LCD Marquee Project: AKA "How to put even more money into an old Defender cab"

[Avrus]

Simply amazing Randy.  Your ingenuity never ceases to astound.

[Fozzy The Bear]

Based on all of the other projects I'm working on currently, I know it's one of those things I'll never get around to do myself.

Yes absolutely.... How dare you work on anything for yourself Now stop wasting time on here and get that 49 way sorted this instant you naughty boy!!  Or Mr Hand will be meeting Mr Botty for a high velocity physics experiment

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[G1zm0]

ive got a golden tee caB with the marquee and scroller took out i could prob put a 22widescreen in there.
would this work with a arcadevga(driving polo 2)
  and would i need another gfx card to drive the top lcd?

[NIVO]

run the GGG banner. Nothing wrong with a shameless plug of your goods Randy 

I am no photoshop wizard by any stretch but you get the idea.

[RandyT]

run the GGG banner. Nothing wrong with a shameless plug of your goods Randy 

Heh,  I should have thought of that.  But the product promotion is probably already shameless enough, considering it's attached to every post I make

RandyT


(whoops! There it is again!  )

[ryantheleach]

hmm, depending on your screen angle you could have it jutting out the bottom of the marquee with an instruction card type thing...

[Spaced Ace]

Dude, that is insane.   It's cool and all, but I could think of some better thing to do with a $2,000 plasma screen tv, like watch cable.  Better than that, I could use $2000 period. 

So, now that arcade is worth about 8 grand now?

And where is this K-Mart at that gives these LCD tvs away for free basicaly? 

Sheesh....

[RandyT]

Dude, that is insane.   It's cool and all, but I could think of some better thing to do with a $2,000 plasma screen tv, like watch cable.  Better than that, I could use $2000 period. 

So, now that arcade is worth about 8 grand now?

You are off by a factor of about ten there.  I wouldn't put a $2000 plasma in for that either.  Maybe for a virtual pinball machine, though.

And where is this K-Mart at that gives these LCD tvs away for free basicaly? 

I'm really glad I picked that one up when I did.  I have no idea why they were being closed out, but I haven't yet found another at a similar price.  I would have thought that the price on this size would be much better by now, but instead, they cram more features into them and seem to have stalled the price.

Someday the price will drop and we will be ready

RandyT

[Spaced Ace]

Well dont know if you noticed Randy, but K-Mart has been in trouble since Sears took them over.  They have been closing stores left and right.  Sad to think that of K-Mart, cause when I was a kid, way before Wal-Mart, thats all we had.  K-Mart, with the consesion stand in the front, you know, ICEE's, Star Wars & G.I. Joe and of course the arcade a few stores down.

Anyway, you lucked out bro.  Nice work man on the arcade....

But youre wrong about one thing.  Someone, somewhere would pay at least $8,000 for that machine.  I mean, if they can sell the MAME Multi-cabs for $5000, I know yours is way better than those with a plasma screen.  Jut really cool though.

[RandyT]

Well dont know if you noticed Randy, but K-Mart has been in trouble since Sears took them over.

Yeah, I'm aware of the Sears takeover.  It was a case of two troubled business helping to prop each other up.  But this was likely just a matter of moving out old stock.  To be honest, this isn't the greatest LCD for watching TV.  There are no user selectable scaling options.  It just fills the screen in the worst way possible (linear scale).  Fine for marquees, not so great for TV.

And yes, I do have fond memories of my local K-mart as well. Ours has a huge front lobby that long ago introduced me to PONG, Donkey Kong and pinball.  I loved it when mom went shopping there, for obvious reasons.

Thanks for the compliments.

RandyT

[richms]

Yeah, I'm aware of the Sears takeover.  It was a case of two troubled business helping to prop each other up.  But this was likely just a matter of moving out old stock.  To be honest, this isn't the greatest LCD for watching TV.  There are no user selectable scaling options.  It just fills the screen in the worst way possible (linear scale).  Fine for marquees, not so great for TV.

Whys that a problem for watching TV? The only problem I can see is the lack of a crop mode for the few channels that are letterboxed 4:3 occasionally, but since they look like trash when blown up fullscreen, seeing them postagestamped is something I can live with.

[RandyT]

Whys that a problem for watching TV? The only problem I can see is the lack of a crop mode for the few channels that are letterboxed 4:3 occasionally, but since they look like trash when blown up fullscreen, seeing them postagestamped is something I can live with.

That's the problem with this set (for TV viewing, not as a marquee).  The default and only mode is "blown up full-screen".  It just stretches everything linearly and you can't shut it off.  Ok for widescreen content, but 4:3 looks poor (I'd rather deal with sidebars.)

