1st project - rotating monitor - no name

[Haterot]

Well I have been here long enough that it was time for me to get started on my first cabinet.
First off I want to say thank you to everyone on the forum and the chat for all the help and answered questions. I especially want to thank
DaOld Man and weisshaupt for answering my questions about their cabs and software.

I decided on a rotating cabinet because, well partly cause I'm an idiot and partly cause I love a challenge. Rotating cabs are not for the faint of heart
or for those who aren't willing to do some research. I started this project with no woodworking or electronic skills.
After reading all the rotating cab threads and PDFs I could find I decided on a hybrid of sorts. I was not impressed with the Pizzapan/lazzy Susan form of rotation nor was I gung-ho enough for the Huge sprocket/motor form. I was using an LCD for my monitor and that just proved to be overkill.
Psychotech's design caught my eye and that is what I based the rotation platform on. I based my motor design and wiring on weisshaupt's Ghost in the Machine cab, which if you have never seen it, do a search it's a fantastic cabinet.

I decided to build the rotating part first. I figured if i couldn't get this to work it would be better to know that up-front than be knee-deep
in a cabinet design built around a failed rotating platform. My first stop was to buy parts. I had a few pieces (computer-wise) laying around but not a suitable Monitor.
Enter eBay and a nice 21.5" Samsung Syncmaster. Great colors, fantastic resolution and it looks good from all sides, either vertical or horizontal.
I am going to keep a running total of my bought stuff below and keep adding to it.
My next purchases would be from Digikey - 2 Magnetic actuator switches, 2 magnets and a DB25to RJ45 adpater.


And then from Solarbotics - the Secret Motor Driver Kit, GM3 Motor, traction wheel and other stuff.


Grabbing my newly bought router I fashioned a rudimentary trammel and cut out an 18" circle out of 1/2" oak.
A 5/16"x5" hex head bolt and 4 swivel casters later I had my monitor plate set up.


My next move was to solder together the parts for the Secret Motor Driver. I have never soldered jack in my life, and let me tell
you, when people say practice, you should. This was very nerve wracking as the PCB was small and the component parts were even smaller.
This picture is not very good but I did manage to get the 2 LEDs and the resistor soldered onto the board. It ain't pretty.


And then with the DIP socket attached


And finally with the 5 wire leads attached.


I was sure I had screwed something up. Either didn't solder it right, burned through the wires or left enough solder on the
PCB to short the whole thing out. I had a DPDT switch, which I planned to use if i could not get the software to work later on.
I decided to wire up the Secret Motor Driver to the switch and GM3 motor, just to make sure it was not fried.


Everything worked fine, first try. I was thrilled and a bit surprised. I had thought I would have screwed the pooch on
the whole electrical wiring thing. Sorry no video yet.

I then cut a 3/4" oak plank down to 25" long (the internal width my cabinet will be) and 9" wide. I used a jigsaw to cut a 7/8" wide x 3/4" deep
notch into the board where the GM3 motor will sit. Also cut 3/4" notches on the top of the board to place blocks to hold the actuator switches, so they
would be close to the monitor platform that will have the actuator magnets.




I then mounted the Secret Motor Driver to the back of the monitor brace, using a motherboard stud and screw
with a felt washer.



I then started laying out the wires and terminal blocks. Notice the I bracket I have across the GM3 motor to keep it in place.
This was about as far as i got on day 1 of the build.


I still have a lot more to do, including finishing the rotating mechanism and seeing if it actually works. Picking up the MDF this
weekend for the cabinet. Ordering a ton of crap for the CP and deciding on Artwork and a name. So much to do.  Againt hanks to everyone who
has helped me out and those who came before laying down the hard work for us newbs.

[Haterot]

