Ipac2 still powered on after shutdown ****PROBLEM SOLVED****

[Zaven]

  First of all i'd like to say thank you to anyone who takes the time to help me with this annoying problem. I've tried to figure this out for 3 weeks now, because i really didn't want to post at the first sign of it not working, and wanted to figure this out for myself without troubling anyone. Failed i guess I'll do my best to supply all the information i can think that is necessary along with pictures and video of my problem. Forgive me if i ramble, trying not to be too long winded here.

  Disclaimer: I have zero experience with any cab building (as most people when they first start:P) nor have i done any electrical work in my life. (i bring this up because i have perfect 360 happ joysticks)

  When the ipac first gets power, it flashes two times, and then goes off. Once windows starts to boot, it comes back on, and stays on the remainder of the time the board has power. I checked ultimarcs chart, and this "flash pattern" is supposed to indicate that the motherboard usb controllers are not turned on (at least this is the way i interpreted  it) With that in mind, i've checked the usb controllers, and anything else that has to do with USB support for keyboards, and even made sure i was using Usb 2.0 drivers. All of that is set correctly, but i still get the flash. Have also tested a usb keyboard on the pc, and it works perfectly

  Ok, this is the really tricky part. Like i said before i get the flash everytime. Sometimes though (i'd say 50ish%) the board powers on, does the flash, does it's thing, and when max arcade is loading, 5 keys get into a spam mode and go crazy (the reason i know it's 5 keys is because i have tested this problem in notepad and keyboard test when it's doing it. You will notice in the video included that when the max arcade demo nag screen pops up, some of the keys are getting fired like mad. at this point i have closed out max arcade and tested the buttons in notepad and keyboard test, and one thing that is a common theme is after the board goes into bezerker mode (firing 5 keys rapidly) the button presses eventually stop, but some keys become completely non-functional. At this point no matter what i do, reboot max arcade a million times, i can't select an emulator with the button i have set (player 1 start) until i unplug the ipac and reboot. Sometimes i have to do this several times before it gets working again. at this point, even if i try to use the keyboard to control max arcade "the same keys that don't work on the arcade buttons, does not work on the keyboard. Check out the videos i have included.



everything working as intended:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7o5A7qextM[/youtube]

Everything going insane:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHWM7gjmS9Q[/youtube]

  As you can see, some very odd things going on here. going to post a few pics of my set up, to see if there is any wiring mistakes that i may have made.


in this photo i traced my ground wire that is daisy chained with a yellow line, my question is: Should all of the ground start on one side of the board, and go to everything on the panel then back into the right side? Or is it ok, to wire each side to the ground connectors?




Ok, here are some additional photos that may be of some help:

player 1 wiring


player 2 wiring


close up of ipac2 wiring:


+5v supplied to Happ 360 joysticks

is this correct?

  Something that i hate to admit, much less mention here is that i put the perfect 360 joysticks in wrong, i misread the directions and didn't realize until it was too late. So instead of re-drilling holes, i figured out that left = up, right =down etc (this isn't  necessarily how it is exactly, just using this as an example) so when everything works right, the corresponding directional movements work fine. I am mentioning this just because i wanna get it all out on the table =) But i honestly don't think this is the problem. Ok, well it's getting late and i have to work tomorrow. I really wanted to get this posted tonight so i can check the responses at work tomorrow =)


  If anyone has a solution or and idea to try, i am indebted to you forever!

[swamprat96]

This might be stupid but in the video when things go bad you have cables running across the keyboard- and it looks like across keys? Tell me its not this......

Your wiring looks fine

OK to the Ipac2. On the good video the two short flashes then permanently on tell me that you are using a PS2 interface for the Ipac. But you are using USB yes?

Now on the bad video I don't get to see the start led sequence of the Ipac2. Does it just come on and stay on? If so suspect the x key on your keyboard or Player1 switch 6. Check both- try the following

Unplug the keyboard from the ipac and just leave it off altogether. If you like plug a different usb keyboard into the PC and use that when you need a keyboard. Now see if the problem returns...

If it does disconnect Player1 switch 6 (just unplug the microswitch) and try again.

If its still there post and tell us what happened

[Zaven]

This might be stupid but in the video when things go bad you have cables running across the keyboard- and it looks like across keys? Tell me its not this......

