Author Topic: Installed my Aimtrak into act labs gun. [Video Added] (Read 8510 times)

syph007 · « **on:** September 28, 2009, 08:01:27 pm »

Hey guys. My aimtraks were delayed in customs.. box was open and badly repackaged, all contents loose in shipping envelope which sucks, but nothing seems damaged.

Everything in the package looks as expected except, my only initial beef is that the included 4 pin connector only has 2 wires attached. I had planned on connecting both buttons on my guns, so I had to go ahead and add the other 2 connections myself, with pins i luckily had.

Pics 3 and 4 show the solder points I used. Only mod I had to do was cut the legs from the trigger switch, isolating it from the rest of the board. It has some weird shared ground system that was giving me grief.. but anyway thats all i did to the board besides cutting it down a tad.

I had a very short usb cable (white) I used to connect the sensor board to the longer supplied usb cable. Worked out great since the plug acts as a cable stop.

I wasnt sure how I wanted to permanently mount the pcb so I just made some temporary cardboard springs to hold it in place, and screwed it all back together to test.

syph007 · « **Reply #1 on:** September 28, 2009, 08:02:41 pm »

Here's what it looks like all back together, and with me giving it a test in House of the Dead. Seems ok, but something isnt quite right, I think I didnt put the sensor far enough forward in the gun, and I should not have left the original gun lens in.. will open and retry.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #2 on:** September 28, 2009, 09:12:41 pm »

Yeah, the instructions say to remove that lens. Nice work, though.

syph007 · « **Reply #3 on:** September 28, 2009, 09:32:29 pm »

Yup, retried with the lens removed and the pcb moved more forward. Its better but still flaky. I upped my usb polling to 500 to make sure that wasnt an issue. Really hard to calibrate, i find it makes me retry many times and the 3rd time the arrow at the bottom is 1/3 the witdh of the screen from the left.. not centered if its supposed to be. I had fun using it as a mouse in windows. HotD played better this time but really hard to hit anything in the corners and sometimes when i move to the corner it would cause the cursor to jump accross the screen back to teh center area.

I'll have to keep fiddling.

syph007 · « **Reply #4 on:** September 28, 2009, 09:42:33 pm »

Ok for sure weird in windows games. Im playing house of the dead 1 for windows. If i calibrate the gun perfectly at windows desktop, then launch the game , the guns range of motion is a small rectangle of the upper left of my screen. I guess due to the resolution change? Well I try to recalibrate but it makes me do it many times before it accepts one. Then this is what I notice while playing.. the rate of motion of the cursor is non linear. The speed is about 1:1 with my motion near screen center, but when i move to the outer 25% of the screen, the cursor moved about twice the distance compared to what Ive moved the gun.

Haven't tried in MAME yet, might work better there, will try area 51 next.

Neverending Project · « **Reply #5 on:** September 28, 2009, 10:54:24 pm »

The instructions on Ultimarc's site say that the third point for calibration is not in the center, but rather a bit off-center. Maybe this is why you are having problems?

Also, are you sure you're at least two feet back? From the pic of your monitor, it looks like you may be close to 2 feet. If you aren't far enough back, this may be causing the sensor to not be able to "see" the LED strip when you are pointing at the edges of the screen. Just a thought.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #6 on:** September 28, 2009, 11:12:31 pm »

I made sure to measure two feet, then stood back and held the gun up to that point, then stepped back until I was standing in a comfortable position. I looked at things around me to see where I was standing, and now that is where I stand (except tonight, when I sat on a stool and shot from the hip. Worked better for me most of the time. Obviously I was relying on crosshairs for position.).

BobA · « **Reply #7 on:** September 29, 2009, 10:15:52 am »

Don't know if the regular silver guns from act labs are useful but they have them on sale right now (discontinued)

Act Labs Silver Gun

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #8 on:** September 29, 2009, 10:22:30 am »

~~Yeah, I noticed that, but when I saw discontinued, I didn't realize they were actually for sale.~~
EDIT:
Nevermind. I added it to my cart and got this:

** You have a DISCONTINUED item in your cart ** DISCONTINUED items are no longer available from ACT LABS. To ensure speedy processing and delivery of your order, we recommend that you remove this item from your cart.

BobA · « **Reply #9 on:** September 29, 2009, 11:41:04 am »

Thanks for clarifying that. I thought they were for sale because they were discontinued. Wonder why they list them if they are no longer available?

