Adding trackball to built cab

[tore-]

Hello BYOAC!

About an year ago i finished my cab, a few pics of it can be found here: http://home.no.net/eyeboard/arcade/

Because of lack of hard cash, I didn't include a trackball, and now I want one after playing Marble Madness, adictive, but not nearly as fun with a trackball. I can't be less adicitive with a real trackball!

As you can se from the pics of my cab, adding  a trackball to the CP is'nt to easy. So I have three options:

• Build my own box, solder and wire for myself (1player) Around 100 bucks
• Build two boxes to enable 2 players, around 155 bucks
• Buy an X-Arcade, around 100 bucks.

PS: Is there other prebuilt options i should look at?

The idea with building my own boxes to contain the trackballs, was that i could design them to fit just over the buttons on player1 and player2. Thus providing some sort of a module setup, remove the box when not needing the trackball, easely add them when I need them.

Currently im usin an IPac2.

What would you suggest? Considering that I could use the trackball on normal pc-games (not xbox, correct?) also, I in favor of buying a prebuilt version.

Thanks for all your support and 

[DaveMMR]

Dude, are you using beanies babies as a marquee.     Very original.

I know you're looking prebuilt, but what you could do is buy one (or preferably two) trackballs and make a dedicated panel.  If you screwed down your current panel semi-permanently, it would still be easy to replace those screws with panel clamps.  Then you'll need either a USB harness for the trackball or an encoder (e.g. Optipac) and you can make a trackball panel quite easily.

By the way, if you hang around eBay long enough, you can find good prices on used trackballs (I got a 3" Happs for $40 and it plays fine). With enough shopping around, you'll save money over a prebuilt panel and it'll feel a lot better.

One consideration if going that route is that you'll probably have to convert your wiring to modular.   It's time consuming but not terribly hard or expensive.  Conversely, if these were to be your only two panels, you can dedicate the iPac to the joystick panel and the analog encoder to the trackbal panel and switch out with a simple USB cable. 

Your cabinet looks good and simple.  You could stand to cover the white in the monitor and add a non-stuffed marquee but otherwise I think it looks excellent.  Intergrating a nice homemade trackball panel over a pre-built solution would ultimately be more satisfying and you'll do a lot better at Marble Madness.

[lloydcom]

My suggestion is to build an extension on wheels that would extend your CP.  Then you can wheel in the trackball extension and lock it to the front of the cab.  Incidentially you can make the trackball wireless, and put a spinner on it too.

No wires and it would look cool.

[tore-]

If I understand correctly I cannot use a trackball(or two for that matter) together with me IPac interface? I know that I would have to aquire a Opti-pac, but I cannot have them both connected at the same time? I would have to switch cables each time?

I haven't had time or the money for a real marquee, had theese muppetshow beanies laying around and its much better than a black marquee.

[ahofle]

You can definitely use an Optipac and an IPAC at the same time.  No problems.

[tore-]

The thing im also afraid of is spending to much money on something that I wont use to much. The arcade-cab is used to little allready, alltough getting a girlfriend CHANGED that (she loves Golden Axe and Rainbow Island).

Just tested Marble Madness two player, very amusing! But no matter how i try, I cannot get passed level 3 with a stick, strange or normal?

Also, there doesnt seem to be alot of games available for trackball, alltough Hamsterball seems extremly cool!

[ahofle]

Personally I can't imagine having a cabinet without a trackball, but that's just me.  It was more than worth the money for Millipede and Marble Madness alone IMO.

[pmc]

Just tested Marble Madness two player, very amusing! But no matter how i try, I cannot get passed level 3 with a stick, strange or normal?

I don't think I can get much farther even with a trackball! 

-pmc

[DaveMMR]

The thing im also afraid of is spending to much money on something that I wont use to much. The arcade-cab is used to little allready, alltough getting a girlfriend CHANGED that (she loves Golden Axe and Rainbow Island).

Just tested Marble Madness two player, very amusing! But no matter how i try, I cannot get passed level 3 with a stick, strange or normal?