GeForce 9400GT	$45.00	Computer	Buy.com
WD Hard Drive 350GB	$75.93	Computer	Best Buy
21.5" Samsung Syncmaster	$113.00	Computer	eBay
Magnetic switchx2	$12.20	Electronics	Digikey
Magnetic Actuatorx2	$6.16	Electronics	Digikey
DB25-RJ45 converter	$4.38	Electronics	Digikey
Secret Motor Driver Kit	$12.95	Electronics	Solarbotics
16Pin DIP Socket carrier	$0.30	Electronics	Solarbotics
Gear Motor Traction Tires	$4.00	Electronics	Solarbotics
GM Series Plastic Wheels	$4.00	Electronics	Solarbotics
GM3 Gear Motor bracket	$1.50	Electronics	Solarbotics
Regular Motor 2	$2.25	Electronics	Solarbotics
Gear Motor 3	$7.00	Electronics	Solarbotics
Round PCB Kit	$4.99	Electronics	Radio Shack
2oz Can of Rosin	$6.59	Electronics	Radio Shack
1pk 330 OHM  Resistors	$0.99	Electronics	Radio Shack
Solder Station	$22.99	Electronics	Radio Shack
Bearings (Roller Blades)	$13.93	Miscel	Dick's Sporting Goods
Project Arcade	$19.79	Miscel	Amazon.com
Countersink Drillbit #10	$7.49	tools	Ace Hardware
7/16"x2' Dowel Rod	$1.99	tools	Ace Hardware
3-28 Fastners	$1.80	tools	Ace Hardware
Respirator Air maskx2	$4.97	tools	Lowes
5/16"x5" Carriage Bolt	$0.97	tools	Lowes
5/16" Hex boltsx5	$1.00	tools	Lowes
1" corner bracing	$2.92	tools	Lowes
1" L-bracket	$2.97	tools	Lowes
Dewalt 616 Plunge Router	$107.00	tools	eBay
1/16" 1/2" Shank Slot cutter	$16.00	tools	MLCS Woodworking
1-1/8 Forstner Bit	$7.05	tools	MLCS Woodworking

[Haterot]

Well I finished up the wiring for my rotating controls.


And made sure to test each connection so I knew they worked and what went where.


I created a jig to hold my monitor and rotating mechanism so I can work on it easily and see how it turns and also to connect it, soon, to a computer to test the software rotation.


That was the back of the monitor brace board, here is the front. you can see the GM3 motor at the bottom, sans the traction wheel and at the top are the actuator switches.



aaannnnddddd here is mistake #1. I made the studes for the actuator switches to long. there was no way I could get the monitor plate with the magnets on it to spin without knocking off the magnets. so, coping saw in hand I took off about 3/8ths.


Here is the monitor mounted on the monitor plate with the magnets attached (velcro rocks!)


And here is the  monitor on the jig, front and side views.




That is where I am now. I picked up the MDF (and other things) for the cabinet, so I think I will start cutting the sides tomorrow or saturday. I also need to get my monitor setup hooked to my laptop to make sure the rotating works. The connection uses a parallel port interface and damn if I didn't have a ton of parallel cables a long time ago. So, i gotta go find me a parallel cable sometime tomorrow. More pics soon.

[csa3d]

Welcome to the rotation club!

You weren't kidding on the rotation portion of the project being challenging.  It's ultimately the most fun part of the project as well.  Fair warning - be sure you think about how you are going to pull the monitor in/out of the cabinet, because something will require you to pull it at some point in time.  Also, if you are a fast worker and get to the software part, be sure to visit our StartCom thread in the MalaFE subforum.

Can't wait to see how your project turns out!

-csa

[Cornchip]

  Turns out...get it? A little rotating monitor humor.

[Sosetsuken]

Hey Haterot, nice work mate,

how about Rotate-a-cade / Rotatarcade / Rotate-a-rcade?

[Haterot]

Captain we have wood! (Green chick in Star Trek, smoking  )


First things first. MDF is heavy. yes we have all read the wiki and forum posts which says i t weighs an ass-load.
THEY WERE RIGHT. This stuff is solid weighs a ton and requires the use of a good friend. Also be careful of the edges
they chip easily at the corners should you be taking a piece down from the warehouse shelf and accidentally drop them.
"Honest, Mr Lowes guy I have no clue how this thing got wrecked. Um can you get me another piece?" 

I would gather that most firs-timers look at people's projects and the sides of their cabinet cut out and think, that looks easy
enough to do. WRONG. Now I speak from lack of experience. I'm not a carpenter (I'm a doctor damit), but I put the old adage
measure twice cut once to the test. I measured about 10 times as I was drawing out the lines for the shape. Worse thing is,
as a beginner, you are more worried about jacking up your measurements and cuts than having fun. oh well.

Two hours later we have side 1. Beginners tip. When working with huge sheets of MDf you should have at least 3 sawhorses.
Found this out the hard way when I was cutting the top 2 feet off the sheet and at the end, the unsupported piece was bending
down, then caused the circular saw to jerk back. scary stuff.



Now this was honestly the part I had been looking forward to.  Got my 2nd piece of MDF on the 3!! saw horses and
then laid down and clamped side 1. Sketched out the rough shape and got to cutting with the circular and jig sw.


I got my new router and my new flush trim bit out measured the bearing on the bit correctly and went to town.
HOLY CRAP is this tool (and bit) the greatest thing ever??? mrroowwaaarrrrr and a few minutes later two identical
pieces.