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #10 on:** September 29, 2009, 11:47:14 am »

I couldn't find them by navigating the site. It was only through google that I found them in the first place.

bungy · « **Reply #11 on:** September 29, 2009, 11:55:10 am »

Quote from: BobA on September 29, 2009, 11:41:04 am

Wonder why they list them if they are no longer available?

They do that so it turns up in a search if you are looking for it. If they can get you in the store, you might buy something, or they might have a replacement. I used to work in ecommerce and it drove me crazy maintaining thousands of items that we didn't even sell.

syph007 · « **Reply #12 on:** September 29, 2009, 06:34:05 pm »

Ok now I'm in business! I gave up testing on my desk pc so I stuck my tv and pc in my unfinished cabinet for testing. Way better! I mounted the pcb on top of the tv with foam double sided tape, then just slapped back together the gun and plugged it in to test with House of the Dead 2. Works awesome!! I didnt try to recalibrate the gun in game this time, just calibrated in windows then launched the game.

Oh I set the correction mode to continuous as well and I found that to work way better. I was head shoting the zombies no problem.. very fun! I dont even have a working cp yet, but i can game on my cab! LOL. Love the product!!!!

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #13 on:** September 29, 2009, 06:38:02 pm »

You using crosshairs?

syph007 · « **Reply #14 on:** September 29, 2009, 06:43:01 pm »

This pc game has crosshairs on ya. Just about to try in MAME now.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #15 on:** September 29, 2009, 06:50:35 pm »

I meant are you relying on the crosshairs or are you aiming with the gun itself?

I do not aim with my hand;
He who aims with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I aim with my eye.

I do not shoot with my hand;
He who shoots with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I shoot with my mind.

I do not kill with my gun;
He who kills with his gun has forgotten the face of his father.
I kill with my heart.

syph007 · « **Reply #16 on:** September 29, 2009, 06:51:38 pm »

oh both i guess, im using the sights on the gun, but they are matching with the screeen crosshair. Not from the hip if thats what you mean.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #17 on:** September 29, 2009, 06:55:53 pm »

I'm still having trouble getting mine to line up, so I have to rely on the crosshairs until I can get this calibrated right.

syph007 · « **Reply #18 on:** September 29, 2009, 07:02:59 pm »

Im not having alot of luck in MAME. I turned on multimouse in the ini, but in area 51 I cant figure out how to assign it. My normal mouse plugged in is mouse1 in the system, so i assumed the gun woudl be mouse 2. I go to the key config screen and hit enter on x analog, but when i mouse the light gun left and right mame never sees it.. Yet i can move the cursor up and down on the menu, but cant get mame to accept it. Im sure im doing something wrong but not sure what.

Dartful Dodger · « **Reply #19 on:** September 29, 2009, 07:08:43 pm »

I'll consider the glass at being half full. If it doesn't work in MAME now I'm confident the MAME Devs won't let us down.

Good luck Ginsu, I'm hoping you can make this work.

If the guys who were motivated to buy this thing on day one can't get it to work, I don't have a snowball's chance.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #20 on:** September 29, 2009, 07:16:08 pm »

It works in MAME, I'm just having trouble getting a calibration I'm happy with. I'm always close, and always getting closer, to having a perfect calibration, just not quite there.

syph007: I set my aimtrak to device 3 in the aimtrak software. I set lightgun to lightgun in the mame.ini, then in the mame tab menu, I set the X and Y for the lightgun by moving the gun along the X and Y axis. I configured the trigger and other buttons by setting them as off-screen, so that in MAME, it doesn't freak out when you're moving the gun around as you pull the trigger, etc. Then I went back into the aimtrak software and set the trigger, etc back to what they should be.

Also, I only have a 19" CRT PC monitor, so I'm having to work with a smaller screen than most gun games use.

syph007 · « **Reply #21 on:** September 29, 2009, 07:23:55 pm »

Quote from: Ginsu Victim on September 29, 2009, 07:16:08 pm

syph007: I set my aimtrak to device 3 in the aimtrak software. I set lightgun to lightgun in the mame.ini, then in the mame tab menu, I set the X and Y for the lightgun by moving the gun along the X and Y axis. I configured the trigger and other buttons by setting them as off-screen, so that in MAME, it doesn't freak out when you're moving the gun around as you pull the trigger, etc. Then I went back into the aimtrak software and set the trigger, etc back to what they should be.

