auction coming up - cabs available.. advice?

[dax]

After successfully converting a Neo Geo cab to Mame, I am looking to work on some more cabinets and experiment.  There's a bankruptcy auction coming up next week and the following cabinets are part of the auction:

Tekken, High Impact Football, Street Fighter II, Skull & Crossbones, Simpsons, Toki, Knockout, Arch Rivals, Red Baron (cockpit), X-Men, Lethal Enforcer II

I have reason to believe they all work, but I'll check them out condition wise.  My questions are:

a) Which one(s) do you think would be best for MAME conversion?
b) Are any of these more valuable if they were restored?  (i.e. Skull & Crossbones is probably a pretty rare machine, but not sure if anybody cares)
c) What would you pay, taking into account the most-ikely condition if they were running?

Almost all of them are Jamma+, and my research indicates they all run standard arcade monitors, horizontal, except for Lethal Enforcer II which seems to have a higher res monitor, which is appealing, but the control surface would have to be completely re-done.

Personally, I am thinking the Simpsons cab would be easiest to modify and add more buttons and things, since it has a lot of play area, but the Red Baron cockpit must be kinda rare - although I assume the x-y monitor there wouldn't be MAME-compatible, the notion of a cockpit MAME cab is kind of appealing.

Any thoughts?  I'm thinking that none of these cabs should go for more than $250 ea at this auction.

[Witchboard]

Red Baron cockpit?  The vector red baron?  That would be sweet.  Not to MAME obviously, but to own.

[AtomSmasher]

Where is this auction at?  I'd love to have working tekken, simpsons, or red baron cabinets.

[MYX]

Um dude, where is the auction. Drooool.

[eccs19]

I don' t think he will want to tell anyone.  It will drive up the price that me may be able to get the cabs for!   

[Tiger-Heli]

Red Baron cockpit?  The vector red baron?  That would be sweet.  Not to MAME obviously, but to own.

My thoughts as well - could cost more to restore than it's eventually worth though, if the vector monitor is non-working.

[dax]

I don't have a problem saying where the auction is (it's a live auction - not online), but I'm amused that nobody answered any of my questions...   this place is dog-eat-dog isn't it?  Hehehe

[Hoopz]

I don't have a problem saying where the auction is (it's a live auction - not online), but I'm amused that nobody answered any of my questions...   this place is dog-eat-dog isn't it?  Hehehe

No its not a dog eat dog forum.  Most people are very helpful.  Tiger-Heli, who posted in this thread,  tries to help every poster that has questions on encoders and maintains a thorough site with more information that anyone could remember.  Minwah supports his software on the site religiously even though you don't want to hear that.  The list is very long of people who are more than helpful and tolerant to newbies and old timers who ask questions. 

You, dax, have not added much to the forums and, in fact, have taken multiple shots at people unfairly.  I would strongly suggest that you not act that way and bring something to the table to help people out versus being an ass.

My answers to your questions.

1. None.  Build dont convert.
2. I don't know.
3. $0. 

Not helpful answers, but since you asked, I will answer.

Now will you answer the question?

[TheCaptain]

I don't have a problem saying where the auction is (it's a live auction - not online), but I'm amused that nobody answered any of my questions...   this place is dog-eat-dog isn't it?  Hehehe

No its not a dog eat dog forum.  Most people are very helpful.  Tiger-Heli, who posted in this thread,  tries to help every poster that has questions on encoders and maintains a thorough site with more information that anyone could remember.  Minwah supports his software on the site religiously even though you don't want to hear that.  The list is very long of people who are more than helpful and tolerant to newbies and old timers who ask questions. 

You, dax, have not added much to the forums and, in fact, have taken multiple shots at people unfairly.  I would strongly suggest that you not act that way and bring something to the table to help people out versus being an ass.

My answers to your questions.

1. None.  Build dont convert.
2. I don't know.
3. $0. 

Not helpful answers, but since you asked, I will answer.

Now will you answer the question?

Chill.

[Tiger-Heli]

I don't have a problem saying where the auction is (it's a live auction - not online), but I'm amused that nobody answered any of my questions...   this place is dog-eat-dog isn't it?  Hehehe

Not-at-all.

I haven't followed your previous posts, so I'll let HooPz voice his own opinions . . .