Nope, tested it without they keyboard and it still does it.

OK to the Ipac2. On the good video the two short flashes then permanently on tell me that you are using a PS2 interface for the Ipac. But you are using USB yes?

it's a plug that that is ps2 on the board, and converts to usb to the motherboard

Now on the bad video I don't get to see the start led sequence of the Ipac2. Does it just come on and stay on? If so suspect the x key on your keyboard or Player1 switch 6. Check both- try the following

Nice observation, i never noticed until now, but you are absolutely right, you found the problem! I didn't notice it, but the 2nd time i am booting, the green light stays on. when i turn the pc off by hitting the power switch on the motherboard, the pc shuts down (PSU still on, and the green light stays on the ipac2 forever... and when i turn pc back on, the light is already on and doesn't flash at all. I tested this several times, turn off the PSU to make sure the green light went off. Then booted, and sure enough, everything works perfect. It seems that when i am shutting down, the ipac is not turning off, not allowing itself to boot properly or do it's self check deal unless i cut power to the PSU. Is this normal? During all of this, the keyboard was unplugged, and i also unplugged player1 sw 6 and it still repeated this. Thank you so much swamprat, on to something already. Now just need to know whats causing this.

[Zaven]

Update: i unplugged the power to the happ joysticks and booted up, no 2 flashes. this time the board fires up and led comes on, and stays green, and all the buttons work fine (besides joysticks of course). rebooted (green light never went off) pc boots back up green light was on during boot. this time though, everything works perfect minus the joysticks because they are still unplugged (no power). I tried this 5 times, and every time worked the exact same.

ok, now i hook up the power to player 1 joystick, and now i get 19 flashes! but everything works (tried 5 times). So i refer back to ultimarcs chart, and 19 flashes means that player 1 sw 1 is the culprit. So i unplug that switch from the microswitch, and i still get 19 flashes

ok so i hook back player 2 joystick and i am back to two flashes but boots up fine and all keys work fine. So i reboot without cutting the power to the PSU and the green light never goes off, turn pc back on with green led staying on the whole time. As suspected. back to square one. As soon as i hit the first key, in keyboard test it shows like 7 keys getting spammed, and then i hit another key and they stop, and some keys are non responsive. I have no idea what's going on, but at least there is a pattern, and that pattern seems to be dead on without fail. Something to work with i guess. Ok, going back to bed for a few minutes before work thanks again for the help swamp.

[swamprat96]

Sounds like there's a load somewhere in the controls that the Ipac does not like-or something on the pc. I'm suspecting the PC. If I understand correctly you are just "warm" booting the PC - and I'm guessing that the PC does not cut power long enough to the USB to reset the ipac

EDIT:Before you try below just try shutting down the PC completely and waiting for the green light to go off.

Because you have been wise enough to use kwik connect terminals it will speed this up
Disconnect all the switches and joysticks - at the devices- not at the ipac - and now try. If the problem still exists then its either the ipac or PC.

1. If the problem is gone add one switch back at a time and test. That will isolate a switch fault
2. If the problem is still there , you need to test the ipac on another PC. If you can grab a note book or bring another PC close enough - try testing the ipac with the wires still attached. If the problem still exists on another PC its time to talk to Andy at Ultimarc. If the problem does not occur with another PC then its a power issue to the USB hub on your donor PC. If so try shutting down the PC and wait for the green light to go off. It has to go off eventually.

[Zaven]

If I understand correctly you are just "warm" booting the PC - and I'm guessing that the PC does not cut power long enough to the USB to reset the ipac

EDIT: I am fully shutting down the pc, but leaving the PSU on.

EDIT:Before you try below just try shutting down the PC completely and waiting for the green light to go off.

I have already done this several times, and if i wait 4-5 seconds the green light goes off, and i can boot back up and everything works perfectly.


With that information, should i still do the tests you mentioned?

[DeLuSioNal29]

Something similar happened to me with Maximus Arcade and my i-pac4.  However, upon further inspection (it happened outside of Maximus as well) I realized that it was a faulty I-pac.  Andy from Ultimarc send me a replacement i-pac chip and it solved the problem.  My problem was with p1sw1 by the way.  I simply swapped out the player 1 - 2 chip.

