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Author Topic: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)  (Read 1239 times)

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johnnybleu

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Ok, sorry for all the questions, but I've been digging, and searching for days and I'm still not sure about some things.

Basically, I have a working Dynamo HS5 cab, with a Lethal Enforcers conversion inside. My aim is to just dump my PC in there and have a decent Mame cab. At this point, I have the PC all set up, configured, and ready to go, and my control panel is all wired up and working. The next step would be to get the PC in the cab, and hook it up to the monitor, and this is where I have a few questions.

1- I'm going with a VGA cable hack, and Soft-15KHz. I have my cable hacked and mapped out, but don't know what wires should go where on the monitor board- they're not labeled. The RGB wires are fairly obvious, but then there's two more wires on a separate connector- I assume Ground, and H/V Sync. Is there a way to find out which is which? The monitor is a Zenith, and the two wires in question are white, and white with a black stripe.

2- My second question is; can I power the arcade monitor (and marquee light) with my PC's power supply, or power my PC with the arcade's power supply? The simple reason is that I'd like to have one switch that does everything, and one plug to power the whole cab. I know the easy way around this is with a Smartstrip... I mean, if it requires clever (and dangerous) rewiring of the cab and monitor, I'll just go with a smartstrip, but if it's just a matter of plugging a harness into my PC's power supply, that'd be the way for me.

3- Will the monitor even power up without the game's PCB inside? Right now, I just unplugged all the harnesses I could find, and pulled out the board. I assume the monitor gets it's juice from the power supply, and doesn't need the game board to work? The plan is to put my PC where the game board used to sit.

Thanks a million! This project would be simply impossible without all the info I got from this site!

HaRuMaN

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2009, 09:33:42 am »
1) don't know
2) No
3) Yes

fa001

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2009, 12:15:36 pm »
1) Check out Ultimarc's site, http://www.ultimarc.com/monfaq.html#monitorcable . They have information on the breakout of the VGA cable.  Also since Lethal Enforcers is JAMMA you can check the wiring at the board connector. Pin P is video sync and Pin 14 is video ground. Model number of the monitor would be useful to find the pinout of it.

2) This one has been covered a lot. Basically you probably need an isolation transformer for the monitor and 115v for the PC supply.

3) Yes, but you might not be able to see anything without an image source.


johnnybleu

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2009, 02:12:35 pm »
I never thought of tracing the wires back to the Jamma harness..... So yeah, the one with the black stripe is V ground, and the solid white one is sync. Now that's figured out.

Ya know, I think I'm gonna skip the power supply thing.... There is an iso transformer in the cab and all that, but it just seems like it would be too much work. I'll just figure out a way to turn on both supplies with one switch, or something. Even if I have to power on the cab with two switches, it wouldn't be the end of the world.  :-\

Thanks for the help!

CheffoJeffo

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2009, 02:15:52 pm »
The monitor does not get power from the switching power supply -- that provides +5VDC, +12VDC and -5VDC to the game board and possibly to the lights/counter (if any) on the coin door.

The monitor runs on AC power and may connect to the AC main at the power supply as it is a convenient place to do so. Depending on the monitor, it may need to be run through an isolation transformer (if so, it is probably already in the cab).

EDIT: You may well kill the existing power supply if you run it without a board.
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johnnybleu

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2009, 05:40:31 pm »
Ok, so what you're saying is that the monitor is on it's own circuit that has nothing do to with the power supply- except maybe to get an AC current?

That would mean that I could tap into any AC supply to power the monitor, provided it's still on it's own circuit with the isolation transformer, right? Without the board, the cabinet's power supply is only running the coin door lights and marquee then?

Now, when you say I "may well kill" the power supply by running it without the pcb, do you mean it might damage it, or that I might as well remove it as it's not really needed?

I'm just trying to make sense of all the information I'm uncovering... Seems there's lots of differing opinions. How would people usually run an arcade monitor with Mame?

CheffoJeffo

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2009, 06:18:01 pm »
Ok, so what you're saying is that the monitor is on it's own circuit that has nothing do to with the power supply- except maybe to get an AC current?

Right -- since the power supply is fed with AC, it is a convenient place to tap into that power (instead of, say, having a separate plug running out the back of the cabinet).

That would mean that I could tap into any AC supply to power the monitor, provided it's still on it's own circuit with the isolation transformer, right? Without the board, the cabinet's power supply is only running the coin door lights and marquee then?

Yes and you will need to tap into the AC for your marquee lights as well (most likely it is a flourescent 115V fixture).

Now, when you say I "may well kill" the power supply by running it without the pcb, do you mean it might damage it, or that I might as well remove it as it's not really needed?

The former, which leads to the latter. Some power supplies don't like running with no load on the +5V.

I'm just trying to make sense of all the information I'm uncovering... Seems there's lots of differing opinions. How would people usually run an arcade monitor with Mame?

No worries -- ask away until you are comfortable, especially if you are receiving differing opinions (what are the other opinions ?). 

This may help clarify the AC connections for you:



Your cabinet may not have a power distribution block, in which case folks often connect all of the AC in, marquee power and monitor power to the connectors on the power supply.
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johnnybleu

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2009, 06:41:04 pm »
Well, thanks a lot for all the info! You're clearing up a lot of the confusion.

Now, I just did a first test of the "complete" cab... Everything works quite fine, actually- didn't even have to adjust the monitor. However, I'm still running the original cabinet's power supply for the monitor. In fact, when I turn on the cab without it's pcb, the only things that come on are the monitor and marquee light since, like you said, they run off their own AC circuit. So, since the power supply doesn't like to work without the board hooked up to it, I should just get rid of it then, right? As of now, it's only there because it's the only way I know of getting any kind of power into the cab- it's my "monitor power switch".

