WOW New LightGUN Info !!! Woot!!! :)

[wbassett]

Well I got it working.

I found a broken wire, which explains why I was only seeing one IR dot.  I'm surprised I was even getting that.

I still need to tweak it is possible.  It's okay but still not totally accurate on the outer edges of the screen, but that sounds typical from what others have posted.

I've calibrated it several times and it is always sligtly off to the right.  Police Trainer is at least playable now though. 

It also works with 'recoil' but that's more annoying than realistic.  I stretched the spring some and it gives it more 'pop', but it's still weak and I ended up just disabling recoil.

I'm going to get an Act Labs gun and test them both out and see which one is more accurate, but for now I have one gun working.

For those interested, I tried the newest EMS drivers and it had problems.  I was only able to track the left half of the screen.  With Smog's driver I got it working.

Now I feel better that I didn't tank $60 but still feel for the price it should be a better gun and system right out of the box.

[arbrandes]

It's okay but still not totally accurate on the outer edges of the screen (...) I've calibrated it several times and it is always sligtly off to the right.

Ok, this sounds like what I experienced.  As far as I'm concerned, this is the only true design flaw of the gun:  calibration is *really* flaky.

Still, I was able to get it pretty well calibrated, enough so that it is accurate even at the edges of the screen.  So if you haven't yet, make sure you read this wiki, especially the calibration part:

http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/LCDTopGun

I don't use Windows, but the Linux driver uses the same fixed software calibration values specified in the wiki.  I suggest you do the same with Smog's.

Now, for hardware calibration, which as far as I can tell, is the only calibration that matters.  Make sure the LED bars are aligned as per the wiki, either vertically or horizontally but with the proper orientation.  And if you're going to use the laser pointer for this, *make sure it is properly aligned before you begin*; it loses alignment very, very easily!

Here is where I have to aim the four last shots (after the center shot) to get good accuracy.  The square in the middle is the actual screen, the outside square is the TV frame.

Code: [Select]

                    x
 --o----------------------------o         
|     ---------------------     |
|    |                     |    |
|    |                     |    |
|    |          o          |    |   y
|    |                     |    |
|    |                     |    |
|     ---------------------     |
 --o----------------------------o

I'm not sure how this is going to look on your screen (maybe should've make an actual drawing, .  In any case, center shot is really at the center.  But on the edge shots, you have to shoot outside the edges of the screen, not exactly on them.  Top shots and bottom shots are respectively at the same y, left and right shots at the same x.  However, left shots are closer to the screen (approximately half the distance to the edge of the TV) than right shots , which have to be taken at the very edge of the TV (about double the distance of the left ones).

[wbassett]

It's okay but still not totally accurate on the outer edges of the screen (...) I've calibrated it several times and it is always slightly off to the right.

Ok, this sounds like what I experienced.  As far as I'm concerned, this is the only true design flaw of the gun:  calibration is *really* flaky.

As I stated before, I do like the look at feel of the gun.  The recoil is enough of a joke though that they would have been better off for a vibrate feature instead of the 'recoil'.   

I had the gun apart and part of the problem is their gear mechanism.  The way it works is the teeth that catch the receiver slide is only a partial gear.  That way it can grab the slide, move it back, and then no more teeth so the slide snaps back home.  The problem is that the slide teeth then have to travel all the way around again and sometimes it only does a partial grab and only brings the slide part of the way back.

I don't know if this is a problem with other guns, but my slide strikes the thumb stick every time.  I highly recommend lightly filing the slide so it doesn't do this.

The spring is too week to really give any type of 'feel' to the recoil.  A simple stretch does help things (also a trick with springer Airsoft guns as a quick tweak to increase the FPS).  Even with the spring 'stretched, the slide is just too light for any realistic feel and I quickly disabled the 'recoil' option.

A solenoid thumper or vibrator would have been more to my liking.

Still, I was able to get it pretty well calibrated, enough so that it is accurate even at the edges of the screen.  So if you haven't yet, make sure you read this wiki, especially the calibration part:

http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/LCDTopGun

I don't use Windows, but the Linux driver uses the same fixed software calibration values specified in the wiki.  I suggest you do the same with Smog's.