Ah ok I will try that now. I hooked up my speakers and have been playing HotD2 ... very very fun. I dunno if 2P woudl work though outside of mame?

Edit: Yes that worked. I have 2P working now in area 51, one with my gun the other the system mouse, each moving their own cursor. Pretty cool!!

Cananas · « **Reply #22 on:** September 30, 2009, 01:34:58 am »

Quote from: Ginsu Victim on September 29, 2009, 07:16:08 pm

syph007: I set my aimtrak to device 3 in the aimtrak software.

That is not necessary at all if you have only to change the gun Id if you have more than one. It doesn't matter how many mice you have connected. You only have to change For mame, mouse is one device and gun is another.

Quote

I set lightgun to lightgun in the mame.ini

Yep. that's the trick. You need to use -lightgun to use lightguns in Mame.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #23 on:** September 30, 2009, 08:35:27 am »

Quote from: Cananas on September 30, 2009, 01:34:58 am

That is not necessary at all if you have only to change the gun Id if you have more than one. It doesn't matter how many mice you have connected. You only have to change For mame, mouse is one device and gun is another.

It was necessary for me. I wasn't saying what he should do, but what I DID.

When it was set to Device 1, mine was freaking out. Once I changed it, the problem went away.

speedklz · « **Reply #24 on:** September 30, 2009, 10:33:17 am »

Nice quote from the gunslinger series.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #25 on:** September 30, 2009, 10:49:16 am »

Thankee sai. Fits my avatar, if ya can kennit.

syph007 · « **Reply #26 on:** October 01, 2009, 08:42:43 am »

Ok it's working very good in MAME now except for 2 issues which Im not sure how to fix.

1. I only have one gun plugged in and it's detected by MAME as Gun2, so I have to manually config each game to setup the controls. Can I tell MAME to use this as Gun1 somehow?

2. Since I have to manually config MAME when I tab in and try to tell it what analog axis to use for P1, I hit enter then move the gun on x or y. Every single time it detects both axis so it add x_axis AND y_axis. No matter how carefully I move it I cant get it to add just one. The only way I have made it work is by manually editing the cfg file and just putting in the axis I want.

Any suggestions?

ArcadeBliss · « **Reply #27 on:** October 01, 2009, 09:01:58 am »

My tip would be cfg magician. It is in the software section.

syph007 · « **Reply #28 on:** October 01, 2009, 09:41:14 am »

Ok I have a short video of some gameplay action, I'm not awesome , but I think the system is working great. This is me playing Zero Point in MAME. Finally have the accuracy dailed in. Very happy!!! I think only the ghost shooting shows the accuracy part (1:11 in the vid), it was feeling bang on for that.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #29 on:** October 01, 2009, 09:58:17 am »

Nice vid, but the question remains:

Are you relying on the crosshair for your aim? It's on, so I'd assume so.

If you can make a video without the crosshair and do well, I'd be impressed, but right now, I'm seeing the same thing I see when I play.

syph007 · « **Reply #30 on:** October 01, 2009, 10:25:06 am »

I don't think it would work well at all without the crosshair on due to the way the gun works. For example if you hold the gun and pivot your body with gun moving, the crosshair and sites DO NOT line up at all points of the screen. If the pivot point is the gun itself, then the crosshair and sites line up, but who plays like that? There will need to be more tweaks to the software to be able to use it without crosshairs.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #31 on:** October 01, 2009, 10:28:21 am »

I do enjoy playing this way, but I was hoping to play without crosshairs. I am satisfied with my purchase, only I can't use it the way I'd thought I would (at least not yet....here's hoping something changes with updates and better calibration on my part).

bkenobi · « **Reply #32 on:** October 01, 2009, 11:18:08 am »

Quote from: syph007 on October 01, 2009, 08:42:43 am

2. Since I have to manually config MAME when I tab in and try to tell it what analog axis to use for P1, I hit enter then move the gun on x or y. Every single time it detects both axis so it add x_axis AND y_axis. No matter how carefully I move it I cant get it to add just one. The only way I have made it work is by manually editing the cfg file and just putting in the axis I want.

That's the way my GunCon2's have needed to be setup. Sometimes (1 out of 10 or so), I can get MAME to detect the correct direction and not put both in, but it's not really worth the hassle. I usually just put in some setting for each axis and map the buttons for each player then manually edit things so they are correct. I don't know for sure, but I suspect this has to do with the fact that the gun will twitch a few pixels as it sits in one place.

