I have many questions about my SORCERER pin

[vintagegamer]

Can someone recommend a supplier for new speakers for a Williams 1985 SORCERER pin?

Thanks in advance,

VINTAGEGAMER

[divemaster127]

there is a guy on ebay that sells speaker upgrade kits for pins, I have thought about getting one for my t-2, i do not know anything about these but they look pretty good, if you want i can get you link
dm

[vintagegamer]

Yes that would be great, thanks!

[ChadTower]

There is nothing special about the speakers in a pin.  In fact, most of them tend to be cheap crap.  Just find another that is the same size and impedance.  It's almost guaranteed to be better than the original.

[divemaster127]

Here is a link same guy just not on ebay right now, I was hoping chad could weigh in on his opinion I have been kicking around changing out my speakers also
thanks
dm
http://www.decoratorsupply.com/pinball/

[ChadTower]

His stuff gets good reviews for the kits... premade, easy to install, good choice of speaker.  It also usually gets pointed out that you're paying a premium for the kit and that if you chose an appropriate speaker and did the installation without a kit you could get an even better speaker for the price.

So, basically, it's a good kit, but you can do better on your own for the same money.

EDIT:  A good guide on replacing pin speakers

[divemaster127]

cool thanks for the info
dm

[vintagegamer]

His stuff gets good reviews for the kits... premade, easy to install, good choice of speaker.  It also usually gets pointed out that you're paying a premium for the kit and that if you chose an appropriate speaker and did the installation without a kit you could get an even better speaker for the price.

So, basically, it's a good kit, but you can do better on your own for the same money.

EDIT:  A good guide on replacing pin speakers

Chad, do you have a certain type of speaker you personally recommend?

VINTAGEGAMER

[ChadTower]

Does Sorceror have a woofer?  I'd replace that first, backbox speakers second.  Other than that, you don't really need much for a pin that old, just a good quality basic speaker.

[rovingmind]

www.parts-express.com

This is where i get replacement speakers for everything when i need components.

[vintagegamer]

Does Sorceror have a woofer?  I'd replace that first, backbox speakers second.  Other than that, you don't really need much for a pin that old, just a good quality basic speaker.

I'm going to pick up the machine on Friday, and was told the sound doesn't work at all- another person suggested it's prob that the speakers are blown, so I thought I'd swap out the small speakers first to see if that in fact is the problem.  I have not yet gotten to see if there's a woofer yet or not.

VINTAGEGAMER

[vintagegamer]

www.parts-express.com

This is where i get replacement speakers for everything when i need components.

Thanks RM!

[ChadTower]

Dude, odds are very low the problem is the speakers.  Pins don't put much wear on a set of speakers, so unless they did something like poke them with sharp objects or get them wet, the speakers are likely just fine.

[divemaster127]

Chad, my t2 pin was made in 1991, I was kicking around replacing the subwoofer just due to age, 16 years old.  I was reading on some pin sites that the subwoofers are bad about cracking & coming apart after so much time.  On a side note a premium subwoofer is much cheaper than buying the kit I was looking at.
dm

[ChadTower]

Yeah, they used cheap paper cones in most pins.  I'd think he'd be getting something out of one of the three, though, and whenever someone gives a major symptom with a "it's probably just <simple item X>", usually it means it's something bigger.

Just like the "t's probably just a fuse" seller, if it really were the speakers, the seller would have reaped some cheap speakers from something else and sold it as fully working.

Upgrading the woofer on a T2 will really improve that game, IMO.  It will just sound much better.  The cost of the kit, for the most part, is for the mounting plate, which you'd probably have to make yourself buying a better speaker.

[divemaster127]

thanks again for the help Chad, im pretty new at working on pins but i'm sure enjoying it
thanks
dm

[ChadTower]

Yeah it's a blast if you're into it.  Once you work on a few pins, when you go back to a vid, the vid looks dramatically simpler in comparison.

[vintagegamer]

Dude, odds are very low the problem is the speakers.  Pins don't put much wear on a set of speakers, so unless they did something like poke them with sharp objects or get them wet, the speakers are likely just fine.

Innnnnnnnnnnnnn-teresting..  so do you think maybe it's the speech/sound boards?  The guy said when you turn up the volume you can hear some hiss, but no other sounds.  I also read that there's some type of diagnostic button you can hit on the main board that provides some beeps you should hear.  I can't wait to get it home to start troubleshooting.

[ChadTower]

Without more info, it could be any of a hundred things.  I'm just basing my logic on the fact that if the problem were so simple to fix he'd have done it.  That's the assumption one has to make with games, no 5 minute fix in a major function goes unfixed when trying to sell a game.

[vintagegamer]

That's a fair statement- however I don't think he's a regular seller of games, and I think was just looking to make some money in the flipping of this unit.

I will share more details when I get it back to the house Friday night.

[ClubNinja]

I also highly doubt this is a speaker issue.  There is in fact a test button on the sound board, and you should definitely start there when you have the game in your possession.

Aside: Sorcerer is awesome and kicks ---my bottom--- all the time.  I love it.

[vintagegamer]

Many thanks for the input, CN-  I think I remember playing the game as a kid somewhere..   Do you own a Sorcerer pin?

VINTAGEGAMER

[ClubNinja]

Do you own a Sorcerer pin?

Yup.

[vintagegamer]

SWEET!  Did your Sorcerer pin need anything when you got it?  Is it OK if I ask some more questions when I get mine home?