Now, for hardware calibration, which as far as I can tell, is the only calibration that matters.  Make sure the LED bars are aligned as per the wiki, either vertically or horizontally but with the proper orientation.  And if you're going to use the laser pointer for this, *make sure it is properly aligned before you begin*; it loses alignment very, very easily!

Yes the laser does go off easily, but it's still a cool feature.  I noticed the cursor lags the laser so it's easier to just use the on screen cross hairs in my opinion.

As far as accuracy, yes I tried many recals and dead center it's always slightly off to the right.  Here's the best I can do for now to show it...

                                                                      l  x

Where 'l' is the physical gun sight and 'x' is the on screen cursor.  For the most part it is okay if you only use the cross hairs for aiming, but in Police Trainer for the accuracy and speed target shooting it's off enough that if you're used to using the 'iron sights' it will thrown your score off some.  For big body targets where a hit anywhere is a 'kill' it's not as much of a problem.

It does get further off to the edges, and I noticed that it's also not consistantly off to the right, but depending on which quadrant I am in, it could be slightly below, above, or even to the left.  It really only matters for precise shooting as I mentioned.

Here is where I have to aim the four last shots (after the center shot) to get good accuracy.  The square in the middle is the actual screen, the outside square is the TV frame.

Code: [Select]

                    x
 --o----------------------------o         
|     ---------------------     |
|    |                     |    |
|    |                     |    |
|    |          o          |    |   y
|    |                     |    |
|    |                     |    |
|     ---------------------     |
 --o----------------------------o

I'm not sure how this is going to look on your screen (maybe should've make an actual drawing, .  In any case, center shot is really at the center.  But on the edge shots, you have to shoot outside the edges of the screen, not exactly on them.  Top shots and bottom shots are respectively at the same y, left and right shots at the same x.  However, left shots are closer to the screen (approximately half the distance to the edge of the TV) than right shots , which have to be taken at the very edge of the TV (about double the distance of the left ones).

Yeah I tried things like that too.  I suspect that each person will have their own 'sweet spot' and it is just a matter of finding it.

That's part of what I feel is a deficency with this gun.  It's a bit too random and the hardware build for the sensors really needed some more R&D.

The Guncon 3 has two small LEDs and calibrates in two shots and tracks well (and fast) across all 55" of my HDTV.  The Topgun can be a little jumpy and as noted the screen edge tracking issues, and this is on a 21" screen.

I definitely give the concept a solid 5 stars, but I give the excecution 2 1/2 stars. 

I hope to have the Act-Lab gun soon so I can compare them, and then I can really evaluate quality and accuracy.  Still though, the Act-Labs gun only works on CRT monitors and is a bit expensive.

Unless EMS works out the kinks and gets the setup refined, as soon as another PC gun comes along I can see the Topgun quickly being replaced by many.  Many private individuals are working on a Wii mote gun for the PC, and I 'read' that the Guncon 3 that comes with Time Crisis 4 is basically the same technology but I can't confirm that right now.  If so, it is a better setup in my opinion.

[aljupy]

Hello:

New driver avalaible for XP in download section!!!!

It is the "official" made by HKEMS. Now totally mame and multiple topguns
 compatible.
Also it has Keyboard assign, and a  Edge´s configuration/calibration by software........So you can fine-tune calibration  , Autofire/autoreload options, and a "stability bar" to make the cursor less "shaky" at your wish.
 

It works perfect!!!!!

http://www.hkems.com/download%20-%20TopGun.htm

http://www.hkems.com/m_main.htm

Have fun.

[Fozzy The Bear]

Hello:

New driver avalaible for XP in download section!!!!

It is the "official" made by HKEMS. Now totally mame and multiple topguns
 compatible.
Also it has Keyboard assign, and a  Edge´s configuration/calibration by software........So you can fine-tune calibration  , Autofire/autoreload options, and a "stability bar" to make the cursor less "shaky" at your wish.
 

It works perfect!!!!!

http://www.hkems.com/download%20-%20TopGun.htm

http://www.hkems.com/m_main.htm

Have fun.