Ugh, Mistake #2. When I was using the circular saw to cut out the rough trace for side 2 I made a boo boo.
When setting up my guide fence to run the circular saws base against I put the guide fence on the wrong side
when I was cutting out the top incline. I realized it but to late.


Kind of hard to tell in this pic, The good side is on the bottom and you can see where i cut to much off of the
top piece. So, my question is this. just change the angle of the good piece to match the bad piece or go get
some bondo and fill in the missing section? I have not done the flush trimming yet, my t-molding has not come in.
If I go the bondo method can I flush trim it and not have it break off? Any thoughts would be appreciated.




So all in all a good work day. Measuring and cutting the sides took a lot longer than what I thought, but I was being
anal meticulous as I didn't want to screw up (to many things). My plans are to get the other parts cut out then wait for
my t-molding to get in. I don't want to flush trim the sides without having practiced first. Screw the pooch there and oy! 

[Haterot]

Hey Haterot, nice work mate,

how about Rotate-a-cade / Rotatarcade / Rotate-a-rcade?

I could just stick with my theme name and disdain for all things and go with Haterot-acade and death emporium.
Nah to wordy, cost me a fortune on marquees.

As a kid I played in the Spaceport arcade in the mall (didn't we all) and since this is a nostalgia trip I am thinking of naming it after
that arcade. Not 100% definite on that as I have to come up with a theme/art to go with that name, but I still have some time.

[Haterot]

Update to show how far I have gone and how far i still need to go.

Got the sides and ledger boards together


All parts primed and ready for paint. protip, MDF soaks up primer like mad, make sure you buy enough.


My $20 coin door. Thank you eBay.


I cut out a 2" frame form the back piece of the cabinet, this way it gives the cabinet some rigidity even with the back door open. Not sure if I am going to paint the piano hinge.


I am going with passive venting, so i routed out some vent holes on the top.


The Backdoor attached.



Got the T-molding on and the monitor brace mounted. You can see the actuator switches attached at the top there and the motor wheel at the bottom. the bracket on the right is a physical stop, mostly a precaution as the mrotate program (props to Da Oldman) works like a charm and spins the monitor just enough.


And finally slid the monitor and it's back plate with casters into the hole and attached it with washer and nut.


I am working on the bezel and still deciding on artwork. need to get some other wiring done and mount the MB and HD on the inside wall. More pics to come.

[danny_galaga]

Good work. I loves me a rotatin' monitor. You certainly have gone more high tech than me! I wonder about the use of castors though. I feel it would work more smoothly if you used 'fixed' castors.

[DaOld Man]

Great work Haterot!

I was wondering if you have made any progress lately?

[Haterot]

danny_galaga,
You would not believe how hard it is to find 1-2" fixed casters. but i agree i th ink there is an inertia problem with the rotating caster which may be causing the current motor problems.

Da OldMan,
Not to much, ran into trouble with the rotating motor. I was all ready to put the bezel in. but the monitor is not turning 100% and I have to fix that before I can get anything else done.
I did mount the MB and HD and cut out a slot for the power plug, ethernet and fan intake on the back

[DaOld Man]

thats looking real good.
Wonder if you could replace the secret motor with a bigger one?
Maybe put a tire on it and mount it the same as the secret motor is?
Also, have you tried full speed to the motor?

[csa3d]

but i agree i th ink there is an inertia problem with the rotating caster which may be causing the current motor problems.

What motor problems are you having?  I had an almost exact same setup, and the motor struggled with the weight.. especially in the backwards direction.  Why?  Well, you mounted the motor at the bottom.  Therefore, there the motor likely also helps support the circular disk due to the hanging angle.  I ended up moving my motor to the top, and adding two support wheels made from fixed casters which the disk rested on.. instead of resting on the motor wheel.  If I recall, DaOldMan has done exactly the same thing.

If these are not your issues, then never mind.  I couldn't get that exact setup to work in my cab.

-csa

[Haterot]

well 2 problems. it's either struggling to turn and the motor slips or it doesn't turn it at all (motor struggles) I inverted the monitor so the cables were at the top to give it a little top heavy. That helped some but not enough. I will try to move the motor/wheel to the top but I am thinking with the weight of the monitor/cables/mounting board is to much weight for a traction/friction wheel. That's why I was thinking of going with the chain method.

[csa3d]

well 2 problems. it's either struggling to turn and the motor slips or it doesn't turn it at all (motor struggles) I inverted the monitor so the cables were at the top to give it a little top heavy. That helped some but not enough. I will try to move the motor/wheel to the top but I am thinking with the weight of the monitor/cables/mounting board is to much weight for a traction/friction wheel. That's why I was thinking of going with the chain method.