Also, there doesnt seem to be alot of games available for trackball, alltough Hamsterball seems extremly cool!

HA!  You'll quickly change your tune.  There are many, many fine trackball games in Mame (plus many mouse driven PC games).  Trackball is totally worth it!  Yourl girlfriend will love Centipede.  Plus, it makes an adequate "poor man's spinner", so you can add some spinner games to the list (though a few purists may balk).

Let me tell you, Marble Madness was the one and only game that inspired me to add TWO trackballs to a panel (they're swappable of course).  It was my favorite game as a kid, and let me tell you that playing it for the first time in 20 years with a proper trackball made this game feel brand new to me.  By the way, Cabal and that Atari Classics prototype also employ dual trackballs - both are pretty fun.

Honestly, if you shop wisely, you'll be able to get a panel like that done for less than $150.00 - one that'll feel and play right.  I guarantee you will use it enough to justify the cost.  This is just my opinion but I believe that a trackball is the second most important controller on a panel after the joystick (including 4/8 way).

I really do like the cut of your cabinet, which is why I'm rooting for a nice, slick looking trackball intergration.

[tore-]

Ok, I have been convinced!!     


Im going for a Dual Trackball setup, how I will integrate this with my current setup I havent thought about yet, but maybe ill design a whole new CP just to fit everyting. That would maybe be the best.

Also, DaveMRR pointed out that I could use it like a spinner(poor mans version, still) - THANKS for pointing that out, I was wondering if I should go 1x Spinnner and Trackball than 2x Trackball.

This is my shopping list so far, seems good i suppose? I dont miss anything?

I just curious how i should integrate the trackball, but also install a button for each players. I suppose I need 1 for each player?

[tore-]

Just tested Marble Madness two player, very amusing! But no matter how i try, I cannot get passed level 3 with a stick, strange or normal?

I don't think I can get much farther even with a trackball! 

-pmc

What for real? But with trackball, you can speed up the ball, but that is impossible with a mouse?

Only thing that I don

[DaveMMR]

Wow, the three-emoticon salute! 

Well since I talked it up, I'll help you out.

First of all, you can hook up OptiPac in conjuction with your J-Pac.  With a little modular wiring (more on that later) you can use the OptiPac inputs along with the JPac buttons.  Even if you don't want to go that route, the OptiPac does include inputs for two buttons for each player.  Not really enough, in my opinion... and here's why:  If you like Missle Command, even just enough that you'll want to occassionally play it, you will need three buttons per player.  The  prototype Atari Centipede/Missle Command remake supports two players simultaneously, so figure three per ball.  Cabal, on the other hand, uses two.  Basically, play around with some trackball games and see what you want to support.  My advice: buttons are cheap - 3 is the way to go.  Also, if you're putting start buttons on individual panels, that's an extra input.  Perhaps using the JPac for buttons is a better bet...

With a little planning, modular wiring (is that even the correct term?) is quite easy, depending on how many inputs you want to have access to.  There are many threads on it, feel free to do a search.  But basically you get a cable that has matching male and female ends.  Wire up your controls to one side and then wire up the interfaces to the other.  When you swap  panels, all you need do is unplug and replug.  Some people use IDE cables, RJ-45s, printer cables, etc.     

You could also just place the OptiPac on the trackball panel  (providing you have enough room, which you should) and just swap out with a USB cable, as I stated.   Though, you still need a modular wiring solution to access the JPac inputs (a couple of RJ-45s will do good here ~ 16 wires - even one if you can keep the total under seven buttons + one ground).  The downside to this is that this will be your only use of the OptiPac unless you buy another one. 

I don't know about Ultimarc's trackballs, but I know the Happ's had six wires (actually 8 but two are "doubled up" - the 5v and the ground).  Instructions are on his website as to which one goes where.  Everything worked perfectly!   Actually, the axises were reversed on mine but a quick switch of the molexes fixed that problem lickity split. 

