Is there a doctor in the house? *edit* Wife is slowly killing me. SEND HELP!

[DrewKaree]

Someone please explain to me why the eff my BACK hurts because of kidney stones.  I mean, seriously....it's not bad enough the BIG symptom?  Are my back muscles somehow working overtime without me knowing it to work these things out?

Bones, it's keeping me awake.  I can't find a comfortable position for ANYTHING, much less sleep.  What've you got going on since I'm up?

[Goz]

I get stones about once a year. Back pain is normal. I had asked about it once and was told it was a muscular compensation thing. Some crap about crunching through the pain and tension... blah blah...

[DrewKaree]

I get stones about once a year. Back pain is normal. I had asked about it once and was told it was a muscular compensation thing. Some crap about crunching through the pain and tension... blah blah...

I had 'em about 3 years ago and none since.  I feel like puking several times during the day.  It didn't happen last time, so is that normal too? 

Of all the stupid things in the world to pack-rat away, I've got that effing seive they give you

I'll prolly be farting around here tomorrow too since the doctor gave me some "don't operate heavy machinery when taking these" kinda pills and my job specifically entails operating heavy machinery.

This wouldn't suck half as bad if I could lift crap and work on my cab....my basement is dang near soundproof.

[Bones]

The back pain is a side effect of tensing your body.  It's a common mistake, pressure can reduce pain somewhat and your surrounding muscles are working overtime thinking that they are helping. Your mind is probably also associating movement with pain and has taken a firm stand to guard this area and all surrounding movement.

You need a relaxant. Try cannabis.

Ohh yeah, and if I was you, I would be more concerned about the future inevitable pain you will feel in your urethra at the exact moment this unholy chunk of rock decides it wants out.

Warm regards,
Dr Bones

[ChadTower]

Your kidneys are in your lower back, if that helps.

I've lost track of the amount of times I've ended up pissing blood the day after a football or hockey game.

[Bones]

Life is short. Play hard, piss blood.

~Nike~

[ChadTower]

It wasn't a good game if you don't end up leaking blood from someplace.

[Goz]

Ohh yeah, and if I was you, I would be more concerned about the future inevitable pain you will feel in your urethra at the exact moment this unholy chunk of rock decides it wants out.

Warm regards,
Dr Bones

Ah yes the pain that could associate with doing it with a cheese grader. 

[ChadTower]

That cheese would not pass. 

It would fail.

[danny_galaga]

(",)

[Stingray]

No, I won't come over and play doctor with you, Drew. Please stop asking.

-S

[Ed_McCarron]

For some reason, I'm prone to kidney stones.

The doc asked me to save one for them to analyse.

Never got back to the doc.

I've got quite a collection of stones in a jar to gross out friends with.

That, in a nutshell, is todays information you never needed to know.

Seriously:

I end up passing 2 or 3 a year.  I've found a few things help:

Hoard narcotic painkillers.  Once it starts to hurt, it'll take too long to get a new prescription, go to pharmacy, etc.  Much quicker to just pop a percocet before the pain gets too bad.

Lie on side in dark room.

Mine usually make the trip to the bladder in a few hours - thats the only intense part of the pain.  The doc 'splained it to me as the fact that the kidney really does not like having urine back up, and this is the painful part.

Passing them from the bladder doesn't really hurt me - but having the stone sit in your bladder is irritating as all get out.  The trick is to drink loads of water - fast.  Try to hold it as long as possible.  The more pressure and flow you create the quicker the stone passes.

The 'stutter' that occurs in the stream when the stupid stone finally passes has never failed to give me the creeps, tho.

[ChadTower]

Okay, dude, I'm glad I'm not you.

[Ed_McCarron]

I'd say "you get used to the pain" but that'd be like saying "I understand my wife."

A total lie.

[Stingray]

I just took a trip down the hall to the restroom and for the first time in my life was thankful that when I do so, it's completely uneventful.

-S

[Jabba]

Hey Drew, just found a linky for you...

Your back and you...

http://www2.aaos.org/yoc/lowbackpain_56k.asx

http://www2.aaos.org/yoc/lowbackpain.asx

[DrewKaree]

You need a relaxant. Try cannabis.

I got some Vicodin.  Will those make me a superstar QB in the NFL?  I'd like to get a refill on my prescription if they would.  I could do a lot even with only one week of that paycheck.  One week is about all I think I could last.  Actually, one play where I got hit, but I think my powers of "OMG I"M GONNA GET KILLED, RUUUUUUUUN!" are better than their powers of chasing me down 

No, I won't come over and play doctor with you, Drew. Please stop asking.