[divemaster127]

Boy you have some nice pins, what all do you have, I only have a T-2, I would love a lord of the rings, TZ, Adams, or magic pinball at some point
dm

[vintagegamer]

OK folks, I got my SORCERER pin home!  It's now time for me to ask those folks here who are chock full of wisdom for assistance.  Before I post my questions, I will state the following details:  game powers up, I've downloaded the manual for the pin, and the game appears to power up in "game over" mode.  I have also changed out the 3 'AA' batteries in the CPU board.  The 3 buttons inside the coin door, advance, auto/manual, and high score reset are all functional.

1. no sound present- when I turn the volume switch from left to right that is inside the unit under the playfield, I can hear a "hiss"- I tried pushing the sound check switch on the CPU board and heard nothing.

2. I don't know how to get the game to start "playing"-  the coin doors/slots are present, but no internal guts seem to be there.  I tried reading through the manual and set the number of required credits in that specific function to 0, but upon pushing the credit button nothing kicks off.  I know the credit button works b/c I needed it to update the function settings and it made changes w/no problems.  However, in one of the "test" functions, the balls launched and the flippers are functional.  So, I think it's just a case of me not knowing what to set properly.

Any help or steps in the right direction would be greatly appreciated.  I can provide pics as needed and will answer any questions as best as I can.  Please help me save another one 

VINTAGEGAMER

[vintagegamer]

Trying to figure out how to set my SORCERER pin to free play- in the manual it shows function #23, and the factory setting is "01", which I'm assuming is for 1 coin..  Is this what needs to be changed to set the game to free play?  Or is there something else?  The manual I have doesn't point this setting out.

Thanks,

VINTAGEGAMER

[Guaranos]

I'm not sure if Sorcerer in particular can be set to free play, but I know a lot of machines from the 80's on up can.  Maybe you could change that setting to "00" and see what happens.

[Guaranos]

1.  Your sound board could be bad, disconnected, or missing.  I'd turn off the machine and check the wiring/boards in the back box (up where the back glass is).  Make sure you see something that meets the description of the sound board.  Be careful playing around back there with the power on, as pinball machines can use some higher voltages that can hurt a little.  I know mine uses around 200v for the displays, and it doesn't tickle when you accidentally touch one.

2.  Are the coin mechs present inside the coin door?  Either way, if you look down near the bottom of the inside of the coin door, are there wires running to it?  If so, there are probably some little slots down there with a switch with a little piece of metal sticking out of it (usually looks like a thin paperclip bent into an L-shape).  Try flicking that down a couple of times to register some credits.  Then hit the credit button on the front of the machine.

[vintagegamer]

Thanks for your responses G- I've been doing some research online, and the sound board IS actually there, and the wires are hooked up.  So, I'm wondering if it's maybe just shot.  I can hear faint hiss in the speakers when I turn up the volume, and it doesn't sound like there are any weird hums or anything, so I'm thinking it might just need a new sound board.  Another member mentioned they'd be surprised if it was the speakers, so I'll prob try replacing the sound board first.  Since the game's over 20 yrs old, I know those parts tend to break down.

As for the coin door, I will snap a pic so you and everyone can see what the machine has-  to answer your ?s, there are wires running into the door, but I don't see anything in there that the coin would hit going in.  More info soon-


VINTAGEGAMER

[vintagegamer]

Here is the inside of the coin door-  I don't see any paper-clip type thingys except the 1 small piece standing vertically in the upper left corner.  There are plastic L-shaped parts which appear to allow you to get your change back out, but don't see anything that tells the game the credit when in-  Please take a look and let me know what you all think.

[SirPeale]

The switches for your coin door are near the bottom.  They kind of stick out.  You see the microswitch with the wires coming from the bottom?  Trip the rotating wire actuator, that'll trigger credits.  IF it's working, of course.

[Guaranos]

I've circled the coin switch in green.  Tap the little L-shaped wire sticking out of it for credits.

[ChadTower]

The coin mech on the right is mostly the same, but in the beige housing, so the switch is enclosed.  It would have a button on top you could press but that button appears to be broken off where the slot is in the housing.

[ChadTower]

He's probably right, that works on a lot of them. 

[vintagegamer]

Thanks guys!  I'll check this out ASAP and provide an update.

VINTAGEGAMER

[vintagegamer]

OK...  I did what you guys recommended and...............................


IT WORKS!!!!!    I'm so psyched!  Even the wife played!  NOW- what do I need to put in the door to make the quarters hit that actuator?  I assume I'm missing some pieces.

There was also something sitting inside on the playfield, so I'm thinking this machine had a broken playfield glass or something.   The prior owner said they had it for about 5 yrs and it just sat.  The graphics in the playfield appear somewhat cracked, and 1 or 2 of the balls have a little bit of surface rust on them- so it definitely looks like it sat w/those parts exposed for some time.  Nonetheless, I love it!

And now onto the sound issue-  I'm going to get a new(er) speech board first and go from there.  Stay tuned!

[vintagegamer]

The SORCERER pin I bought has the back glass, but it wasn't in the machine at the time of purchase.  I want to put it in now, but the seller advised that he thought there was some type of track-like base that went on the bottom of the glass before it went into the machine.

Does anyone happen to know if that's true?  And if so, where I can I buy/order one?

Thanks!

VINTAGEGAMER

[Ken Layton]

On Williams pinballs of this vintage, I believe you set the "Maximum Credits" function to "00" to enable free play of the machine. However, there's a downside to this: you can not win any free games by either scores, high scores, specials, or match numbers. Starting with Williams "High Speed" they included a free play mode in the game software.

[Ken Layton]

If the balls have rust on them don't use them as they'll chew up the playfield. Buy new ones at Marco Specialties along with some Novus #2 polish to clean the playfield.