As for putting the trackballs in the panels, make sure you give enough space around each one.   Try it out with a few games before mounting and get a feel for how far your hand moves.  If your making a new panel just to add the balls, keep in mind that you may have to make it wider. 

By the way, you could always do what was done in Doc's modular cabinet.  Basically you just swap out the joysticks and put in the trackballs, leaving the buttons behind (or even swapping out the buttons for some nice empty space).  It's more work implementing and a little more work swapping, but the possibilities of almost infinite layouts and controls can't be beat.   If you're planning any kind of intricate artwork for your panel, this may not be an option.

Also, remember that later on down the road, you could always add a cheap spinner should you feel the urge.   If this is in the back of your mind, leave some space open.  For now your trackballs will keep you plenty busy.

Good luck. 


EDIT:  Saw your new question.  I think I'm the only one calling it "modular wiring", after doing a quick search.   Nontheless I think the paragraph I wrote should help.  If not, let me know, and I can whip up a little diagram I made for my own schematics.   

[tore-]

I think maybe my question was somewhat misleading. I was wondering if I could use the trackball with tha I-Pac, thus not buy a Optipac-controller, which I must aquire anyway right? Cant

[DaveMMR]

No you can't use the Jpac for trackball input.  If you buy the trackballs with USB interface, you can skip the Optipac, but I don't if that's cost effective.

Check the stickied topics in B/S/T.  The sell Happs trackballs - though you have to PM them with a quote.  And also, as I stated, check eBay.  Sometimes you can find a used one for cheap - the new ones sometimes go for $65.00.   

And, yeah, don't buy them directly from Happs.

[tore-]

DaveMMR, thanks alot for all your information I really appriciate it!

I think I'll go with Ultimarc, he may be alittle overprized but I've bought stuff there before and im very happy with his service. Sent two PM to some people at B/S/T, if they can give me a nice price i might reconsider.

DaveMMR, could you please verify my shopping list in the thread? I know i need some wires and a few buttons, but other than that i think im set!

[DaveMMR]

I saw nothing that needs to be amended with your list (unless you want to add some buttons or wire to the mix). 

You could always order one in blue and one in red (like the MM balls), but other than that, you are good to go!  Enjoy!

[tore-]

Thanks mate! Just ordered from Ultimarc, when my finals is done, and i've completed my programming job for a beer company, and moved to another city, and and ... Dam, out "Left player out of time!"

[tore-]

DaveMMR, how would you suppose i use the trackball for a spinner also? Im know i need a switch of somekind, but i cannot seem to understand how to wire this on a switch?

[ahofle]

Why do you need a switch?  Just roll the trackball sideways (or up/down, depending on how you mapped the inputs) to use it as a spinner. 

[tore-]

Why do you need a switch?  Just roll the trackball sideways (or up/down, depending on how you mapped the inputs) to use it as a spinner. 

No problem there, but wouldnt i need a switch so that the optipac doesnt get input on both the spinner and trackball ? I would asume that would cause some problems.

[ahofle]

I guess I misunderstood your initial question...I thought wanted to use the trackball as a "poor man's spinner device" meaning you just roll it left and right for games like tempest (instead of having a separate dedicated spinner control).  MAME (assuming that's your emulator) will only look for input on one axis for spinner games, and it will ignore any up/down movement you accidentally register with the trackball, so no worries.  Is that what you meant?

[Turnarcades]

  If it wasn't for the location of your Ipac, you could have added one in the space between your two players' layouts.

If you choose to do what you say (add it over the top) but can't be bothered to do much building, you can now get USB-wired trackballs that attach using just 4 bolts. The ball comes in it's own housing, but you could easily build a 'top-plate' to bolt it to and just plug it in and out without any messy wiring. Try this link and see what you think:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/3-TRACKBALL-USB-PS2-FIXING-BOLTS-4-BLACK-BUTTONS_W0QQitemZ102250791909QQihZ010QQcategoryZ3945QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

This one even includes buttons and a choice of connection.....

[Dreamwriter]

Isn't that just the X-Arcade trackball?  They sell them separately now, without the preassembled box.