-S

Sure, but you'll play Pope with Tommy.  ---daisies---!

Okay, dude, I'm glad I'm not you.

Seconded.  I was told to drink less tea (I drink a lot of cold sweet tea) and soda as both help contribute to the formation.


Jabba, I only started watching one of those videos.  When the doctor snapped that rubber glove and started throwing KY on his finger, I had to look away.  I'm still a few years away from that "special treat"

I got a visit from the pee fairy last night.  Combined with my new friend Mr Vicodin, I got to sleep some.  I was almost certain I was gonna pass out before I was done.  My back still friggen hurts, but nowhere NEAR the same as last night.  Back problems aren't USUALLY a problem for me, as it's one of the few areas I exercise, along with my abs.  A family member screwed up their back pretty badly a while back, and even though it doesn't look like it when looking at me, I've got pretty good ab/back muscles.  Now it's time to start losing MORE weight.  Anyone here in my area need a raquetball partner? 

[Stingray]

No, I won't come over and play doctor with you, Drew. Please stop asking.

-S

Sure, but you'll play Pope with Tommy.  daisies!

He's my favorite altar boy.

-S

[shmokes]

Yikes...that tea bit scares me.  I've got a pretty damned healthy diet.  No soda whatsoever (aside from the occasional rum/jack and coke).  Almost no candy or sweets of any kind.  Lots of veggies and more bread and pasta than is healthy.  Lots of chicken, too.

But tea.  I drink earl grey like it was going out of style.  I do not want kidney stones.  EVER.

Are there any other indicators aside from diet for kidney stone pronedness?  Cause I'm a skinny sonofabitch so I'm hoping that overweight is one.

[DrewKaree]

No, weight doesn't seem to play a part in 'em whatsoever.  It's a diet thing primarily.  There's oxalates (dunno if I spelled that right) in tea, which is one of the large contributors.  I dunno if it's any old kind of tea or what, but they DID make a point to ask me "hot or cold".  Calcium also is a contributor (obviously) to the formation of stones.  Other than that, yes, heredity DOES play a role, as well as the water you drink in your area.  If you don't drink filtered water, you're ingesting whatever is in your water as well.  I don't know specifically what elements there would be in water, but that's what I was told.  They really only asked me about the liquids in my diet, and I have no idea why soda would be a big thing, because I'd guess they would filter that water so they wouldn't waste more money on overcoming any elements to achieve the taste they wanted.  Mebbe it's the bubbles

[shmokes]

Hmmm...maybe I'll look into it.  Primarily I drink spring water.  So I'd guess it is filtered naturally, but probably has lots of minerals in it.  I also eat lots of cheese.  I don't know what that oxalate thing is, but I know that green tea is the big one for antioxidants and that also has "ox" in it, so maybe I'm okay there.  Earl Grey is black and I drink it hot.  Nobody in my ginormous family has had kidney stones except my sister, and she's always been an odd duck with all kinds of health problems.  I sometimes wonder if she's not a product of the milkman (aside from the fact that I've never had milk delivered).

[Ed_McCarron]

Seconded.  I was told to drink less tea (I drink a lot of cold sweet tea) and soda as both help contribute to the formation.

Sounds like oxalate stones.

Avoid dark green veggies, also.  Finally, an instruction from the Dr I could live with.  No more spinach.

One thing that predisposes you to stones (my case) is inflammatory bowel disease.  Your gut can't process the oxalate, so it gets excreted via your kidneys.  What can't stay in solution, crystalizes.

Mine seem to happen after a physical shock - 2 year old jumps on my gut, I fall or hit my side, marathon DDR session... must shake something loose.

Oh yeah, drink more water.  Any liquid will help.  Judging by the amount of trips to the bathroom when we go to a bar, I'd think a beer a day will cut stones in half, at least.

[DrewKaree]

Earl Grey is black and I drink it hot. 

Orange and something else cold.  Is "pekoe" a tea?  That's all that's coming to me right now, and I dont' care to go look at the moment.  Brewed, sugar added, and cooled.  Good stuff!  Chick-fil-A is the only other place to get decent sweet tea if you like it, and now it looks like I've got to make it an "every so often" kind of treat.  Some things just aren't worth doing what I want because I want to enjoy my life.

Yeah, those are the kinds of stones they supposed me to have.  Green vegetables aren't a worry for me.  I love peas like they're going outta style, but I don't often get to eat them because my son can't stomach them.  That, and broccoli are about the only green vegetables I ever eat. 

[ChadTower]

I got some Vicodin.  Will those make me a superstar QB in the NFL? 

