Dingoo or Caanoo?

[gman314]

I am thinking about picking up one of those portable emulation systems, but am not sure which one is better.  I am mosty interested in NES, SNES, Genesis, Neo-Geo, and Mame (2600, SMS, and TG-16 would be nice too).  Which system performs better?  Which one is easier to set up and use?  I am attracted to the fact that I would be able to carry a portable version of my arcade (the "Game Master") in my pocket.  Any recommendations?   

[Bender]

I was just wondering the same thing
The Analog control on the Caanoo worries me a little, I'm not sure how it will handle what is supposed to be digital imput

[Donkbaca]

what about the GP 2x Wiz?

[gman314]

Well, I think I have narrowed it down to a Dingoo a320 or the GP2x Wiz.  I, also, feel a little funny about the analog stick (as opposed to a d-pad) on the Caanoo.  I found detailed reviews for the Dingoo a320 and a330, but could not find much on the GP2x Wiz.  What would be the advantages of purchasing a Wiz as opposed to one of the Dingoo models? 

Reviews of the a320 and a330 can be found here:

http://gbatemp.net/t230291-dingoo-a330-review

[Donkbaca]

I have seen you tube videos of gp2xwiz, why th 320 over the 330?  I have a jailbroken psp, runs the oldschool console emus well, but apparently make sucks on it... That is about all I know about portable emus

[Nephasth]

I have seen you tube videos of gp2xwiz, why th 320 over the 330?  I have a jailbroken psp, runs the oldschool console emus well, but apparently make sucks on it... That is about all I know about portable emus

Is that supposed to be MAME?

[gman314]

What I've been hearing is that the D-pad on the a320 and a330 is not the most reliable.  Also, I heard that Genesis and SNES emulation can be iffy (or not even work at all) for some games.  Are there any known strikes against the GP2x Wiz?

[ahofle]

I have been extremely happy with the Dingoo a320.  Put Dingux on it and you will be happy.  Is the a330 just a faster model?

[Vigo]

I'm happy with my dingoo a320 as well. I think the a330 is an updated body mostly. the shoulder buttons on the 320 were weird, so they gave the system a face lift.

[Donkbaca]

With a psp you can play all the classic console emus, psx games and of course psp games. I think there is a decent final burn alpha emu. I have a snes, nes, genesis and SMS emu and they all work great. I haven't tried mame on it yet, but I hear it's not that great. How well do the gp32x and the dingoos run mame?

[wongojack]

I have a GP2x Wiz and its almost flawless for the things that you mention above.  There is so much content available that it will likely take a lifetime for me to 'test' all the different emulators with their games.

My GP2x Wiz does MAME emulation great - the only issue is that its a relatively old version of MAME that has been ported to the device.  NES emulation is done with a port of FCE which I've never noticed a problem with.  2600 emulation is basically perfect.  I've played with the UAE (Amiga) port and I would give it an above average grade.  Done less with the SNES emulation, but 97% of what you want for SNES is available according to the forum posters.  There is even some fledgling Playstation emulation that is actively being worked on.  Some PS games emulate 100% (oddworld). Genesis, TG-16, Gameboy, C64, TI, DOS conversions, homebrews, tons of stuff!

The Caanoo will replace the Wiz, and while you can still find some retailers selling the Wiz (ThinkGeek), they are running out and will soon be out for good.  Most people who have played the Caanoo don't mind the analog stick/pad thing.

Everything you want to know about GPH handhelds is here:
http://www.gp32x.com/board/index.php?/index

Software is here:
http://www.openhandhelds.org/

[Donkbaca]

Just for reference here is a list of psp emulators:

http://pspslimhacks.com/psp-emulators/

16 bit and fewer console emulation: I run these console emus, have no problems with them on my PSP

PSX/N64/Dreamcast emulation: I know the PSP does psx perfectly, there is a N64 emulator, don't know how good that is, there is no dreamcast emulator from what I gather. 

Arcade:  I haven't tried these, from what I have read FBA and Neo Geo games run decent, MAME runs really slow except for the old classics.

I am just wondering what advantage the dingoo/canoo would have over a psp with custom firmware, especially when you consider that the PSP also plays psp games that are actively being developed, and it plays PSX games better, and you can get one for about the same price or less than a canoo/dingoo.

[wongojack]

When I bought the Wiz I wasn't aware of all the PSP hacking that was out there, so the PSP didn't really get my attention.  I would have to consider it strongly if I were to be in that position again.  If you were to pick an advantage for the Wiz it would be that the device is open and you don't have to fight Sony to keep the thing going.  The community for GPH handhelds is also pretty active so there are contests and new development efforts going on.  This may be true for PSP, but I somehow doubt that one could be as open about it.

