Author Topic: Cheap arcade joysticks "wood" box $30 (Read 4894 times)

armad1ll0 · « **on:** April 21, 2003, 05:47:20 am »

I'm sure that you've seen them on Ebay. The "arcade" parts suck but these $30 joysticks can be easily upgraded. I drilled two extral holes on mine and swapped all of the buttons and stick for a competent arcade joystick. I'll probably resell it but it was an easy conversion. Their offices were 5 mins from mine so I stopped by and chatted for a while. They were really nice and I offered advice on how to upgrade their "cheap" sticks to something that could fill this low end arcade controls market.

theirs
http://www.redoctane.com/joystick-series.html

mine
http://www.geocities.com/armad1ll0/images/Mini_stick.jpg

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #1 on:** April 22, 2003, 04:27:09 am »

do you guys think that this is a good place to start w/ a controller?
I think that it gets you going pretty quickly...

paigeoliver · « **Reply #2 on:** April 22, 2003, 04:32:46 am »

The only problem is that those are playstation controllers. Not sure how useful those would be if you didn't have a Playstation.

MameFan · « **Reply #3 on:** April 22, 2003, 11:26:31 am »

Okay, raise your hands... How many peopele were expecting some oak-covered joystick shaft or something when reading the title of the post

That'd be cool but wouldn't last long

mattudland · « **Reply #4 on:** April 22, 2003, 11:34:28 am »

Please explain - are the buttons and joystick actual arcade parts, linked to some hardware device like some sort of PSX hack... or are the parts not arcade, and not compatable with arcade switches etc...

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #5 on:** April 23, 2003, 04:41:33 am »

Sorry all.... these are PSX joysticks but with a Kikijoy PSX to USB adaptor, ($10) you have a desktop arcade controller. Their parts are substandard... but how easy is that to replace/fix.... You can even rewire it as a supergun controller or a USB gamepad hack...

I just wanted to spread the word since I'm working on a few of these right now. The redoctane dudes were really nice when I visited them.

Vampyre · « **Reply #6 on:** April 23, 2003, 06:28:43 am »

MameFan ,. he got me too

paigeoliver · « **Reply #7 on:** April 23, 2003, 06:48:36 am »

If you ever go in there again, tell them to start making metal Pump it Up pads.

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #8 on:** April 24, 2003, 06:14:39 am »

I'm stopping by next week to have lunch, pick up some more sticks, and to consult on joystick designs with them.

I finished my first stick and it's boxed and ready to go to the buyer.

1) swapped in a Happ Super
2) put in the L1 and L2 buttons (PSX)
3) changed all of the buttons to black Happ horizontal buttons. The coloring is similar to the DualShock2 colors.

NAH · « **Reply #9 on:** April 24, 2003, 08:32:21 pm »

Why not have a wood covered joystick shaft?? Somebody with a lathe should get on this...

Infrasonic · « **Reply #10 on:** April 28, 2003, 02:18:40 am »

Would there really be a market for an oak joystick cabinet?

That would be cool, I have access way better woods than oak though. If they can sell these units for $30 dollars, that just hurts this business in two ways. Either people will opt for that unit 'cause it's cheaper than mine, or people will try those units and think that all of the home arcade commercial style units will be like that and never buy any of commercial grade part-having arcade sticks.

By the way, when they refer to Happ's competition and horizontal parts they forgot one thing: L_O_R_E_N_Z_O M_A_K_E_S T_H_O_S_E P_A_R_T_S.

Here their website, mostly in Spanish http://www.industrias-lorenzo.com/

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #11 on:** April 28, 2003, 05:06:26 am »

I built an Oak stick. With like $40 in good woods, it was pointless cause playability was not any better. It's also harder to work with. Router cuts were a pain. I prefer Black Melamine the best.

I like Redoctane and I think that they are doing gamers a service. I'm talking to them about making better sticks overall. I find the parts inside a little cheap. But for overseas box manufacturing, it's decent enough and low enough in price so that normal kids going to stores can get a decent stick. How is that a bad thing? They do this industry a service! Compare it to the X-arcade at $150 and how does that make sense. X-arcades suck in my mind. cramped 2 player panel, bad button layout... at least they got the multi-platform part right!

