Author Topic: Need help troubleshooting 3" Happ Trackball (Read 7097 times)

nickbuol · « **on:** July 01, 2007, 01:33:28 am »

My 3" Happ trackball was working great for about 2 years and then it seemed the it just stopped working for some reason. I don't play the arcade on a real regular basis, and not always trackball games, so I don't know exactly when it stopped or why.

I get absolutely no movement on screen when moving the ball, but it does register if a press a button. I have the USB/PS2 version of it (using the USB connection).

Any ideas on what I can try or known issues that I could find a way to get it working again? Thanks!

nickbuol · « **Reply #1 on:** July 01, 2007, 06:15:00 pm »

OK. I took the trackball out of my cabinet today, and hooked it up to my laptop, and still no go. The circuit boards "look" ok, and everything was clean and connected. I still can't figure out why it isn't working. If I don't figure this out, does anyone know if I replaced the electronics with the USB-PS/2 Trackball Interface Kit (Happ PN 56-0113-00K) that should fix the problem, right? I can get one for about $47 vs. a whole new trackball for $90...

Any help would be great here. Thanks!

fatfingers · « **Reply #2 on:** July 01, 2007, 06:35:41 pm »

I don't have a clue what I'm talking about, but I suppose for fun you could run a voltmeter against the thing to see if current flows through it?

rescue161 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 01, 2007, 07:01:53 pm »

Is there dust in the optical sensors? Are you able to take voltage readings on the sensors themselves? If so, what are the readings? Does the circuit board have any voltage readings at all? I stay away from USB type things if at all possible. It's easier to troubleshoot things that aren't USB. USB = Plug-n-Play which equals the manufacturers want you to throw it away when it break = more money for them.

nickbuol · « **Reply #4 on:** July 01, 2007, 08:27:26 pm »

I checked the sensors and they are clean. I also broke out the volt-meter and got various power readings on both boards, but I have no idea what I should be looking for...

rescue161 · « **Reply #5 on:** July 01, 2007, 08:34:50 pm »

Are you able to snap a couple of pics of the board?

nickbuol · « **Reply #6 on:** July 01, 2007, 09:21:47 pm »

My wife has the camera, but she should be home soon (it is 8:20PM Central time US right now). I will take some pictures of each of the two boards, front and back and post what I have.

rescue161 · « **Reply #7 on:** July 01, 2007, 09:26:30 pm »

Man, if you are near Wichita Falls, TX, then bring it by. I know it's a long shot, but I saw Central time...lol

nickbuol · « **Reply #8 on:** July 01, 2007, 09:31:36 pm »

I'll jump in my car and head over... Should be there around 6:35 AM if I leave right now and don't stop... LOL...

(just trying to be funny) Thanks anyway...

rescue161 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 01, 2007, 09:39:16 pm »

LOL. If you send pics of the PCB and give me part numbers of the components, I should be able to let you know what you should be reading. I'll try my best to get you up and running without having to spend a fortune.

nickbuol · « **Reply #10 on:** July 01, 2007, 11:06:30 pm »

Ok. Below are the pictures. Board "1" is the first one in line from the USB/PS2 plug, board "2" is on the end (farthest from the USB/PS2 cable) and plugs into board "1"...

Kind of like this...

CABLE ---- Board 1 ---- Board 2

They show a copyright of 2001, but I bought this trackball new from Ponyboy here in July 2005.

Board 1 (PN 55-0301-00) front and back:

Board 2 (PN 55-0302-00) front and back:

rescue161 · « **Reply #11 on:** July 02, 2007, 07:59:22 am »

Can you give me the numbers of of U1 (the chip) and if there are any, the numbers off of each of the optocouplers?

I'll look up what the chip actually does so we can get some proper voltage readings. Those optocouplers have an LED inside of them that will drop some voltage ~1 to 2 volts. I wouldn't imagine that both would go bad at the same time, especially with them being on different boards. That's why I'm suspecting the chip. Depending on what it is, they can be pretty cheap. Soldering on the other hand can be tricky on a double-sided board like that if you've never done it before.

Get me the numbers and I'll get you the voltage readings that you're suppose to have.

