Translucent Microswitch Buttons*Taking Pre-Orders*

[pointdablame]

Why not throw on a small dab of matte medium under the button?  It is a gel, so you can put a nice thin coat on it.  It'll harden, and should never "heal" itself.

I've used it for a lot of things, including "waves" on a train layout I have and the wave peaks have been standing up for 5 years now with no problems.

It's translucent, buy varying thickness of the application should alter the light.  Once I get my order in (I'm dead broke ) I'll give it a try.

[AmericanDemon]

I'm going into work tonight and I will sandblast a button to get a "frosted" look.  I agree if you look straight down into the button, it is very bright.  I will post pics tomorrow in the AM EST.

How'd the sandblasting work?

[Elfman]

I can't believe I am reading this 

I remember when Shawnzilla got his first blue prototype in, you guys were saying it didn't really look clear and was too hazy for your tastes.

Now you are saying they are too clear and need to be hazed up a bit? 

You guys are a fickle bunch indeed. 
 

[tetsujin]

I remember when Shawnzilla got his first blue prototype in, you guys were saying it didn't really look clear and was too hazy for your tastes.

Now you are saying they are too clear and need to be hazed up a bit? 

You can take a clear button and make it hazy.  You cannot take a hazy button and make it clear...

[Chris]

Tried this a week or so ago.

[thetered]

Tried this a week or so ago.

[gl.tter]

I could be wrong, but I really dont think you'll find brightness to be an issue after you do those two things, however, I could be wrong as I have not yet tried the clear ones, only the colored ones.

Right, diffusing the LED reduces the brightness as the same amount of light is now spread over a wider area.  That's why the brightest LEDs usually have a very tight beam - you can often find the exact same LED with wider angles at lower mcd ratings.

If it's better to diffuse the LED with the clears, you might aswell purchase the wider angle ones.

[Kremmit]

A quick spray on the inside with some of that "window frosting" paint might do the trick...

That's what I suggested back on page 3.

Pay attention in class, Raymond! 

[Chris]

I could be wrong, but I really dont think you'll find brightness to be an issue after you do those two things, however, I could be wrong as I have not yet tried the clear ones, only the colored ones.

I suspect this is going to vary from button to button.  I suspect that the green buttons are going to take a lot more light than the clear buttons, for example, so I'll probably tailor my resistor values to the buttons they're going to light .

[Heffaklumpen]

Thanks shawnzilla - I received my 30 buttons today!
They look awesome!
Now if could only find some time to actually but them in my cabinets and try them out... 

[AlanS17]

Anybody tried lighting these things up with mini bulbs? It sure sounds easier if it'll work.

Also, are the nuts black or white? (I'm guessing black)

[MrTroy]

The Nuts are black

[Chris]

Anybody tried lighting these things up with mini bulbs? It sure sounds easier if it'll work.

Heat buildup would be an issue, I think.

[shawnzilla]

The Nuts are black

Hey,

I've noticed that on some of the buttons it takes a little more force to screw in the nuts (but it's easier after you get it done once). Probably an artifact of the molding process (and I think the greens are a little thicker).

[Elfman]

The Nuts are black

Hey,

I've noticed that on some of the buttons it takes a little more force to screw in the nuts (but it's easier after you get it done once). Probably an artifact of the molding process (and I think the greens are a little thicker).

I think you are right about the molding process and the various colors.  I think this exists with the regular opaque Happ buttons as well.  My whites and blacks screw on fairly easily, but my purple and blues are a little tougher  to 'get started' so to speak.

[AlanS17]

Anybody tried lighting these things up with mini bulbs? It sure sounds easier if it'll work.

Heat buildup would be an issue, I think.

Well I'm not talking about shoving a mini bulb up into the assembly. I just mean like mounting mini blubs to the underside of the CP between buttons.

[quarterback]

If you've got colored buttons, you could get some cheap cold-cathode tubes and run them underneath all the buttons at once.  They've got them for cars so they should be able to run off the 12v of your PC.

Or, if you have clear buttons, I think they make color changing tubes as well (or maybe those are actually leds)

[AlanS17]

See, if that would work I think it would be infinitely easier than wiring up each button. I'm a bum.

