Another CP for advice: basic, 4 player in line, 2 LS30's

[Barkuti]

Hi guys.

I've been spending the last couple days into the design of my future 4 player CP.
I'm a fan of classic multiplayer beat'em ups, shooters and rotary joystick games.
The panel is designed to be 116 x 40 cm (around 45.67 x 15.75").

My biggest concerns are related to its comfort distances and layout for 4 player gaming, and for 2 players on the LS30's.


*** EDIT ***
Added a trackball. Do you find it well placed?
New big buttons for player starts.
Service buttons increased to 3, for shared use as trackball buttons also.
Reworked/optimized layout.
Vastly improved drawing

Cheers

[MameJunkie]

I think making player 3 & 4 at a angle facing towards the center is better.

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[Barkuti]

I think making player 3 & 4 at a angle facing towards the center is better.

Mmm, that's always a controversial aspect of CP designing.
During my early years at the arcades I never had a problem playing with the angled 3 & 4 player controller setups of many machines. But in fact, I had to do that often because many of my friends never liked it. Besides, if you want to play dual stick two player games, having in line plus same orientation joysticks is a no qualms solution.
So that feature is a must for me.


Cheers

[RetroACTIVE]

I toyed with the straight 4 player panel.... I almost went with it because of the exact reason you did.  I ultimately went with the angled approach... I chose "form" over "function" on that one!

I do like the clean look of your panel... If a 4 player stick panel is what you are after... then you can't get much better than what you have... You know what happens once you start adding trackballs, spinners and flight sticks.... all hell breaks loose!

good luck.

[Sinner]

I went with a straight config for mine...I really wanted to be able to play 2 player Karate Champ...
Here's a picture of what I finally ended up doing...it's a little big (49" wide)...I could have gone smaller, but I'm a big dude, and I wanted to be cofortable when I played with others...

[Barkuti]

CP updated to revision 2. Check first post.

Changes:

• Added center service buttons.
• Fixed some errors in the measurement lines, and added new ones.
• Player 1 & 2 buttons rearranged for less space usage.
• Minimum mid-button to next useable joystick distance now fixed at 170 mm (~6.7") -PL3 isn't going to be used at the same time as PL1 on LS-30-. PL1 buttons to PL2 joy distance is 230 mm in 4 player mode (~9.1").
• Lowered controls row by 50 mm (~2") and uppered PL1 and PL2 buttonry by 18 mm (~11/16"), allowing increased comfort for 2 player LS-30 gaming. PL1 controls moved 5 mm (~3/16") to the right and PL2 ones 5 to the left.
• The new increased upper right part free space allows for a compact keyboard placement.
• Maybe something I don't remember now...

Looks much more final to me now. What do you think?

Sinner, your CP concept looks similar to mine, somewhat wider yet with trackball. Is it comfortable for 4 player gaming?


Cheers

[RetroACTIVE]

Since your are a beat'em-up fan have you considered P360 sticks...  some folks prefer them for such games. 

I have a t-stick plus for 4 way... I find it a bit squishy even though the throw is tight...

I was going to ask about service buttons... but it looks like you have it taken care of!

[markrvp]

Would you discuss your thoughts for how you chose your joysticks?

[Sinner]

Sinner, your CP concept looks similar to mine, somewhat wider yet with trackball. Is it comfortable for 4 player gaming?

Yeah, it's good for me...I have a bunch of big friends, and I got them to stand in position to make sure, and it was fine...
The only problem I had was when I first started making hooked shots in GT, the player 2 joystick would sometimes get whacked...I got used to it pretty quick, and it seems to be fine...

[Barkuti]

Would you discuss your thoughts for how you chose your joysticks?  The reason I ask is because the T-sticks and J-sticks have such a different feel.

Well, I already have 3 J-sticks laying around. These were bought in the past for a 3 independent CP panel project shared with 2 other friends. We had more or less frequent meetings for mameing at one of them's house back then, but some events in his life changed his mind and the project got cancelled.

The problem is I can only get that kind of stick from Andy (Ultimarc). And I have no other interesting thing to get from his store at this moment. I can, however, get T-sticks from the same place I'm going to buy the illuminated buttons, and those are probably more adequate for some basic SF style combo movements, altough I'm just speculating.
What do you think of J-sticks for VS fighting style games?