I looked on Lorenzo industries website, and yes... you are correct... the buttons are from them.

paigeoliver · « **Reply #12 on:** April 28, 2003, 05:14:30 am »

Give a company an opportunity to save 20 cents per unit, and they will do it.

You can't put a 15 cent joystick and 5 cent buttons with 3 cent microswitches in a commercial arcade game, because they will fail in a week.

BUT.

Put those same junk components in a home stick and it will fail in two years instead, at which point the console it was made for will probably be on its way out anyway, so the person will be buying the next stick for the next console.

Infrasonic · « **Reply #13 on:** April 28, 2003, 04:14:03 pm »

Two player sticks suck because you're always fighting for space and being cramped. Also (regarding 2-player X-Arcade) some people stink, and I wouldn't wanna be too close to them, you never know maybe it's their strategy. You never got to worry about that with 1-player units because you can distance them far from eachother, also, you or your opponent can always plug in a game pad.

If a company can save 20 cents they might do it, but if they can save 30 dollars they will do it. Whatever type of components are used in those sticks look so much like the STP, Lorenzo, Wico, Happ, and Atari stuff that I feel that the uninformed customer may mistake the two. The arcade stick business doesn't look too lucrative at this point, even X-Arcade's products accounted for less than 1/1000 of 1 percent of sales at a local business I know of.

I believe that there is great potential for high end beautiful manufactured arcade sticks, and consoles. If there are people actually buying $10,000 internet refrigerators-a $2,000 fine-furniture grade, full sized mame would probably find some buyers.

RandyT · « **Reply #14 on:** April 28, 2003, 04:32:05 pm »

Quote from: Infrasonic on April 28, 2003, 04:14:03 pm

I believe that there is great potential for high end beautiful manufactured arcade sticks, and consoles. If there are people actually buying $10,000 internet refrigerators-a $2,000 fine-furniture grade, full sized mame would probably find some buyers.

I can see it now, "Rolltop MAME", with optional inlaid brass player indicators and mother of pearl joystick restrictors.

*shudder*

(off to go wash my mind out with lye.........)

RandyT

Infrasonic · « **Reply #15 on:** April 28, 2003, 05:49:40 pm »

No I was thinking more of neon lights, gold plated computer chips, plush interior, automated orchestra music greatings, and yes-- air conditioning. Maybe a built in beer tap.

and some laser beams.

Infrasonic · « **Reply #16 on:** April 28, 2003, 05:51:24 pm »

Oh yeah, I forgot, it would also need a GM Performants Parts Crate 502, with some polished headers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ahi_Tuna · « **Reply #17 on:** April 28, 2003, 10:10:08 pm »

LOL

how about a full lazy boy chair that's connected. The machine tilts so that you can play comfortably.

Did anyone point out that there's a sale on Ultimates at Happ. The black ones are $6.99 and why do people prefer Supers? They generally feel the same accept that supers have shorter thicker shafts... hmmm

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #18 on:** April 29, 2003, 06:57:13 pm »

I've talked to some stores and their thoughts are that the market will suport a wood case joystick like this for up to $50. What do you think?

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #19 on:** May 02, 2003, 04:18:40 am »

So I had lunch with the RedOctane guys and they were really cool.
I brought them my Sanwa ball top Capcom themed conversion of one of their sticks and went over why I used each type of part. They are basically trying to develop two products.

1) a less than $50 joystick that plays well and is for the entry level game buyer but better than all of the cheap plastic body sticks out there.

2) develop a competition level stick for the performance player. under $100???

They really liked the Sanwa arcade grade stick that I made and saw the difference of the competition Lorenzo buttons as well. I think that it really gave them an idea of what parts to go looking for to match and to basically get the best priced product built and into many retail channels. I think that it's doable because of their overseas manufacturing.

