First control board questions

[z38gm]

After having finished reading the main site and browsing the forum for the past couple days I have come up with some specific questions before I start purchasing items to build my first control board.

I guess first I should get some things out of the way. This control board will first be used as a stand alone box on a desk until I can convince the significant other that I need a full size arcade. I will likely design the cabinet before building the control box so that I will be able to drop it in with minor adjustment. I would like to make the control board two player and maximally compatible (I realize 100% compatibility is silly) with MAME and I would like to be able to hook up an N64 controller as well as a Playstation one for console emulation (the PS controller will be used for NES, SNES, Gensis etc..).

To reach these goals it would seem, from my research, that I would need 2 joysticks with 8 buttons per stick as well as a start button per, one track ball and a spinner (preferably something that can also be used as a wheel unless there is a drawback to this method, are there?). Eventually I would like to add light gun support, but as of now am worried about the LCD TopGun reliability. Due to this I contacted Act-Labs and they implied that something is in the works and to contact them again in June.

As of now I am looking at these items:

Computer Interface: I-PAC2/Opti-Pack

The I-PAC units were picked because I have read they are simply great and easy to use, especially because I won't want the permanency of having soldering these together.

Joysticks: Happ Super Joystick

The joysticks were just randomly chosen because they looked good and the description sounded good. I have read the UltraStick 360 is simply great, is it worth the extra money? If so, why? Are there any other sticks people would recommend? I play virtually every type of game.

Buttons: Happ Competition Buttons/Happ Player Buttons

The buttons are just typical concave buttons that are comfortable from the arcade.

As far as a controller adapters, spinner/wheel and trackball go, I have no idea what to look for. Any suggestions along these lines? Nothing at all is set in stone, I am very new to this and would greatly appreciate any help in all areas, if I am forgetting something or looking at a non-quality part for any reason, please let me know!

Lastly, is there anyway to rig such a unit such that an external accessory, such as a shifter and pedals, could be added/piggybacked via a single cable without opening the unit?

Thanks in advance and sorry about the long post.

[weisshaupt]

That is exactly how I started.. just a small CP...

2 Spinners are nice to have (no I don't have them yet...) 
the U360s from IPAC are great when paired with a system that will swap them to 4/8 way etc for you.
If you have the money, the general consenus seems to be to buy the U360s.. I still use my original happ supers...

Groovy Game gear sells really nice lighted buttons, if you go for that sort of thing (I Do) otherwise the buttons are the button are the buttons.. The Switches can make a difference and getting a Leaf type switch for your buttons makes them be quiet and gives them a slightly different (more arcady) feel. I use standard microswitches ..


I think the Happ Trackballs are the best. They are also more expensive. I have an Old WICO in mine.. the new high-ball trackballs introduced recently at both GG and Ultimarc look tempting becuase they will be SOOO much easier to mount.

As for making external controls, I would look at using Doc's method of a RJ-45 (ethernet cable) and jack on your CP somewhere that runs down to your other controls.  My project has interchangable panels, and this is how allo fthe controls are connected to the IPAC4, the Joystick etc.  You can also buy USB inserts for quickports for USB based controls. A Bit pricey a $10  a shot, but if you want them you want them.

[Ginsu Victim]

I just switched to the U360 and there is no better stick.
ANYTHING I want to play, I can play. (within reason...)
It's easy to configure in your favorite frontend (I use Mamewah) to switch to the map needed for each control type.
Awesome sticks that feel better than every stick out there (with the optional medium spring and a circular restrictor especially).
Worth the money.

[z38gm]

Well, I didn't really want to spend the extra money on the UltraStick 360, but I like to do things right from the start. So I will switch to that. With me I try to cheap out, but know myself well enough that if I get something that is sub par it will annoy me until I replace it. So sometimes I am willing to spend the extra money and get the upgrade and save myself money in the long run. Delaying gratification is something I am good at in these cases.

As far as the Happ trackballs go, I was looking at them and realized they cost $100 and was wondering if there is anything else of similar quality at a lower price. I couldn't find too much, but don't know the best places to look. Also, how would such a unit get connected to something like the Opti-PAC or would a different interface be needed? It looks like the trackball has a harness that doesn't mate with the PAC unit?

As far as the spinner goes how do these units fair? I know someone who has one and he said its not half bad. It is a USB unit so I wouldn't need the Opti-PAC except for the trackball, unless there is another solution.

Are there any links to using RJ-45 as an external jack? I guess if I went that route it would certainly be easy and I would just need to build a couple of adapters as well as probably buy the IPAC4. Such a solution would be great for adding pedals, shifters, flight yokes etc...

