Should I sand my cabinet?

[Justin]

I have a Centipede Cabinet that has been painted over the side art.  The texture on the sides is pretty rough.  (Although not as rough as it looks in the picture:   http://www.control-click.com/qipo/cabinet/IMG_2118.jpg )

The 'Finishing' page has dissapeared from BYOAC, so here's a few questions for someone with experience that might have some ideas to share:

1) Does the Centipede side panel use some kind of laminate over the wood?  I scratched beneath the paint, and I'm not sure what it is that I'm seeing... it is either the wood, or laminate.  (BYW it looks like the front panels use black laminate)

2) What's the best approach to restore these side panels to a smooth surface, and paint?  Should I use an orbital sander at 60 grit, progressivley to 400 grit?  Then prime and paint several coats?  

3) Anyone used the MegaMouse from Black&Decker for a job like this?   The panels and paint are very rough, and I wonder if I should use a belt sander instead.  

4) Paint... what kind/brand to use?  I want a white finish, with a very mild shine to it, if at all.  I will be using stencils to paint some geometrical art of my own over the white paint.

I know these are a lot of questions, but I really could not find the 'finishing' page mentioned in several posts.

Thanks to ayone who can provide some help!!!

-J

[kspiff]

It depends on what your cab has been through in the past.

For instance I have a Pac-Land cabinet that I peeled the sideart off of (luckily it hadn't been painted over) and underneath was smooth particle board with a light coat of sealer -- really no need to sand at all (generally if the surface is smooth enough for laminate it is more than smooth enough for primer), but I sanded just a little by hand with 100 and 220.  I would assume that your Centipede also has adhesive backed vinyl sideart.. therefore I would suggest one of the following:

1.) To try to save the sideart, use Goof Off to try to remove all the paint;
2.) To abandon the sideart, -- provided it is the same kind of vinyl and hasn't been superglued back on at any point -- you can probably just peel it off paint and all (get a scraper or dull razor blade to make this easier).

The front panels probably use black laminate, -- this stuff also peels off, but can be more stubborn than sideart for some reason -- but unless you have edge/corner chipping I would just leave it on.  Even if you do I would just touch it up.

I've broken several mouse-type sanders and don't like them myself.. but a belt sander would probably be really rough.. my personal preference leans towards hook and loop sanders that use the velcro discs.. but for sanding particle board like this?  Just do it by hand, assuming the surface isn't ready to paint to begin with.

I think most will recommend indoor/outdoor semi-gloss applied with a roller.  I'm actually going to go out on a limb and say that I'm becoming partial to spraypaint (sorry, but it looks fine to me as long as you follow the directions).

PS, I would really recommend just sanding the paint down or peeling it off, maybe refinishing, and buying some repro sideart.. Centipede is a classic and the sideart was not only cool but is readily available from several sources.  In fact, Centipede is one most my most wanted dedicated games!

[Justin]

Thanks KSpiff for your detaled advice.

I tried peeling off the paint today by hand, and it began coming of pretty easily, in big chunks of about 8"x8".    The bad news is that the Centipede Side art came along with the paint... you could easily see it in the underside of the chunks of peeled paint that I was removing.    

In any case, I don't intend to save the original art, because I'm going for a 'mint' look.   So I would purchase new side art for the cab  (or maybe I would make some art of my own using stencils - leaning towards this right now)

Mouse sander:  I think I might stay away from it then.  You say hand sanding should be enough, but I'm telling you, there re some pretty rough (and tough) portions!  I'll give it a try and see.

The front is in excellent condition.  Like you said, if anything, I will finish it.  (Do you just paint over laminate?)

Thanks!

[kspiff]

Y'know, I'm really not sure.. when I stripped the laminate off the inside of my cabinet it was flaking somewhat (which makes me a bit wary), but it may have been some kind of dirty film.. if the laminate is on the front, I would say peel it.. if you need to touch up laminate on the insides of the cab sides.. just touch it up.. I ended up completely disassembling my cabinet because I stripped all the laminate from the insides (well that and do fix some major corner damage).

So I would say yes, you can paint over the laminate.. but it will turn out @ as well as the sideart that was painted over (sorry, never dealt with a cab that had been made over like that).