Regarding your questions:

a)  How the h-e-double toothpicks can any of us tell without seeing these games - how much are they asking - working monitor, etc.  Anything JAMMA would be easier to MAME with a J-PAC.  SF II was a very common game, so would be a good candidate for conversion, (especially if you like that style game) except it was also very popular, so might go for a higher price.  Arch Rivals used 49-way joysticks, so could be good for conversion with a GP-Wiz49, or might be better (worth more) to preserve as original b/c of that.  Except for it, and Red Baron, the others are all about the same, mame-wise, IMHO.
b)  The fact that both myself and Witchboard stated that Red Baron would be nice to have but not to MAME suggests that it might be worth more restored.  Also, Arch Rivals b/c of the 49-way sticks.
c)  I don't know pricing, so not the one to ask. . .

[dax]

My answers to your questions.

1. None.  Build dont convert.
2. I don't know.
3. $0. 

Not helpful answers, but since you asked, I will answer.

Now will you answer the question?

Thanks.

[mahuti]

For mame conversion, I generally buy interesting or unusual cabs that have been converted from something cool to something dumb and non working already and that are under $125, or dynamo cabs which are generic boxes anyway with no inherint historical value. I usually try to get at least 1 interesting thing, marquee, bezel, stick, or cab shape. If I can't find something interesting and already ruined I go for super cheap and generic.

As for reselling. Don't bother. You'll have more luck buying and selling stock.

I would personally never pay a premium for  a working game, unless I had it on my list. I generally leave those to the collectors, though.

[dax]

I don't have a problem saying where the auction is (it's a live auction - not online), but I'm amused that nobody answered any of my questions...   this place is dog-eat-dog isn't it?  Hehehe

Not-at-all.

I haven't followed your previous posts, so I'll let HooPz voice his own opinions . . .

Hoopz seems to want to manufacture drama.  I am not inclined to feed the fires of his apparently fragile sensibilities.

Regarding your questions:

a)  How the h-e-double toothpicks can any of us tell without seeing these games - how much are they asking - working monitor, etc.  Anything JAMMA would be easier to MAME with a J-PAC.  SF II was a very common game, so would be a good candidate for conversion, (especially if you like that style game) except it was also very popular, so might go for a higher price.  Arch Rivals used 49-way joysticks, so could be good for conversion with a GP-Wiz49, or might be better (worth more) to preserve as original b/c of that.  Except for it, and Red Baron, the others are all about the same, mame-wise, IMHO.
b)  The fact that both myself and Witchboard stated that Red Baron would be nice to have but not to MAME suggests that it might be worth more restored.  Also, Arch Rivals b/c of the 49-way sticks.
c)  I don't know pricing, so not the one to ask. . .

I am thinking I will go to the inspection in a few days and see what the condition of the cabs are.  At this point I don't know.  I assume they will fire up the games, and if they were non-working, it would be listed, but they're not so I assume the monitors work.  If they don't, IMO, I wouldn't bid on any of the cabs unless they appeared operational.

I have been to these auctions before.  This is how I got my NeoGeo cab (I paid $250 for it) but it was the cleanest cab in the whole auction.  I can't imagine these going for that much, but I don't know. 

So I was just wondering what you guys think.  Obviously condition is TBA, but you could speculate if x game were in y type of condition, anything under $z would be a good deal.

It's also possible that if someone wanted a particular game that I didn't, and set a price they'd pay, that I'd be willing to pick the cab up for them.  I am mainly interested in picking up one of these, maybe two, but I am getting a friend with a big truck so we could possibly load four or more in a single trip.

[Hoopz]

You didn't have to delete your posts Ahigh, I mean dax.

Your previous posts don't show you apologizing.  I think Brophog, DrewKaree and others would agree that you owe Minwah an apology which you have not done yet.  Everyone gets frustrated when things don't work properly the first time.  Adults don't attack others when they are asking for help.

Welcome to the club.  Ironically there's a developer in here too, but it's like pulling teeth to get straight answers.   I asked the same question as you and still didn't get a good answer.

I don't know what the deal is with MameWah.  I got every other FE and version of mame working.  And the damn creator lurks around here, but there must be some little clicke or private club where they only help each other out and get their jollies watching other people flounder around in frustration.  I think there may be some sort of scoreboard in a private forum where they take pleasure in frustrating newbies.