Nah.. it's all about implementation.  I went through three variations, so I feel your struggle.  Take a look at my images here.

Note the following:
1.  My motor wheel is parallel to the monitor disk, not 90 degrees
2.  motor is at top, monitor weight does not impace majority of torque
3.  The motor disk is supported by two wheel parallel to the monitor disk at the bottom
4.  I use exactly the same components as you

It's very easy now using this setup, for me to whack the monitor by turning it too fast.. same parts.

Let me know if you need greater explanation.
-csa

[Haterot]

csa3d did you attach ball bearings (look like in line skate bearings)  to L brakets instead of using casters??

after some study
You aren't even using casters on the underside. you are using the ball bearings as the support, friggan brilliant. I assume there's no center point/shaft.
are you worried at all that weight can be supported by  those two bearings are enough?

[csa3d]

csa3d did you attach ball bearings (look like in line skate bearings)  to L brakets instead of using casters??

after some study
You aren't even using casters on the underside. you are using the ball bearings as the support, friggan brilliant. I assume there's no center point/shaft.
are you worried at all that weight can be supported by  those two bearings are enough?

As a kid, I skated pretty hard, and have never broke a skate bearing.  They are built to be rugged for a reason.  After attaching the homemade "casters" to the bottom of the monitor support disk, I sat on it and rolled down the driveway to test.  It's not breaking anytime soon, I promise.

I think if you can stomach ripping apart your rig and trying it one more time, you'll get to a good place.  Took me three times

-csa

[Haterot]

I was in Vegas for the 4th of July b ut was thinking about this idea the whole time (Well no not the whole time). Yeah i think I can stomach tearing the rotating mechanism apart. Will give this a go this week and see what can be made of it.

Also I can't tell from your pics, but how did you attach the motor's body to that strip of wood?

[Richie Rich]

Hi, Haterot

Your rotating cab looks good so far. Hang in there with the rotating monitor, It took me six months of research  planning and building my rotating monitor setup but it is worth it in the end.

I noticed your motor wheel is at a 90 a degree angle with your monitor disk, have you thought about trying it parallel on the edge of the disk possibly at the top with supporting castor's on the bottom? Also to cure slipping problems you could try some spray on liquid tape on the wood where the wheel makes contact "just make sure to mask off your monitor and anything else you don't want over sprayed".

Hope your monitor turns out for you.

[danny_galaga]

I used ball races instead of castors too. simpler, and cheaper!

[csa3d]

Also I can't tell from your pics, but how did you attach the motor's body to that strip of wood?

When I bought the gearmotor from solarobotics, I purchased the right angle mounting bracket that came with it.  One bolt keeps the motor on the bracket, and two screws adhere the bracket to the wood.  I had to drill out the bolt hole a tad bigger using my drill to fit the bolt through.  I'm sure If I made a special trip to the store that step would have been unnecessary.


Then I made an adjustable "shelf" using some dremmel out right angle brackets, so I could adjust the pressure of the wheel on the rotation disk.  Notice how I turned the base hole into a slot on the brass braket.


Then it's just a matter of aligning everything and adjusting the pressure


-csa

[Haterot]

ugh. I was at 3 stores yesterday looking for angle brackets that could slide. I should have realized you machined those. I did replace my casters with the bearings and it turned better. I also put the motor parallel to the disc and it worked...somewhat. 

The only problem I ran into was that my disc that I am turning on is welllllll not  so smooth. So i need to re cut the mounting disc
But i think it will work. Going to try that tonight I hope, unless the lawn needs mowing.

[csa3d]

ugh. I was at 3 stores yesterday looking for angle brackets that could slide. I should have realized you machined those. I did replace my casters with the bearings and it turned better. I also put the motor parallel to the disc and it worked...somewhat. 

Don't worry, I did the same thing.  I was super frustrated with not being able to find slotted right angle brackets, which led me to my dremmel tool.  If you go the same route, definately CLAMP or temporarily screw the right angle bracket into something before using the dremmel on it.  Mine went flying half way through the cut, and I'm lucky it didn't get me or my monitor which was near by.

The only problem I ran into was that my disc that I am turning on is welllllll not  so smooth. So i need to re cut the mounting disc
But i think it will work. Going to try that tonight I hope, unless the lawn needs mowing.

