Trouble setting up 2 ACT Labs guns

[jasonbar]

Howdy-

I'm having some trouble with my 2 ACT Labs guns.

I'm running MAME 115, optimized for my processor & w/ the hi-score/no-nag patch.  Running Win XP Corporate 2002 SP2.  Using a Betson 27" 800x600 60Hz multisync monitor.

Per the instructions, P1 gun box is connected to PC's video port, P2 gun box is connected to P1 gun box, & monitor is connected to P2 gun box.

Running ACT Labs' Light Gun Test program in Windows, both guns work great--accurate shot placement & both buttons work & screen flickers briefly for each button press.

In Area 51 or Area 51/Maximum Force in MAME, however, it all sucks.  I go through the calibration of both guns.  P1 gun buttons function normally, but shot placement is terrible--it seems to just default to about 4 different locations on the screen, depending on rough gun position.  P2 gun is even worse--can't seem to get any shots off--when I pull the trigger, the monitor blanks for several seconds, I hear a relay click in the monitor as if it's switching resolutions or lost signal, then it comes back & the image wiggles for a brief degauss.

Any ideas?  Note that these 2 games don't run @ full speed on my machine--I tried running them w/ frameskip on, which gets me to 90-something %, and I tried running them as-is, at 65-75% speed.  Same results.


Thanks,
-Jason

[u_rebelscum]

Are you forcing mame to keep the same resolution as the desktop, or you making switch res?  Either keep the same res, or you'll have to recalibrate the guns (with the gun's calibate switch) at the new res.

Is mame's dual gun support enabled, and one gun in gun 2 mode?  Or are both in gun 1 mode, and dual gun support disabled, and multiple mice enabled?  I suggest the latter, as it usually is easier to work.   Also, disable mouse and enable gun.

The first time the "gun calibration" in the games runs, use the keyboard to change the values.  Then make sure the guns are mapped correctly in mame to their respective players (tab, "Input (this game)").  If the game is still mis-calibrated, off by a fixed direction and almost same distance, then try the game's calibrate screen with the guns.

[jasonbar]

URS-

Helping me yet again.  Thanks!  :]

Resolution: I'm running the Win XP desktop @ 800x600.  My mame.ini says "switchres 0", & when I launch a game, I don't get the *click* & pause of changing resolutions & degaussing, so I believe I'm still at 800x600 in MAME.

I've currently got the following line under INPUT DEVICE OPTIONS in mame.ini: dual_lightgun 1
P2 gun has the switch to 2
P1 gun is mouse 2.  If I run a game in MAME & go into "Input (This Game)" & set a command to "Coin 1", it says P1 trigger is Mouse 2 Button 1
P2 gun is mouse 3.  If I run a game in MAME & go into "Input (This Game)" & set a command to "Coin 2", it says P2 trigger is Mouse 3 Button 3 & jumps into the click 'n' degauss routine



OK, I'll try setting this up as you recommend:
1: I changed dual_lightgun 1 to dual_lightgun 0 in mame.ini
2: I don't recall how/where I can set multiple mice to be enabled, but they must be, as I have 6 (3" Happ, 2 light guns, 2 spinners, X-Arcade trackball)...


OK, now we're getting somewhere--both guns act normally, but their aim is *terrible*.

If I switch P1 gun to C for calibrate, it gives me the white screen.  If I switch P2 gun from 1 to C to calibrate, I get a white screen but a monitor click 'n' degauss routine...

Unfortunately, Area 51 relies upon shooting to do its setup.  Argh, once I've done a P2 calibrate, then the P2 gun goes back to click 'n' degauss when I pull the trigger...

OK, this is weird...in the Area 51 calibration screen, both guns' shots fall *only* on a line between the top left corner & bottom right corner...


Alright, setting gun inc & dec & button to be keyboard presses, I did the in-game A51 calibration (point @ crosshair @ center of screen & hold trigger until it says "DONE").  Then, when I shoot, all shots still fall on that same darn diagonal line from top-left to bottom-right, but at least both guns are behaving apart from that...



Is there perhaps something in the "Analog Controls" section of the settings that needs changing...



Soooo, got anything useful from my disjointed ranting to help troubleshoot?  :]


Thanks for your patience,
-Jason

[u_rebelscum]

Alright, setting gun inc & dec & button to be keyboard presses, I did the in-game A51 calibration (point @ crosshair @ center of screen & hold trigger until it says "DONE").  Then, when I shoot, all shots still fall on that same darn diagonal line from top-left to bottom-right, but at least both guns are behaving apart from that...

This might be the problem, or it might be just me not reading what you're doing correctly.

In the game's calibration, you should point at upper left corner, then center, then lower right corner.  The crosshairs (one blue and one red under the blue) you see in the middle of the screen are added by mame for easier mouse/joystick/keyboard control.  Move them out of center with keyboard to see.