Another option would be using J-sticks for players 1 and 2, and LS-30's for players 3 & 4, saving 2 sticks. Speculating again (I don't have the LS-30's at hand to check how do they feel; I expect to receive them tomorrow or this Friday), I don't like this idea because I'm supposing LS-30's won't be great for sidescrolling beatem' ups.

Or maybe I should get another J-stick & a wiring kit despite having to pay additional shipping costs. Grrr... I'll at least have to wait for the LS-30's to make up my mind a bit...

On a side note, I'm not a big fan of VS fighting games either.

Suggestions?


Cheers

[Crowley]

Wow.

[hulkster]

you may not have the money or room for it, but if you are wanting a 4 player cp and room enough for everyone, you need to go the showcase cab route.  4 players on an upright cab is okay, but not exactly ideal so everyone can see and be comfortable.  i would look into showcase cabs if you really want 4 players and the room to play.  check out my site and others like jakobuds for plans. 

[Barkuti]

Actually I'm not going to get or build a cab, hulkster.
My plan is to use the CP over a pedestal or table. And have my arcade monitor built into a custom wooden frame over a big tall chest of drawers or something for the matter. It will look similar to what you're suggesting me, yet not as fancy. I'm making the designs, but I'll hire a carpenter to do the jobs; I don't have room, tools or time enough for properly building the furniture.

And honestly, with all the stuff, shipping costs, decision changes, etc. going on for this project, I'd better not bother in calculating the grand total it's taking from my wallet . I'll live happier.


Cheers

[Barkuti]

Huh forgot to ask, how hard do you think rotating a 50 Kg (110 lbs) framed monitor over one of its corners will be?


Cheers

[markrvp]

Would you discuss your thoughts for how you chose your joysticks?

[Silver]

Huh forgot to ask, how hard do you think rotating a 50 Kg (110 lbs) framed monitor over one of its corners will be?
Cheers

Not quite sure exactly what you mean by rotating over one of its corners - Do you mean make the corner the centre point of rotation? This would move the monitor completely to a different place as you rotate it....

To rotate a large monitor is probably going to take a lot more space, as most ways I've seen of doing it involve building a wooden circular frame that is strong enought to support the entire weight of the monitor....

[Barkuti]

New, improved and more featured design.

Should I place the trackball buttons at the left side?

Not quite sure exactly what you mean by rotating over one of its corners - Do you mean make the corner the centre point of rotation? This would move the monitor completely to a different place as you rotate it....

How about mounting small wheel(s) on the desired rotating corner of the monitor frame, and same height legs on each opposite corner for stopping/leveling in both horizontal and vertical positions? This would allow simultaneous displacement and rotation of the monitor for recentering, over some kind of platform with rails for the wheels.
It's a compact solution, but may require some muscle for the operation.
Size is the true problem. The damn thing would require a 34" or bigger diameter rotating frame otherwise.


Cheers

[Silver]

I think Im being a bit slow about what you mean for your rotating idea....

I know the setup were you build a strong circular wooden frame round the monitor (to support all the weight) and place wheels round the frame so that it will turn easily with the wheels lying on a wooden support.... But as you say this takes a large amount of space.

Could you draw a diagram of what you mean?

[thebrownshow]

I have to admit that I'm not a huge fan of the J-Stick, in fact, I'm currently replacing mine.  The diagonal range is huge, and the movement is definitely very square.  They were nice for their ability to be switched to four-way mode back before the T-Stick Plus came out, but if you're going to be playing lots of four-player brawlers or VS fighting games and don't need to ever switch to four-way mode, I'd absolutely go with something else for all four sticks.

Check out Retroblast's joystick roundup and you'll see what I mean.

[Barkuti]

Mmmm, I think the sticks are something more of a personal taste. The Sanwa microswitches of a J-stick are way softer than the ones on the "old" T-stick (it has been updated with softer ones).
I've literally grown using "T-sticks" (actually, genuine IL sticks) at the local arcades, and prefer the longer throw of the J-stick, because coupled with the soft switches allows for easier rotating movements: you don't need to steer the stick all the way, the J-stick is to be "guided".
At least that's the way I feel it.

Cheers