Edit: I forgot to ask if there is voltage on the red wire (V+). With it plugged in, measure across the black wire (G) and the red one (V+) and tell me what you're getting.

nickbuol · « **Reply #12 on:** July 02, 2007, 07:07:55 pm »

OK. Let me take a shot at this:

The optical sensors are both ALPR0J0001-HC

Oh, and I get 5 Volts (4.999) on the V+ and G wires when plugged in to the board (and USB obviously)

rescue161 · « **Reply #13 on:** July 02, 2007, 08:27:49 pm »

I can't seem to find any info on the chip. The 6.00L4P is a crystal. Those rarely bite the dust, but it's possible. I wish I could at least get a schematic of the chip that you have so I could at least come up with the voltage readings that you should be seeing.

nickbuol · « **Reply #14 on:** July 02, 2007, 10:48:03 pm »

I had emailed the folks that are selling the boards and cables as a kit, and they would sell the boards for $28 total shipped to my door, so I always have that as an option too. That is a little more reasonable of a cost than $48... I would still love to try to fix this, but who knows if that is possible...

rescue161 · « **Reply #15 on:** July 03, 2007, 07:32:01 am »

If I had a schematic for the board and a layout of the chip, it would be easy. The schematic could be extracted by looking at the board, but I have no idea what that chip is, so it'd be a shot in the dark.

I'd go ahead and get the new boards. That way, you could take readings on it and then you'd know what's wrong with the broken one.

rescue161 · « **Reply #16 on:** July 03, 2007, 02:26:24 pm »

Okay. I had better luck today searching the internet. Here is a PDF of the chip itself. http://www.holtek.com.tw/pdf/computer/82m98av200.pdf

You can see in the reference schematics that the 6 MHz crystal is tied to pins 17 & 18. If you have an oscilloscope, you could verify that it is working. I doubt that it is bad as you stated that the buttons work. That means that the chip is working in that respect. If the buttons are working, then the volage at pins 1 & 16 are correct, there is a 6 MHz signal at pins 17 & 18, pins 12, 13 & 14 are receiving the porper voltage during their respective button press and pins 3 & 4 are sending the correct data to the USB post on the computer. This rules out the chip for the most part.

This leads me to believe that one of the optocouplers IS bad as they are tied together. I would imaging just by looking at the pictures that if the optocoupler on the first board is bad, then the second one would not work.
It looks to me just judging from the photos that the LED in the optocoupler on the main board is closest to the chip. If you place the black lead of your multimeter on the black ground cable of the plug and then probe with your red test lead (using the DC setting), you should see 5 volts on the red wire. If you follow the trace to the optocoupler, you'll run into "R1". You should see 5 volts on one side of R1 and a different, smaller voltage on the other side. If it's the same voltage, then something is open. Just keep following that trace until you see "0" (zero) volts. Once it shows zero, then you know where the open is. It's probably going to be one or the other. Just don't remove the black test lead from the black wire and you should be fine.

Let me know what you find out.

divemaster127 · « **Reply #17 on:** July 03, 2007, 05:26:19 pm »

your optic boards are bad, happ has had issues with these & a month ago released the new version 2 optics to fix the issue
dm

divemaster127 · « **Reply #18 on:** July 03, 2007, 05:27:15 pm »

I have 5 sets of the new revision 2 boards, these are the complete boards for 19.99 plus shipping
dm

nickbuol · « **Reply #19 on:** July 04, 2007, 01:15:15 am »

Is that $19.99 for both boards or just one?

I am out of town tonight and tomorrow (the 4th), so I won't be home to do more testing for a little bit.

divemaster127 · « **Reply #20 on:** July 04, 2007, 09:55:31 am »

hello, that is for both boards
thanks
dm

rescue161 · « **Reply #21 on:** July 07, 2007, 12:45:28 pm »

Have you had a chance to troubleshoot the boards any?

Here's another tip. Put the black lead on the (G) black wire and place the red lead on the red wire comeing out of the 1st board going to the 2nd board. You should see ~1.2v DC. If it shows zero, then either R1 is open or the first optocoupler is open.

nickbuol · « **Reply #22 on:** July 07, 2007, 02:03:44 pm »

Quote from: rescue161 on July 03, 2007, 02:26:24 pm

If you place the black lead of your multimeter on the black ground cable of the plug and then probe with your red test lead (using the DC setting), you should see 5 volts on the red wire. If you follow the trace to the optocoupler, you'll run into "R1". You should see 5 volts on one side of R1 and a different, smaller voltage on the other side. If it's the same voltage, then something is open. Just keep following that trace until you see "0" (zero) volts. Once it shows zero, then you know where the open is. It's probably going to be one or the other. Just don't remove the black test lead from the black wire and you should be fine.

OK. I get the 5V coming in to the red wire. I get 5 volts on one side of R1, and I get 2.184 volts on the other side of R1.

The lowest voltage I get is 0.05 on one of the pins for the opto on the first board. It is the pin that is the absolute furthest away from the power plug.
For the opto on the 2nd board, I get 0.05 volts on one of the pins there too. It is actually the same pin as on the first opto, based off of the markings on the board.