I couldn't tell from your pics, but your wheel doesn't look super crooked.  I did make a router jig to cut mine, so yeah.. if you did it with a jig saw then I can see it being a bit off.  Another thing you might want to try is to completely REMOVE the bolted axel through a skate bearing mount.  My rotation platter is completely supported by only the "wheels", and since the monitor is at a slant, it's not going to pop out or come off track due to weight and gravity.  If I was going to transport the machine, it's real easy to also remove the monitor for safe keeping.

Keep us updated.  Hope your grass is short.

-csa

[Haterot]

Well, fortunately (or unfortunately) it has been raining the last couple days, so no mowing, just lot's of work.

My first attempt at salvaging my motor setup was to create a brace below the disc and place two  support wheels there.
This was not succesful, to say the least. the brace board was a little to low so I would loose contact with the wheel, then when the bearings came
back into contact it would cause the wheel to slip. bad bad bad 


So I stole a little thunder from the experts here ::cough:: csa3d ::cough:: and created a new backing board with support wheels at the bottom.
here you can see the layout as I'm working. motor at top, actuators switches to the side and one wheel installed below so far.


Here is the board mounted with monitor.  I retained the center pivot point and used one wheel at the bottom for support. mostly because the second wheel was getting in the way of the actuators. I had already mounted the wiring and motor and couldn't be bothered with moving the actuators again. Mostly because I dropped the motor/wheel while it was still wired and tore one of the contacts out of the motor. Pissed? yeah just a !(*Y#(! tad. But fortunately this worked out in my favor which i will explain in a bit.


So taking more advice from csa3d I busted out my dremel and a metric nut ton of cutting discs and went to town on several L-brackets, making them into sliders.  Protip: inform your wife you are doing metal work so when she comes out into the garage to see "what's up" she doesn't freak out from the shower of sparks.

So I mounted my motor/wheel on sliding L-Brackets (Thanks again csa3d) AND I mounted a new wheel at the top. My monitor is at a 25 degree pitch so tended to want to move forward a bit. the top wheel rides along the top of the disc holding it down. So I have the bracing wheel below, the 4 wheels on the bottom and the top wheel holding the monitor in place. the center picot point is still there but not nutted down tight, just turning on a bearing and acts as the center rotation point. The sliding L-bracket is the key to the tension/friction for the motor.


So I fubared my more powerful motor and had to hunt for the lesser motor the original wheel setup came with. Turns out with the stronger wheel i was having trouble with over shooting the monitor and had to install physical stops. These worked OK, I used felt padding as bumpers but they tended to 'bounce' a bit and would offset the monitor a bit. The smaller motor spins slower but stops dead when the actuators reach their terminus. Don't need a physical stop (took it out) and have had no problems since. So i got that going for me, which is nice.

So i got the inner bezel cut of foamcore. I went with an idea javeryh threw my way and I am happy with it. You may notice the foam core on the top/bottom of the monitor has an edge angled. yeahhhhhh Don't make your cabinet only an inch or so wider than your monitor diagonal if you are going for rotation. The chopped pieces were necessary to allow the monitor to turn. if you look close you can't see the edges behind the outter bezel both in horizontal and vertical mode.


so that's where I stand, working rotational monitor, working bezel, partially completed cab, no control panel yet, no artwork or marquee. Out of all the frustrating parts still to come I am stressing most over the artwork. I still don't have a theme for the cab. 

[csa3d]

 

I had to cut interior supports of my cab to account for diagonals as well.  I also found that the stronger motor was almost overkill after having proper wheel supports.  I used DaOldMan's stepper motor functionality in MRotate to slow down the stronger motor.  My felt pads also bounce slightly, but the stepper action keeps the bounce soft and within reason.  Only thing different I do next time is try some of those magnetic triggers you've used and to try to find a quieter motor.  It's not super loud once it's in the cab, but it would be nicer if it was less noisy.. for those 2am gaming sessions

Glad all has worked out!

-csa

[DaOld Man]

....to try to find a quieter motor.  It's not super loud once it's in the cab, but it would be nicer if it was less noisy.. for those 2am gaming sessions
-csa

The sound is part of the awe....

[DaOld Man]

I used DaOldMan's stepper motor functionality in MRotate to slow down the stronger motor.  My felt pads also bounce slightly, but the stepper action keeps the bounce soft and within reason. 

Have you thought about using a brake relay on that little motor?

[csa3d]

I used DaOldMan's stepper motor functionality in MRotate to slow down the stronger motor.  My felt pads also bounce slightly, but the stepper action keeps the bounce soft and within reason. 

Have you thought about using a brake relay on that little motor?

No.  Not sure I wanna much around with that setup anymore   It's pretty solid in general.  hehe

-csa