Some advice please- Jurassic park shooting game

[swamprat96]

Got a friend with one of these. It has an IR gun system(so he tells me) that keeps blowing IR sensors. It has a CRT in a deicated cabinet and I think its the first generation

1. If he's right and the guns are IR could I replace the CRT with a LCD or a plasma (CRT is on the way out)
2. Anyone know anything about the ir system used and where to get parts?
3. Finally any suggestions why its eating IR sensors?

TIA

[swamprat96]

OK - have I posted on the wrong forum? Yes it is a true arcade machine so I guess not totally BYOAC- but- I want to modify it so surely still ok?

Has seriously no-one worked on one of these? I've found the replacement sensors (betsons)- even found why they blow so easily and the fix (static kills the sensors and there's a sega board add in to fix). But I still would like to know if I can change the screen easily. I "guess" I can if its IR for the guns - but might have missed something

[BobA]

IR sensors that work with CRT type screens usually do not work with LCD screens.  Not sure if this is the case with the game you are working with but the whole light gun area is very much in the air.   The light guns on a dedicated arcade game will most likely only work with the type of screen used in the original game.

[swamprat96]

Interesting. So I may have a poor understanding of the IR guns used in this sega game. I have only experience with Guncons, Topguns and mame and I do understand how those work.  So I presumed that IR guns were the same theory as Topguns- but they read the sensors at each corner of the screen?

The guns are the same ones as used in HOTD 2 and 3 for arcade and Virtua Cop 3

[BobA]

I didnt realize your screen had IR emitters that could be sensed by the gun.  Which jurassic park game its it? 

[swamprat96]

its this one - http://www.segaarcade.com/archive/lostworld.aspx and click on deluxe cabinet. Massive big beast.

[bkenobi]

So there was a game that was built and released that used IR tracking way back in 1997.  That deluxe cabinet puts the user pretty close to the monitor.  I wonder why it's so hard to make a gun system today that works well?  I mean, there's NO way this would have sold if the gun wasn't reliable, so we should be able to have one made today using the same type of hardware, right?

I know this is the wrong thread, but oh well.  Maybe others will see this and look into the IR system Sega used.  I wouldn't know how to do anything with it, so...

[BobA]

Since the unit uses a rear projection screen the sensors probably will work with any type of screen of the same size to keep within the calibration limits.  I see that  there are alot of fixes for the IR sensors so they must be prone to damage hence the added protection circuits.

[grantspain]

i worked on lots of these,this is a common problem when the gun cables short out.
there is a upgrade kit supplied by sega that prevents this happening

your friend will need to disconnect all the screen sensors and visually inspect all for burnt out led,then disconnect both guns from the gun i/o board and check for shorts

anyone of those sensors remains with a short and then you can get more burn out so you will need to prove all are fine and the same with the gun cables

in some instances the actual gun i/o board can cause this

if i was fixing this then i would leave the guns disconnected and connect each screen sensor one by one to see what happens

[swamprat96]

Thanks to everyone for the help. I was wondering whether to take this on so I will now armed with this knowledge

Cheers

[Turnarcades]

So there was a game that was built and released that used IR tracking way back in 1997.  That deluxe cabinet puts the user pretty close to the monitor.  I wonder why it's so hard to make a gun system today that works well?  I mean, there's NO way this would have sold if the gun wasn't reliable, so we should be able to have one made today using the same type of hardware, right?

I know this is the wrong thread, but oh well.  Maybe others will see this and look into the IR system Sega used.  I wouldn't know how to do anything with it, so...

Regardless of the technology used, remember that arcade lightgun technology is usually developed or modified at length to work well with a specific game and cabinet setup, so more time and money could be spent fine-tuning them to work in unison. I think that although many home light gun technologies borrow from arcade systems, the problem is getting them working in an 'average use' scenario - the problem comes in that the combination of games/software/console technology/display type/gameplay environment etc. will vary to almost infinite different combinations.

[bkenobi]

I don't disagree.  All I meant is that the same basic technology in Jurassic Park is being used by Topgun, Wii, AimTrak, etc and people are complaining (to varying degrees) about calibration.  All I meant to point out is that that cannot be acceptable in a setup like JP.  As a result, even if there are variables not being considered here, the game must have played acceptably or else it wouldn't have been sold.

I haven't played the game in a cabinet (only through MAME), so I can only assume that it worked acceptably.  Now, perhaps the game designers loosened up the tolerance on the aim enough that close was good enough to register as a hit.  If so, then the same problems some people are experiencing on the home guns would have been seen in JP. 

Also, JP has a mirror that I didn't know about which would kick the gun that much further back.  It also had seats in the deluxe cab, so the gun would have been nearly at the same height for all players.  I don't know how the upright was setup.

[Turnarcades]

Also, JP has a mirror that I didn't know about which would kick the gun that much further back.  It also had seats in the deluxe cab, so the gun would have been nearly at the same height for all players.  I don't know how the upright was setup.

Virtually the same setup I believe - the better 'Lost World' sequel certainly did. I can confirm that these games had excellent accuracy in the arcades I played them in - just last year me and the missus ploughed through the interior seated cabinet version of 'Lost World' on just a few credits, as the accuracy and gun condition on that particular machine were in great condition, as they were on most.

Obviously the problems exist for the reasons I outlined in my last post when it comes to porting arcade technology home, though of course I'm also still both surprised and disappointed no-ones got it right yet.