GP-Wiz 49 with modular panels

[KenToad]

I'm using a pair of swappable panels on my cab with parallel port interfaces.  One of my panels has the 49-way Midway/Happ joysticks and the other one has super joysticks.  I have two GP-Wiz 49's.

The odd thing is that when I unplug the 49-way joystick panel from the parallel port interfaces, the joysticks default over to the up-right diagonal.  I've checked this out in the control panel.  So far, I can't figure out a way to get the default to be centered.  If you try to play a game with that mapping, it's like you're holding up/right all the time .

What this means is that I can't share joystick controls between games.  Like, for example, I would love to have it set up in my emulator that either the 49-way joys or the supers could control the games.  Instead, I either have to switch back and forth between panels or remap the joystick controls manually every time.  This sucks because I'd like to have all the eight-way games shared between the two different types of joys.

I'm thinking of emailing RandyT if he has any ideas, but I thought I'd go ahead and pitch the annoyance out here first.  Any ideas why this might be happening or how to fix it?

Cheers,
KenToad

[Kremmit]

I don't have one where I can lay my hands on it right now, but I'm betting that when a Happ 49-way is in the furthest up/right position, all of the optical sensors on the joystick are unblocked, or maybe all blocked- either way, I'll also bet that when that happens, the joystiick is sending no data to the GP49.  So when you unplug your parallel cable, the GP49 suddenly gets no data, and thinks your stick is in the up/right position.

As for a fix, try unplugging and then re-plugging the GP49s after you disconnect the parallel cable for the 49-way panel.  That should re-boot the GP49s with no stick attached.  I don't know if they will reboot in the centered position or not, but if it works, then you could rig a "reset button" inside the cp for the GP49s, just a button that would cut the power on the USB lines.  Whenever you switch panels, press the button for a second, and when you let it up, power would be restored, and the GP49s would reboot.

Alternately, you could disable analog controls in MAME whenever you pull the 49-way panel.

Or ??

[KenToad]

Thanks for the info and the tips, Kremmit.  I'll give your reset idea a test this afternoon and let you know what happened.

Cheers,
KenToad

[Lilwolf]

The other item you might want to try is to setup two mame configurations (with two mame.ini's or with two directories).  One setup with joystick support and the other without.

I do this because I have hotswap on my AKI board... and you don't get just motion to the upper left, but just the analog joystick moving all over when not connected correctly.   The biggest problem with this is you can't set any inputs in mame (you select update button 1 and it instantly takes a random analog joystick direction

[2600]

1. You could put the gpwiz in the Cp and just disconnect the USB connection instead of the Parallel Port interface.

Or

2. Make an adapter for the Gpwiz parallel interface that sets the appropiate bits high or low so that it is centered.  Probably cost you $1.


Could do what Lilwolf said, but it sounds like you don't want to do that.

[markrvp]

What inputs on the GP-Wiz 49 do you have the 8-way joysticks mapped to?  I don't have a solution, I'm just curious how you hooked this up as I may want to do something similar.

[RandyT]

I don't have one where I can lay my hands on it right now, but I'm betting that when a Happ 49-way is in the furthest up/right position, all of the optical sensors on the joystick are unblocked, or maybe all blocked- either way, I'll also bet that when that happens, the joystiick is sending no data to the GP49.  So when you unplug your parallel cable, the GP49 suddenly gets no data, and thinks your stick is in the up/right position.

Good call.  This is exactly what is happening here.

I'd also like to comment that this probably isn't the best approach for the swap.  Swapping at the USB port is much safer.

Remember the old warnings on video game systems about swapping games with the power on?  The electronic joysticks like the 49-way, P360, Suzo Inductive, etc, all use a real electronic controller to generate the on/off or binary data expected by the interfaces.  A sudden surge caused by disconnecting or connecting the data and power lines in a random fashion (which is what happens when using a connector like a card edge or db-25) could cause damage to the interface or the driver circuit of the stick.

If you must do this, I recommend an extra switch to disconnect the power to the interface and stick before disconnecting the data lines.

RandyT

[SirPoonga]

I'd also like to comment that this probably isn't the best approach for the swap.  Swapping at the USB port is much safer.

If the gpwiz was in the cp and plugged into a usb hub in the cp then unplug the usb before dealing with the 49way.  But if the encoder is located in the cabinet and plugged into the PC directly then it won't be easy which defeats the purpose of modular controls.

