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Author Topic: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?  (Read 3571 times)

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simpleman46

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Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« on: March 22, 2002, 07:22:20 pm »
I'm just looking for some opinions before I build, any input is appreciated.  :)
Two things:

1)  I'm building a two player control panel.  Two 8-way joysticks, 7 buttons per player.  Possibly an additional 4-way stick.  And of course the usual coin and player start buttons.  
Based on previous experience, what do you think is a good width for this?  I don't want to make it too huge, but I don't want the two players to be interfering with each other too much (bashing elbows).

2)  It seems that most people use either 1/2" or 3/4" thick wood for their CP.  I think I'll probably use the 1/2" because I'm concerned with the length of the joystick shaft.  Should I be concerned?
What if I have plexiglass also?
Will 1/2" wood be strong enough for play?

Thanks for your opinions!

btw.....  I'll probably be using MDF for the CP.



« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

ArcadeFX

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2002, 10:03:31 pm »
I am 6'3 and about 210.  My control panel is about 35 x 17.  It is T shaped and  this is the perfect size for my cabinet.  It also is just right for two players my size.  I made sure I had enough room.   It all depends on your cabinet size and your layout.  Here is a pic of mine if you have any further questions..

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

tellarite

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2002, 11:26:34 pm »
Here is my newly completed panel: http://www.tellarite.net/new-cabinet#03-17-2002

It is 900 cm across. I used 1/4 inch phenolic with 3/4 inch wood underneath. The wood is for the added weight and rigidity to the phenolic. The joys are mounted directly to the phenolic (so that's 1/4 inch clearence) I haven't had too much playtime involved with this panel, but anything longer than 900 would be too big for my cabinet and it seems about right for two players. (My cabinet is skinnier than a lot of peoples. Dimensions were based off of an old millipede cabinet I have that since was converted to a two player aero fighters cab. The joys in that were even closer than I have them.)

I am very happy with the length of my joysticks (I am using Happ Supers), however, I might be concerned even with the 1/2 inch you suggested. Idunno.. this is my first panel.. and I just barely got it done.. so take my comments with a grain of salt.

My suggestion is to go to a real arcade and see what feels good to you. Don't forget to bring a tape measurer!

Here is a pic:

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

Frobozz

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2002, 11:38:26 pm »
Of course, if you have a bridgeboard sitting around in your basement, you could make it out of 12 gage stainless steel. ;)

Question tellarite.  How well does the CP hold up?  Is there any flexation or misformation around the joystick mounts?  I wouldn't want to break my panel during a heated game of Sinistar. ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

tellarite

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2002, 03:32:47 am »
phenolic is SOLID AS A ROCK

I honestly don't think I could break it with a hammer.

I knew that phenolic was hard stuff, but I was surprised at just how hard it really is (But not to cut or drill amazingly!) The stuff is made by GE for high voltage electrical stuff like transformers ... it's a polymer of fabric and plasticy stuff... smells terrible when you cut it. Weird stuff.. it is normally tanish brownish but the dust turns bright orange when routered.

I wanted to use steel originally because of it's thickness (or lack there of) but then I realized that I wouldn't be able to use my tools on it (I only have woodworking tools). So, I thought I could use aluminum because it's softer and have heard woodworking tools are fine with it. BUUUT... I found out it would cost me about $90 for the sheet I needed... ouch.  

The pluses of phenolic:

1) a LOT cheper than aluminum. I paid about $30 for my sheet. I forget how big it was originally, but it was the minimum order... not that much bigger than my control panel which is 900 cm across by 310 cm deep

2) Can be cut with standard woodworking tools

3) The stuff is actually used for some bullet proof applications.

4) I cannot bend this stuff

5) Aluminum dents if you hit hard enough. I haven't tried but I doubt phenolic will...

phenolic rules!!

Here is some pics of the phenolic allready cut and cemented to the wood. The surface on it is as it came from the factory (I actually had one friend think that I stained the wood.. LOL)



-Tellarite
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

Frobozz

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2002, 11:21:47 am »
Wow, and it's only 1/4" thick?!  Ok, I got a few more questions if you don't mind.  This sounds like some awesome CP stuff.  My big problem is I like tall sticks, and while the Wico stick I got is tall, when mounted under 3/4" plywood, it gets considerably shorter.  

