Noob question about contollers for controls.... (make sense?)

[Mickelonis]

If I am making a four person control panel similar to this:

http://customarcades.com/images/barracuda/controller2.jpg

What type of controller would I use for the buttons and joystick?

I found this, but it's for two player right? http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=303

How can I get it to work with four player?

Thanks!

-Pete

[protokatie]

You will need more than 40 inputs for that CP. Dunno if GGG has an adaptor that has more, but you can always use multiple adaptors. I think Ultimarc's Ipac4 has more than 40 inputs, and may work for what you want...

[Malenko]

is that the panel you WANT or the panel you THINK YOU NEED?

That frankenpanel just has too many inputs, most people do 2 sticks 6 or 7 buttons per player. Optionally they add a trackball in the middle;others also add the spinner if it'll be used. You are never going to use the flight stick, and if you get the U360 you wont need a dedicated 4 way or if you're like me, you'll use the 8way on 4 way games.

you'll need 2 more encoders too, one for the spinner (GGG has a spinner with encoder built in) and another for the trackball. Years ago back when I was a knewb I couldnt understand the desire for a panel like that yet years later all the knewbs think its what they have to put on their machines

[leapinlew]

is that the panel you WANT or the panel you THINK YOU NEED?

That frankenpanel just has too many inputs, most people do 2 sticks 6 or 7 buttons per player. Optionally they add a trackball in the middle;others also add the spinner if it'll be used. You are never going to use the flight stick, and if you get the U360 you wont need a dedicated 4 way or if you're like me, you'll use the 8way on 4 way games.

you'll need 2 more encoders too, one for the spinner (GGG has a spinner with encoder built in) and another for the trackball. Years ago back when I was a knewb I couldnt understand the desire for a panel like that yet years later all the knewbs think its what they have to put on their machines

[DaveMMR]

is that the panel you WANT or the panel you THINK YOU NEED?

That frankenpanel just has too many inputs, most people do 2 sticks 6 or 7 buttons per player. Optionally they add a trackball in the middle;others also add the spinner if it'll be used. You are never going to use the flight stick, and if you get the U360 you wont need a dedicated 4 way or if you're like me, you'll use the 8way on 4 way games.

you'll need 2 more encoders too, one for the spinner (GGG has a spinner with encoder built in) and another for the trackball. Years ago back when I was a knewb I couldnt understand the desire for a panel like that yet years later all the knewbs think its what they have to put on their machines

Seconded.  It's all opinion but too many buttons for the outer players, seemingly angled controls (which looks to have become the homemade panel standard for some reason but they are not helped in this example by the cuts of the front not even parallel to the angling), and the eye-sore of an analogue stick makes for a unfriendly looking panel. 

I agree with Malenko.  If you really want the go with four-players (seriously, make a list of all the games that need that many players and also the number of times you'd conceivably have that many people playing and see if it's still the way to go), I also recommend two U360's (they remap in software as analogue, 4-way, 8-way, etc.) and then two simple 8-ways for the outer players (with no more than 4 buttons each).

[TAG]

You are never going to use the flight stick

I've wondered about that, myself.  I've got one planned for my panel, because I would think a flight stick would almost be a necessity for effectively playing the tanks and MCP levels of Tron.  Is there a workable alternative?

[DaveMMR]

You are never going to use the flight stick

I've wondered about that, myself.  I've got one planned for my panel, because I would think a flight stick would almost be a necessity for effectively playing the tanks and MCP levels of Tron.  Is there a workable alternative?

The stick in Tron is not a flightstick in the traditional sense, i.e. it's not analog (as are most commercially available flight sticks).  It was barely an 8-way (the diagonals, if I'm remembering correctly from what I've read, have a smaller register area than usual 8-ways due to a special restrictor).  A top-fire 8-way would be your best bet for Tron (or hacking of same to add a flight-stick type handle).

A traditional flight stick works best for After Burner (II), Space Harrier and similar analog controlled games.  Except for the authenticity factor, a U360 or similar mappable joystick does quite well with none of the clutter. 

My opinion, which is not legal tender, is to save big flight sticks for swappable panels as they are large and imposing.   If you do put it on a panel, make sure it's not in the way of anything (viewing, tracking, etc.)

[TAG]

You are never going to use the flight stick

I've wondered about that, myself.  I've got one planned for my panel, because I would think a flight stick would almost be a necessity for effectively playing the tanks and MCP levels of Tron.  Is there a workable alternative?

The stick in Tron is not a flightstick in the traditional sense, i.e. it's not analog (as are most commercially available flight sticks).  It was barely an 8-way (the diagonals, if I'm remembering correctly from what I've read, have a smaller register area than usual 8-ways due to a special restrictor).  A top-fire 8-way would be your best bet for Tron (or hacking of same to add a flight-stick type handle).

Right, but I thought the "flight stick" on that sample panel was like the Happ heavy duty 8-way trigger stick, so that's what I was referring to.  If it's a true analog flight stick, then I agree that it probably wouldn't get all that much use.  But if it's an 8-way with a trigger and buttons, then I think it could be used quite a bit.

