Arcade Tilt Idea For Emulated Pinball Games

[DinoRoger]

Here ismy idea for getting tilt to occur in pinball games if the cab is rocked (Just like in real pinball).  Two-mercury switches barley angled at opposite angles.  Have the angle where the mercury switches are not completing the circuit but almost.  When the cab if shifted left or right by a player with the slightest touch the circuit will complete and the tilt key will be pressed.  Link the wires to either a keyboard/game pad hack or I-PAC.

[TheTick]

Nice.  Now just add a real plunger that hits a Happs' switch or arcade button mounted inside the control panel (thats going on my next setup).

[DinoRoger]

Great idea TheTick!  

[TheTick]

Which pinball games are you using? The old Epic tables only had a single bump (bottom bump?).  I was just looking at the one that comes with windows and it has Left, Right, and Bottom bump.

[DinoRoger]

Virtual Pinball - Emulates thousands of tables and I believe will simulate all bumps.

[paigeoliver]

You could also just use a real tilt mechanism from a real pinball table. The one inside my Gottlieb Victory is basically just a weight hanging inside a loop.

I am sure if you asked in the pinball newsgroup that someone would have an extra one.

[TheTick]

That's a good idea; except that the ball might keep swinging after the machine was bumped or it would need to be bumped pretty hard to register.  You kind of want each single bump to appear as a single keystroke.

Could make a small assembly with a ball or washer hanging from a string, and get it to bump into switches. I think the mercury switches would be easier to fine tune; and look cleaner as well.

[creatine28]

Wonder if an old Leaf switch with a weight attached to one of the metal leaf parts might work as a tilt mechanism?

[mpm32]

Look at some coin doors,  they have a leaf switch with a weight on on of the leafs.

[CitznFish]

my fathers Gottlied Kewpie Doll also had a weight hanging through a loop as their tilt mechanism. Might be easier than wiring 2 seperate mercury switches.

I miss playing that old Pinball. 1 dime = 1 play.  a DIME!

[RandyT]

Look at some coin doors,  they have a leaf switch with a weight on on of the leafs.

Those are what is known as a "slam" switch.  Usually this set off an alarm, reset the machine or both if someone kicked the coin door.  It takes a good shock to activate one of these.

Sometimes kicking a coin door would jog the credit switch enough to get a free game, but sounding an alarm or resettiing the machine deterred the attempts.  

*edit*

BTW, I see references to tilts and bumps.  Are we talking about a true tilt mechanism (you know, too much force, lose the ball in play) or are we talking about a "nudge" (body english)?

The hanging weight is probably the best for a tilt mechanism because it takes a bit to get it swinging.   It can be adjusted for sensitivity by raising or lowering the cone shaped pendulum, which alters it's proximity to the surrounding metal hole.

The mercury switches seem like a very cool way to implement body english though.

RandyT

[1UP]

I think the idea is that the loop is fairly tight around the weight.  Also, it doesn't HAVE to hit any switches at all--what if the weight and loop ARE the switch!  In other words, the wieght is electrically conductive (a metal weight haniging from a wire) and the loop is another piece of wire wrapped around the inside of a hole that the  weight is hanging thru.  I'm not familiar with the pinball tilts, but it's probably something similar.  Also, if the wire for the weight is fairly stiff, it's not going to keep hitting the loop.  You could even use a metal spring.  Or just get a real pinball tilt -- why not have the real thing?

[skirge66]

just my silly opinion...but isn't a "tilt" on video pinball kinda useless? i mean why would anyone bother shaking the cabinet? are there really people so stupid out there that really think shaking a video pinball machine is going to make that ball do anything at all? just asking..because with a real pinball machine that was the whole reason for bumping the machine to begin with...just had to be careful how hard you bumbed it.  i really think that this is completely a waste of time and money here...just my opinion so please don't take offense.

[TheTick]

Alot of video pinball games have the a bump feature of sorts, that simulates what would happen if you lightly bumped a real table. If you are close to hitting a target and hit the "bump" key it might help hit it (similar to a real table). The games I've played with this feature would only let you hit the key about three times until the video game locked up and started flashing "Tilt" on the screen.

The feature is there. He's just interested in making it a little more realistic.  Kind of like sticking a plunger in the front... it looks stupid as hell, but it ads a certain look. Like adding coin doors to the front, when you don't need to use any coins to play.

Than again, some people think playing pinball games on the computer is stupid in itself (can't say I disagree).

[skirge66]

but on a pinball machine there is no tilt button correct? but i could see adding a bump button to give the effect. but from the pics shown here it looks like a physical movement of the cabinet is required to activate this tilt feature...why would you ever shake this machine thereby activating this physical tilt mech? electronicly like you describe makes sense, not some ball on a string and a hoopy type thing...just sounds like more work with no effect really.

[1UP]

I think the idea would be to USE the tilt mechanism as your tilt input.  Rather than making a dedicated tilt button on the front of the cab, you'd bump the CP, the tilt sensor would close, sending an input to the game, which in turn bumps the table in the game.  Most, if not all, pinball games (including the crummy one built into windows), will accept one or more tilt inputs (i.e. bottom tilt, right tilt, left tilt) and if the idea of this board is supposed to be making home gaming more authentic, then why draw the line at pinball?

[SirPoonga]

that's how tilt mechs work.  A plumb hanging by a rod or steel wire, the rod or wire connects with a metal loop, completing a circuit.

[TheTick]

that's how tilt mechs work.  A plumb hanging by a rod or steel wire, the rod or wire connects with a metal loop, completing a circuit.

But that won't differentiate which side or angle is being bumped.