I don't know what the deal is with MameWah.  I got every other FE and version of mame working.  And the damn creator lurks around here, but there must be some little clicke or private club where they only help each other out and get their jollies watching other people flounder around in frustration.  I think there may be some sort of scoreboard in a private forum where they take pleasure in frustrating newbies.

Frankly I'm quite offended by that...if you bothered to search you would see up until recently I answer pretty much all questions about Mamewah.  I just haven't been around much over the last month or so, I haven't been 'lurking' anywhere.

To address one point you made before you deleted your posts, I could and should have provided more context to my answers.  Allow me to remedy that:

1. I dont believe you should convert a cabinet IMHO.
2. I don't know.  Sorry, I don't have more information on that question.
3. These items would not be where I would chose to put my disposable income at this time purely for personal reasons which are in no way indicative of the games themselves.

[Tiger-Heli]

Welcome to the club.  Ironically there's a developer in here too, but it's like pulling teeth to get straight answers.   I asked the same question as you and still didn't get a good answer.

I don't know what the deal is with MameWah.  I got every other FE and version of mame working.  And the damn creator lurks around here, but there must be some little clicke or private club where they only help each other out and get their jollies watching other people flounder around in frustration.  I think there may be some sort of scoreboard in a private forum where they take pleasure in frustrating newbies.

I don't know what the deal is with MameWah.  I got every other FE and version of mame working.  And the damn creator lurks around here, but there must be some little clicke or private club where they only help each other out and get their jollies watching other people flounder around in frustration.  I think there may be some sort of scoreboard in a private forum where they take pleasure in frustrating newbies.

Frankly I'm quite offended by that...if you bothered to search you would see up until recently I answer pretty much all questions about Mamewah.  I just haven't been around much over the last month or so, I haven't been 'lurking' anywhere.

I missed this exchange, but I somewhat sympathize with both parties.

MAMEwah is a great frontend, one of the easiest to setup graphically, and MinWah does a great job of supporting it in the forums.

It is also undoubtedly the most difficult FE to setup that I have ever tried.  I never got any games to show up until I stumbled across a tutorial at screenshotarchive that got it working.  Then with the new version, that method didn't work, and I ended up having to copy my config file over from the previous version to get it to list games. . .

[dax]

Hoopz:

Regarding the MinWah issue....

First off, I actually think I PM'd him awhile back.. and we talked.  I was unaware that he was still bothered by my comments, or that he had enlisted you to defend his honor and feelings.  If that's the case, and you need an apology as well, ok.

I have no problems with MinWah.  I really like MameWah - it looks like a beautiful FE.  Unfortunately, I can't get the damn thing to run right on my cab and nobody seems to know why.  All the games run in the same resolution when run from MameWah.  MinWah and nobody else has been able to fix this or explain what could be happening.  I finally gave up.  I hope to later at some point, try to get it working again.

[MYX]

Pricing is relitive. What is it worth to you. I bought a Defender for 375 plus buyers premium and tax was about 450. But this was like my favorite game and was well worth it. I cleaned it up and eventually sold it for 455. I had to get new video decoders for it, so it was a 10-15 dollar video game rental for 4 months of having a great game in my house. Can't beat that.

DO NOT CONVERT. Unless it has already been badly bastardized. I converted a qix that was even converted already and it felt horrible. If you have any respect for what it is that you are buying. If you want a shell to MAME then check out e-bay and a lot of times there are cabs just prime for conversion. Beter yet... Build your own.

[Hoopz]

I missed this exchange, but I somewhat sympathize with both parties.

MAMEwah is a great frontend, one of the easiest to setup graphically, and MinWah does a great job of supporting it in the forums.

It is also undoubtedly the most difficult FE to setup that I have ever tried.  I never got any games to show up until I stumbled across a tutorial at screenshotarchive that got it working.  Then with the new version, that method didn't work, and I ended up having to copy my config file over from the previous version to get it to list games. . .

I don't disagree at all, but to attack Minwah (and others in various posts) is not the best way to try and find more information.