[u_rebelscum]

... I thought the "flight stick" on that sample panel was like the Happ heavy duty 8-way trigger stick, so that's what I was referring to.  If it's a true analog flight stick, then I agree that it probably wouldn't get all that much use.  But if it's an 8-way with a trigger and buttons, then I think it could be used quite a bit.

Assuming throw, weight, return to center strength, and other stuff are the same, I'd think an analog flightstick would be of more use than a digital 8-way flightstick.  With mame's analog mapping, the analog stick would be able to do everything a digital FS would plus analog.  Not only would it also do analog games great, it could be mapped in mame with tron's small diagonals for tron, or as an 8-way for zaxxon, or a 4-way for assault.  (Should decrease deadzone too.)

Of course, most analog FSs have a longer throw than most 8-way or 4-way sticks, flight or not.  So I'd think those are just as important, is not more, (as is with all sticks).

[DaveMMR]

... I thought the "flight stick" on that sample panel was like the Happ heavy duty 8-way trigger stick, so that's what I was referring to.  If it's a true analog flight stick, then I agree that it probably wouldn't get all that much use.  But if it's an 8-way with a trigger and buttons, then I think it could be used quite a bit.

Assuming throw, weight, return to center strength, and other stuff are the same, I'd think an analog flightstick would be of more use than a digital 8-way flightstick.  With mame's analog mapping, the analog stick would be able to do everything a digital FS would plus analog. 

Thanks u_rebelscum.  I'm guilty of forgetting about that newer MAME feature (I'm still in the stone age with my Mame .116 and .99).   That's entirely true.

And yes, TAG, you are correct, the Heavy Duty 8-way is not the analog stick I was thinking of.  Though in light of cost and also u_rebelscum's suggestion, hacking a store-bought analog stick (depending on the weight/throw factor) might be a better option considering Happ's trigger stick is upwards of $100 or more and analog now gives better versatility than before.

I'm still not crazy about them on panels though when it's cluttered into other controls, but if you place it carefully with enough real estate (or swap), it's a nice addition. 

[u_rebelscum]

I'm still not crazy about them on panels though when it's cluttered into other controls, but if you place it carefully with enough real estate (or swap), it's a nice addition. 

Yeah, agree.  Hard to fit nicely on 2 player CPs, IMO, though.

FWIW, I'm a switchable CP person.  I have a hotrodse CP, a tron CP, a "rotary joystick" CP with 2 buttons mirrored per player, and a dual TB CP.  The tron CP has a happ super with a hacked on PC flightstick & spinner & buttons.  My "rotary joystick" CP actually has two u360s on it ATM, but I plan to make a u360 CP.  I had a single TB CP, but I hacked to fit the happs high ball bigger mounting plate, and I don't like the high ball TB, so I don't use that CP.  They aren't as switchable as I want them to be, and am planning at some point to redo them all.  As well as making a dual 360 steering wheel CP and a 270 wheel CP.  Not happening until after I buy a house, though.

[ArcadeBliss]

Hey u_rebelscum, do you have any pics with all of your cps? I'm in the process of planning swappable cps and am looking for ideas.

Thanks.

[ghettodish]

Here are mine, from the top down:

Track and Field
Defender/Stargate with 4/8 way Magstick for Pac Man, Donkey Kong, etc.
Asteroids
Tempest/Tron/Discs of Tron. DOT uses the trigger and one thumb button on the "flight stick", and push-pull spinner.
Battle Zone/Robotron/Crazy Climber, etc.

[daywane]

funny thing about Tron stick.
the restrictor is Identical to a Ms PAC mans.
I took them both to work.
CNC lath guys and 2 engineers could not see any differences.
looked at both in a OC and used micromiters.

[SavannahLion]

looked at both in a OC and used micromiters.

OC? I know a lot of meanings behind OC, but not as an engineering term.

[Blanka]

LOL
In the rendering the trackball looks like a European AC socket. Yeah it would be nice to plug your Philips shaver while playing your early-morning wake-up Pac Man 

[ItchyD]

oscilloscope?

[SavannahLion]

oscilloscope?

On a restrictor?

[daywane]

yes.
That was a way I could measure the radius.
equipment I am used to using.
 had the engineer with me because he was intersted as well.
I make AC lines for all makes and models of cars.
we use the OC every hour to check 2 parts.
it was simple to magnify it up to 20 times and record the radius of each part. (had to edit)
nope
not a oscilloscope
I just remembered what that is. Sounds like it though.
We ( at work have allways called it the OC , Sorry about that. I use it all the time and it is second nature to me)
I shall describe the machine.
you put your part on a clamp with a bright light shinning on the part.
the light hits the part and passes into a magnifying glass.
the image is shown on a glass circle , I can rotate the circle in degrees and measure in millimeters and find radius
With this machine I can look and measure thinner than a hair.

[daywane]

I know I will mess the spelling up. 
It is called a Optic comparator