If the gun doesn't work without the cross hairs turned on, then it's not a gun IMO. You can do better than that with the GunCon2, it's just a PITA to get working (and it doesn't work with LCD's).

syph007 · « **Reply #33 on:** October 01, 2009, 11:29:14 am »

Well I turned off all crosshairs and gave that a 'shot'. Works ok, I'd say I was hitting about 90% of shots compared to crosshairs on. I found though I really didnt like playing that way, I liked knowing where the shot would hit.. I guess thats like having a real gun with a laser sight. So I turned back on the crosshairs and like it better that way. It's not perfect I guess, but its fun and I don't regret the purchase at all.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #34 on:** October 01, 2009, 11:36:50 am »

Yeah, it's not exactly like playing a proper arcade or console lightgun, but it's fun and I love my purchase.

FrizzleFried · « **Reply #35 on:** October 01, 2009, 01:03:47 pm »

I want one but I have too many projects on my plate to deal with building a gun for it. I can't wait until a "complete" package is offered. Any ETA on that brother Andy?

AndyWarne · « **Reply #36 on:** October 01, 2009, 02:00:45 pm »

Quote from: Ginsu Victim on October 01, 2009, 10:28:21 am

I do enjoy playing this way, but I was hoping to play without crosshairs. I am satisfied with my purchase, only I can't use it the way I'd thought I would (at least not yet....here's hoping something changes with updates and better calibration on my part).

We need to find out why you cant get good calibration. Maybe I need to amend the instructions? Perhaps we can liase by email on this.
Andy

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #37 on:** October 01, 2009, 02:27:36 pm »

Yeah, don't take my posts as me slagging your product. Definitely not what I'm trying to do. I know it's still in its infancy and there are changes being made. I mostly have been trying to find out if I'm alone in having to play like this (which I'm enjoying) or if others are playing without relying on the crosshairs.

If I think of anything to ask, Andy, you know I will. For now, what I'm doing works well enough for what I'm after.

TheShanMan · « **Reply #38 on:** October 01, 2009, 02:41:14 pm »

Andy, I'd expect that most everyone here assumes there are a few issues that need ironing out with a brand new product, but that you will find a way to solve them and everyone will be just as thrilled with this product as they are with your other great products. Keep up the great work. Can't wait until it's time for me to order a pair!

Neverending Project · « **Reply #39 on:** October 07, 2009, 03:59:14 pm »

Quote from: syph007 on September 28, 2009, 08:01:27 pm

I had planned on connecting both buttons on my guns, so I had to go ahead and add the other 2 connections myself, with pins i luckily had.

What size were the pins? Not the side that would connect to the microswitch, but the side on the connector that plugs into the AimTrak?

Neverending Project · « **Reply #40 on:** October 09, 2009, 03:21:43 pm »

Also, did you guys get reloading working in Area 51? I have tried several combinations of settings, but can't get it working. Offscreen reload does work for me in CarnEvil, for example.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #41 on:** October 09, 2009, 03:30:39 pm »

It worked when I set Trigger to left mouse for both on and off-screen shots. (And, of course, set lightgun=lightgun in MAME.INI and turned offscreen reload = 1)

syph007 · « **Reply #42 on:** October 09, 2009, 03:39:07 pm »

I'm still using lightgun = mouse. It doesnt seem to matter I guess. Makes sense to me that its mouse though as that whats the OS sees it as.

Neverending Project · « **Reply #43 on:** October 09, 2009, 04:02:37 pm »

So from what Ginsu said, it seems that Area 51 requires the off-screen shot to register the same button as the normal trigger. By default the AimTrak sends an alternate button when shooting off-screen. And I am guessing that the other game I tried (CarnEvil) requires an alternate button to be sent as an off-screen reload.

Maybe Robin can chime in an shed some light on what the off-screen reload setting in the ini file does, and whether there is an easy way to change the Area 51 input.

This would be a good example of having a utility reprogram the AimTrak on the fly when launching the game, just like the UltraStiks.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #44 on:** October 09, 2009, 04:30:20 pm »

Quote from: Neverending Project on October 09, 2009, 04:02:37 pm

This would be a good example of having a utility reprogram the AimTrak on the fly when launching the game, just like the UltraStiks.