Dax, I don't need an apology.  You stated, albeit in the deleted post, that you apologized numerous times about it and you didnt realize you had to keep doing etc.  If you did it via PM, great.  But those who were reading the threads were not aware of it.

[dax]

MAMEwah is a great frontend, one of the easiest to setup graphically, and MinWah does a great job of supporting it in the forums.

It is also undoubtedly the most difficult FE to setup that I have ever tried.  I never got any games to show up until I stumbled across a tutorial at screenshotarchive that got it working.  Then with the new version, that method didn't work, and I ended up having to copy my config file over from the previous version to get it to list games. . .

I feel your pain.  I think one major reason why the software is so un-user-friendly is due to the way it handles config files.  You can't put your own comments in, because the program apparently reads, strips and re-writes the config file when its run.  This design flaw means that people cannot easily distribute documented config setups that help others get the software running efficiently. 

With that in mind, I still recognize that the software is a gift, and it might seem a bit selfish to criticize a product that is donated to the community in one form or another, but I only say this to suggest that a great product, with a few improvements, can be made even better.  It sure looks better than any other FE I've seen.  I just can't get it to run right, and having a developer around, and still not knowing WTF is wrong, compounds my frustration.  I plan to check into the software again soon though.

[dax]

I missed this exchange, but I somewhat sympathize with both parties.

MAMEwah is a great frontend, one of the easiest to setup graphically, and MinWah does a great job of supporting it in the forums.

It is also undoubtedly the most difficult FE to setup that I have ever tried.  I never got any games to show up until I stumbled across a tutorial at screenshotarchive that got it working.  Then with the new version, that method didn't work, and I ended up having to copy my config file over from the previous version to get it to list games. . .

I don't disagree at all, but to attack Minwah (and others in various posts) is not the best way to try and find more information.

Dax, I don't need an apology.  You stated, albeit in the deleted post, that you apologized numerous times about it and you didnt realize you had to keep doing etc.  If you did it via PM, great.  But those who were reading the threads were not aware of it.

I understand.  I want to get along with everybody here and I want to contribute, and I don't mind you all telling me I might be a little insensitive or caustic sometimes, I can handle that.  It's better than copping an attitude and suggesting I'm not worthy of consideration... that'll just get my gander up.   Anyway, I'm over all this and I hope everyone else is too.  I was definitely burned out trying to get my cab working, especially when I'm a software guy and I figured out the hardware and the software stopped me cold.. that just really pissed me off.  I still am upset at myself when I think about it.  I hate it when I can't get a program that should work to work.

[dax]

Pricing is relitive. What is it worth to you. I bought a Defender for 375 plus buyers premium and tax was about 450. But this was like my favorite game and was well worth it. I cleaned it up and eventually sold it for 455. I had to get new video decoders for it, so it was a 10-15 dollar video game rental for 4 months of having a great game in my house. Can't beat that.

DO NOT CONVERT. Unless it has already been badly bastardized. I converted a qix that was even converted already and it felt horrible. If you have any respect for what it is that you are buying. If you want a shell to MAME then check out e-bay and a lot of times there are cabs just prime for conversion. Beter yet... Build your own.

It does seem that the consensus is to not convert, but instead restore?

Is there much of a market for restored vintage games?  I have been checking eBay and there seems to be a little activity, but not much.

Anyone care to comment on which of the games they think is most valuable if restored?  The cockpit Red Baron?

[dax]

You didn't have to delete your posts Ahigh, I mean dax.

It looks like you're accusing me of being another personality on the board?  That's provacative.  I don't know why you guys think that there can only be one person who disagrees with you.  I find that amusing.

Can we move beyond this?

[Tiger-Heli]

DO NOT CONVERT.

I'm a little more liberal in this respect than many of the "purists" on here.

Unless it has already been badly bastardized.

Agreed - probably the best choice if you want a fully custom machine, or

2.  Unless it can be restored back with no trouble - i.e. if you find a Centipede with perfect marquee and sideart  and you remove the metal CP and PCB's, install a wood 2-player CP and player shum'ups on it, no problem.  If you paint it blue with custom side art and chop it down to hang an X-arcade off it, problem . . . , or.

