Putting together a joystick, what am I doing wrong?

[payment_due]

Here's the diagram that my joystick should follow.  Everything on the right is already pre-assembled so I just put everything together on the left.

The Actuator doesn't want to slide all the way 'down' around the z-stop and the stick itself won't go any further either, so I can't get the E-Ring on it.

Am I doing something incorrect here? Here are some pictures.

[Kevin Mullins]

When you try to push the actuator on, does it have a spring loaded fell to it ?
(it should)
You should have to hold the stick and force (due to the spring) the actuator up far enough to get past the groove so you can get the E-Clip on.

[payment_due]

Yes it has a spring feel to it but I can't get the stick any further than what you see in there, and the actuator won't budge any further either.

It's the strangest thing

[Kevin Mullins]

Is it new ?

Did it come with different size "pivot cylinders" ? (plastic bushing)
Do you have that on the correct side ?

[payment_due]

Yes they are both new, and the pivot cylindars (judging by the diagram) are supposed to go under the plastic washer just like in the diagram.  And both pivot cylinders are the same, either way they face. I tested the sticks with some older shafts I had and they slid right in, no problems.

I have no idea whats going on.  Maybe the plastic needs to be shaved or something, its just too tight of a fit.

[payment_due]

tiny update, just for shits and giggles, I tried putting the shaft through without the pivot cylinder and it went all the way through.

Will these sticks worth well without the pivot cylinder? 'course, this doesn't solve the problem with the actuator.

[severdhed]

 you need to have the pivot cylinder.    does the pivot cylinder fit through the hole in the washer?  what happens if you assemble the stick without the washer?    i'd slide the washer onto the shaft, then the pivot cylinder, then stick it through the hole in the base, attach the actuator..then apply firm pressure on the actuator so that you can get the eclip installed.

[payment_due]

Yes the pivot cyl does fit through the washer, so the order there is unnecessary. Also, the actuator doesn't look like it will move any further.

This is very strange. Do you think i got parts for 2 different sticks?

[payment_due]

One small thing I noticed, I dont know if it's significant is that the picture of the shaft in the diagram does not match my actual shaft. The picture shows a 2 groove shaft, whereas I have a 3groove shaft.

[payment_due]

Anyone else every have this problem?

[TelcoLou]

Not me .. I have those sticks. Question: did they come completly un-assembled?

[payment_due]

The spring/z-stop etc assembly was assembled. All that was left to do with them was to insert the shafts and set up the actuators/erings.

I decided I'm going to get rid of these things and go with some Sanwa sticks.  Screw it.

[Namco]

The stick looks to belong to a Happ Ultimate. Not a Happ Competition at all. Ultimates are like the Competition's bigger, heavier, slower, clunkier cousin. I'll post some pics in a second...

[Namco]

Here's my Happ Competition exploded. Square actuator, non-tapered pivot washer thingy, 5/16th inch diameter shaft, two rings on the shaft.


Here is the Happ Comp on the left next to the Happ Ultimate on the right. The Happ Ultimate is little longer and wider:


Ultimate has a 7/16th diameter shaft, a whole 1/8 wider than the comp, and it has the 3 rings on it for the e-clip.


Here's the Ultimate assembly. Note the round actuator that can be flipped for "4-way mode", the tapered pivot washer thingy, and the levers on the microswitches. The competition does not have levers on the microswitches while the ultimate does (because of the round actuator)


I think they gave you the wrong shaft. Sorry man.

But then again, the Competition stick I have is probably like 20 years old. Maybe designs have changed since then. The Ultimate in the picture is from 2002.

EDIT: Looking at yours again, the shaft does fit into the actuator, so it may be that the Competitions are actually that wide nowadays. Also I notice that the plastic part of the shaft/bat matches my competition and not the Ultimate.  Are you sure you can't push that stick down through the base to expose the second e-clip ring? Force it if you have to, man!

EDIT2: I measured it wrong. Fixed measurements.

[Kevin Mullins]

I think they gave you the wrong shaft. Sorry man.

But apparently the pivot cylinder AND the actuator both fit on the shaft he has.
If he had the beefier (larger) stick, then neither of those would have gone on at all.


The Z-Stop ain't upside down or something is it?
Is the actuator hanging up on any of the actual switches?
(just eliminating the simple out of the equation)

And both pivot cylinders are the same, either way they face.

What I meant was that the competition sticks used to come with two different "length" pivot cylinders. (in the little bag o parts) One short, one a little longer.

tiny update, just for shits and giggles, I tried putting the shaft through without the pivot cylinder and it went all the way through.

Hmmmmmm......

[Namco]

I think they gave you the wrong shaft. Sorry man.

But apparently the pivot cylinder AND the actuator both fit on the shaft he has.
If he had the beefier (larger) stick, then neither of those would have gone on at all.

Looking at again, I agree Kevin.

Payment_due, push harder man!!!

[Kevin Mullins]

Yeah, I saw where you were coming from though..... I had to stop and think about it myself.

It'll turn out to be something simple. One of them slap your forehead things.

[payment_due]

believe me, I've tried! I even have a rubber mallet and some bubble wrap I tried.. I literally tried bashing it in.

Will. Not. Budge.

So I figured what I would do is use my old shafts and new switch assemblies. I couldn't get the ERing on them either. I think I'm just going to get some Sanwa sticks with bat-tops, and get some octagonal gates to make them seem 'more American' and use those.  What pisses me off the most is that while I was trying to mess with the sticks, the CP fell and some of the brand new paint that I worked on for the last week was scratched off.

[Namco]

I'm looking at your pic a little closer, and it does look like the actuator isn't up all the way. Could it be resting on one of the red switch nubs? Have you pressed them all in while pushing the actuator up and moving the stick around a bit? I know mine hangs up like that a lot and this one looks new with very tight tolerances, like no deadzone making it very easy for the actuator to push up against the fully extended switches.