The main thing I don't like about the Mouse sanders is their pad changing system.. cheap thing starts to fall apart and won't hold the sandpaper after heavy use.  If it's a Mega Mouse.. I guess they might have fixed that Achille's heel, dunno..?  Ignore the part about sanding by hand, though.. thinking about it a bit more, unless you have to fill a lot of gouges/scratches with filler/putty or you are sanding between paint/primer coats, it's probably no big deal.

[neuromancer]

Assuming the wood is particle board, I would probably peel up what's there, spread filler on the entire thing with a 4" spatula, and lightly sand it.

Then either paint or apply a sticker as you desire.

Bob

[Justin]

OK, I have decided to use a rotary heavy duty sander, which I borrowed from my neighbour.  A 100 Grit didn't do the job, but a 60 Grit worked wonders.  I managed to completely remove the thick layer of paint from one side in about 45 minutes.    I think the key is to not apply too much pressure, or you risk ending up with an uneven surface.  So I went gently and everything looks good, although I can feel some *extremely mild* bumps, and uneven surface.  This is what happens when you use a rotary sander!  But it's nothing serious really.

I now plan to use a block sander to even this out by hand, and then smooth the surface further (100-200 Grit)

What to do after?  No idea!  Some people mention using a primer before painitng, so knowing that is my next step I have a few questions:
-Is primer necessary?
-What brand/type to use?
-How to apply it?
-Should I sand after applying primer?

The effect I want is that of an extremely smooth surface... I don't want any texture on the sides.  I also plan to paint it white.

Thanks so much for your help.  (BTW, where has the 'finishing' page gone? I think I'm asking questions that might all be covered under that disappeared section)

-J

[kspiff]

Prime it (sanding between coats, probably 2 coats), and paint it (maybe sand after first coat, probably use 2-3 coats).  I also highly recommend Polycrylic spray for a tough, less chippy/sticky final coating (gives you more of a texture, though).

It's my understanding that when you prime, the wood is sealed so that no sap can bleed out.. it also prevents the wood from sopping up your paint and lets you get the smoothest, most even surface possible before painting.  I use oil-based Kilz spray primer.. it seals and primes, but if you don't plan on sanding at least once before moving on to paint then I would pick something in latex-based.

Didn't somebody paint over their particle board cab with Rustoleum, too?  Did that work out OK?

If you plan on using non-spray paint, use the lightest knap roller you can and apply multiple coats.  This will definitely leave some sort of texture without sanding, though.

<drool>.. dedicated Centipede.. I can't wait to see this when you finish, esp. if you put repro sideart or stencil Centipede art back on..

[Justin]

OK, I bought Kilz-2 exterior/interior water based primer (white tinted). The guy at home depot told me this was one of the thickest primers he had, and I thought this was appropriate to level out the sides of the cab (which is mildly uneven in certain areas.

I also got the smoothest roller they had  ($8).  but might use this only for the paint.  What should I use for the primer?  Also a fine roller?

I hope this works out well.  I will be sanding and priming both sides over the weekend and post results.

-J

[GodSin]

thanks for the tips too guys
helping me out alot, even though I cant afford to get sand paper tell pay day (I'm broke)

been scraping off the side art to my cab whith a chizzle
after scraping off one layer (TMNT Turtles in Time ... was in really bad shape) only to find that my cab was originally a Kick and Run arcade

this is so going to be worth all the time its taking me to scrape this stuff off once the project is done

anyway I just took a break (been scraping the one side for about 4 hours now and well I still got alot left (not even done one side yet) )

this site kicks ass:P

[kspiff]

Yeah, I would just use a fine roller for the primer, too, but it's not as critical since you'll probably want to sand it when you're done.  Medium and heavy knap rollers tend to just leave blotches and coat less evenly, unless you're really good and careful.  Good choice on the latex Kilz, btw - if you're not spraying your Kilz on (they don't make a latex spray), then it's probably the better choice, paint seems to adhere to it better and it isn't as flaky/dusty (it does seal better, though).

I'm about to start painting mine but will be using a spray (probably Rustoleum's wood primer/paint).  Let me know how the latex does on particle board, though. I may want to roll on a couple coats and just spray on the paint coats.