RandyT

[richms]

Does your settop box not pillarbox the few remaining 4:3 channels that are not taken care of by the broadcasters? I have only seen 4:3 mode on a few PC LCDs, but its pretty rare to not see it on something sold as a tv since if your watching old VHS or analog off air you have nothing to add the bars, and all the old sat boxes in pal countries left it out since back in the days it was done by the TV via scart signalling.

Not that you can second use it for TV with the middle stripe being obscured with the bezel

[wolfsoft]

great work. RandyT !

It is possible to get the infos, how it works with the frontend?
I want to make it for my cabinet too and I am using MaLa as Frontend.
It is a special layout you are using for the marquee display?
Can you post it?

Thanks for your time

[havoc29]

Hi RandyT!

That's an amazing cab you have there!!

well.. im also working in a cab similar to yours.. but more (very) modest 

Instead of that big lcd, i'm using the ps1 lcd hack, just to display info about the game that's playing..just shows a 640x480 jpg...

But i'm having trouble finding an app the does that for me...

Will you be willing to share your app that does that for you? i would be very appreciated..!!!

thanks!

Regards
Carlos

[Hollywood]

Yes...I would like this program as well.  I am thinking of designing my own lcd marquee but I would like to see the software side working first.  Anyway you can send it my way?

Thanks in advance,

Lance

PS Keep up the great work.  You are a credit to this community with all your products.

[BobA]

Bump

Just to bring back a great idea.   TVs are alot cheaper now.

[shateredsoul]

I wonder why no one has made an lcd marquee you can buy, would it just not be profitable?

[Santoro]

Large upfront engineering costs + very small target market = high risk.

[ccmathome]

I've thought about doing something just like this, my cab has a large marquee pretty sure I could fit a 22" lcd there.

[DarkKobold]

A member from very long ago logs in to show you this


http://www.alibaba.com/product-free/106521954/Spanpixel_High_Brightness_LED_Backlight_LCD_Creative_Shape_LCD_Module.html


The only place I found specs was here, in german:
http://www.mpi.ch/products/industrial_computers/accessories_chassis_monitors/lcd_displays_tft_monitors/litemax_tft_lcd_kit_and_monitors/litemax_lcd/spanpixel_streched_lcd.html

I have yet to find one for sale, but this may be the new answer to having an LCD marquee.

[Yvan256]

I have yet to find one for sale, but this may be the new answer to having an LCD marquee.

Not sure it's the same monitor but I also found a PDF:
http://www.tokyo.numata.co.jp/products_n/it_system/lcd_solution/litemax/SSD3912_3915.pdf


And for bartops, those "visor LCD" ones seem to fit the bill too.
If you search a bit, you can find ones that are "ultra-wide" such as:
http://www.amazon.com/PLVSR10GR-10-2-Inch-Right-Visor-Monitors/dp/B0029V9CV6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1272327914&sr=1-2

Yes they seem to stretch the image, however all you need to do is prepare your marquee images so that once stretched they appear with the correct aspect ratio. And since they seem to have more pixels than the 16:9 ratio, maybe someone will figure out how to hack them to address all pixels individually.

[Bender]

Litemax scanpixle
I got a call in for pricing for one that has a display size of 27.5" x 10.25", seems just about the right size
so we'll see
I think it going to be BIG$$

[Yvan256]

Litemax scanpixle
I got a call in for pricing for one that has a display size of 27.5" x 10.25", seems just about the right size
so we'll see
I think it going to be BIG$$

Did you get a list of all the available sizes? And do all sizes have DVI, VGA and S-Video inputs?

[Bender]

they have 3 sizes, I think this is width w/bezel
15.9"
29.3"
39.1"
Details here

I think they are made to order so you can get them with any combination of VGA, DVI and component

*Edit* just got a price on a 29" one $1475  
I was hoping for $800 or less
such a shame, seems perfect, maybe they'll come down in price someday
All the details are in the PDF below

[DarkKobold]

If they are making each one individually, maybe a group order would drop the price?

Anyway, sad, I thought I'd found the perfect solution.

[Bender]

I asked about a discount for multiples and they said that would ordering hundreds of units

you did find the solution, I used your guys info and did just a bit more searching, never would have found it without your lead

[DarkKobold]

I contacted an LCD cutter about making a marquee.
http://www.tannas.com/html/amlcd.html

Mr. Tannas
      I stumbled across your website for cut LCDs looking to perform the same task myself. I wanted to introduce you to a possible market for your device/services. People build custom arcade cabinets that play multiple arcade games, known as MAME cabinets. One aesthetic desire is to have a marquee that changes with the game. However, given the standard marquee size (24x7), it is extremely difficult to find an LCD of a reasonable size. Here is an example of a project that someone has done, with a full LCD.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=70840.0

I'm not sure what your price range is, but if this is of interest to you, you may want to let the community know your price ranges/availability. Thank you for your time.