No, even us lowly semipros can get vicodin.

[DrewKaree]

I think she's on the phone on purpose so I can't call the cops.  You guys are my only hope.  Call the cops for me, and quick.  She's trying to slowly kill me and make it look like an accident.  I have photographic proof now.  Print this out and take it to the cops.  It's what she made for dinner tonight.  HELP!

[Goz]

If she cooked the veggies in the grease from the whatever kind of fried meat thing that is; I'd have to concur that she likely found out from Social Security that you are worth more dead than alive. (survival benefits).

[shmokes]

Pork chop, I'd guess.  But yes, someone should call the police.  Those peas look like they came from a can!!!  Buy frozen and you will never go back.  Next best thing to fresh.

[Jabba]

Mmmmm, goodly goodliness. Nuthin better n fried chicken thies and overcooked mushy peas.

Can you say Heat Attack 

[DrewKaree]

Pork chop, I'd guess.  But yes, someone should call the police.  Those peas look like they came from a can!!!  Buy frozen and you will never go back.  Next best thing to fresh.

Winner winner pork chop dinner.

Breaded pork chop.  Yes, indeed the peas came from a can   Since the boy character here doesn't like 'em, I usually get FRESH peas from her mom.  She grows 'em for me since she knows her grandson doesn't like 'em.  Frozen just isn't cost effective, although I promise her every friggen time I'd eat the whole bag if she'd buy it.

Fresh peas in a steamer piece of cooking equipment designed to steam foods.  Add a touch of sea salt when done.  Nothing else needed, cuz DADDY LIKE!

*edit*
Done to remove a terrible use of the word "steamer" for some of our more quick-witted members and save some disgusting mental images from being posted.

[tommy]

 I feel like puking several times during the day. 

I often feel like that after reading most of your posts. 

[Sephroth57]

tommy strikes again!!  his patented giants calling card left behind, scarring my screen

[tommy]

tommy strikes again!!  his patented giants calling card left behind, scarring my screen

You must be running at a low resolution, it's really a wonderfull AV.

[Goz]

tommy strikes again!!  his patented giants calling card left behind, scarring my screen

Tommy posted in this thread? hmm that ignore feature really works. 

[tommy]

I hold no grudge against you goz, you stupid basterd. 

Somebody translate this to him in a nice way for me. 

[Zakk]

:Whew: I thought that was a picture of Drew's fried kidneys, complete with green kidney stones!!

[Zakk]

Goz, tommy sends his love...er...well I think that's what he sends... I'm not a good translator.

[DrewKaree]

Goz, tommy sends his love...er...well I think that's what he sends... I'm not a good translator.

Dude, I'd never pass along tommy's love!  If I were you, I'd take the day off tomorrow and go see the free doctor to get some antibiotics to clear up the inevitable infection you're bound to have!

* DrewKaree can't believe Zakk took tommy's love to pass on.

Zakk, show your secretary this pic to let her know my opinion of you is quickly changing.

*edit*
nevermind.  I thought I'd take care of it myself since you obviously don't know how to finagle her pictures from her properly.  You suck at that

[Goz]

Drew.... that pic will make Tommy jealous

[DrewKaree]

Drew.... that pic will make Tommy jealous

Take a closer look.  I think you just missed it the first time

[Goz]

AH... now I see. This will be a change for Tommy. I've heard about him with sheep; but didnt know he was in fact the sheep getting it.  Somehow it all makes sense now.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

Someone please explain to me why the eff my BACK hurts because of kidney stones.  I mean, seriously....it's not bad enough the BIG symptom?  Are my back muscles somehow working overtime without me knowing it to work these things out?

Bones, it's keeping me awake.  I can't find a comfortable position for ANYTHING, much less sleep.  What've you got going on since I'm up?

Uh...Kidney's are near your back.

So...you've got stones, eh? Muhahahaha! Karl Rove just got over them a couple of weeks ago...looks like my voodoo dolls are paying off!

mrC

[mr.Curmudgeon]

Someone please explain to me why the eff my BACK hurts because of kidney stones.  I mean, seriously....it's not bad enough the BIG symptom?  Are my back muscles somehow working overtime without me knowing it to work these things out?

Seriously though, if you've really got stones passing through...drink more water than you ever have in your life. It'll drive them out faster, which is what you want. Even though you may be trying to avoid the last part of the journey, the longer they're in, the more you suffer. If you can stand it, drink cranberry juice as well, helps avoid urinary tract infections - which are common following their passage, as the stone is going to tear through your pee-pee hat!

