"Ports" vs MAME...

[my58vw]

Hello all,

I am about 80% done with construction of my "Candy showcase" Cabinet, focused on fighting games. I am running an XBOX, PS2, Dreamcast, and SATURN (PS2 Adaptor) through an arcade X system, also connected to a PC for NEO GEO and console emulation. As I go though my extensive console fighting (and other) game list, some things are interesting me.

My cab is based on the TMNT arcade 2 player sitdown, but graphics are from the new XBOX series of TMNT, not the older arcade units. I can also play TMNT and TMNT Turtles in Time via the last two XBOX games in the series. I am using a 32 inch standard def Sony WEGA TV, but have been considering going to a 33 inch WG 9400 arcade display if I can get the settings right (XBOX, DC and PS2 are HiDef 480p compatable.

Here is where things get interesting though...

I praise MAME for introducing me to the "rare" and unported arcade games, such as 88 games, Raiden DX, etc. Personally I have nothing to compare some of these games to, which makes them ok though emulation. Now I also would never expect mame to run games like tekken 3/4/5/tag team, SF III, VF 1-4, Soul Calibur 1-3, MKA/D/DA/SM, KOF2006, DOA 1-4, etc - and I have "console ports" of all these games. The grey are occurs in the games that are MAME/ZINC and Console/PC Ported.

Such as...
Tekken 1/2
VF 1
SF 2 (All Varients), Alpha
XMEN vs Streetfighter
Marval vs Capcom 1 (2 is not mamed)
KOF 95-97, 99 (different name of DC), 2000-2001 (PS2), 2002-2003 (PS2 XBOX)
Capcom VS SNK
SF EX series,

ETC

Now there are obvious differences between arcade vs port - no coins on the ports for example. Other than that, assuming MAME/ZINC runs 100% 60/60 frames, how do the two compare? Is it better to run mame or the ports?

Also an interesting question... If I own say SF vs Capcom on PS, is it "legal" to play the arcade rom?

Thanks are always, pictures coming soon...

[8way]

My opinion I would stick with the original arcade version. I would only substitute the original on games that are not emulated good or not emulated at all. The way I look at is, im building an arcade so I can have the arcade experience at home, console ports just don’t give you that felling, even if its stuck in a cab it’s just not the same (some might disagree). As far as owning a port (console CD or cartridge) that would not make using a arcade rom legal, only a copy of that CD would be consider legal.

[MameJunkie]

I agree with 8way.

The ports might be close but I personally still prefer the original arcade versions.

I always like to see the 'Insert Coin' flashing and dropping in a quarter or two to get it going.

[Kremmit]

The answer may be to take it on a game-by-game basis.  I mean, it's hard not to prefer the arcade version of Pac Man over the Atari 2600 version, but when you get into more modern games, the console / PC version often has as good or better graphics and music, and usually some gameplay differences- different characters, different moves, more/less blood, etc.  I think you might find discussion on which version of a given fighting game is "best" over on www.shoryuken.com.  And of course, if you first got hooked on the console version of a game, it may seem "better" than the arcade version to you, while somebody who came to the game first in the arcade would see if differently.

[daywane]

bump and jump comes to mind
and marble madness
I found these games on the nes console. Love the games

Hate the arcade versions

[Fozzy The Bear]

Native PC versions or console versions will always run better than any version running under an emulator.

In the case of Dreamcast titles, they are (in general) the actual original arcade versions with the coin code stripped out. This is because a great number of arcade titles run under the Sega Naomi system. The dreamcast itself is in fact a cut down Naomi System. So it was easy for Sega to just slightly modify their already written arcade versions. In some cases they were actually written at the same time as the original arcade machine software. Effectively they are the original games....

My cab has a Dreamcast in it, as well as the PC....

The other thing that Mame simply can't do (and won't for a long time) is emulate games like House Of The Dead (up to version 3 is available for the PC)  and running those on a PC is way better than trying to emulate them, because they already run on what is effectively PC hardware inside the original arcade machines anyway.

Most current and new arcade machines simply have PC's inside them running the games anyway, a lot of them on windows XP.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Lilwolf]

btw, what monitor are you running?  This may make a difference between Zinc and MAME. 

Zinc can handle higher resolutions that look great!  Sure MAME is more accurate, but if you have a hires SVGA monitor in there, you might like the looks of Zinc better (I do).  But if you have a true arcade CRT running at true arcade resolutions... Then I would guess that MAME looks better.

As for Ports... I happen to like some of the ports better then the original arcades for home use.  They give you game play options that the arcades don't have...  But they aren't arcade games.

but why wouldn't you have both?  Consoles require you to put a CD / Cart in to play.  But you can have them all in MAME.  I don't see why you wouldn't just keep both around.

Sometimes you don't want to go find the CD to play a game... you just want to click it and go.

[Wade]

Are you sure about that?  While I don't have a Dreamcast, the pictures of Dreamcast ports that I've seen were very obviously different than the arcade versions.  I have a very hard time believing they "ported" the games at all, seems a lot more likely they just rewrote them for the DC.  Just because they have the same processor doesn't automatically mean the arcade versions were ported to the DC.

In fact, I'd say just the opposite, because it could be very hard to port a game written for multiple processors into a single, stripped down version of the same processor (isn't that what is in a DC?)

Wade

In the case of Dreamcast titles, they are (in general) the actual original arcade versions with the coin code stripped out. This is because a great number of arcade titles run under the Sega Naomi system. The dreamcast itself is in fact a cut down Naomi System. So it was easy for Sega to just slightly modify their already written arcade versions. In some cases they were actually written at the same time as the original arcade machine software. Effectively they are the original games....

[Fozzy The Bear]

Are you sure about that?  While I don't have a Dreamcast, the pictures of Dreamcast ports that I've seen were very obviously different than the arcade versions.  I have a very hard time believing they "ported" the games at all, seems a lot more likely they just rewrote them for the DC.  Just because they have the same processor doesn't automatically mean the arcade versions were ported to the DC.

Well lets put it this way.... Given that I'm a senior maintenance engineer in a large arcade and given that I work every day with the real thing and given that I run a Dreamcast at home.... What do you think!!

let me give you a few examples....  Sega Rally (identical).... 18 Wheeler (absolutely identical).... Hydro Thunder (identical)... etc etc etc.

They really are the same pieces of software with a couple of things including coin inserts stripped out. They even run at the same resolutions.

Why?? simple economics! It's was way cheaper for Sega to do that than to re-write them.  The only real difference between the arcade machines and the Dreamcast is the amount of memory they bundled with it. Other than that, they are pretty much identical. Why re-invent the wheel when you already have a game system and software that will run on it. In fact, to the degree that if you hack your way into some of the arcade software you can actually find some of the Dreamcast options and menu structures in there.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Wade]

Well, you may be right.  Porting seems very unlikely to me, but I admit I don't know the details of the differences between Naomi and DC, and I'm certainly don't work in the arcade field professionally.  I also don't know how it could be verified whether they were ported or not, without knowing some people who work (or worked) at Sega at the time.

TTYL,
Wade