Having said that, I am 100% satisfied with the Wiz.  The MAME version that they've ported is called Mame4all and it is based on MAME 0.37b5.  The interface gives you the opportunity to scale the image, overclock the Wiz's cpu (which goes up quite a bit), set the audio rate, as well as other tweaks.  There is also a Neo Geo emulator for the Wiz as well as Final Burn Alpha - I've personally only used MAME for arcade emulation.  If you do a torrent search for something like  "full wiz mame romset," you will find all the compatible roms and could just get the gamelist quickly from there.

One thing to note is that there is no save state option in Mame4all on the Wiz.  Also, the emulators for Wiz are not directly compatible with the Caanoo, so I have no experience with that device's Mame emulation.

[gman314]

Well, after much deliberation, I decided to purchase the GP2X Wiz.  I'm still not 100% sure that I made the right decision though (even though I'm not sure that I made the wrong decision either).  The main reason I chose the Wiz over the a320 is primarily because of the somewhat mediocre review (posted above) that I read for the a320 (the a330 was rated even worse).  I wasn't too crazy about the fact that the a320's D-pad is apparently not always reliable.  Also, it has been stated that SNES/Genesis emulation on the a320 can be an issue.

Because of this information, along with the fact that I did not read of anything significantly negative, I decided to purchase the Wiz.  In retrospect, I am not too crazy about having only 1GB of built in memory (as opposed to Dingoo's 4GB).  Stupid question, but is there a specific type of SD card that I would need to purchase in order to increase the Wiz's memory?     Another stupid question, is one unit any easier to set up than the other?     Also, are the face buttons on the Wiz as awkward to use as they look?     I just wanna make sure that I made a good choice.  I also figured that the fact that the Wiz is slightly more expensive than the a320 might mean that it is better.   

[wongojack]

The Wiz's SD card slot takes regular SD and SD HC (high capacity) up to 16gb.  Most software you just copy onto it and go.  A card reader is not required, but it can be faster for large copies.  This guy's video shows how easy it is to put games on the Wiz.  He also posts on the message boards that I linked earlier.

http://www.gp2x.de/shop/product_info.php/cPath/35/products_id/107

Overall, the Wiz is really not that expensive and GPH offers a warranty with repair options if it breaks, so the risks are minimal.  If you ordered from ThinkGeek, they will take it back within a month if you say it didn't match your shoes (or any other reason).

The Wiz is kinda small so while the buttons are not really awkward so to speak, it is kind of a hand cramp to hold for hours of gameplay.  But every handheld is like that to a point.

[Donkbaca]

Cool, post a review!

[gman314]

I don't suppose that I could run a frotend such as Maximus Arcade on the Wiz, could I?  By the way, how much do the SD cards typically run?  I figure that I would probably be interested in one around 4GB - 8GB.  I guess this would be enough to store full romsets of the NES, most of SNES / Genesis, and some Mame / Neo-Geo (although after growing accustomed to playing Mame on an actual cab, it would feel a little strange to play it on a handheld). 

[BobA]

No  PC front ends will not run on the Wiz.

edit: spelling

[wongojack]

Regarding a Front End - You'd have to port a Linux FE to the Wiz yourself, or you could get the source for one and request someone else to port it on the forums.  If you have source for something like that, someone will usually get to it. 

If it works exactly how you want it to work is another question.

Another concern is that the device is supposedly capable of accepting a USB gamepad, but I've never tried.  The same cable that has USB is also your charging cable, so you'd probably have to mod the cable to get power to the device and have a USB device at the same time.  You could also open the Wiz's case and try to wire the buttons to arcade controls yourself.

If you want to try something like this you are better off using something like an old Windows Mobile PDA.  You can likely get them on Craig's List very cheap and I know others have built little bartops with them.

http://home.comcast.net/~lightnet/site/

[javeryh]

I use my PSP for emulation on the go.  It works great.  I've got NES, SNES, GB/GBC, GBA and Genesis emulators on there.  PSX games run great but the file sizes are too big.  N64 doesn't really work - major frame rate issues to the point where I just deleted it.  What I really wish someone would figure out porting the Zelda Classic program on the PSP...  funny that I don't use my PSP for anything other than playing the old school games...

[Donkbaca]

Have you tried MAME or Final Burn Alpha or any Neo Geo on it?  I haven't, maybe I will get around to doing it this weekend.

Yeah, for the PSX games, you can only have a couple at a time per SD card.

+1 on the old emulators, I had my PSP collecting dust, and then I found out about custom firmware and now its my portable all in one emulator!  I don't know it its just me, but I don't really like many of the psp games...

[gman314]

As far as the GP2X Wiz goes, can anyone confirm some SD cards (preferably 4GB and up) that are definately supported?  I want to go over to Best Buy to pick one up, but I am afraid that I will pick up one that is not supported.  On the following wikipedia link, it states that the SDHC format cards are no longer supported by the latest firmware.

http://wiki.gp2x.org/wiki/SD_card_compatibility

[gman314]

Also, is a SD card reader necessary or the Wiz?

