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Author Topic: Multi-Jamma setup  (Read 1866 times)

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gsoul

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Multi-Jamma setup
« on: November 13, 2005, 08:29:54 pm »
Okay,

Anyone who hasnt seen it yet, I have just bought this DREAM cabinet.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=45749.0

Its the ultimate Mortal Kombat machine with MK1, MK2, Ultimate MK3 and MK4 all inside.

Basically I'm looking for a way to easily switch the games *WITHOUT* having them powered up all the time. Even some kind of switch or something.

I know MultiJamma would work, but the boards are all powered.

What I want is something like this.



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gsoul

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2005, 08:30:45 pm »
Obviously, I want to also put a big warning button on the switch saying "POWER DOWN CABINET BEFORE SWITCHING GAMES!!!"
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grueinthebox

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2005, 08:58:20 pm »
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=45208.0

Guy's got a multi-jamma setup that doesn't keep all the boards powered up (currently), and seems like it could be made to work with more than the current two boards.  Get in touch with him...  He's talking about making the final setup power all the boards simultaneously, but maybe he could do something for the setup you desire, or at least point you in the right direction...
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gsoul

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2005, 11:03:58 pm »
 know I'm a complete electronics IDIOT.. but could the following technically work?



So all the Jamma connectors go into a terminal strip then into another jamma connector, then all you're effectively doing is turning on or off each board ie cutting it off from the power.
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meanbean

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2005, 03:06:32 pm »
You have the right idea.
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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2005, 03:32:20 pm »
Out of curiousity, what is the issue with having all boards powered ?

Also, don't forget the kick harnesses in your plans.

Cheers.

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SirPoonga

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2005, 03:35:27 pm »
thinking about it.  Could all boards have the buttons and joys wired to it.  Then switch the ground and power pins.  If no ground or power going to board pushing the button can't affect it?

Then just get your standard printer selector box and hack away. (Modify with correct gauge of wire for the power and ground pins).
« Last Edit: November 14, 2005, 03:37:26 pm by SirPoonga »

gsoul

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2005, 04:48:57 pm »
The reason I dont want the boards powered is for the following reasons.

1) Preservation - I dont want to put more mileage on the boards than neccessary to play them.

2) Heat - The cabinet gets quite hot inside even with the two massive server fans that LAI put in there. 4 boards running might make this worse.

3) No need for quick change. Since the can is a dedicated Mortal Kombat cabinet, I'm only ever playing one game or the other. A quick change isnt neccesary, at the moment I'm switching Jamma harnesses and power connectors.
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gsoul

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2005, 05:11:22 pm »
You might need some electrical part that stops current from flowing in the wrong direction, and put on on each and every wire coming from each JAMMA board... otherwise in the end, wouldn't something like a video signal "bleed" out to the 4 other video connections that are attached (though unpowered)??


Is this true?
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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2005, 07:04:53 pm »
Note I said "might". I suppose if the circuit isn't closed, then there's no draw on power, but I don't know. Let's find an electronics expert......
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BobA

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2005, 07:35:56 pm »
Even non powered components can affect powered circuits that they are connected to because they may conduct power from the live circuit.  A component such as a transistor can act as a drain on the active cirucuit because it will appear as a diode.  A mechanical switch or a CMOS switch (used on multi setups) will give isolation for each separate board.

BobA

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2005, 10:25:43 pm »
The reason I dont want the boards powered is for the following reasons.

1) Preservation - I dont want to put more mileage on the boards than neccessary to play them.

2) Heat - The cabinet gets quite hot inside even with the two massive server fans that LAI put in there. 4 boards running might make this worse.

3) No need for quick change. Since the can is a dedicated Mortal Kombat cabinet, I'm only ever playing one game or the other. A quick change isnt neccesary, at the moment I'm switching Jamma harnesses and power connectors.

I would definitely recommend a conversation with stratjakt then ... I have a JAMMA countertop that I was thinking of taking multigame and heat would be a big issue, so I was intrigued by his project. Of course, I later realized that I didn't actually have room for more than two very small boards, so that idea has been shelved for the moment.

