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Author Topic: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all  (Read 6166 times)

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Bender

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What I want to build is a dual analog joystick CP for the XBOX360  (maybe the PS3 also down the road)

I've been wanting to do this for a while and don't have enough electrical knowledge to figure it out myself and was hoping with the wealth of knowledge on this forum we should be able to put our heads together and figure it out

because of a chip inside the x360 controller a panel must be built off a hacked original X360 controller

HarumaN has hacked every imaginable input on that controller except the analog sticks (though he said he would be willing to work on it)

the controller has 2 potentiometers that have a range of 0 to 1.61v
the analog joysticks I've seen have 5k or 100k pots, I don't know how those relate
so basically I want to hack a regular joystick to the inputs of the x360 controller's pots

so if any of that makes sense and you have any input I'd much appreciate it


found this on the interwebs

Part 1
Part 2

man, if that guy can build a tilt controller we should be able to add couple of analog sticks


« Last Edit: August 10, 2009, 03:46:28 pm by Bender »

HaRuMaN

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2009, 03:47:26 pm »
You need the resistance value of the pots from the controller.  Neutral (centered) resistance for both pots.  Then you would need to find the value for 100% North, South, East, and West.

The voltage doesn't mean anything in this case.  You need ohms.

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2009, 03:50:26 pm »
I think I can do that with an ohms meter, but how does that relate to 5k or 100k pots?

HaRuMaN

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2009, 03:52:01 pm »
I think I can do that with an ohms meter, but how does that relate to 5k or 100k pots?

That's the issue.  You would some how have to modify your analog sticks to match the pots on the controller. 

(5k or 100k pots referring to ohms).

HaRuMaN

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2009, 04:04:54 pm »
A quickie explanation that I hope makes sense:

I don't know the values of resistance on the controller pots, I'm making these up illustrate my point:

Considering the pot that controls N / S.  Say South is a resistance of 20 ohms.  Neutral is 40 ohms.  North is 60 ohms.  Somehow you would have to make your analog joystick read the same exact resistances for the same exact positions.

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2009, 04:11:31 pm »
ahhh, that does make sense, but how do ohms relate to the pot rating of 5k or 100k

what does the "k" mean?

on the happ analog joystick page it says  "Optional pot. amplifier PC board allows variable output from potentiometer"
could that be a way to get them to match up?
« Last Edit: August 10, 2009, 04:14:16 pm by Bender »

Namco

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2009, 04:21:53 pm »
I am extreeeeeemmmmly interested in this topic.

I know Quasimoto is already doing it on their panels and arcade installations:
http://www.quasimoto.com/images/1pcon.jpg

I know this one has a PS2 logo on it, but I their other cabs have xboxes in them:
http://www.quasimoto.com/images/as_images/ex/ex3.jpg

I think the point for us however, is to do this on the cheap. I would love to get those sticks they use on that panel, find out who the vendor is and place an order.

If I recall correctly, I think slagcoin said they were 100k pots. The just getting pots is easy, but the hard part for me is finding the right stick. The ones on the quasimodo panel are just perfect for what I had in mind. Anyone have one of these things willing to take some pics?

Namco

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2009, 04:23:46 pm »
ahhh, that does make sense, but how do ohms relate to the pot rating of 5k or 100k

what does the "k" mean?

on the happ analog joystick page it says  "Optional pot. amplifier PC board allows variable output from potentiometer"
could that be a way to get them to match up?

k means thousand. As in " this potentiometer goes from 0 Ohms of resistance to 100,000 Ohms of resistance, so it is a 100k pot"

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2009, 07:30:09 pm »
ahhh, that does make sense, but how do ohms relate to the pot rating of 5k or 100k

what does the "k" mean?

on the happ analog joystick page it says  "Optional pot. amplifier PC board allows variable output from potentiometer"
could that be a way to get them to match up?

k means thousand. As in " this potentiometer goes from 0 Ohms of resistance to 100,000 Ohms of resistance, so it is a 100k pot"

ok I feel a bit stupid now but, at least now I know



yeah, this thread got started cause GaryMcT and I were talkin about trying to make it happen and I mentioned Quasimoto to him
but I feel like they are very expensive and those controls don't look very comfortable to me

but the point is that they did find a way to do it

I'll bust out the Ohms meter tonight and see what we have in there
« Last Edit: August 10, 2009, 07:44:28 pm by Bender »