That's great! I'll give it a try....  Thanks!

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[wbassett]

Julian thanks for testing this out.  I finally got mine working at a somewhat acceptable level so right now I don't want to mess around and end up having it not work again.  After you get a chance to test and review their new driver, if it is better than Smog's then I'll definitely give it a shot.

[ChicagoDave]

Hello:

New driver avalaible for XP in download section!!!!

It is the "official" made by HKEMS. Now totally mame and multiple topguns
 compatible.
Also it has Keyboard assign, and a  Edge´s configuration/calibration by software........So you can fine-tune calibration  , Autofire/autoreload options, and a "stability bar" to make the cursor less "shaky" at your wish.
 

It works perfect!!!!!

http://www.hkems.com/download%20-%20TopGun.htm

http://www.hkems.com/m_main.htm

Have fun.

Wow!  This is great news.  Have you tried it with any of the PC Games (House of the Dead, etc.)?

[aljupy]

Yes, it works perfect for everything.

It seems now it is like a pure mouse, not the "directx hook trick".

It is the official, so it shouldn´t have any problem with any topgun model.

It remind´s a lot (too much) the Smog´s driver:

Pro (Vs Smog driver) : You do not have to Unplug / replug to save Settings

Cons (Vs Smog driver): At this moment, you do not have the "Profile manager" that Smog´s has. (I miss that A LOT )

BEST REGARDS

[ChicagoDave]

Yes, it works perfect for everything.

It seems now it is like a pure mouse, not the "directx hook trick".

It is the official, so it shouldn´t have any problem with any topgun model.

It remind´s a lot (too much) the Smog´s driver:

Pro (Vs Smog driver) : You do not have to Unplug / replug to save Settings

Cons (Vs Smog driver): At this moment, you do not have the "Profile manager" that Smog´s has. (I miss that A LOT )

BEST REGARDS

Thanks, can you  boot the system with both guns plugged in?  With Smog's driver, my system would lock up when the guns were plugged in a boot time.

It took me so long to get these guns somewhat stable that I'd almost rather jump into a box of knives, than change anything.  Did you have any issued with removing the old (Smog's?) drivers?

I know I have a lot of problems getting rid of the EMS drives when I switched to Smog's.

Sorry about all of the questions, but experience with these guns has taught me to be VERY afraid.  :-)

[wbassett]

It took me so long to get these guns somewhat stable that I'd almost rather jump into a box of knives, than change anything.  Did you have any issued with removing the old (Smog's?) drivers?

I know I have a lot of problems getting rid of the EMS drives when I switched to Smog's.

Sorry about all of the questions, but experience with these guns has taught me to be VERY afraid.  :-)

I'm in the same boat.  After having hardware issues as well as driver issues and now having the gun work at a mostly 'acceptable' level (but still with some minor issues) I am a bit afraid to start over and end up spending another month getting it to work again.  On the plus side, I am changing out my MAME computers soon so at that time I'll have to set things up again so I'll give the new drivers a try!

[aljupy]

Ok, now I understand your fears, I didn´t know why you didn´want to install the new EMS driver.

NOTHING TO FEAR RIGHT NOW, I had the SMOG´S driver for a lot of years, and it gives not any problem to Switch to the EMS one.
You DO NOT need to erase/Uninstall Windows nor even format the Hard Disk.
I have used the WINDOWS SP3 for this

After installing it I can turn ON  PC and it will not ask nothing about drivers. And I can connec my TOPGUN Before turning ON PC

Higly recommended

Regards

[aljupy]

Of course I UNINSTALLED Smog´s Driver.

Just Uninstall Smog´s one, Reset your PC, and install EMS  one

[arbrandes]

Thanks, can you  boot the system with both guns plugged in?  With Smog's driver, my system would lock up when the guns were plugged in a boot time.

I use Linux and have the same problem: if the gun is plugged in, the computer won't boot.  I don't think this has anything to do with drivers.  It is a hardware issue.  Just one more of the TopGun's quirks, I guess.

[aljupy]

I can turn ON my PC with TOP GUNS connected before it turns ON.