FWIW -- I do love my MultiJamma and have never had a problem with heat in that cabinet (indeed, never noticed additional heat due to the additional boards). I'm a bit surprised that such a big cabinet actually has two fans running in it (none of my uprights have fans).

Cheers
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stratjakt

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2005, 01:22:30 am »
I did something similar putting a PC10 and a VS super mario in a cabinet..

I used relays, and a flip flop to drive them, so its just a toggle button, no powering down or whatnot..

Wiring all the joys and buttons together is no big deal, these are active low, in other words, you're just grounding them out, not switching voltages..  All the multi-jammas out there just tie all the controls together.

Video and audio are another problem though, well, video was for me..  The video signals tied together came out all washed out and blurry..  I used two CD4066 chips to switch them (Quad bilateral switch)..  Basically, these are just digital switches, I tied all the activation lines together, powered each with 12v and ground, and by sending 12v to one or the other, I allow signal through that chip..

Diodes did not work to isolate the video signals, as I read in a Bob Roberts article.  The 0.7v or so voltage drop made it look awful, it was better without them.  Nintendo boards are negative video, maybe a positive video would work better with diodes, but the 4066 chips have an "on" resistance of a mere 100 ohms, which is negligable, and both games look crisp and great when running.

In my case audio wasn't amplified, and tying the two audio lines together wasnt a big deal, although the VS is noticably louder.  A solid state relay, or another cheap realay would be a good choice for switching audio, and from what I can see that's what the commercial solutions do.  I wouldnt recommend splicing amplified audio like this, since that may do some damage.  In this case, I'm probably going to add a couple of 10k pots to attenuate the volumes to match, but most boards out there have volume onboard.

Although it works great, my home-wired on perfboard solution is a friggin mess of wires, I will say that much.  Maybe you're neater than I am, but four boards would be a nightmare to do the way I did, but still doable.  Mounting the boards and wiring the harnesses was the real killer, the electronics involved aren't complex at all.

Relays (or mechanical switches) for power (12v and 5v, -5V if needed), CD4066's to switch video (or more relays), relays or switches for audio.

Of course, none of this is any good if your monitor wont sync all the games, so make sure you try 'em one by one by themselves and make sure you dont have to adjust it for each game...

I plan on making more multi-cabs, and am looking into having some boards fabbed by expresspcb.com or a service like that.  I did start noodling around some layouts, and I'm thinking a 4-board pcb would be a good goal, as I could keep the size down, and I dont see how I'd manage to mount 8 boards in any of the cabs I own.  I like the stuff I do to look "pro", or like it was designed that way.

I have all the cabs I'm ever going to fit into this house, yet want more games, so it's the way to go for me..  (Neo Geo + Neo Geo 64 + Atomiswave, CPS2 + CPS1, etc etc etc)  I want to make it optional whether boards are all powered, or power is switched (for tight spots where multiple psu's aren't feasible, or other reasons) - I can think of cases where either scheme is better.

It's late, I'm rambling and not thinking too clear, but I'll post some schematics and more info on what I did later, and keep you folk up to date on the progress of my proposed DIY-boards, I figure if there's enough interest, a small run of 20 or so would make an attractive alternative to big-$ solutions..


In the meantime, I need to get a CPS2 and an F3 system ready for xmas (XMen vs SF for the boy, Puzzle Bobble 3 for the girl), so my short term goals involve painting and finding artwork and t-molding and new buttons and patching the F3 to play in US and all that good kindsa stuff.. I'll be on this, though, because I definately want to get my Neo/Hyper Neo machine in effect, and do a proper double or triple donkey kong (no cheesy chipstacking hacks where the sounds aren't right)... I want to add a mario bros (original) and popeye to the nintendo cab I built, etc.

If any of that jabbering made sense, woohoo..  If not, I'll be back later.

gsoul

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Re: Multi-Jamma setup
« Reply #13 on: November 20, 2005, 08:51:26 am »
Thanks, I'd like thos schematics, though its starting to make more sense now.

Hey if you need help with any of your artwork or anything, let me know. I've done some good stuff for other guys on here.
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