Another thought, I love pinball, I guess I should account for two buttons on the sides as 'paddles' and one on the front as the 'spring'. Is this common or am I just crazy?

[Ginsu Victim]

Another thought, I love pinball, I guess I should account for two buttons on the sides as 'paddles' and one on the front as the 'spring'. Is this common or am I just crazy?

Not at all crazy. I have them on my desktop control panel, but not on my arcade. I would've, but the way my cabinet and control panel were built, there's no good way to have them.
Most people would recommend 2 on each side. For the plunger, you can either add it to the front, use a button already on your panel, or use an actual plunger (Search the forums and you can find examples. I think mountain did it...)

[z38gm]

I was just thinking about layout questions. How far apart is typical for placement of buttons? It looks like 1/2"-3/4" seems typical to me, but it is hard to tell from pictures alone.

Also, I was planning on putting the spinner and trackball centered between the two joysticks, with the trackball closer to the player and the spinner up above slightly offset. This would pretty much remove comfortable reach to buttons when needed so I was thinking are there any real advantages to having 8 buttons per player as opposed to 6? I can't remember, off hand any games that use 8. Instead I was contemplating just placing those four extra buttons to the side of the trackball/spinner...I guess I could always just add another four buttons in this spot and give 8 to each player, but want to see if there is a real point or not.

Thanks for all the help so far. I am getting more ready to purchase, but still want to be 100% sure of everything before I pull the trigger  .

[Ginsu Victim]

The space you measure for button placement is from the center. Mine are 1 1/2" apart. It varies from person to person.

I have 7 buttons myself, wired as 6 (the four button is wired twice). This is just a preference of mine and is in no way the norm. 8 buttons are really only needed for console emulation, but that's up to you and what you plan on playing.

Check the Control Panel thread for examples as far as spinner / trackball placement
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=59359.0

[wbassett]

Hey good to see you z38gm!

Lottsa good people here.  Another great tip I see recommended here and one I'll be doing for my main cp is to first lay it all out in cardboard.  What looks good on paper may not feel right or comfortable when actually used.  This way you can test a couple of layouts and which ever one you like the best you can use as a template.

[Ginsu Victim]

^Yes, this can't be stressed enough. Draw your layout on cardboard and actually install everything in it. Great way to see how well your setup works. Also, have someone stand next to you so you can judge whether there's enough room for other players.

[BobA]

A mini pac will provide you with all the options you first described.
Get the proper harness if you are not into DIY cables.

[Spaz Monkey]

Here's a Capcom layout .pdf that I got somewhere.  Just unzip it.

[z38gm]

The space you measure for button placement is from the center. Mine are 1 1/2" apart. It varies from person to person.

I have 7 buttons myself, wired as 6 (the four button is wired twice). This is just a preference of mine and is in no way the norm. 8 buttons are really only needed for console emulation, but that's up to you and what you plan on playing.

Check the Control Panel thread for examples as far as spinner / trackball placement
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=59359.0

I plan on doing some console emulation, but using a console controller to do so. The joypad will be a MAME only thing which seems to mean I can go 6 button comfortably.

Hey good to see you z38gm!

Lottsa good people here.  Another great tip I see recommended here and one I'll be doing for my main cp is to first lay it all out in cardboard.  What looks good on paper may not feel right or comfortable when actually used.  This way you can test a couple of layouts and which ever one you like the best you can use as a template.

Great idea! I think I have a good idea of what I want to do. 2 joysticks with 6 buttons per person, in the center near the player the trackball and up above slightly offset to the left the spinner. The area left by the offset will be for 4 buttons for whatever games need them. Up above I will put the other control buttons/start buttons. I will definitely use cardboard to test my ideas though!

A mini pac will provide you with all the options you first described.
Get the proper harness if you are not into DIY cables.

Looking at the Mini-PAC it does seem to be a interesting option. I think I like the idea of getting the I-PAC4 over this though as it will allow for a more modular design (I think?) and it also seems to need no soldering (please correct me if I am wrong). If I go with a unit such as the I-PAC4/Opti-pac how would I go about connecting the trackball, I still don't get it? It seems as if I would need some sort of harness, but don't see one on the Ultimarc site.

As far as making cables, I come from a speaker building background, cables are no issue at all. It seems as if all that is needed is a crimped on pin and bare wire under the screws.

I think I am missing something from your post, could you perhaps expand?

[Ginsu Victim]

Mini-pac with optional harness requires no soldering. I'm not sure how much you're looking to do with your control panel other than the two players, but it's been more than enough for me.