But as it says above, that is not a driver issue.

My Topguns are bought on the same month of released.

I would like to know your thoughts, this new EMS driver is pretty good. 

[TPB]

http://www.hkems.com/download%20-%20TopGun.htm

The driver's still a Beta version.

Is it stable ?

Does it have debugging code embedded into it ?

Are EMS conducting a Beta testing program, to iron out any bugs ?

Any word from EMS, as to when the final Production version of the driver shall be released ?


I guess no-one has the answers ... except perhaps the EMS reps. in Hong Kong, but I doubt they're regular visitors to the BYOAC forums.   

[GreatLamer]

I tried it out the new driver on XP32 SP3 and SP2 also. Works well, and looks like Smog's Guncon2Driver. EMS driver doesnt need to plug in and plug out after change anything. The functionality is the same: MAME and most emus work perfectly, but the Epsxe and virtua cop 2 have to use ActLabs Troubleshooter.

If anybody uses 2 guns under XP and mame, tell it how it works.

Is there a possibility to change the laser color? To blue, for example? - for two player a different laser color maybe a good thing...

Any fix for screen flashing in old softwares? I think this flash is from the original ROM code and unsolvable, but... Point Blank will be better without that in 2 player mode.

[aljupy]

As said. It works PERFECT. Not any bug found.

Multiple Guns works perfect!! (Mame and TroubleShooter)

Is there a possibility to change the laser color? To blue, for example? - for two player a different laser color maybe a good thing...

It is NOT possible, this lightgun just has a red Laser. For player colors you just have your game, not the laser of the lightgun itself.

Same on Flashing Screen. That´s a part of the game code, not the lightgun.

Best Regards

[lanman31337]

Some people were mentioning that they can't have light guns plugged in when they boot.  One of the members here asked about it on the HKEMS site, and let me tell you what I've found - it's in your chipset.  I had an ALI chipset on my ASRock mobo, would not boot.  Nvidia 570 and the 570 SLI will boot no problems.  If you guys who can't boot with the light guns have a VIA chipset, please let me know, or which Intel chipset it is.  Nvidia seems to have no problems.  Not sure about the new AMD chipset yet.

Tonight I'll give the new driver a whirl with both guns and report back.

[arbrandes]

Nvidia seems to have no problems.

I have two different Nvidia chipsets (nforce 4 SLI and nforce 430), and the TopGun won't let the system boot under any of those.

[lanman31337]

That's very interesting, since the 570 590 5 series is based off of the 4 series and just renamed.  Check your bios settings under both boards - see if legacy usb on or off makes any difference for me please.

[ChicagoDave]

Some people were mentioning that they can't have light guns plugged in when they boot.  One of the members here asked about it on the HKEMS site, and let me tell you what I've found - it's in your chipset.  I had an ALI chipset on my ASRock mobo, would not boot.  Nvidia 570 and the 570 SLI will boot no problems.  If you guys who can't boot with the light guns have a VIA chipset, please let me know, or which Intel chipset it is.  Nvidia seems to have no problems.  Not sure about the new AMD chipset yet.

Tonight I'll give the new driver a whirl with both guns and report back.

I have the nVIDIA nForce3 Ultra Chipset and I have the boot problem.

[lanman31337]

When you say boot problems, your machine will sit at the cmos screen and show all the information, but won't go any further until you unplug the guns, then it'll work fine?

[ChicagoDave]

When you say boot problems, your machine will sit at the cmos screen and show all the information, but won't go any further until you unplug the guns, then it'll work fine?

I honestly can't answer.  I use a TV with component video, so I do not get a display until I get into Windows, so I'm not really sure what is displayed.  I just know when a gun is plugged in, the PC never gets into Windows.  When I unplug the gun, it works fine.

It was never a huge issue, just irritating, so I never spent much time debugging it.

[lanman31337]

It's all good, I thought it was the chipset that was causing the problems.  Trying to come up with a solution for those who keep the guns plugged in.

[arbrandes]

When you say boot problems, your machine will sit at the cmos screen and show all the information, but won't go any further until you unplug the guns, then it'll work fine?