Multiple mercury switches are the best solution... next to just pressing the corresponding button with your fingers.

[paigeoliver]

One other question.

Even if it is functional, do you really want to be knocking your Mame cabinet around?

I don't even nudge my real pinball machine (even though they are designed to take it), because I want to keep it in tip top shape.

[TheTick]

One other question.

Even if it is functional, do you really want to be knocking your Mame cabinet around?

I don't even nudge my real pinball machine (even though they are designed to take it), because I want to keep it in tip top shape.

I don't have a full size cabinet, so its not an issue for me. Though on an unrelated issue, it has tipped twice while playing Metal Slug.

[M-80]

Hmmm...

1.) Needs to feel authentic and natural even though it's video pinball.
2.) Don't want to ruin the cabinet with excessive rocking. Tearing away at the screws and joints and making the cabinet creaky over time.

Maybe come up with some sort of shock absorption technique for putting together a cabinet where the panels of the cabinet (especially around points where the most stress would be) don't actually touch because of intermediary coushions between the panels. So if exaggerated to show what would go on the cabinet would look like it's bending and twisting without ill effects. But obviously would have it stiff enough where during normal play the shaking wouldn't be perceptable. So if you tilt the cabinet or jostle it in anyway there's less chance of wearing the cabinet out at the screwpoints. Maybe some sort of rubber bumpers between the panels and around the screws that absorb the shock. You'd need L-braces though to screw the panels together...

And then for the tilt mechanism. Maybe some sort of spring action double switch?


Or

[RandyT]

That's an interesting idea for saving wear and tear on the cabinet, but there's no real need to re-invent the tilt mechanism.

The real deal is amazingly simple and inexpensive:



The cone slides on the shaft to adust the sensitivity.  

RandyT

[Rasher2k]

Sounds like a nice authentic feature to have and all, but how heavy are your cabs? It's takes a fair bit of muscle to shunt a solid cab (unlike pinnies, which are on legs), meaning you'd have to set the cone deeper for more sensitivity. Then you're looking at a full-on tilt when it eventually does make contact. It'd probably work better on the lighter cabinets though.

Something to remeber if you DO install one though, every second other non-pinball game has the tilt feature. It's gonna suck when your game tilt's out on the last level during a hectic battle! Authentic, but irritating!  

[RandyT]

Sounds like a nice authentic feature to have and all, but how heavy are your cabs? It's takes a fair bit of muscle to shunt a solid cab (unlike pinnies, which are on legs), meaning you'd have to set the cone deeper for more sensitivity. Then you're looking at a full-on tilt when it eventually does make contact. It'd probably work better on the lighter cabinets though.

I think M-80 was addressing that with the "floating CP" idea.  Could be cool for someone who likes pinball sims.

Something to remeber if you DO install one though, every second other non-pinball game has the tilt feature. It's gonna suck when your game tilt's out on the last level during a hectic battle! Authentic, but irritating!  

Ok, I'm lost

What video games have a Tilt mech in them?  Slam switches, yes, but normally no tilts.  Besides, you can disable it for anything but pinball if you were worried about it.

RandyT

[Aceldamor]

Isn't there another method on BYOAC?  Is that method not good?

[M-80]

I think M-80 was addressing that with the "floating CP" idea.  Could be cool for someone who likes pinball sims.

Yeah, but as with all ideas. I'm not too sure of the particulars and it might, in the end, turn out to be more trouble than it's worth. :\ You'd have to be really into the physics of the thing I guess. And then there's the same wear and tear on the contact points. I'm really not too sure how such joints would look. I just figured that rubber washers would keep it steady and stiff but still give for some rough handling. And then again the cab might be too heavy to rock anyway. LOL Which was why I mentioned the springy legs (I think, or maybe I was just thinking about it and didn't mention it).

[SirPoonga]

What video games have a Tilt mech in them?  Slam switches, yes, but normally no tilts.  Besides, you can disable it for anything but pinball if you were worried about it.

Many, I know the ms pacman cocktail in a near by bar has one.  It's to stop people from bang on the machine.  Especiually cocktail tables.

[RandyT]

What video games have a Tilt mech in them?  Slam switches, yes, but normally no tilts.  Besides, you can disable it for anything but pinball if you were worried about it.

Many, I know the ms pacman cocktail in a near by bar has one.  It's to stop people from bang on the machine.  Especiually cocktail tables.

Hmm....this is interesting.

Here's a (hijacked, sorry) topic.  A number of games have a "tilt" input (for some reason Ms Pacman doesn't), but I haven't seen one do anything yet when activated.
 
So here are the questions:

Which games actually do something when tilt is activated?

What action is taken on games (like the aformentioned Ms.P) where a tilt mech is present, yet the code doesn't seem to support one?  Reset? External alarm?


RandyT

[Rasher2k]

Good old Space Invaders. That game ain't nobodys bitch, one little slap and *BANG* she tilts on ya, no warnings, no nuthin. One strike and you're outta there.

The screen comes up 'tilt' accompanied by 'game over', but thankfully your extra credits remain. Most other games where tilt works would do the same I imagine.

[BillyJack]

I remember seeing the tilt input (mamewise) in at least one of the old williams games (joust?  defender?) and when i did hit the button it said tilt...  of course i'm not at home right now or i'd fire them up and document what happens when it gets tilted.

[M-80]

What action is taken on games (like the aformentioned Ms.P) where a tilt mech is present, yet the code doesn't seem to support one?  Reset? External alarm?

With that in mind, I'd guess it would be for security. If anybody tried to tip the machine to somehow get into the coinbox...