New System, Now Mame Struggles?

[lettuce]

In my old cab i used to have an aging AMD Athlon 64 3200+, 2GB RAM running windows XP, in my new cab i have a  Intel Core 2 Duo E7200 OC to 3.8ghz, 2GB RAM running Windows XP64. I have notice in my new cab now that when i enable triplebuffer to stop tearing on any games mame seems to struggle alot more and i get sound stuttering in games, which i never used to on my older cab. I would have thought seeing as i have a much more powerful system now that i should never get stuttering sound problems, the only way i can avoid these stuttering problems is by enabling autoframeskipping. Any ideas why this is happening??

[Ginsu Victim]

Have you tried frameskip off, throttle on, and matchrefresh on? (I don't have a higher end system in my cab, so I'm only making suggestions to see what happens)

[lettuce]

Well, im using the same settings in the mame.ini file that i had in my old system, whcih ran the majority of game fine with triplebuffer on, there were a few that had stuttering sound on my old system when i enabled tripplebuffer, but on this new system, all games seem to stutter 

[u_rebelscum]

What video card are (and were) you using?  Unlike in the past, a few of the video options in mame can rely on the video card.  AFAIK, these are the option that can be video card (& video card driver) dependent:
video, d3dversion, triplebuffer, numscreens, prescale, effect, artwork_crop, use_backdrops, use_overlays, & use_bezels.

[lettuce]

Well before i was using an ArcadeVGA1 AGP card, and now im using a Nvidia 7600GT with soft15khz

[Ummon]

It seems any time a mode that isn't very close to, and kept consistently at, 60hz refresh there is often at least some intermittent tearing or/and stuttering. The first thing I can think of in your case is that the card drivers aren't enforcing 60hz. Selectively use triplebuffer and see if the games that need it aren't at 60hz refresh. If they aren't then you may have trouble. Another thing that comes to mind is something in your configuration may not be syncing with each core....or something like that.

[retrometro]

that is strange.   there's such a good and wide difference that i'd be surprised too at the performance.

have you tried to run a new download of mame without any of your old settings?

[lettuce]

Ok the mame version im currently using is a complied version to add hiscore support so im using headkaze's mame complier 64, i ticked the boxes for 64bit proccessor and Dual Core, and optimized for Intel Core2. I have just downloaded the binary 64bit exe version and load a game i had trouble with before, im now getting no sound skipping!. So it must be something happening whilst im compling mame, i noticed that there isnt a 64bit source code of mame just a exe and zip version, i take it there is now 64 bit source file??

[lettuce]

Ok ive come across something now. I'll use shinobi as an example, before i was getting shinobi running at 98% speed (press F10 in game), if i remove shinobis ini file, the game runs at 100% speed, i have narrowed it down to the resolution i have the game set at, 321x240, if i dont have a ini file for shinobi and let mame select the screen resolution the game runs fine with triplebuffer enabled. So my qustion is what screen resolution does mame select for shinobi itself, and why does running shinobi in321x240 cause the games to have sound skipping and not run at 100% speed? Im using soft15khz program to get my custom resolutions

[retrometro]

I had the exact same problem and coincidentally also compiled for 64bit, core2duo, dual processor, and using soft15khz.  For me, it was running pacman at some resolution it skipped sound.  when i run it with double resolution but not full desktop resolution scaled, it works great.

I think I read somewhere from a faq that when you change refresh rates you're also modifying the speed at which mame runs...

[lettuce]

Strangle, its seems it i dont have triplebuffer enabled its runs at 100% but with it enable only at 98%, wounder how i could speed it up by 2% with triplebuffer enabled!?

[Tafoid]

> Strangle, its seems it i dont have triplebuffer enabled its runs at 100% but with it enable only at 98%,
> wounder how i could speed it up by 2% with triplebuffer enabled!?

I don't believe you can with the way your have your system set up.

Using any syncing or triplebuffer will use your video display refresh rate (is most cases nowdays, it's 60hz) as it's base for emulation speed.  If the actual refresh rate the game expects to use is higher than what your monitor is currently able to produce, the emulation still tries to run at it's native refresh rates, even though your display is refreshing slower - there will be stuttering as it's feeding more than your display can handle.  This was a change between MAME 0.113 and 0.114 in the core code of how the emulated game is to be presented.  There is a command "-refreshspeed" which attempts to compensate for the difference by actually slowing down the emulation to meet your monitor's refresh rate requirements.  It's not a perfect solution, but it is better than nothing at all.  Remember when using any syncing lke that, your speed is regulated even though your computer can often handle much more!!

The best solution is to set your actual refresh rate of your monitor to something higher .. 70hz or 75hz should cover you in almost all cases.  You can always shut off your sync/triplebuffer and it will work just fine.

[retrometro]

Tafold!   

You just fixed several of my games that had these weird pops in the sound.   thanks so much!

[Minwah]

There is a command "-refreshspeed" which attempts to compensate for the difference by actually slowing down the emulation to meet your monitor's refresh rate requirements.  It's not a perfect solution, but it is better than nothing at all.  Remember when using any syncing lke that, your speed is regulated even though your computer can often handle much more!!

Can you tell me if this option actually works now?? For several versions, it does not work at all (I think the last main release I checked was v0.126). Also, it can cause problems with some games (eg horrible static noise in Pole Pos).