3.  The machine isn't worth restoring - This is a gray area, but let's say you find a Galaga with the original joystick replaced, the marquee cracked, and no side-art on one side and damaged on the other.  Galaga is a true classic, IMHO, but also a fairly common game, so I do think they sell for much . . .  To fix it up would not return as much as you would put into it, so it's PROBABLY okay to MAME, but I would likely look for a more bastardized cab myself.

[dax]

Yea, a friend of mine bought a Galaga '88 machine at the last auction where I got my NeoGeo.  He paid $45 for the unit, tweaked it just a tad, and sold it for $350, and it was in raggy condition.

I can appreciate the satisfaction of building a custom cabinet.  I'm just not looking forward to doing things like T-moulding and stuff like that because I don't have a router.  I'd rather jump right into modifying the control surface, painting the cabinet and integrating the computer.  Along those lines, the Simpsons cab seems like it has a lot of potential.  However, that's because I'm under the impression the Simpsons as a stand-alone game isn't that valuable an item.  When I converted my Neo cabinet, I set it up so that I could switch it back to the original setup if I wanted.  This next project would be the next step for me, which would be completely changing a cabinet, but not doing it from the gound up.  I figure a third project would probaby be a cocktail or tabletop.

Here are some pictures of some of the cabs:

[AtomSmasher]

Back to the question at hand, where is this auction?    I doubt it's near me, but it never hurts asking.

I would of tried answering your questions if I had an intelligent answer to give, unfortunately I'm fairly new to the mame scene and have no idea.  I do think you should build instead of convert, but if you can't build, then spend $100 and get an empty cab that no one will miss.

[Tiger-Heli]

Is there much of a market for restored vintage games?  I have been checking eBay and there seems to be a little activity, but not much.

For most of us, it's a question of nostalgia rather then market value.  Case in point - my nick is Tiger-Heli.  I played the game daily in college and it was the only game I ever got through all the levels on without using cheats or unlimited quarters in MAME.  I have seen maybe two of them in RL since college and always played them at least once when I saw it.  AFAIK, the game was never sold as a dedicated cab, and a full-up conversion with accurate marquee, CP, and side-art goes for around $200-$300 on E-bay.

Clearly if you found one with a good PCB, but generic CP, no marquee, and bad side-art, it would cost you more to restore it than it would be worth in the end . . .  But if you painted it black and turned it into a MAME machine, that's one less Tiger-Heli machine in the world for people like me to find and play.  (Then again, if you didn't turn it into a MAME machine and the owner threw it in a field b/c nobody would buy it, it's still one less Tiger-Heli machine for me to play, but now you don't get the enjoyment from it either . . .)

But it's that kind of thing for most of us . . .

Anyone care to comment on which of the games they think is most valuable if restored?  The cockpit Red Baron?

Hmmmmmn, two of the three people (Myself and Witchboard, but not Hoopz) that responded to your original question mentioned the cockpit Red Baron, how much plainer do you need it???

[Tiger-Heli]

However, that's because I'm under the impression the Simpsons as a stand-alone game isn't that valuable an item.

It is to someone.  Point is for every game you pick that you think "This was a crappy game anyway and no-one will miss it if I make a MAME machine out of it.", there's someone that will go "OMFG, that was my ALL-TIME FAVORITE game!!! You actually had a dedicated working one and converted it!!!"

That's why we're recommending something bastardized like, oh say a Williams Blaster cockpit that's been coverted to some crappy racecar game . . .  How much could that be worth to anyone? ($5,800 AUD).

[Witchboard]

Here are some pictures of some of the cabs:

Where's the rest?  I honestly wouldn't convert any of those you showed as they all seem to be in good condition with nothing missing.  Did they plug them in for you?

[dax]

Back to the question at hand, where is this auction?    I doubt it's near me, but it never hurts asking.

Louisiana.

[Hoopz]

I understand.  I want to get along with everybody here and I want to contribute, and I don't mind you all telling me I might be a little insensitive or caustic sometimes, I can handle that.  It's better than copping an attitude and suggesting I'm not worthy of consideration... that'll just get my gander up.   Anyway, I'm over all this and I hope everyone else is too.  I was definitely burned out trying to get my cab working, especially when I'm a software guy and I figured out the hardware and the software stopped me cold.. that just really pissed me off.  I still am upset at myself when I think about it.  I hate it when I can't get a program that should work to work.

