable to a Neon.    >.<

 You cant sell a Neon for the equivalent of a Lamborghini price,
to wealthy people, and expect them to sell well.   Strong Desire
(to both play and buy) comes from actual works of Art. And a Neon is no
work of Art, nor is it a highly sought after car.

[Jeff AMN]

See? Why now would I want to use the ignore feature and miss out on those sorts of inspired rants? 

[pinballwizard79]

From the PHOF website...

# Stern 1999 South Park (Solidstate)
# Stern 2000 Monopoly (Solidstate)
# Stern 2001 Austin Powers (Solidstate)
# Stern 2001 High Roller Casino (Solidstate)
# Stern 2001 Roller Coaster Tycoon (Solidstate)
# Stern 2003 Lord of the Rings (Solidstate)
# Stern 2003 Ripley's Believe It or Not (Solidstate)
# Stern 2003 Simpson's Pinball Party (Solidstate)
# Stern 2003 Terminator 3 (Solidstate)
# Stern 2005 Pirates of the Caribbean (Solidstate)
# Stern 2006 Nascar (Solidstate)
# Stern 2006 World Poker Tour (Solidstate)
# Stern 2007 Family Guy (Solidstate)
# Stern 2007 Spiderman (Solidstate)
# Stern 2007 Wheel of Fortune (Solidstate)
# Stern 2008 Batman Dark Knight (Solidstate)
# Stern 2008 Indiana Jones (Solidstate)
# Stern 2008 Shrek (Solidstate)
# Stern 2009 24 (Solidstate)
# Stern 2009 CSI (Solidstate)

He has not updated it for the BBH. Man I need a full weekend there so bad, that place is ---smurfing--- insane!

Yeah Q*Bert_24/7 you are right he does not have 2 of the 3 you mentioned :-) .... So "No Michael Jackson didn't ask to use my phone......but his sister did" - Goonies


Xiaou what can I even say to you that hasnt already been said by others countless time....c'mon dude cheer up some. Get drunk, go to the strip club, eat some wings & enjoy some pinball. I will even buy you the first lap dance if you want. Just dont post a thread about how fake boobs suck & they dont make em like they used to.

[Xiaou2]

 Dont know why anyone would buy that many Sterns.  All the better, leave the
good pins to those who have Taste.

  Xiaou what can I even say to you that hasnt already been said by others countless time....c'mon dude cheer up some. Get drunk, go to the strip club, eat some wings & enjoy some pinball. I will even buy you the first lap dance if you want. Just dont post a thread about how fake boobs suck & they dont make em like they used to.

 Thanks for the offer.

 Its exactly what I did last weekend     Friends & Food, Pinaball get-together,
friendly drunken ball bowler competition, strip club, lap dances...

 Fun times    Though, I spent too much at that darn strip club.  >.<

 I may seem overly negative, but Im merely just passionate about things.
The state of Pinball today is not good... but its not like its effecting my daily
life and mood.     

[Jeff AMN]

Eh, I think the PHoF is on the up and up. You have to report where that money is going or the IRS will really nail you for trying to be a non-profit company. If they're covering a modest cost of living expense with some of the proceeds, that's fine by me, because they do donate a lot of money to the Salvation Army. They even do special game nights where they take open donations and all of it is carried out that night by a Salvation Army volunteer, so there's no chance of anything goofy going on there. I'd have no problem donating to the PHoF, but I'll do it through playing their stuff, not just dropping money into a building fund.

[nostrebor]

I spent last year serving as the president of a NFP (6 years on the board before that). In Missouri, it is virtually impossible to slip anything by the govt. The accounting effort is huge compared to a similar for-profit organization. As long as there is no "profit" at the end of the year, they really don't care how you take in money. We do all kinds of different things to raise income and then give the excess to students in the way of scholarships.

Regardless of how the PHOF is set up, as long as the profits are donated, they are a NFP. If you're really worried about it, you could probably get a look at their books. Most states require a level of transparency for NFPs.

I'll be going there in June. I'll be sure to check their pockets!

[Xiaou2]

You go to a place where women crawl on you a little for money, and you spent your money and you got crawled over.  Wow.   Roll Eyes  I can understand it scratching that 'wanderlust' itch that some (all?) men get, but c'mon.  There's nothing special or noteworthy about the fact you went.

 Umm...

 A) I was not bragging... just stating that I had a good time.

 B) Im Single. Its not always easy to find a nice girl to stick around... and I seem
to have managed to meet enough Psycho's to make me consider staying single...
not to mention, the financial burden that a girlfriend can carry.  In fact, there
are plenty of woman just in it for the free ride... so in essence, you are still
paying for pleasure.

 C) Still, I love woman.  And having a beautiful one in my lap for a few moments,
is quite satisfying to me.

 D) If I was in a relationship, Id have no need or desire to go to the club.
However, I dont judge those who still do.  In fact, some couples go together,
or both go alternating on occasion.

 D) Its not like I go there every weekend.  Ive been to them maybe once every
3+ yrs... and usually dont go overboard with what I spend.  I might feel a little bad
about the money I dropped that could have went somewhere else... but then again,
I have some good memories too. 

 E) You go to a concert, you pay them to play music... they play music and then
you go home.  (your example could be extended to anything)

There's nothing special or noteworthy about the fact you went.

 There is nothing special or noteworthy about anything you say or do either.
heh

[Jeff AMN]

RGP is getting more hot on Big Buck Hunter. I still haven't dropped by to check one out, but now I'm really going to have to set aside the time. Everybody is pretty much saying that if they can come up with a good fix/protector for the Elk that it should be considered a great game. It sounds like a good game for casuals that just want to hit stuff, but that it's also fairly rewarding for those that figure out how to advance through the game.

I will definitely will seek it out and report back now.