[quarterback]

Yeah, since there are switches on the bottom of each button and the lights wouldn't be INSIDE the button (like with the individual LED lighting), you might have to run the tubes in between the buttons (depending on your button layout) but it seems possible.   

I don't know, stick a household lightbulb under your CP and see what lights up.  If a unidriectional household bulb gives you something, it seems like a couple cold cathodes would do the trick.

[thetered]

I fashioned a little tray out of metal and built a fire pit under the control panel, it gives the buttons a really cool flickery effect and when the fire starts to die I just feed some more twigs through a special hole in the side of the panel.



As far as "external" lights (which I haven't tried, only theorizing here) go, I think the width of the panel material will play a big part, me for instance I'm using 3/4" plywood, and on top of that you have the black (opaque) nut, which leaves roughly a little over 1/4" of thread showing. On top of that you have a huge light blocking switch with high thick plastic mounting pieces for the switch.  So unless you are talking million candle power bulbs here I dont think there is enough (Translucent) plastic to effectively "carry" the light.

Prove me wrong though!

[CJK]

My buttons arrived today, and they're great! I only ordered red, blue, and clear, but now I wish I'd ordered some of the other colors as well. I can't wait to try them out -- but I'm waiting for someone to figure out the perfect way to light them up first.   

-- Chris

[Chris]

I remember when Shawnzilla got his first blue prototype in, you guys were saying it didn't really look clear and was too hazy for your tastes.

Now you are saying they are too clear and need to be hazed up a bit?

[shawnzilla]

I remember when Shawnzilla got his first blue prototype in, you guys were saying it didn't really look clear and was too hazy for your tastes.

Now you are saying they are too clear and need to be hazed up a bit? 

Well, I'm on record as preferring the original version, precisely for this reason. 

When it came down to these, I had to make a choice. The majority seemed to prefer the clearer ones. If there was ever enough demand I'd order the murkier ones.

[gl.tter]

Shawn, what's the status on the clear backorders?  How many do you have now?

[Chris]

When it came down to these, I had to make a choice. The majority seemed to prefer the clearer ones. If there was ever enough demand I'd order the murkier ones.

Weren't the clearer ones also cheaper because they didn't have to mix different plastics?

Although I would have preferred the murkier ones, I'm VERY happy with these.  As noted, you can make clear ones murky but you can't make murky ones clear...

--Chris

[shawnzilla]

When it came down to these, I had to make a choice. The majority seemed to prefer the clearer ones. If there was ever enough demand I'd order the murkier ones.

Weren't the clearer ones also cheaper because they didn't have to mix different plastics?

Although I would have preferred the murkier ones, I'm VERY happy with these.

[AlanS17]

If someone wants to send me a couple spare translucent buttons, I'll test out lighting them with mini bulbs and cold cathodes. I just don't want to spend $10 on testing something when I'm not even sure if I'll be using them even if it does work.

[Xiaou2]

 Well, heres the deal...

   The brighter the lightsource, the darker the colors have to be to hide 
the light from the center.   

  However, that means that when the light is off - or its daytime, the colors will look sorta ugly and too dark.

 Wico leaf translucents used bulb lighting (on the outside of the button).  They were not so much dayglow - but you could see them lit in dim lighting.   They also had a center support structure under the pulnger face, which helped to avoid direct light blast thru it. 

  If something simular was added, it may help greatly. 

 Still, many Leds are too bright.  While this may be nice for an overall effect... the plunger area will always be too bright.  Unless you can find a way to dim the leds, or a dimmer led.. ect.

 One of my ideas was flourescent lighting, because its cheap and cold.  However, if the buttons are too dark - which they kinda seem to be, the light may not be bright enough unless you use the very brightest of those type of bulbs (simulated 200watt bulb - which at that level of power becomes hot to the touch, but still not too bad).   Light may also leak thru slight holes in you cab elsewhere : )  heh
 
 Another idea to try, is to put the led or a few, arround the outside of the button.  This may cause a very good illumination, without the plunger getting blasted.