Andy plans on this for the future.

bkenobi · « **Reply #45 on:** October 09, 2009, 07:46:50 pm »

urebelscum (or many other people) would know better, but the difference between lightgun=mouse and lightgun=lightgun is subtle. If I understand correctly, MAME will only track the position of the gun if it's set to mouse as it expects to get constant updates on location. If the gun is set to lightgun, it will only update the position when you press the trigger.

FWIW, I have my GunCon2's set to lightgun=lightgun and offscreen reload is on. Area 51 works fine. Carnevil is too much for my cab's PC

, so I can't help you with that one.

Neverending Project · « **Reply #46 on:** October 09, 2009, 09:26:36 pm »

Quote from: bkenobi on October 09, 2009, 07:46:50 pm

FWIW, I have my GunCon2's set to lightgun=lightgun and offscreen reload is on. Area 51 works fine. Carnevil is too much for my cab's PC , so I can't help you with that one.

What do you have the AimTrak buttons set to for Area 51, for on and off-screen settings? Are they both to the same button?

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #47 on:** October 09, 2009, 09:41:26 pm »

Quote from: bkenobi on October 09, 2009, 07:46:50 pm

urebelscum (or many other people) would know better, but the difference between lightgun=mouse and lightgun=lightgun is subtle. If I understand correctly, MAME will only track the position of the gun if it's set to mouse as it expects to get constant updates on location. If the gun is set to lightgun, it will only update the position when you press the trigger.

I don't know the story on that, but I do know the crosshair will go where you point it, so that's all I care about.

Cananas · « **Reply #48 on:** October 10, 2009, 06:10:53 am »

To clarify:

How ActLabs gun works
The trigger is set to left mouse button when shooting on screen.
The trigger is set to rigth mouse button when shooting off screen.

What is -offscreen_reload option in MAME for?
Some many years ago, the ActLabs was the unique PC lightgun.
99% of lightgun Arcade games needs shoot to the frame to reload. One of the best place is the left-lower corner. That is (0,Ymax) position.

So this option in MAME traslates a right gun button pressed to a trigger pressed in the (0,Ymax) position.

How it works the AimTrak?
With the Aimtrak (as well as LCDTopGun) you have two possibilities to reload in MAME:

OPTION 1:
a) Configure trigger shot on screen and off screen to Left Mouse.
b) Configure MAME device lightgun like lightgun. If you don't have lightgun enabled this option will enabled it for that games using lightguns.
c) If I'm not wrong, when you shoot off screen with the Aimtrak, the cursor will set to (0,Ymax) and the trigger will be pressed.

OPTION 2 (ActLabs Compatibility mode (useful for Troubleshooting games):
a) Configure trigger shot on screen to left mouse button and the shoot off screen to right mouse button (just like ActLabs do).
b) Enable in mame the shootscreen_reload option and setup lightgun device to lightgun.
c) Each time you shoot offscreen, The AimTrak will press the right mouse/gun button. Mame will detect this and (offscreen_reload option is enabled) it traslates this rigth button pressed to a left button pressed in the (0,Ymax) position.

BamBam · « **Reply #49 on:** October 10, 2009, 09:44:54 am »

Quote from: Ginsu Victim on September 29, 2009, 06:50:35 pm

I meant are you relying on the crosshairs or are you aiming with the gun itself?

I do not aim with my hand;
He who aims with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I aim with my eye.

I do not shoot with my hand;
He who shoots with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I shoot with my mind.

I do not kill with my gun;
He who kills with his gun has forgotten the face of his father.
I kill with my heart.

Creepy $:-\$

bkenobi · « **Reply #50 on:** October 10, 2009, 12:27:13 pm »

I don't have an AimTrak....I have GunCon2's. I don't press a button for off screen reload. I hit the trigger off screen and it reloads.

Ginsu Victim · « **Reply #51 on:** October 10, 2009, 01:37:28 pm »

Quote from: BamBam on October 10, 2009, 09:44:54 am

Quote from: Ginsu Victim on September 29, 2009, 06:50:35 pm
I meant are you relying on the crosshairs or are you aiming with the gun itself?

I do not aim with my hand;
He who aims with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I aim with my eye.

I do not shoot with my hand;
He who shoots with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I shoot with my mind.

I do not kill with my gun;
He who kills with his gun has forgotten the face of his father.
I kill with my heart.

Creepy $:-\$

Not if you're a fan of Stephen King's Dark Tower saga.


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