[Bender]

As far as the GP2X Wiz goes, can anyone confirm some SD cards (preferably 4GB and up) that are definately supported?  I want to go over to Best Buy to pick one up, but I am afraid that I will pick up one that is not supported.  On the following wikipedia link, it states that the SDHC format cards are no longer supported by the latest firmware.

http://wiki.gp2x.org/wiki/SD_card_compatibility

seems like mixed results see the comments at the bottom of this link http://dl.openhandhelds.org/cgi-bin/wiz.cgi?0,0,0,0,42,488

[wongojack]

I use a Polaroid SDHC 16gb card.  A friend of mine bought the Wiz on my recommendation and he got an PNY 16gb card.  Both worked without any issue.  He bought his because it was the cheapest and I bought mine because there was a big rebate on it at Fry's.  Neither one of us researched the purchase beforehand.  I also have a SanDisk 1Gb card that I've used in the Wiz just fine.

Card reader is not required, you can transfer with the cable that comes with the Wiz.

Post your Wiz questions here: http://www.gp32x.com/board/index.php?/forum/67-wiz/

[SammyWI]

Interesting topic.  Got me looking into all of these.  I'm thinking about a Caanoo for myself.  I'm mostly into Mame - classic era stuff so I think I may like the Caanoo's joystick better than a D pad.  The reviews seem good.

I'm kind of disappointed that all the current models seem to have gone to built in rechargeable batteries instead of AAs.   I prefer to use rechargeable AAs whenever I can.  This seems like the best of both worlds to me.  Recharge in the device or swap out for a fresh set and recharge in a separate charger.   

[gman314]

So my Wiz arrived yesterday.  It is an awesome device, but I have some questions.  (I wanted to post this on the GP32x forums, but I am having trouble registering for some reason).  By the way, I successfully updated to firmware 1.2.6 with a 8GB Sandisk HDSC card.

1) Is there some type of global "exit emulator" (or exit to the emulator's menu) button?  Some emulators, such as the NES and Genesis ones that I am using, allow you to assign some type of button combination to exit into the emulator's menu.  However, for SNES (and other emulators that I have looked at but have not yet tried), the only way to seemingly exit the emulator is to power off the system.  I had to do this twice, and am scared to even try out other emulators because I do not want to have to do this again.

2) For some emulators, such as Atari 2600, SMS/GG, TG-16 (and probably a few others), I have been unable to locate the .gpe file which starts up the emulator.  Do I have to place each one in a specific folder or something?   

3)  Is there a way, when searching through an entire romset, to skip around by letter / page or something?  I was playing Abadox last night, and then wanted to play SMB 2.  It took me a good couple of minutes to scroll all the way down. 

4)  I have not been to connect to WiFi.  I though the 1.2.6 firmware would allow me to do so.

I would greatly appreciate if anyone could answer all or some of these questions.  Thanks. 

[gman314]

Update:  Well, I figured out how to scroll quickly (either L/R or Left/Right).  I also figured out that you can quit PocketSNES by holding the two volume buttons.  However, I have some more questions.

5)  How do you get to a control config screen in PocketSNES?

6)  How do you exit MAME?  Also, does anyone know the default button combinations associated with MAME?  For example, I figured out that "Menu + Select" result in the tab menu and that "L + R" pauses, but what combination results in "ESC"?  I'm assuming that ESC will enable me to exit back to MAME's main menu.  Also, I'm assuming that I need escape in order to clear the default button assignments in the Tab menu.

7)  When I click on a Gameboy rom in OhBoy, it takes me back to the Wiz's main screen (the one with Launcher, SD, Flash, etc).  How can I get the roms to work?  I can't even locate the .gpe file (I'm just clicking on the roms in the roms folder).

I will continue to experiment to see if I could figure anything out, but any help would be great.

[Bender]

keep us posted

I caved and have one on the way

[ids]

fwiw, I've had the Wiz for a while.  No real complaints, but also not using it much (no reason).  The Mame games I've run have worked flawlessly.  The only issue I'd say is that the controls are... what they are.  You're probably not going to get near your old high-scores with this.  A D-pad, another d-pad like set of buttons, etc.  My Galaga score is suffering with this, ymmv.  Some games can be a bit frustrating, especially for me when I panic and my thumb slips off the d-pad.  The hardware quality has not been an issue, it's just that playing games with these types of controls is sometimes challenging.  Otherwise, it makes for a great little mini-mame portable.  You can rotate the screen for vertical games, and the controls seem to follow the re-orientation.  I've jammed a 16G SD-HC card in there, and have plenty of room to spare; no console emulators at the moment, but plenty of the free games from http://dl.openhandhelds.org/cgi-bin/wiz.cgi

[wongojack]

These emulators all have a readme file that have the answers you are looking for.