That is a fair description of the problem when I leave the gun plugged in.  I tried different USB slots, using a hub, using a *powered* hub, and nothing fixed it so far.  I'm gonna try the Legacy option in the BIOS, but in the end I'll just leave everything disconnected anyway, since suspending the system works better that way.

[GreatLamer]

It's all O.K. with nForce 570 SLI

I am playing the Virtua Cop 2 with the troubleshooter. It is ok but the epsxe can't work (after pressing F5 the crosshair moves around the screen edges - so Troubleshooter doesnt work).

I am very happy hearing the good 2P feature. Thanks the answer! The gun now being more enjoyable (maybe I will buy a second gun).

[ChicagoDave]

Can someone that has the new beta driver working post screen shots of their setup?  I just would like to see how you set everything up.  Once again, I'm paranoid to change anything....   

Thanks in advance.

[GreatLamer]

Like smogs driver. only two pro: no autocalib needed and not need to plug out and plug in the gun after change settings.
Not any special setting. If you install the driver, the gun must be work correctly (once i was with a HID device problem. just remove all usb hid device from system manager and refresh the hardware list)

[lanman31337]

Beautiful!  Question for those who are having problems with guns attached while starting - do you have the wire connected for recoil?

[ChicagoDave]

Beautiful!  Question for those who are having problems with guns attached while starting - do you have the wire connected for recoil?

I don't now, but I don't remember if I did when I had the startup problems.  I had to disconnect the recoil because the guns would randomly disconnect in the middle of a game.  I seemed to be some sort of USB power issue.  After turning the recoil off, the disconnect problems went away.  I do believe I had the recoil off at the time of the boot issues, but I'm not positive.

[fjl]

So has anyone used the wii mote for MAME?

[aljupy]

Yes.

It is nice, but you must play with cursor activated (wich I hate). Because to calibrate it,  is a pain.

Best Regards.

[Xiaou2]

 Greatlamer / All,   

 I think you should not play the guns with the laser on.   Only use that for
calibration.   The reason is that the laser can reflect off of shiny surfaces and go into your
eyes, and cause permanent damages.

 Even when calibrating, please be careful.

[GreatLamer]

Thanks the advice. I can't use the laser, only tried it three or four times. The laser pointer isnt recommended for games, I share your opinion. On the other hand Duck Hunt and Wild Gunman looks idiocy with red laser :-D

[kfisher]

So, are these drivers 32-bit only? That's the last thing standing between me and buying these guys... Since there was a recent driver update, I'm hoping to see a 64-bit build in the near future. Anyone had luck with these in 64-bit Vista or XP 64?

Any info is appreciated.

Thanks in advance...

[TPB]

Separate to the LCD Topgun drivers ...

Has anyone tried using Happ or Arcade lightguns, with this USB interface ?


http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=80261.msg838484#msg838484

[GreatLamer]

EPSXE team released a new version of EPSXE (1.7.0.) unfortunately the lightguns stay unusable without Act Labs Troubleshooter (lightgun crosshair moves around at screen edges). So pSX emulator is the second way to play PS-one lightgun games on PC.

[Malenko]

k so I got the drivers installed and they work, but MAME keeps saying gun 1 is gun 2 and gun 2 isnt even out of the box
it might just be the angle of my screen but I cant get the guns to be very accurate, the corners are really sketchy to me

[Xiaou2]

Try turning off all the lights before & durring the calibrations.   

 The LEDs can sometimes get overpowered by other light sources.... and thus
not get seen well by the guns receiver... thus making the accuracy mess up.

 Then, if its still acts up after that... try repeating that, and playing with the lights
off to see what happens.


Also, if the bars are pointed at angles... it may be possible that could cause inaccuracies,  but Im not sure about that.

 

[GreatLamer]

EMS TopGun Download Section

　

TopGun driver + panel v.1.0 beta 9 May, 08 (2K/XP)

Download : Link

This program supports both (#0718) EMS TopGun II and (#0508) EMS TopGun.

Supports MAME and other gun shooting games perfectly. With keyboard mapping function.

** This program also supports Vista (32bit), for (#0718) EMS TopGun II.