Here's some possible solutions on how to fix it:
Try downloading the ipac ultility to program it here:  http://www.ultimarc.com/winipac_ipd.html

-  Try setting a key to change your config and then program your ipac.  then revert back to the default and then program it again.  Sometimes changing the config and re-flashing the ipac will reset it and make it work properly.
-  Contact Andy from Ultimarc.  He can better suggest things to try.  Point him to this forum topic as well.

Some suggestions:  Run your test WITHOUT the keyboard plugged into the pass through on the i-pac.  This will eliminate any doubt that the keyboard is interfering with things.  Plug your keyboard directly into the computer while testing.  Once you get it to work, then you can use it through the pass through to troubleshoot further.

Also, once you get it fixed, make sure you are grounded before touching it and make sure the computer is OFF before connecting/disconnecting anything.  Even a small static discharge can ruin an i-pac.

Make sure you run your tests OUTSIDE of Maximus Arcade.  If they still fail, it's not MA it's something else.  Try to have the least amount of variables possible when testing.  Eliminate the frontend, so that you don't wonder if that's what's causing the problem, when it could be something else.

Hope this helped.

~ DeLuSioNaL

[swamprat96]

Zaven,
Whilst it could be a faulty Ipac I doubt it. Because the green light stays on for 4-5 seconds after shutdown- in a warm boot the Ipac is still powered on in its last state- so it can not reset. You are then trying to feed it a new set of instructions when it is still loaded with the last lot. There maybe a setting in the BIOS of the PC to slow down a warm reboot - so that the USB powers down. But the simple advice is always shutdown then restart- which is what I do with my cabs. I *think* there maybe no problem here. Its really common for modern PC's to do this- if I power down one of mine and pull the power plug it takes a good 4-5 seconds before the led on the motherboard goes out.

However I would try Delusionals tests- try resetting the ipac and see if it takes the instruction. Also forward this thread to Andy as he knows his ipacs back to front.

[Zaven]

First off, thanks for joining the party Delusional =) I tried reprogramming the ipac to default, still have the same problem. Also, have had the keyboard completely unplugged, and i am testing with keyboard test, outside of max arcade.

Whilst it could be a faulty Ipac I doubt it. Because the green light stays on for 4-5 seconds after shutdown

I think i may have answered you wrong earlier, you had asked me if i was doing a warm reboot. Actually, I am shutting the pc down via windows shutdown button (but leaving the PSU switched to on) If i leave the PSU supplying power to the pc, (even with the pc not running) the green light never goes off, until i switch the PSU off. At that time it powers down 4-5 seconds later.

[swamprat96]

Zaven- PSU is power supply unit?? Presuming so - it seems as though your motherboard supplies power to the usb ports/hub even at shutdown.

Whatever- the green led tells you that the IPAC is receiving power even when the motherboard is powered down. I can't see  the usb leads in the video clearly enough but I'm guessing they are plugged into the motherboard's usb sockets? Or is it an external hub drawing power from the PSU.

But as long as the ipac is powered up it can't reset. That might still be an IPAC problem. Can you try it on another PC?

Also- when you reset the ipac- it took the reset OK? If so another sign that it maybe OK

[Zaven]

Zaven- PSU is power supply unit?? Presuming so

yes.

it seems as though your motherboard supplies power to the usb ports/hub even at shutdown.

Yes, after shutdown it still has power.

But as long as the ipac is powered up it can't reset. That might still be an IPAC problem. Can you try it on another PC?

I am going to try it on my other pc, will be back in a few, and it reset ok.

[swamprat96]

I am going to try it on my other pc, will be back in a few, and it reset ok

So you are saying it worked ok on another PC?

[Zaven]

Poor choice of wording, what i meant was, i was going to test it on my other pc, and before i did that, i was letting you know that the board reset ok on the cabinet pc.

I just tested it on my main pc, i still get constant power after the pc is shut off. I didn't have the joysticks hooked up to any power, because i brought the CP to my desktop and held it on my lap. One interesting note though, is when i hooked it up on my desktop, it flashed one time, then went solid right after. I should note, i hooked the usb from the ipac to my G15 keyboard passthrough because the usb cable couldn't reach the back of PC, tomorrow i will get my brothers laptop to test things better, but i am starting to think the board is faulty

[swamprat96]

Yes I think it might be faulty. Time to email andy@ultimarc.com. Link this thread as well but explain the led power on issue to him as I think we've narrowed it down

I have an earlier ipac to you- just before the Ipac 2 where I have the big chip in the middle and the led down the bottom. The led goes off 1 second after shutdown.