This causes some major problem when using an ArcadeVGA...my solution is to literally alter the refresh rate of games whose FPS is >59.85, bringing it down to 59.85 (or slightly less). (This could probably be 60hz exactly with the latest ArcadeVGA versions). It would be a LOT easier if refreshspeed works properly!

[lettuce]

Thats part of the problem though, some screen resolutions that either the ArcadeVGA card or soft15khz use have the refresh rates as low as 51kh sometimes (im guessing the picture wouldnt be able to be displayed if the refresh was higher), so when you use this refreshspeed tab in mame the game runs alot slower than it should. Im guessing mame runs (or tries to) games at there correct refresh rate if you dont have this refreshspeed option enabled? I guess im going to have to live with either screen tearing or autoframe skip on some games then. Im quiet annoying really i have this powerful PC to run mame yet i cant even get it to run 100% speed if i turn tipplebuffer on. Its a shame theres not a hack diff file where you can get mame to run 2% faster when triplebuffer is enabled!?

I know saliorSat has a soundsync diff file which changes the pitch of the sound, so it either slows down or catches up with the game, but i can really notice the pitch difference when it happens 

[Ummon]

lettuce, you're mixing up scan rate and refresh. Khz is the former, Hz is the latter. Anyways, yeah, this is the problem with later Mame and running native. Most games I don't have issues with; it's usually vertical games displayed horizontally, in which case I've needed to find a special mode that isn't at 15khz (refresh is more important than scan rate, you know) but most arcade multisyncs can't do this. (Presentation monitors often can, though.) Also, there may be some hardware elements, particularly in combination, involved here as these newer devices I think aren't made with such video conditions in mind.

It just came to me, though: the reason ATI's newer cards don't have the resolution restrictions Nvidia's do is perhaps due to ATI having an emphasis in display feature, whereas Nvidia's is in high-end gaming.

[deadsoulz]

I have the same problems as you lettuce, I hate screen tearing, but I hate the stuttering even more, (really noticible in ms. pacman.)  I also have an arcadevga, core2duo 2.4 ghz.  I disable tripple buffering and my problems disappear, but man screen tearing is annoying.

[lettuce]

Ok can some one tell me what screen resolution mame picks for Shinobi when there is no shinobi ini file?? As if i delete my shinobiini file and let mame pick a screen resolution, i dont get any stuttering at all even with tripplebuffer enabled???

[u_rebelscum]

Ok can some one tell me what screen resolution mame picks for Shinobi when there is no shinobi ini file?? As if i delete my shinobiini file and let mame pick a screen resolution, i dont get any stuttering at all even with tripplebuffer enabled???

Depends on your system setup and other mame options.  If you use mame's default settings, mame uses the windows desktop resolution and refresh rate.  If you don't use the defaults, you'll have to see what your system does; mame outputs to the commmandline what it picks if you enable -verbose option.  (MameUI can output to a file.)

So for mame, I'd try "mame shinobi -verbose", or "mameui32 shinobi -verbose > mameoutput.txt" and look near the top of what mame outputs.  You should get something like:

Code: [Select]

Parsing mame.ini
Video: Monitor 00010001 = "\\.\DISPLAY1" (primary)
Direct3D: Using Direct3D 9
Direct3D: Configuring adapter #0 = Intel(R) 82915G/GV/910GL Express Chipset Family
Direct3D: Selecting video mode...
   640x 400@ 70Hz -> 92.921166
   320x 200@ 70Hz -> 90.909094
   640x 480@ 60Hz -> 1001.733102
   640x 480@ 72Hz -> 78.656182
   640x 480@ 75Hz -> 64.233102
   800x 600@ 56Hz -> 21.166862
   800x 600@ 60Hz -> 1001.166861
   800x 600@ 75Hz -> 63.666861
  1024x 768@ 60Hz -> 1000.800640
   512x 384@ 70Hz -> 93.741955
  1024x 768@ 75Hz -> 63.300640
  1152x 864@ 75Hz -> 63.178887
  1280x 768@ 60Hz -> 1000.664452
  1440x 900@ 60Hz -> 1000.556483
  1440x 900@ 75Hz -> 63.056483
Direct3D: Mode selected =  640x 480@ 60Hz
...
If you don't get any "Direct3D: Selecting video mode..." part, mame is using your desktop res.

[web.geek]

So it must be something happening whilst im compling mame, i noticed that there isnt a 64bit source code of mame just a exe and zip version, i take it there is now 64 bit source file??

Does anyone know? Is there a different MAME source for 64-bit, or is the source the same but just compiled for 64-bit? If the source files are different, where can I find the 64-bit source (did I miss it on the MAME site)?

[u_rebelscum]

So it must be something happening whilst im compling mame, i noticed that there isnt a 64bit source code of mame just a exe and zip version, i take it there is now 64 bit source file??

Does anyone know? Is there a different MAME source for 64-bit, or is the source the same but just compiled for 64-bit? If the source files are different, where can I find the 64-bit source (did I miss it on the MAME site)?

The source is the same, you just need a compiler that can compile in 64 bit.  MameDev's compile 64bit page,

[headkaze]

You can also use Mame Compiler 64 to compile Mame64.