It is definitely of interest to me. What you desire should be resizable from a 28" HDTV.  I charge $1,500 to cut the LCD glass which my customer provides and remount it into its original frame for testing.  My customer then puts it into his frame as may be appropriate fro his product.  This is a prototyping cost and there is no NRE.

Regards, Larry

It sounds like a high prototyping cost, but possibly a cheaper model afterward. Unfortunately, we'd need lots of people to make the prototyping cost effective. 

Just another possibility.
 

[bazaillion]

Why not use a $250 Optoma Pico PK201 WVGA (854 x 480) DLP projector with a piece of frosted rear projection acrylic. letter boxed with a filter of some sorts. there about the size of a cell phone.

[RandyT]

Why not use a $250 Optoma Pico PK201 WVGA (854 x 480) DLP projector with a piece of frosted rear projection acrylic. letter boxed with a filter of some sorts. there about the size of a cell phone.

From the review;

Throw distance and lens performance: The PK201 has a fixed throw ratio of 2.20:1. When using the PK201 as a secondary computer monitor, I was limited to a 10-inch wide screen size by the 22.5 inch width of my desk.

It will also not look very "marquee-like".  With a decent LCD panel, it's hard to tell it's not painted and backlit.  I could probably even fix that with some shading at the edges of the bitmaps to simulate drop off.

RandyT

[bazaillion]

put the projector on back down lower bank to screen with a mirror

[bazaillion]

As for LCD I agree it would look best.

Here is the patent filed for how they do resize LCD's. Seems like you could find someone with a CO laser cutter or a water jet and get it done cheaper possibly. They seal it with UV curable adhesives.

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/7161651/description.html] [url]http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/7161651/description.html[/url]

[RandyT]

put the projector on back down lower bank to screen with a mirror

Been done.  Also, the further you go, the dimmer the light.  The reviewer stated that "Image sizes up of to fifty percent greater are viewable in normal, non-direct room lighting.", which is a paltry 15" diagonal.  With only 18 lumen to play with, you'll run out of light fast.  You also need a totally unobstructed light path, large first surface mirrors (to avoid a 4% ghost image from the face of the glass), etc.  If it was a $50 toy that one could re-purpose for this, then it might be worth the effort.  But not at the cost of an LCD, which gets the job done faster, easier and at better quality.

As for the patent, IANAL, but I think they will have a hard time enforcing that one.  It's an approach anyone with half a brain would take, let alone be pretty obvious to anyone who is "skilled in the art".  But writing about how to do it and actually being able to are hugely different, and the second one is full of nuances you won't find in that patent.

RandyT

[Wade]

As for the patent, IANAL, but I think they will have a hard time enforcing that one.  It's an approach anyone with half a brain would take, let alone be pretty obvious to anyone who is "skilled in the art".  But writing about how to do it and actually being able to are hugely different, and the second one is full of nuances you won't find in that patent.

RandyT

My guess is that it's not about protection, it's about marketing (being able to truthfully claim "our patented process...")

Wade

[Rick]

If anybody has been keeping up with technology lately, this could be possible in the next few years by going OLED.  Read here.  From the article:

DuPont  stated in a press release in May 2010 that they can produce a 50-inch OLED TV in two minutes with a new printing technology. If this can be scaled up in terms of manufacturing, then the total cost of OLED TVs would be greatly reduced. Dupont also states that OLED TVs made with this less expensive technology can last up to 15 years if left on for a normal eight hour day.

I've read more than a few articles, and with this 'flexible' display technology, they were even discussing the possibility of a TV you can roll or fold up, much like a modern day newspaper.

[Yvan256]

I've read more than a few articles, and with this 'flexible' display technology, they were even discussing the possibility of a TV you can roll or fold up, much like a modern day newspaper.

That would mean not only dynamic marquees, but curved dynamic marquees as well.

[Rick]

That would mean not only dynamic marquees, but curved dynamic marquees, side and control panel graphics as well.

Fix'd!

 

[HaRuMaN]

How cool would that be?  Have the sideart and cpo change based on what game you are playing...  *drool* 

[Yvan256]

That would mean not only dynamic marquees, but curved dynamic marquees, side and control panel graphics as well.

Fix'd!

 

I'm also waiting for electrochromic molded plastic so that we can have buttons with the correct colors of the game played. LED-lit buttons don't look right IMHO.

[Yvan256]

How cool would that be?  Have the sideart and cpo change based on what game you are playing...  *drool* 

But did you think about all the work needed to crop/rework all the sideart and cpo overlays of the games to fit your own cabinet?