  Another:  Try cutting a small disc from that simi clear cutting board material and popping it inside the plunger. 

 Heck, even if the inner plunger was blacked out, id bet the light would still travel thru the plastic itself and into the top pertty well.  However, black may not be the nicest thing to look at when daytime.

 

[Chris]

Heck, even if the inner plunger was blacked out, id bet the light would still travel thru the plastic itself and into the top pertty well.

[Kremmit]

If your LEDs are too bright, why not just stop ordering the superbright 10million mcd LED's?

[Chris]

If your LEDs are too bright, why not just stop ordering the superbright 10million mcd LED's?

I tried them with standard LED's, but you have the same issues, only dimmer.  Wide-angle LEDs would probably be the best, but it doesn't solve the problem of the plungers being so clear that you can easily see the LED.

[RandyT]

If your LEDs are too bright, why not just stop ordering the superbright 10million mcd LED's?

When illuminating something that one expects to be visible in normal lighting, more light is going to be better.  The real issue is controlling the light to make it do what you want.  That is a challenge with these buttons due to the crystal clear lense-like property of the plunger and surrounding features.

Blackening out the plunger will not only look bad, but it won't do what is required.  I completely destroyed two of these a couple of weeks back trying different things, including paints, frosted coatings and solvents.  I didn't try everything, but had poor success pretty much overall.  The acetone trick looked fantastic, until the plastic healed and started to go gummy. 

I'm not saying that there isn't a solution, but I don't think dimmer LEDs are going to be it.

RandyT

[Chris]

Blackening out the plunger will not only look bad, but it won't do what is required.

[RayB]

Sounds like this board is full of perfectionists...

[tetsujin]

The acetone trick looked fantastic, until the plastic healed and started to go gummy.

I still want to experiment with acetone...  Your results are certainly discouraging but I'm eager to see for myself I guess.  Could you provide more details about what exactly you did and how long it took the button to revert?  Things like, did you use straight hardware-store acetone, how long was it applied, etc...

[Chris]

Sounds like this board is full of perfectionists...

Yes.

[thetered]

Sounds like this board is full of perfectionists...

I agree, but hey atleast they are doing the hard part for the rest of us   

But after hearing all this, I'm glad I decided to just go with the color buttons, cause I didn't have any of these problems.


Oh ya and I think ANY kind of colored paint on top or bottom of a clear button will do two things, one look ugly and two defeat the purpose of buying clear buttons....

[gl.tter]

Haven't got my clears (waiting on the 2nd order), but how about cutting out a disc of inkjet printer backlight film and gluing that under the plunger with clear glue?

Never used it myself, but the film is white-ish but translucent enough to allow the light through.

[RandyT]

You had no luck with frosted coatings?  Were you trying them on the inside of the plunger?

I tried some Krylon "frosted glass" paint.  It was a little old, but I think it was still good.  Almost impossible to apply it properly in the small area there is to work in.

General comment on the frosted materials:  Most require special application methods that aren't possible to adhere to when working on the inside of the plunger.

The other challenge is making a coating look uniform.  Unlit, it is usually fine.  Light it up and it looks bad.

Acetone:  First tried nail polish remover (don't tell the boss! )  Dumped it in, swished it around for about 5 seconds with a cotton swab,  then dumped it out.  Looked great, even better when lit.  5-minutes later, it was mostly clear again and a little sticky.  Then tried hardware store acetone and started seeing really weird sub-surface "inclusions" in the plastic, manifesting itself as a solid white mass.  In other words, something bad was happening to the structure of the plastic itself, beyond what was happening at the surface.  Shortly afterwards, the legs of the plunger became weak and broke off.

The disc idea might work (I actually suggested that in an earlier thread), but it might be difficult to cut the discs perfectly.  The springs might wreak havoc on the material as well, unless it's fairly durable.

I'm sure there's a solution, but I've spent about $30 to date on different things to try without finding one, so I'm giving it rest for a bit (at least until I have an epiphany )

RandyT

[gl.tter]

The disc idea might work (I actually suggested that in an earlier thread), but it might be difficult to cut the discs perfectly.