And they do sell PUMP IT UP pads, I think metal pads too...

paigeoliver · « **Reply #20 on:** May 02, 2003, 04:40:28 am »

Quote from: armad1ll0 on May 02, 2003, 04:18:40 am

And they do sell PUMP IT UP pads, I think metal pads too...

I saw Pump it Up pads, and I saw metal ddr pads. What I didn't see was metal Pump it Up pads. Which is what I want.

AceTKK · « **Reply #21 on:** May 02, 2003, 05:02:38 am »

I think they're asking way too much for the version built with Happ components. According to e-bay listings the standard version of the stick is selling for 29.99, while the version with "Real Happ Components" is more than twice the price at $79.99. What's up with that? I could buy the basic stick and change all the components myself for less than the price of the other one. I can understand a $10-$15 price difference but not a $50 difference.

-Ace-

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #22 on:** May 03, 2003, 05:14:58 am »

at the normal Happ prices, sticks are $13+ and a set of 8 buttons would run another $13+

That's $30 in parts alone and factor in labor which should be around $15 or so... so that's about $45

Isn't this a little closer?

AceTKK · « **Reply #23 on:** May 03, 2003, 05:57:44 am »

Okay, so say it's $30 in Happ's parts alone (not really accurate since they would be buying in bulk, right?) but for the sake of argument we'll call it $30 in parts. What about the $ they save by not installing the generic controls? That's got to knock $10 off the price right there, right?
And what do you mean about additional labor costs? What difference does it make whether they install Happ components or generic ones? I don't see where these costs are coming from? Don't get me wrong, I still think that stick is a good value considering the XArcade single player is $100, I just don't understand the price difference between the standard and premium models.

-Ace-

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #24 on:** May 05, 2003, 03:39:28 am »

Actually they had their initial run made as is and they take them apart and then swap in parts ordered from Happ. It's backwards, yes... but it's their first round. Just you wait. I'm working with them on their version 2 which will be heavily influenced by my consulting and designs of my own sticks.

X-arcade don't even use the same grade as Happ parts. Theirs are knock offs...

And please don't get me wrong... nothing beats building your own unless you just don't have the skillz... but isn't this what this site is all about... developing those skillz. That's why I'm annoyed when people try to make a business out of building sticks etc... Maybe I sound like a hypocrate cause I do sell stuff that I build but if you can build it yourself then I'd prefer to encourage that. If you want to contract a builder then that's cause maybe you can't settle for nothing but the best.

I like it when a mass market controller brings this type of personal arcade panel to a low price and is reasonably good.

AceTKK · « **Reply #25 on:** May 05, 2003, 04:20:33 am »

ahh, I understand the pricing better now. I like what the company has to offer and I'm sure their new model line will be successful considering they have your expertise to help them. I do hope they're compensating you somehow, but that's none of our business.

What I would REALLY like to see is a low-cost trackball solution. XArcade has one in the works but there isn't very much information available. It's really an undeveloped niche, but it probably would appeal only to MAME users and PC golf gamers, not console owners.

-Ace-

P.S. I want a metal Pump It Up pad too!

armad1ll0 · « **Reply #26 on:** May 05, 2003, 04:31:35 am »

Quote from: AceTKK on May 05, 2003, 04:20:33 am

P.S. I want a metal Pump It Up pad too!

Thanks for the support. I want them to produce something that will really give the lower end market $50 something good to play with and then something fully tweaked out for the competition level player.

Hint, my "Capcom Frame Perfect Stick" was an example of this type of controller.

FYI, forgot to mention it to you. They said that the pads that they sell come from the makers (Korean) of Pump it Up so they do very little manufacturing in this area. It's up to those guys...

After the sticks release and if they make money on it, maybe a trackball would be a good product but it's expensive so go figure... small market also...

paigeoliver · « **Reply #27 on:** May 05, 2003, 05:28:47 am »

Really, how expensive are those PS2 compatible trackballs when you buy them in bulk?

I got mine for $40 off ebay new in box, and the seller had a bunch of them, and was tossing in new buttons to go with them. This makes me think that they can be had for $30 or less somehow or somewhere.


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