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2009, 07:42:09 pm »
actually looks like Quasimoto went the XFPS route.... Damn! :banghead:

look at this under the xbox360 adapter section
that's the first version of the XFPS in that photo there and the fact that they're including a wired controller with it I think proves that's the route they went
makes sense if they wanted to use the same panel for different consoles

the latest XFPS pro 3 is supposed to be pretty good but what a pain to use and itself is expensive and not wireless
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 12:26:16 am by Bender »

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2009, 09:51:02 pm »
ok, each pot has 3 pins

which ones do I measure between for what?

sorry I'm so slow on the electronics front

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2009, 10:16:26 pm »
seem to be 10k pots

the good news here is that almost all console analog thumbsticks are 10k also so theoretically you could wire the same cp to work with the x360 and the PS3
« Last Edit: August 10, 2009, 10:37:34 pm by Bender »

tcleary

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2009, 11:29:31 pm »
edit:  oops, you want dual analogs, so this won't help for that.  I can't imagine there are a ton of games you'd need that kind of setup for, guess it would be good for geometry wars.

i took the easy way out and used some sf4 te sticks for my x360 arcade control panel.  they are nice because they have a switch to set the stick to the right analog or left analog or the digital pad.  splosian man defaults to the analog stick so i just had to flip a switch, maybe that game lets you map it to the digital though.  it's nice not to have to worry about such things.  you could get the cheaper sf4 stick for around $60 now I think and save the trouble.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2009, 11:34:37 pm by tcleary »

Namco

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #13 on: August 11, 2009, 01:25:46 am »
seem to be 10k pots

the good news here is that almost all console analog thumbsticks are 10k also so theoretically you could wire the same cp to work with the x360 and the PS3

Yeah, 10K. I read it in the slagcoin article:
Quote
To replace variable resistors with steady resistors that will make it so interfering signals are not sent, first remove the resistor by heating the three solder point and pulling it out. For variable resistors used by triggers, usually one steady resistor is needed between the voltage source and the middle signal point. This will send a low voltage (which usually is not zero) and make the PCB consider it unengaged. 10K resistors usually work fine, but around 5K is often preferred so it does not affect much current in the PCB.

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2009, 12:19:25 pm »
Thanks namco!

I'd read that article a while back and couldn't find it again on that site

basically now I'm just looking for a joystick with 10k pots and I'll solder it in and see what happens

anybody know of a cheap Joystick that uses 10k pots?

Bender

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2009, 12:41:32 pm »
or is there a way to make a 100k joystick send a 10k signal, other than replacing the pots?

please excuse my ignorance, like I said I'm new to the electrical side of things

HaRuMaN

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2009, 12:51:24 pm »
or is there a way to make a 100k joystick send a 10k signal, other than replacing the pots?

please excuse my ignorance, like I said I'm new to the electrical side of things

Yes.  If you add resistors in parallel, they add like this:



So.  Adding a 11,111 ohm (11.111k ohm) resistor in parallel will give you a 10k ohm (combined) resistor.

Spectrum

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #17 on: August 11, 2009, 04:16:20 pm »
You may have already seen this but I'll throw it ought there anyway.
http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=618909&st=15
The 4th post down has the relevant portions of the PCB traced out for a wireless XB360 Controller

RyoriNoTetsujin

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2009, 05:01:41 pm »
Has anything more come of this thread?  Perhaps in a build thread I'm not familiar with?

I'm interested in potentially building/comissioning an analog-inclusive interface for PC/PS3. (For the usual fighters, MAME etc., but also for Williams Pinball Hall of Fame, which has tilt functions and the ball launcher mapped to the PS3's analog sticks -- with no way to change it in software.)

Did anyone source the Quasimodo analog sticks or something similar?  (WOW Quasimodo designs are incredibly ugly, by the way. Functional, which I appreciate, but UGH-leeee.)

Namco? HarumaN? Bender? I know you guys are up to something!  ;D

RyoriNoTetsujin

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Re: XBOX 360 analog controller hack... could use some help from you all
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2009, 09:45:50 pm »
Well now that I've had some time to do a little research/shopping, I'm going to add these couple of links (if for no other reason than so I don't forget them!)

Analog thumbsticks (with 10k pots) a la PS2/PS3:

http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/electronic-brick-playstation2-analog-joystickanalog-p-468.html

and a cheaper option (with what looks to be a nicer breakout board below it):

http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=9032

  
 

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