1) Does it splinter, chunk away, etc, anything that would make it hard to make perfectly straight cuts and routs on?  I'm building my control panel similar to jelloslug's modular panel.  One of the things necessary is that when I slide the control module in, that there is very little if any gap between, which mean very straight cuts and edges that'll last a long time.  

2) Where do you get the phenolic?

3) I noticed you cemented it to plywood.  Was this just to provide a stable frame for your panel and ease of attachment to the rest of the box?  What type of cememt did you use?  

Thanks!  Heck, it seems the more I hold off on actually building my cabinet, the more awesome ideas I learn here.  

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

tellarite

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2002, 12:56:40 pm »
Phenolic was a bit of an experiment. I'll admit. It was my dad's idea. I haven't seen anyone else use this stuff for a control panel.

for your questions:

1) does it chunk out? In no way. anything that you cut off it makes good straight cuts. Routing is even better, the stuff turns into a kind of powder and leaves a very fine cut. YOU WILL GET DIRTY.. ORANGE DIRTY .. it also doesn't smell too good, but I don't think it's a harmful smell.. though ventilation might be a good plan. I wish that I had had someone else take a picture of me after I was done routing. I was all orange!

2)I got my sheet in Salt Lake City, UT at a place called industrial plastics or something equally as generic. You can get this anywhere that they sell GE (as in General Electric) based polymers. I was lucky, I went in and they had a sheet that was about the right size allready so I just bought it. They should have the facilities for them to cut a big sheet down for you though.

3)I used regular contact cement. The same stuff you use if you were doing a formica counter top. it's a milky white color and is really runny. Works wonders and is really easy to use. You mop the stuff onto any two surfaces.. wait an hour.. and press them together.. instant bonding. However, the cement only sticks to itself.. nothing else. Weird stuff.

As far as the wood underneath? I don't have a good answer for you. I am tempted to say that you would be fine with just the phenolic, but, just having the extra "weight" made the whole panel have a much more solid feel to it. Yes, the phenolic is tough stuff, and is heavier than it looks, but it is still only 1/4 inch thick...

The original idea for the phenolic was so that my buttons could be closer together on my wood control panel. I didn't want my buttons to break the wood because they were too close together. I bought the phenolic to reinforce the wood, not the other way around. The idea never popped into my head to use just the phenolic. I honestly think that it might "bow"  slightly after a few years if left to itself, not sure.

If you got more questions I'd be happy to answer them.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

simpleman46

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2002, 01:49:23 pm »
Has anybody here used 1/2" thick MDF?  Are you happy with it?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

Billabong

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2002, 06:18:18 pm »
A couple of CP's were done with 3/4" MDF, then routered down to 1/2" where the joysticks go. So you get a nice solid panel, and decent stick exposure. I forget which project had it, sorry. :(
I plan on doing it to mine, just been to busy playing. :)

Later,
Billabong
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »
"So, you took apart a joystick to make...another joystick?"

sam

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2002, 06:37:28 pm »
i used 1/2" plywood. i had similar concerns about joystick height with anything thicker. i have happs supers and they are fine.

i was a bit worried about stability, but it turned out not to be a problem. the plywood is tough. my cp has had some serious playing go on on it and no problems whatsoever.

plywood is really easy to cut and drill. doesn't leave any fine powder like i hear mdf does. which is nice when you need your living room to double as your woodworking area (ha).

just make sure to sand and varnish so you don't get splinters.

just to reiterate, 1/2" plywood is really great. i don't feel like it gets the attention it deserves :-)

good luck
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

Frobozz

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2002, 08:22:31 pm »
Really good information.  I think I'm going to try to look for the phenolic, but if I don't find it, will most likely go with 3/4" MDF and route it down where needed.  

Man, all this trouble just to fit a set of controls into a 24" x 7" space.  :)

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »

tellarite

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Re: Ideal CP Width and Thickness?
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2002, 08:35:55 pm »
I wish you luck! Having your own control panel is sooo worth it  ;D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 pm by 1026619200 »