The 2600 gpe is called wiz2600.gpe.  At least thats what its called on my Wiz - I have .ini files that help me launch these from the games folder, so I don't have to use the launcher, but there is a .gpe for it and it works.

A 'Control Screen' in Pocket SNES - 2 volume buttons together.  This gives you the chance to adjust options and then you can 'Resume Game.'  This is also where I've used the save state feature.

To exit back to the game select screen in MAME, I think the combo is L+R+menu where L and R refer to the left and right shoulder buttons - check the readme file for all the MAME button combos.

I haven't tried to run OhBoy so I can't help there.

[Bender]

Got the GPX2 Wiz today
Had Mame up in running in about 5 min
overall pretty good emulation
a couple of observations, the buttons on this are not great, passable, but seems like the week point
and for some reason when vertical games are played in horizontal mode a bit of the screen gets cut off on the bottom (yes I tried all the Apsect setting and still no fix)

AND mine came with a bad pixel
but it looks like thinkgeek has a good return policy, we'll see...

[Bender]

Got my replacement Wiz and all is good (About a week and a half from Think Geek)
Finally got my Dingoo too (took a month from Deal Extreme, got the Wiz retuned it and got another one all before this one even left china)

I have to say overall the Wiz is a better machine plays a lot more mame games with no slowdown and I have to say the Black on the OLED reminds me of the CRT days BEAUTIFUL!!!!

the only downside are the buttons, not impressed, the Dingoo's are better still not great but better

I was also able to get the Wiz to load directly to Mame, which is all I'm using right now so that is pretty cool
There might be a way to do it on the Dingoo, but I think then I'd have to mess with installing Linux

[ahofle]

There might be a way to do it on the Dingoo, but I think then I'd have to mess with installing Linux

How are you running MAME on the dingoo without installing Linux? 

[Bender]

well I'm running Mame4All Dingoo OS Native v1.0
not dingux

[Bender]

Well, I was so impressed with Mame emulation (for a handheld) on the Wiz,
I picked up a Caanoo (I had another reason but that's for another thread   ) and I have to say the controls work beautifully, I was very skeptical of the analog controls, but they work much better than any d-pads I've used, to me this is the by far the best handheld Mame experience, better than I could have hoped for, I'm pretty excited, I've got over 200K on Donkey Kong which I never thought possible on a handheld, blows the PSP, Dingoo, and even the Wiz out of the water, Highly recommended, plus it  has video out and USB pad in, but I haven't even played with that stuff yet

the only drawback is that it is an LED screen, the Wiz has it beat there, shame, this thing would be close to perfect with an OLED screen IMHO

to sum up Handhelds for Mame Emulation:

Hacked PSP, ok D-PAD, good ABXY buttons, analog controls poor, very difficult to get working properly, slow CPU, I could only get a handful of games to work properly $40-80 with pandora
Dingoo A320, ok D-PAD, ok ABXY buttons, slow CPU, very small and light, a little flimsily built $80-100
Gp2x Wiz, ok D-PAD, the ABXY buttons are a little awkward, good CPU speed, KILLER OLED screen, built pretty well, still a tiny bit of button shake $100
Caanoo, Great Analog controls (No Really), great ABXY buttons, regular screen, good CPU speed regular screen, a bit lager, but I like the bigger screen size, built like a tank! $150

Winner: Caanoo!

[KonkeyKong]

EXTREMELY curious to know how the USB pad-in works.  Please post if you have any info.

[SammyWI]

I picked up a Caanoo myself and just got back from vacation where I used it quite a bit.  Very impressed with the Mame emulation as well as Gameboy Advance and Sega Genesis emulation.  The build quality is solid.  The controls work well and are nice quality.  I like the analog joystick - it gives an especially good feel for games like Gyruss, Berzerk, etc.  The screen is nice and big but would be better in an OLED.  The biggest problem with the Caanoo is that the opening for the screen in the plastic case is slightly too small.  The edges of the screen are cut off by 2 or 3 mm.  This may not sound like much but in certain Mame games things are noticeably cut off at the edges.  Overall, it's tolerable but I think I may open the case up and sand back the screen opening to fix this.  Someone on the gp32x forums did this and it worked pretty well.

[Bender]

Just a little update on the caanoo
I finally got around to testing out the usb gamepad
The good news is that once in the emulators the gamepad works great
The bad news is the gamepad does not work as the main input(system menus etc.) so it prevents using the caanoo unhacked for a mini cab unless you leave access to the touchscreen

[SammyWI]

I guess I could give an update as well.  I did take apart my Caanoo and trim back the bezel.  Worked well doing most of the cutting with a razor knife and just a little clean up with sandpaper.   Hardest part was reassembling things - I kept missing getting parts lined up right.  A worthwhile mod, IMHO.