[AndyWarne]

The OP did contact me about this problem originally but has decided to post all the information here rather than in email to me...
Anyway..
From the above it seems there might be an issue with the joysticks because everything seemed to work with them not connected. I would suggest disconnect the 8 joystick wires and check everything is working.

I am wondering where the joysticks are being powered from? If the I-PAC power is staying on all the time but the joystick power goes off when the PC is powered off, this could cause problems.

Some of the information in answers above is not exactly correct as this is the new I-PAC FS32 version.

Andy

[Zaven]

The OP did contact me about this problem originally but has decided to post all the information here rather than in email to me...
Anyway..

I wanted to post it here and then email you the link so i could video and pics and  get as many ideas as possible because the problem seemed rather tricky.

[swamprat96]

so andy could you point to whats wrong with the info? I was going off the web site for the Ipac- and I assumed the error codes are the same for all models?

[Zaven]

Still working on it, when I get home I will try what he suggested

[Zaven]

so andy could you point to whats wrong with the info? I was going off the web site for the Ipac- and I assumed the error codes are the same for all models?

Andy was very helpful. He told me that the board was still getting power from the motherboard, because there is a feature that supplies the power
so you can wake the computer by keyboard or mouse. He says that the board will not lose power, therefore not shut down when the power supply is still on.
The problem comes in when the joysticks lose power and the ipac2 does not. So his suggestion was to check the motherboard for a jumper that you can adjust to
turn the power off to usb after shutdown. Well my mobo does not have this jumper. He then suggested that i wire the power to the joysticks through the ipac2. While i think this could have worked, i opted for a easier fix that costed me 20 bucks.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7833785&st=usb+pci&lp=2&type=product&cp=1&id=1142298626004

I run the ipac2 through this handy card, and when the pc shuts down, all pci devices lose power. So now it works great. The shifted keys do not work however, i have given up on that =) I can always run some dedicated switches for that. I'd really like to say thanks to everyone who offered up some info, and helped me get this fixed!

[Ummon]

-hnh, dude, checking for a jumper costs you a couple minutes at most. I never had the problems you did, but I was worried about unit life with it being powered on all the time, so I found the jumper - in this case, it said KEYBOARD, handy eh? - and took it off. No power. Then, for a couple dollars probly, or maybe even almost nothing if you know where to look for one, you get a little connector with cable attached that goes from the +5v on the IPAC (that's why it's, um, there), and then connect the ends to your hot and grounds on the sticks. Really helps to understand the specs of all your hardware an all.

[Zaven]

-hnh, dude, checking for a jumper costs you a couple minutes at most

Where did you see me say that i didn't check for a jumper in this thread?   You're either assuming i didn't check, or assuming every motherboard
has a jumper. Either way you're wrong. Not only did i check, but i called the company that made my board and they said it does not have a jumper, and cannot be disabled.

Did you even read this thread?

Andy was very helpful. He told me that the board was still getting power from the motherboard, because there is a feature that supplies the power
so you can wake the computer by keyboard or mouse. He says that the board will not lose power, therefore not shut down when the power supply is still on.
The problem comes in when the joysticks lose power and the ipac2 does not. So his suggestion was to check the motherboard for a jumper that you can adjust to
turn the power off to usb after shutdown. Well my mobo does not have this jumper. He then suggested that i wire the power to the joysticks through the ipac2. While i think this could have worked, i opted for a easier fix that costed me 20 bucks.

Then, for a couple dollars probly, or maybe even almost nothing if you know where to to look for one

I realize this, and i just didn't feel like looking for anything at this point, i realized a solution, best buy is 2 minutes from my house, it was well worth spending the 20 bucks to me for convenience. To each his own.

Really helps to understand the specs of all your hardware an all.

He then suggested that i wire the power to the joysticks through the ipac2. While i think this could have worked, i opted for a easier fix that costed me 20 bucks.

Thanks for enlightening me on a problem already solved. Your advice (that was already given by other people days ago) is very helpful
Next time you try to make someone look stupid, at least read the thread first.