Also, player 2 gun should be set to 1, so both are set to 1.  Looks like 0.115 forces multiple mice enabled; for a short time mame did this, right after adding support for multiple mice for different players, but before adding the option to choose.  I thought it was earlier, but guess I was wrong.  Also, FWIW, -dual_lightgun was a hack added before mame added multiple mice support, and the two conflict; since your version of mame forces multiple mice, -dual_lightgun won't work.


However, there still is the degauss issue.   It doesn't do that when in windows, only in mame, right?  These symptoms hint mame is changing the res (and/or refresh rate), but the other info you posted indicates mame isn't.   Have you tried switching the order of the two boxes are connected between the monitor and PC?  How about with only "player 2" gun?

[jasonbar]

Hi Rebel-

Thanks again for your helpful post--let's see if it can get me my results.  :]

Sorry if I sounded inconsistent in that last mail, but that's b/c the light guns *are* behaving inconsistently...   


Exact sequence of operations (with *only* P1 gun plugged in):
1 - Boot Windows (800x600)
2 - Flip gun 1 switch to calibration.  Screen goes into white cal screen w/out degaussing.  Wave gun up & down, back & forth.
3 - Exit gun 1 calibration.   Screen flips directly back to windows desktop w/out degaussing.
4 - Shoot around on windows desktop--gun behaves normally w/ decent accuracy
5 - Launch MaLa
6 - MaLa launches following command line: mame.exe area51a -offscreen_reload -autoframeskip -nomouse -lightgun , & mame.ini has the following input device options on: mouse, joystick, steadykey and the following off: dual_lightfun, offscreen_reload.  No degaussing or forcing resolution to change from Win desktop.
7 - In Area 51, all shots fall on a diagonal line from top left to bottom right.  Gun appears to be reading only "X" value--that is, the bullets move to follow my left-right position, but moving the gun up & down & firing results in bullets in the same place
8 - Pause Area 51 & do gun calibration again.  White screen comes & goes normally w/ no degaussing.
9 - Unpause & play Area 51.  Same diagonal shots.
10 - Go into Area 51 service mode (F2)
11 - Enter gun test.
12 - My MAME red & blue big crosshairs are *not* on-screen.  Pressing F1 toggles them on & off.  I have them off.  Area 51 has a tiny gray crosshair in the center of the gun test screen & says "Aim each gun at crosshair below.  Hold trigger until flashing stops."  So, I point the gun @ the center crosshair, hold the trigger, screen flashes a few times, then stops & it says "DONE"  The calibration routine that you describe doesn't seem to be applicable to Area 51--are you thinking of another game...?
13 - Exit gun test.  Flip test switch (F2), play Area 51.  Same diagonal shots...   


To try to answer your other questions, the degaussing happens *almost* only in MAME.  While running the ACT Labs test target program just now, out of 50-odd firings, 1 triggered a degauss.  I wonder if my monitor sees the blank screen & sometimes thinks that it's lost its signal from the PC...?


I think I'll try to troubleshoot these one at a time.  For now, I have just P1 gun plugged in & want to get it shooting properly in MAME.  Then I'll add P2 gun into the mix.



I also tried Bang (run w/ same options as Area 51, except for no need for -autoframeskip, as it runs fast enough on my PC.  Same results.  Tried doing ACT Lab gun cal in game again, but no change.


I also wanted to try something "old", so I tried Cheyenne too.  Ditto above.


Thanks for your help!  I hope you've got an idea of what I should try!  (where's the "praying" smiley anyway...).

-Jason

[jasonbar]

Help me, Rebel Wan Scumobi.  Your'e my only hope.

[jasonbar]

Well, it's been a little over 1 year since my last post here, & I've finally gotten around to tackling my light guns.

Well, they tackled me...

Now, with my tinted glass bezel, my pair of Act Labs guns don't work even in the Windows test program.  All shots fall in the same spot, regardless of where I'm pointing.

Additionally, the white calibration screen (& sometimes multiple sequential shots) make my 27" Betson multisync monitor click as if it were switching resolutions or refresh rates, then go Gauss wiggly, then click back into a normal display.

Between these 2 problems, I don't think I can get these working fine.

My research has told me that the LCD Topgun is the way to go.  The only distributor that I found was Play-Asia (http://www.play-asia.com/paOS-13-71-1i-49-en-70-16s7.html).  The manufacturer also has a pseudo-order form, though it looks a bit iffy (click on "Order Form" on this page: http://www.hkems.com/product/xbox/LCDTopGun.htm).

Is Play-Asia the place where BYOAC folks have bought their LCD Topguns?

Any comments/preference on LCD Topgun I vs. LCD Topgun II?  http://www.play-asia.com/paOS-13-71-1i-49-en-70-2vss.html

According to this page, http://www.thegametrain.com/blog/2008/09/lcd-topgun-ii-vs-lcd-topgun-i.html , the only difference between I & II is that II works with Vista.  I'm running XP, so that feature doesn't interest me.  Any other features of note?


Thanks,
-Jason