Pssssssssst......pss.........sssss...........................*PLUNK*

I've have a couple. Worst pain in my life.


mrC

[tommy]

I've dressed as a woman for the last 3 or so years for Halloween and gone to work.

[DrewKaree]

I've dressed as a woman for the last 3 or so years

Nice to know, tommy.  That explains a lot, but doesn't really change anything about you that we already thought.  Good luck with that though.

[ChadTower]

I usually get FRESH peas from her mom.

Fresh peas in a steamer

Nothing else needed, cuz DADDY LIKE!

[Bones]

I have never heard of this tea/kidney stone relationship. I have been drinking literally 20 cups of green tea a day for at least the last three years.....

[Havok]

I have never heard of this tea/kidney stone relationship. I have been drinking literally 20 cups of green tea a day for at least the last three years.....

That's crap! Tea is good for you. Avoid soda and salt! (Lots of sodium in soda)...

[Stingray]

Pssssssssst......pss.........sssss...........................*PLUNK*

Did everybody else cringe when they read this?

-S

[ChadTower]

No, because that's the sound of every post he makes.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

Pssssssssst......pss.........sssss...........................*PLUNK*

Did everybody else cringe when they read this?

-S

No, because that's the sound of every post he makes.

Chad is confused, because you have to have a pen!s to get the joke in the first place.   


mrC
EDIT: Damn, auto-censor.

[ChadTower]

After that joke, everyone is confused.

[Sephroth57]

PWNED!

[ChadTower]

BTW, I do have a penis.  When not in use, I store it in Seph's mom.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

I have never heard of this tea/kidney stone relationship. I have been drinking literally 20 cups of green tea a day for at least the last three years.....

That's crap! Tea is good for you. Avoid soda and salt! (Lots of sodium in soda)...

My understanding is that teas, etc...have a lot of caffeine. Caffeine dehydrates your body. The most common type of stone is composed of calcium. If you are not taking in enough water (2 liters a day), and instead, are drinking buku amounts of caffeine, you are essentially just asking for a calcium build-up in your kindneys. Once a deposit (of any size really) dislodges from the kidney wall, it begins to travel and you're in for a world of hurt.

Solution = DRINK WATER before, during and after a stone.

There are several other types of stones, but people who are prone to those are S.O.L. Their bodies are making them on their own, and I don't believe they can treat it.

mrC

[Stingray]

Interesting that it's okay to say dick, but not pen!s. I guess we couldn't talk about Penis Cheney otherwise.

-S

[ChadTower]

By Mr C's desc, the solution isn't to drink water during moving the stone.  The solution is to drink water regularly so that you don't get a stone in the first place.

When the solution is DRINK WATER... that's pretty damn easy.

[Sephroth57]

yeah when im old ill have to remember that drink water thing

[ChadTower]

Everybody must get stoned.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

I had 'em about 3 years ago and none since.  I feel like puking several times during the day.  It didn't happen last time, so is that normal too? 

Yes. Quite normal. Larger stones may induce puking because the pain is greater. I puked with mine. 4 days, no health insurance...so no prescription pain killers either. I felt like a Navy Seal afterward.

Of all the stupid things in the world to pack-rat away, I've got that effing seive they give you

As odd and gross as it is, CAPTURE THE DAMN THING. They can analyze the stone and help you figure out how to avoid them in the future, by possibly adjusting your diet.

One last thing, though, just to pass along this bit of cheerful info, once you've had a stone you're 50% more likely than the average person to experience another! So, just like myself, you're probably going to get them throughout your life. You can cut the percentages down by making sure you consume, once again, lots of water.

mrC

[mr.Curmudgeon]

yeah when im old ill have to remember that drink water thing

I got my first kidney stone on my 21st birthday! Sucker.   


mrC

[Sephroth57]

i think this is all a marketing ploy to buy more bottled water

[ChadTower]

I think people spending $1 on 20oz of water because of the clear bottle is a marketing ploy.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

By Mr C's desc, the solution isn't to drink water during moving the stone.  The solution is to drink water regularly so that you don't get a stone in the first place.

When the solution is DRINK WATER... that's pretty damn easy.

No, sorry it may not have been clear...but it's BOTH actually. DEFINITELY drink ENORMOUS amounts of water while the stone is passing through. It'll push it through faster, and ease the pain since the ureter, and urethra will expand with more water.

If you had to pass a jagged stone through your body, would you want it to skate along on a trickle, or float along on a torrent?

WATER, WATER, WATER....it *is* an easy solution, it's easy prevention, and it's easy treatment. Don't forget to add Cranberry juice during the passage, again, to help prevent urinary tract infections. Those can hurt, just about as bad as a stone, and they'll last a week.




mrC

[Sephroth57]

so what do you do just drink cranberry juice everytime you feel like you gotta pee and hope it comes out?

