Stable, flicker-free 640x480 picture with ArvadeVGA?

[Anubis_au]

Hi all

I'm just looking to hear from ArcadeVGA owners on what res they run Windows and other, non-MAME emulators (eg Visual Pinball / PinMAME) at?

I've got my test bed up and running, however, Windows at 640x480 is *just slightly* flickering, which is grating to the eyes. I get a beautiful stable, flicker-free image when running at 640x288.

The problem then becomes, when I am running PinMAME, the low vertical res means the "electronic scoreboard" obscures part of the pinball game behind it. This is not a problem when running at 640x480 or higher, but then I have the flickering.

The thing is, I'm not sure if the flickering at 640x480 is the card, my home-made cable not being 100% (which I fully acknowledge is the likely culprit), or my 20 year old Commodore monitor.

Hence, I just want to hear from other ArcadeVGA owners, who have it connected (either to SCART RGBTVs, or genuine arcade monitors). Are you getting flicker-free 640x480?

[Joystick Jerk]

Did you install the tri-sync utility?

[Scottk]

Yes, I have flicker free at 640x480 and at 800x600.

The TriSync util was a MUST.

Without it, I also had really really bad flicker at both those resolutions.

Scott

[ahofle]

You can't install the trisync patch unless you have a multisync arcade monitor.  I highly doubt your 20 year old commodore monitor supports it (it's most likely a normal CGA monitor, but you could check).  There is nothing you can do about flicker at 640x480 or above unfortunately other than getting a different monitor.  The only way to run 640x480/800x600 on a CGA monitor is to use interlacing, and that's exactly what causes the flicker.

[Anubis_au]

Eventually I will get a different monitor. No way I am going to keep a 13" screen permanently connected to my MAME setup!

There is nothing you can do about flicker at 640x480 or above unfortunately other than getting a different monitor.  The only way to run 640x480/800x600 on a CGA monitor is to use interlacing, and that's exactly what causes the flicker.

So even with a genuine arcade monitor, 640x480 is always going to be flickering? That would kind of suck... surely that cannot be right?!?!?

    if its true...

[Aurich]

A "genuine arcade monitor" doesn't do 640x480 without interlacing, which is the flickering you're seeing. Yes, that's right. Almost no older arcade games ran at a high resolution like that.

[shorthair]

Curiously, some early games like Tron and Satan's Hollow ran pretty high at 480x512. Popeye ran pretty at 512x448.

[ahofle]

Don't worry, it's not the end of the world really.  The vast majority of arcade games (even Tron and Satan's Hallow) do not flicker running interlaced on a CGA monitor.  You will only pick up this irritating flicker when there are single pixel horizontal lines on the screen (like in windows or visual pinball).  IMO you should forget about running VisualPinball on an arcade monitor anyway (even multisync), as it really needs a very high resolution to look good.  And windows flicker can be avoided for the most part by booting straight into your front end.  Pretty much everything else I've thrown at a CGA monitor in 640x480 looks great.

[RayB]

Curiously, some early games like Tron and Satan's Hollow ran pretty high at 480x512. Popeye ran pretty at 512x448.

They used either a medium resolution monitor (like alot of mid-80's Atari games did) or you just didn't notice the flicker, but it was there.

Play with your focus setting to try and reduce it.

[shorthair]

I don't remember flicker from back then, and I played a couple different trons within the last year and don't remember any flicker, either. In Mame, however, I can't find a native resolution for either Tron or Popeye that doesn't look hideous. As I prefer horizontal scanlines, if any, and these games were vertical, I'm just fine with using hwstretch.

[ahofle]

I don't remember flicker from back then, and I played a couple different trons within the last year and don't remember any flicker, either.

My guess is you don't see any flickering because there aren't any 1 pixel horizontal lines in that game.

In Mame, however, I can't find a native resolution for either Tron or Popeye that doesn't look hideous. As I prefer horizontal scanlines, if any, and these games were vertical, I'm just fine with using hwstretch.

Well Tron is a vertical game, so 640x480 with your monitor rotated 90 degrees is the correct 'authentic' resolution.  For Popeye, the ArcadeVGA has a 512x448 mode doesn't it?

[AndyWarne]

As has been mentioned, 15Khz arcade monitors are not physically capable of displaying more than 300 vertical lines, so they cannot display a 640 X 480 picture without interlacing (ie 2 X 640 X 240)

The Multi-frequency monitor can do this of course as they run up to 31Khz or higher.

More about this on our ArcadeVGA pages on our website.

Andy

[Anubis_au]

Thanks Andy.

I guess I'll just run Visual Pinball at 640x288 and live with some of the table being blocked. That is, if it gets ran in the end at all (it still doesn't launch and quit back to the FE nicely).

My main concern for the cab was MAME, and the ArcadeVGA is perfect for that. I can always run my FE at 640x288, happy and flicker-free.

[shorthair]

I have a multi-sync. If you use 512x448 or 640x480, vertical orientation, yeah you get no flicker...and it decently fills the screen. Horizontally it's not that great. Just easier to use hwstretch on that game.

ahofle: don know on the Trons I played recently.

Anubis: well, given your monitor, I'd expect some sacrifices. But hopefully eventually you'll change that.

[RayB]

I remember slight flicker in games like Tapper, Demolition Derby, Timber, etc...