Also, here's one of the original questions I asked, but was told it's not possible..... Can I use the PC's power supply to provide AC current to the monitor? Or would I have to follow the diagram you showed me to wire an independent power source (which would in turn bring a whole new flood of questions)?

I know I'll have to wire the coin-door lights through the PC's power supply, since they apparently got their juice through the Jamma harness (which is now gone).

Thanks again for all the help! As far as the conflicting information goes, you just have to browse the net and forums for a bit to get all sorts of opinions on the "right", or the "best" way to do things. Gathering information at various stages of this project has been interesting, to say the least.


CheffoJeffo

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2009, 07:35:31 pm »
What I usually do is pull the arcade PS, install a junction block and connect the computer PS to the junction block (cut off the male end of the power cord and connect the wires directly to the junction block). Then you have a single source of AC power for everything.

That still leaves you with actually turning on the computer. you can set the BIOS to boot after power failure so that the computer turns on when the AC is applied or jumper the PS so that the computer boots.

The other option is to go with something like a smart strip, in which case I would not connect the computer PS to the junction block, but would take the existing AC power cord (which will be connected to the monitor and the marquee light) and plug it in to the smart strip. The computer would plug into the smart strip and the smart strip plug into the wall.

More info here:

http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Power_Options
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johnnybleu

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2009, 07:56:05 pm »
Again, thank you very much for the help!

Well, it seems like the first logical step is to get rid of the arcade PS- it doesn't actually supply power to anything right now, and it's noisy. However, my cab doesn't seem to have a power distribution block, and everything seems to be wired directly to the PS- that's where the IEC cord plugs in, which in turn plugs into an outlet.

Now, I'm very much interested in the mod you proposed- using the PC's power supply for the cab's AC needs (monitor and marquee light). Any chance you could point me to a writeup of the process? Also, would I have to install a switch somewhere, or would the AC power only come on when the PS is running (i.e. when the computer's on)? I'm not really sure what you mean by "cut off the male end of the power cord and connect the wires directly to the junction block".... By power cord, do you mean the IEC plug that goes to the wall outlet? Sorry if I sound like a noob- this is all new to me  :dizzy:

As far as turning on the computer, that's not really a problem- I gutted the PC and screwed the motherboard where the arcade PCB used to be, and I extended the wires to the power switch, which I will then mount in a convenient location. Windows is also set to shut down when I press the power button.

Thanks again- it's REALLY appreciated. If you were here, I'd buy you a beer.

CheffoJeffo

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2009, 08:20:42 pm »
Now, I'm very much interested in the mod you proposed- using the PC's power supply for the cab's AC needs (monitor and marquee light).

To be clear, your PC's power supply takes in 115V (I'm making an assumption as to your location) AC and converts it to DC (+5V and +12V). Your monitor is powered by 115V AC and cannot be powered by the DC coming out of your power supply.

EDIT: I wrote a bunch of stuff which I have now deleted, but I should ask a question that will help clarify the situation -- is the arcade power supply one where there are screw terminals where the wires are attached or does it have molex connectors that connect to the JAMMA harness and the monitor ? If the latter, then I can see how one might think that the monitor was being powered by the power supply, although it is just a switched pass-through of the AC.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2009, 08:44:21 pm by CheffoJeffo »
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johnnybleu

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2009, 01:04:49 pm »
Alright, to answer your question, the power supply is just a solid box with wires coming out with two molex connectors. One goes to the Jamma harness, and the other (obviously AC) splits into two paths- one for the marquee light, and the other through the isolation transformer and to the monitor.

All I'm looking for really is a way to get some AC current on the monitor/marquee circuit. Then I can just get rid of the original power supply.

So, you think you have a solution for me?  ;)

Thanks as always!

CheffoJeffo

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2009, 01:12:49 pm »
What I would do is pull the existing power supply and put in a distribution block.

Then, I would run a power cord from the distribution block to plug in to the wall (I use computer power cords and just cut the female end off). I would run wires for the marquee and monitor from the distribution block to the molex connectors for the marquee and monitor power. You may not have these connectors and you can just cut the connectors off and wire straight to the junction box or you can order connectors (I like connectors because then you can just drop the old power supply back in and have a working cab).

Finally, cut off the pronged end of a computer power cord and connect it to the distribution block. Plug the other end into your computer PS.

Or pull the power supply, patch outlet prongs onto the marquee and monitor power supply and use a power bar.
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johnnybleu

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2009, 01:59:00 pm »
Ah, yes! Simple enough! Now, I assume all AC plugs adhere to a standard code for colors? i.e. Green=earth ground, white/blue=neutral, brown/black=hot?

Also, without a switch at any point in the line, the monitor would be on as soon as I plug it in, correct? Can I put a switch after the distribution block, or does it have to be before (as per the diagram you showed me)? I assume I'd need a strong switch to handle all the juice, right? Sorry if these questions sound dumb- I just have too much respect for electricity.  ;)

The reason I want two switches is because I have to power up the monitor after windows has booted up (to avoid wrecking it with high-frequency signals), so I need to be able to turn on the PC and monitor separately.

CheffoJeffo

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Re: Few more questions- putting PC in cab (monitor, power supply, etc)
« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2009, 12:12:31 pm »
I haven't come across on that didn't, but I test with a multimeter anyway.

Yes, you can put a switch in downline for the monitor.
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