I'd do what Randy said, create an on off switch.  In fact, create a power rail/plugs with a master switch.  That way anything that requires power can get it, say if you have perfect 360 and 49way joys, along with a lit tball and buttons, etc...

If you did some ingenious engineering you could have it automatically switch on and off when inserting the module...

however, isn't switching or plugging the USB cable going to have the same effect as using the parallel port interfaces?  You still turn on and off the power in a surge?

[markrvp]

however, isn't switching or plugging the USB cable going to have the same effect as using the parallel port interfaces?

[SirPoonga]

I misread what Randy said, sorry.  He said power to interface, not joys.  Randy, that possible since I take it you get power from usb.  Do you have a way to add a switch for power on the board?

[RandyT]

however, isn't switching or plugging the USB cable going to have the same effect as using the parallel port interfaces?  You still turn on and off the power in a surge?

No.  The power is handled in a controlled manner at the USB port through the use of different length fingers inside the connectors, as well as components that are responsible for ramping power and absorbing small spikes.  The circuits for the electronic joysticks probably weren't designed for this type of activity, considering their intended use.

Do you have a way to add a switch for power on the board?

The best thing to do in this case is to use a hub to get the USB plugs where you can reach them easily and pull them when necessary.  This is one fo those things that will only be an issue for a very small group of people, seeing as the intent of the GP-Wiz49 setup was to prevent one from needing to do these types of things.  Doesn't really make sense to overcomplicate the solution by redesigning the hardware to do something that is outside the intended scope of this product.

RandyT

[SirPoonga]

The 49way in turn received it's power form the gpwiz, right?

As a hack, an ugly hack that Randy probably won't endorse or service your gpwiz afterwards, is to modify the usb port on the gpwiz with a switch on the power pin.  Randy, I wasn't suggesting you change the board, just wonder if it would be easy to hack.

Are their powered usb hubs where the power to the ports comes only from the hub, not the computer?

[Kremmit]

I just tested my USB hub- when I pull the power to the hub, all the devices plugged into it un-install from windows, and re-install when I power the hub back up.  So a switch on a USB hub's power line would probably be the easiest and safest way to do it.

[SirPoonga]

yes, that would be easiest, simple, and safe.  Just make sure you shrink wrap  the switch connections, wouldn't want stray live power touching anything.

[KenToad]

Wow, I'm glad I posted!  I guess I'll have to get myself a usb hub and power down these suckers every time I want to switch panels.  I'd hate to damage these precious 49-ways.  I'm assuming I could just get a regular two- or more port usb hub and plug both GP-Wiz 49's into it without any performance hit? 

I think your solution, lil Wolf, is the one I'll go for.  Not sure why I didn't think of it before.  I already have seperate emulators setup in Mamewah that utilize the same version of MAME with the same configuration in order to conveniently choose between control styles of arcade games.  I just have to make another emulator for the list with a different control configuration.

Mark, I have several buttons on the GP-Wiz 49 setup as my digital joystick controls.  This is fine for arcade games, but some emulators just assume that you're using the gamepad axes.  I'm thinking of Kega Fusion.  Not perfect, but it works for the majority of my gaming experience.

Thanks to all who've helped here.  I'll post results hopefully soon.

Cheers,
KenToad

[markrvp]

So in MAME you have Left mapped as both the left joystick axis and a button number?

If you want to spend some money I have an $80 solution . . . buy two GP-Wiz 32s and connect your 8-way panel controls to these.

[KenToad]

Hey Markrvp,

  I'm in the market for the balltop replacements.  However, I'm waiting to see how my finances shape up with the new, higher rent I'm now paying before making any "unnecessary" purchases. 

I like that $80 idea, however expensive.  I hadn't thought of it before.  I'm really considering adding a keyboard encoder before anything else.  I have a relatively slow computer that doesn't keep up the speed with keyboard emulators running during vpinball, etc.  Also, not all emulators can be controlled with a gamepad.

I guess I could just hack a keyboard, although I've never done that.  It would be primarily for escape, enter and a couple of keys for vpinball.

It looks like Floyd may have the solution to the looseness problem of your balltops.  Or was it another question?

Cheers,
KenToad

[markrvp]

It looks like Floyd may have the solution to the looseness problem of your balltops.