As for the red wire going to the second board, I get a full 5V there... Hmmm....

rescue161 · « **Reply #23 on:** July 07, 2007, 02:21:19 pm »

Well. That is strange. What are the voltage readins on each side of R1 on the 2nd board?

nickbuol · « **Reply #24 on:** July 07, 2007, 03:55:52 pm »

5V and 2.2V depending on the side...

nickbuol · « **Reply #25 on:** July 07, 2007, 04:00:20 pm »

ARGH!!! In my testing, I managed to accidentally pull the red input wire out of its socket in the plug that attaches the USB/PS2 cable to the first board... I don't think that it was loose. I had the board lightly attached to a rubberized "vice" like grip on my work bench, and didn't see that it was snagged when I grabbed it quickly and left the workbench. I felt a good little pull, and then saw the loose wire. Still not EXACTLY sure what it snagged on, but ARGH I am getting frustrated. Now to figure out if I can fix that easily...

rescue161 · « **Reply #26 on:** July 09, 2007, 01:43:58 pm »

That is difinitely not cool. Hope you can get it fixed (at least that part) so you can figure out what's really wrong with it.

nickbuol · « **Reply #27 on:** July 09, 2007, 10:17:24 pm »

I got it back together. Any thoughts on what else to try, or should I just get an order placed for replacement boards?

Thanks!

rescue161 · « **Reply #28 on:** July 10, 2007, 09:51:18 am »

To do any further troubleshooting I'd need to actually see the board. You're going to better off buying the new boards from divemaster127. That's a good deal.

To troubleshoot further, you'd need an oscilloscope to "see" if the timing on pins 6 through 9 is right.

nickbuol · « **Reply #29 on:** July 10, 2007, 07:43:33 pm »

Hey, thanks for your help up to this point. I just fired off a PM to divemaster127 about the boards...

nickbuol · « **Reply #30 on:** July 19, 2007, 03:33:06 pm »

I got my replacement boards today from divemaster127, but they were the wrong boards.
He sent two identical boards P/N A052-1011-00. These are replacements for the original "green" boards P/N A052-1010-00.

As it shows above, I have green boards P/N 55-0301-00 and P/N 55-0302-00. The boards I got don't even have the right size connectors.

I sent a PM to divemaster127, so hopefully he has the correct boards to send me.

nickbuol · « **Reply #31 on:** July 22, 2007, 11:54:03 pm »

divemaster127 is going to order the right boards and then we are going to do a "swap" so he is coming through for me. Just thought that I would update the thread so that people knew what he was being a great help.

nickbuol · « **Reply #32 on:** August 06, 2007, 09:04:16 pm »

Just a follow up that I got my (correct) replacement boards from divemaster127 today and they work perfectly. Now I need to get the trackball back into the arcade. Unfortunately, we have people staying at our house and they just put their small kids to bed in the same part of our basement that I have the arcade in... So I guess I will have to wait until tomorrow after work.

Thanks again to everyone for their help and to divemaster127 for coming through for me.

ChicagoDave · « **Reply #33 on:** December 28, 2007, 05:10:50 pm »

I had the exact same issue with my USB trackball. It worked great for about 2 years and then all of a sudden it would not register fast spins.

I have Rev B on my boards.

I got a new trackball today from bottlenose58 on ebay. The invoice said it was Tornado Terry's, so I think they are on in the same. The new trackball also has Rev B on the boards. Is he selling old stock? I was hoping that it would have the newer boards.

Well, anyways, I plugged it in and all my problems are gone. I just hope it doesn't die like the old one.

Cero21 · « **Reply #34 on:** December 29, 2007, 09:38:37 pm »

I'm about to buy a Happ (USB) trackball but I want to make sure I get the version with the updated boards. What label should I be looking for? It seems the old ones say revision B.

ChicagoDave · « **Reply #35 on:** December 30, 2007, 11:18:17 am »

Actually I was mistaken. I just looked at the old boards and:

55-0301-00 says that it is Rev. D
55-0302-00 says that it is Rev. B

On the new trackball:

55-0302-00 says that it is Rev. B

I cannot read 55-0301-00 on the new ball since it is mounted.

I'm confused. How do I tell if I have the new boards?

ChicagoDave · « **Reply #36 on:** January 03, 2008, 07:18:43 pm »

Another update on this. I ordered a Happ USB Trackball kit from ebay and it contained the 2 boards as well as the cables. I placed the kit into the old trackball and everything is working fine on the old one as well.

It definitely seems to be a problem with the old boards. Note this these new boards also had the same Rev numbers.


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