[Namco]

Here's my stick with the acutator down and the e-clip installed. It is pushed down and touching the base, and the shaft is sticking through and the e-clip is on the 2nd notch


In this pic I've removed the e-clip and the actuator has slid up and is now resting on one of the red switch posts.


Also, because the actuator is no longer pushing down, the round part underneath (z-stop which has the spring attached to it) is not being pushed up into the body of the stick. The actuator does fit onto the Z-stop, but rather pushes it into the body of the stick. Because the Z-stop is not pushed up, the shaft has "bottomed-out" in the body of the stick and you will not feel any spring resistance and you'll notice that the stick won't even want to move making it almost impossible to wiggle the stick to get the actuator clear of the switches. You have to push this round part up into the body of the stick. You'll feel the shaft against the spring and you'll be able to move the stick again. With that Z-stop pushed up, you can now place the actuator on the stick and wiggle it to get the actuator to clear the switches. Once you're clear of all the red switch posts, the actuator will be all the way down and exposing the shaft's e-clip notches will be easy. With my worn out stick it's easy to clear the actuator past the switch posts, but yours is new and has practically no deadzone it looks like.


So, take that actuator off and make sure you can push the z-stop in, it should be springy. Then get the actuator past those switches, may take some wiggling and some extra fingers, but it'll fit.

[johnnybleu]

I recently bought some Happ comp sticks, and had the same problems. Actuators wouldn't fit 'round the shaft. I also thought something was broken/wrong, or that I didn't understand the instructions correctly, but after reading up on joystick assembly (these were my first) I realized everything was in order, and should fit like that.

So I bashed, grinded, forced, sanded, and generally beat the living hell out of those actuators until they finally could fit. While they do go in far enough for me to attach the e-clip, they're still too tight as they wont rotate freely without moving the whole stick (and vice versa)- which I understand is a no-no.

Apparently, Happ got some new actuator for their comp joysticks, and it seems they don't fit so well. Seems this is a rather common problem with the newer sticks. I guess the solutions are to either use a drill to widen the hole, or get some "euro" style actuators from IL joysticks.

[Ginsu Victim]

Apparently, Happ got some new actuator for their comp joysticks, and it seems they don't fit so well. Seems this is a rather common problem with the newer sticks. I guess the solutions are to either use a drill to widen the hole, or get some "euro" style actuators from IL joysticks.

Supposedly Happ is shipping Comps with the problems fixed. When I went to Tornado Terry's, a Happ distributor, I asked if he'd show me the differences and he said that Happ sent people to his place to compare older parts and IL parts with the current parts, plus what modifications he'd done. They took the parts with them and made changes accordingly.

Also, I know RandyT has worked with Happ on correcting these issues, so anyone buying new Comps shouldn't have problems. (Assuming you buy from someone who has current stock. www.tornadoterrys.com and www.groovygamegear.com are both safe for certain)

[payment_due]

The ZStop does move 'correctly'. I can push it in and everything.  And I think I just found the problem. It's sort of a head-slapping issue, but not really.  The shafts on the sticks are different lenghts, and that explains why the stick won't go any further.  BUT, that doesn't explain why the actuator wont go in any further when using the new shafts.  Here's a picture of the zstop and the shaft sizes.

ZStop:  Notice where the arrow points. That lip is where the actuator stops, BUT if I use the old shafts, it (the zstop) WILL go in further, but I can't seem to get the E-Ring in for some crazyass reason.
 


Here is the stick length difference.  The bat-tops are different sizes, but if you'll notice, the bottom of the battops is where the shaft starts, and the new ones (clean) are about a half-inch too short! And when I put them in there, the actuator/zstop pair is COMPLETELY solid. it WILL NOT move.  When using the old sticks, it works like a charm. I just have the e-ring problem.

[MrMojoZ]

Apparently, Happ got some new actuator for their comp joysticks, and it seems they don't fit so well. Seems this is a rather common problem with the newer sticks. I guess the solutions are to either use a drill to widen the hole, or get some "euro" style actuators from IL joysticks.

Supposedly Happ is shipping Comps with the problems fixed. When I went to Tornado Terry's, a Happ distributor, I asked if he'd show me the differences and he said that Happ sent people to his place to compare older parts and IL parts with the current parts, plus what modifications he'd done. They took the parts with them and made changes accordingly.

Also, I know RandyT has worked with Happ on correcting these issues, so anyone buying new Comps shouldn't have problems. (Assuming you buy from someone who has current stock. www.tornadoterrys.com and www.groovygamegear.com are both safe for certain)

Or just Buy iL sticks from the get go and you have nothing to worry about.

[Ginsu Victim]

Well duh. 

[RandyT]

Or just Buy iL sticks from the get go and you have nothing to worry about.

Or buy the Comps from GGG and have nothing to worry about

RandyT

[Ginsu Victim]

Or just Buy iL sticks from the get go and you have nothing to worry about.

Or buy the Comps from GGG and have nothing to worry about

RandyT

Which is what I said in the first place.

[evitagen]

I may be wrong, but it sounds like the acuator itself needs replacing.  I notice it's black, which from my experience and others have been known to have a few bad apples.  I ordered a Happ Comp a while back and one of the black acuators fit very tight on the comp shaft, while the other slide on perfectly and "floated" in place like it's meant.

Like everyone said, just order from GGG or buy a white acuator.  Or get a dremel tool and sand down the inside diameter of the acuator until it fits loose(but not too loose, obviously).

That is, if the acuator is the problem.

Oh, and my happ competitions have three places for e-clips so I don't think you have the wrong shaft.

Just my 2 cents, anyway.