Yep, lets move on. Water under the bridge.   

[dax]

However, that's because I'm under the impression the Simpsons as a stand-alone game isn't that valuable an item.

It is to someone.  Point is for every game you pick that you think "This was a crappy game anyway and no-one will miss it if I make a MAME machine out of it.", there's someone that will go "OMFG, that was my ALL-TIME FAVORITE game!!! You actually had a dedicated working one and converted it!!!"

That's why we're recommending something bastardized like, oh say a Williams Blaster cockpit that's been coverted to some crappy racecar game . . .  How much could that be worth to anyone? ($5,800 AUD).

I see your point.

One man's trash is another man's treasure.   And I can relate, when I was in high school, the local convenience store had a Vangard machine that we played endlessly.  What a lame game, but for some, it can be nostalgic.  For me, that game is Tempest or Joust, maybe Q*Bert but those aren't that rare.  I did have an affinity for Jump Bug, which is probably pretty scarce.  I wonder how rare a red baron cockpit is or what it would be worth restored?  I couldn't find any comparables on eBay.

[dax]

Here are some pictures of some of the cabs:

Where's the rest?  I honestly wouldn't convert any of those you showed as they all seem to be in good condition with nothing missing.  Did they plug them in for you?

I haven't inspected them.  Inspection will be tomorrow, with the auction the day after.  I will go check them out.

Maybe these units were ruined in the hurricane.  I am not sure, but they don't look from the pictures to be water damaged and I don't have pics of all the machines.  I will report back after inspection.

My question still stands... if the machines are in working condition, based on the pictures seem to be pretty stock, anyone care to speculate what they would be worth?

[Witchboard]

My question still stands... if the machines are in working condition, based on the pictures seem to be pretty stock, anyone care to speculate what they would be worth?

Something is only worth what somebody is willing to pay.  That said, I'm a pretty cheap bastard, so I can tell you what I would try and get away with if they all are in WORKING condition.

Street Fighter II = $200
Simpsons = $250
Red Baron = $400

Getting them cheaper is always better, so those would be my max bids.  That's probably why I walk away from most auction without buying anything.    The way I price cabs is pretty much figure what all the parts cost.  It's easy to find repro CPO's and marquees on ebay, plus game boards and monitors.  Just add up everything and see where the price comes in.  Maybe add $50 or so since it's all put together and there ya go.

[dax]

Yea, this makes sense... there are a ton of SF2 machines that won't sell on ebay for over $300.

[divemaster127]

I would think the Red Baron if its in good shape would be worth a bit more than that
thanks
divemaster

[CheffoJeffo]

I would think the Red Baron if its in good shape would be worth a bit more than that
thanks
divemaster

Possibly, but there was a working one on RGVAC recently that the guy couldn't sell at $450 (although I would pay that locally in a heartbeat if I had the room) to the point where the seller was going to trade it for a Vectrex, until he regained his senses (also reported on RetroBlast).

Cheers.

[dax]

I made up my mind I'm going for the Red Baron if it's in good shape... maybe one or two others if I can move them.  I am thinking the Lethal Enforcer might have the best hardware of the bunch - I'll check it all out and let you all know.  I don't know if anybody is nearby, but if someone's looking for something specific and I can pick it up cheap, let me know.  I don't have room to keep a bunch of these units indefinitely.

[Witchboard]

I would think the Red Baron if its in good shape would be worth a bit more than that
thanks
divemaster

I'm a pretty cheap bastard

Well, I only usually give myself around $300 to spend at an auction anyway.  I never spend past my means, and if I can't get what I'm wanting, then I wait for the next time.  I do have a family to feed and bills to pay. 

[tristan]

That Street Fighter II looks like a Dynamo cabinet with the pull out control panel. If it is, it's a pretty nice cabinet and a good candidate for conversion.

[dax]

Tell me more about this dynamo cabinet.. that sounds interesting...

Generally speaking are there some cabinet types that are more appealing?  I guess so.

The Neo-Geo cab I have has this really cool curved metal playfield that opens outward.. made of steel instead of wood.  I really liked that.. UNTIL I had to cut a 2.5" hole in the steel for a trackball (what a nightmare that was).