Anyone hacked a kidsball?

[cdbrown]

G'day,

Hoping for some examples of a hacked kidsball with usb mouse.  Unfortunately the kidsball has a serial plug and I need to change that to USB so I can run more than 1 with analog+.  Tiger-Heli and u_rebelscum provided a lot of info on another thread and it was mentioned to hack the kidsball with usb mouse.

Could someone provide me some links and preferred usb mice to use.  This could save me some money and potential problems (lag) by not having to buy the serial to usb adapters (AU$50 each).

Again thanks for the help everyone has provided and will provide  .

Cheers
-cdbrown

[Tiger-Heli]

1-Up mentions here that he hacked one (happens to be the thread above yours when I posted this):  http://www.arcadecontrols.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=main;action=display;num=1025502116

As far as which mouse to use, I saw a post by Oscar (to Sir Poonga, IIRC) saying it took him a while to find a USB mouse that worked well for his spinners.  You could ask him or Nathan Strum www.cheeptech.com should also be able to help on selection.

[1UP]

I think there are serial to ps2 adapters, and chances are your comp has a PS2 mouse port.  These would be much cheaper than the USB adapters, probably worth not having to spend a Saturday hacking a mouse to death!  (BTW, I don't know about you, but a Saturday afternoon is worth more than $50 to me!   )

My kidsball hack only involves mounting it in a new case, not hacking the interface.  I only need one mouse, so I'll stick with serial.  In the rare case I would ever play 2-player Marble Madness, the other guy can use a stick...

[cdbrown]

1UP - I was going for the usb connection on the advice from u_rebelscum.  If mame runs with 2 trackballs using ps2 connections then thats the way to go.  u_rebelscum only mentioned that analog+ works through noting the differences between the usb ports.  Yes Saturdays are important but I figured that I'm going to be spending my Saturdays designing and building a cab I might as well do some hacking (if I can work out what to do   )

Tiger-Heli - thanks for trying to point me in the right direction.  I have shot Nathan a quick email with some questions.

Any more help would be great  

Cheers
-cdbrown

[u_rebelscum]

1UP - I was going for the usb connection on the advice from u_rebelscum.  If mame runs with 2 trackballs using ps2 connections then thats the way to go.  u_rebelscum only mentioned that analog+ works through noting the differences between the usb ports.[snip]

Any more help would be great  

Cheers
-cdbrown

You can only play as one player with two ps/2 trackballs.  Two reasons why:
All windows OSs combine all ps/2 mice into one virtual mouse, or the "system mouse".  Mame can only see that one sysmouse, and not both ps/2 mice as individuals.
Almost all PC computers only have one ps/2 port, so that means you need a ps/2 Y-splitter cable.  Almost all of these cables fool windows to think that only one mouse is attatched to that port, and even windows can't tell which mouse is generating what data.

Since you want to use two trackballs, I suggest hacking USB mice and using analog+ and win98/Me, or using a serial & a ps/2 mouse and dmame (dos mame) and optimouse driver and dos.  I my

[Tiger-Heli]

Hi CdBrown,

Urebelscum gave me a simple primer on dmame and optimouse yesterday.

[cdbrown]

Hi Tiger-Heli and U_rebelscum,

You guys are champions  .  Thanks for all your input from this thread and the previous thread.  

I didn't realise that dmame would work under win98 so that's why I was fixed on analog+ and hacking to usb.  But if it does work then I will go for the two serial ports which is going to be far easier (and cheaper).  Having the second k/ball unplugged during boot up is a small inconvenience but I think I will survive.

Just downloaded dmame and optimous.zip.  Now i just have to install win98 on a spare drive and try it all out - oh and buy the kidsball(s) (I wish they weren't called that ).  May not happen for a little while but I'll let you know how it all goes.

Thanks again for all the input.  

Cheers
-cbrown

[1UP]

BTW, I was not suggesting to use 2 PS2 mice (dunno where you got that idea) but to use one as serial, and one as PS2 with a PS2->serial adapter.  Hope that clears things up.

[Rocky]

cdbrown,

I too am very interested in having 2 trackballs for one of my cp's. I found a great deal on USB mice from Surplus Computers.  They are selling Matel Barbie mice with the barbie logo sanded off for $.99 each. I picked up 8 (since I hadn't hacked a mouse before). I was able to hack a 2 1/4" Wico trackball to it with no problem. I just aquired a couple of used 3" Happs trackballs that I'm going to try and get working as well.  If you are still interested in USB,  here's the link

http://www.softwareandstuff.com/h_acc_sflexmse.html


good luck and enjoy 2 player Marble Madness

Rocky

[cdbrown]

Rocky,

Any chance of a write-up on the hack.

You guys is USA get some really good prices for your gear, unfortunately the market in Australia is small and we don't get the special deals.  So for the time being I think I will just stick with the two serials and dmame until something really cheap and easy comes along.

Cheers
-cdbrown

[Rocky]

cdbrown,

There are several sites that document mouse hacks. (links on this site)  That's how I learned how to attempt it.

The basics are:
1. desoldering the existing mouse optics
2. soldering wires into the place where the optics came out of
3. connect those wire to the proper pins on the trackball optics.

Basically, there are 6 pins (plus buttons if you want them): 5v, ground, 2 signals for the x-axis, 2 signals for the y-axis.

If the trackball works backwards, switch the 2 signal wires for the appropriate axis.

I used a multi-meter (plus looking at the traces) to figure out where to get a 5v source and a ground. The signals come from 2 of the 3 pins of the optic receiver.  On mine it was the 2 outer pins.

I learned to de-solder during my hack Since the mice were only a buck each, I figured, dive in and see what I could do.

Anyway,  if you can get dmame to work you should be able to play 2 player trackball games anyway.


Rocky

[cdbrown]

Thanks for the tips Rocky.

I have made the my first purchase for the cab
2 x genius kidsball AUS$53.00 each.  Well I guess I had better do some designing and work out what I want and where on each of the control panels.

I have some questions regarding the buttons that come with the kidsball - I'm planning on using the Happs horizontal buttons so is it a matter of removing the old butttons from the case and extending the wires out to the panel mounted microswitch buttons?

Should these buttons also be connected to the ipac as well or will this cause conflict??

Cheers
-cdbrown

[1UP]

I don't see why you would need to connect the mouse buttons thru the Ipac--the mouse is providing the necessary interface!  You'd definitely get problems with that.  Just run two wires from each of your pushbuttons to the solder points for each microswitch on the Kidsball PCBs.  Doesn't matter which wires go where as long as the buttons are wired separately.  This is exactly what I'm doing.

[1UP]

BTW, I meant it doesn't matter which contacts are wired from COM or NO from the Happ buttons to the PCB.  You still need to use COM and NO on your pushbuttons (not NC), the polarity just doesn't matter.  You know what I mean...    Me sleep now...

[cdbrown]

Cheers 1up thanks for the tip.  I'll have to remember this when I have all the parts for trial panels.

Cheers
-cdbrown

[1UP]

Cheers 1up thanks for the tip.

[jcterzin]

i have. long time ago. back in 2001