[ChadTower]

Sounds like an average night out at the bar anyway.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

No. It's just important to get it in your system. Especially immediately after passing the stone.

Acid in the cranberry juice neutralizes the bacteria than can cause infections in the small cuts made by the stones passing. They help cleanse the kidney as well.

Another thing I wanted to suggest for Drew, is, if he's in what seems like an inordinate amount of pain (hard to tell, since the whole process is excruciating), he may want to go get an x-ray. If it the stone is TOO BIG to pass, it can block the kidney, damaging it and/or the bladder, so they'll need to break it up with a sonic device...which, unfortunately means passing many, smaller stones. Yippeee!

There is no surgical way to remove kidney stones, unfortunately. Trust me, once you get one of these ---daisies--- you become a frickin' expert, lest you suffer from them again.

If he doesn't want to drink juice,  he can just down some of these: http://www.azoproducts.com/cranberry/cranberry.asp

Cranberries are also a great antioxidant.


mrC


EDIT: Damn it...somehow edited the post and deleted it when I meant to create a whole new post, so I had to re-write it. Sorry.

[Stingray]

If it's TOO BIG to pass, it can block the kidney, damaging it and/or the bladder, so they'll need to break it up with a sonic device...which, unfortunately means passing many, smaller stones. Yippeee!

The term "sandblaster" leaps painfully to mind.

-S

[ChadTower]

It's an uncharted asteroid belt where you were hoping Alderaan would be.

[Ed_McCarron]

My understanding is that teas, etc...have a lot of caffeine.

There is probably some truth in that, but heres the scoop:

Foods and Drinks Containing Oxalate

People prone to forming calcium oxalate stones may be asked by their doctor to cut back on certain foods if their urine contains an excess of oxalate:

    * beets
    * chocolate
    * coffee
    * cola
    * nuts
    * rhubarb
    * spinach
    * strawberries
    * tea
    * wheat bran

People should not give up or avoid eating these foods without talking to their doctor first. In most cases, these foods can be eaten in limited amounts.

There is no surgical way to remove kidney stones, unfortunately.

Percutaneous Nephrolithotomy

Sometimes a procedure called percutaneous nephrolithotomy is recommended to remove a stone. This treatment is often used when the stone is quite large or in a location that does not allow effective use of ESWL.

Percutaneous nephrolithotomy

In this procedure, the surgeon makes a tiny incision in the back and creates a tunnel directly into the kidney. Using an instrument called a nephroscope, the surgeon locates and removes the stone. For large stones, some type of energy probe (ultrasonic or electrohydraulic) may be needed to break the stone into small pieces. Generally, patients stay in the hospital for several days and may have a small tube called a nephrostomy tube left in the kidney during the healing process.

One advantage of percutaneous nephrolithotomy over ESWL is that the surgeon removes the stone fragments instead of relying on their natural passage from the kidney.



Yuck.  Shudder.  Hope mine stay small.

[mr.Curmudgeon]

Percutaneous Nephrolithotomy...This treatment is often used when the stone is quite large or in a location that does not allow effective use of ESWL.

I'd imagine that's a last ditch effort...I specifically asked my doctors for surgery (the damn thing hurt so badly)...and they said there was none. Based on your post though, I suspect they were just lying to me since it wasn't big enough, even though it was (based on the x-ray) the maximum size they were comfortable with allowing me to pass without ultrasonics.

Thanks for the info!
mrC

[ChadTower]

You said yourself you had no insurance.  That's all they considered.

[DrewKaree]

Yah, just got done from work.  The oxalate thing.  That's the tea thing, and what they surmise to be my main problem.  Like I was saying though, I dunno if it's specific to certain kinds of teas, since as shmokes points out, Earl Grey is higher than others in antioxidants, so mebbe certain teas are more oxalate-filled. 

Something I also felt like slapping my forehead and giving a big "DOH!" about today.  Since I'm all over the place and usually frequent fast-food places for lunch, the water used in your common soda fountain is normally filtered.  The chances that the filter has ever been changed since it was first installed?  Slim to none.  I remember my buddy passing on the company memo to me and asking me if I knew where the filter even was

Worry not.  There's far, far grosser things that can and do happen to your local soda fountains that you never know about and will probably cause larger problems than the semi to non-filtered water running through them. 

Fear my technicolor yawn, for I am a chunder monkey.

I like the sound of that.   

[ChadTower]

Too much tea makes it hurt when you pee.