2005 BYOAC Tokens: General dicsussion.

[spllbnd2]

I would have to agree with Miner Al and keep the non-dated side and change the back (?) side.

[DrewKaree]

You'd be surprised how quickly that many tokens takes to disappear....on the one hand, it bugs me, but on the other hand, I'm kinda proud I've got something someone would want to steal

[Santoro]

Just as a curiousity, wouldn't it be possible to reuse the front, non-dated part of last year's BYOAC token? I know that would save the cost of remaking that one, bringing down the price of additional tokens. Also, every release I've gotten a nickel and brass mix. I personally like the contrast.

It would definitely be possible,though I doubt the voting would show that as a favorite option.  I will include last year's designs in the voting as well to see how they fare.

Dave: How much money are you out on the MAME tokens? Did you still come out ahead, even with what is left?

On the contrary, I have done pretty well on the MAME tokens.  By no stretch of the imagination am I getting rich on this stuff, but I have covered my costs and then a little.

[Chris]

Santoro,

Have you checked to see if a run of 10000 brass tokens could include 8000 of the new tokens plus 1000 each of the MAME and 2004 BYOAC tokens?

[RayB]

Santoro, I think your proposed steps is the way to go...

A design thread needs to start up ASAP though (as you can see, since most of us can't resist thinking up ideas RIGHT NOW).

Here's mine: Zenny coins! I want a picture of the store clerk from Black Tiger. And the phrase "1 Zenny".

[Santoro]

Here is a modified version of Drew's proposal:

1)

[Chris]

#3 should be expanded to "No references to ANY trademarked properties", including all existing games and movies.  The reasons we scrapped Pac-Man from the token last year still exist this year.

[Santoro]

Santoro,

Have you checked to see if a run of 10000 brass tokens could include 8000 of the new tokens plus 1000 each of the MAME and 2004 BYOAC tokens?

[Santoro]

#3 should be expanded to "No references to ANY trademarked properties", including all existing games and movies. The reasons we scrapped Pac-Man from the token last year still exist this year.

Good point, changed #1 to cover this.

[Chris]

Santoro,

Have you checked to see if a run of 10000 brass tokens could include 8000 of the new tokens plus 1000 each of the MAME and 2004 BYOAC tokens?

[Santoro]

OK, I see your point.  I'd consider it if we were having issues getting enough buyers for the new tokens.  I will ask this week so that we know if it is even an option.

[tetsujin]

It's great to see the possibility of a new run of tokens!

For continuity it might be nice (as some have mentioned) to have one side be the same as last year's BYOAC tokens.  I'd like the "continuity".  I could see the Atari guy staying and the atom being replaced with the monkey guy (assuming it's not too similar to old Donkey Kong art...) but otherwise I think the atom logo is the side to keep.

Low-res pixel art might be fun for one of the token sides, too - we could come up with something original but reminiscient of Space Invaders or some other old shooter.

Anyway, I know this kind of statement doesn't mean much until money is put down, but I'd take at least 500 of the new tokens if I like the final design.  (As for the 2004 design, I already know I like that design, so I'd take more of those if you made more.)

Finally, I'd like to suggest that for the new design, we not use "Game not over" or related variations...  I never really liked that slogan anyway.

[Timstuff]

I think that a good token image would be a picture of Pac-Man with his mouth open. It'd be just the right shape for a coin, too.

[Chris]

I think that a good token image would be a picture of Pac-Man with his mouth open. It'd be just the right shape for a coin, too.

That was one of the designs last year, but Saint nixed it, as Namco is particularly litigous. 

[GGKoul]

I can't believed I missed out on the past runs.  I'm in for whatever type of coins you produce.  As I have 5 machines now and forcing people to use BYOAC coins would be a nice touch.

I think we should do a play on Chuck e'Cheese coins.
http://users.pullman.com/fjstevens/tokens/cec/CECdesigns.html

[Chris]

I can't believed I missed out on the past runs.

[Santoro]

I think that a good token image would be a picture of Pac-Man with his mouth open. It'd be just the right shape for a coin, too.

That was one of the designs last year, but Saint nixed it, as Namco is particularly litigous.

In fairness I was reluctantly in favor of nixing it too.

[GGKoul]

[Are you thinking of mimicing the "old-tyme" penny-arcade feel as opposed to the very modern feel we had in the previous ones?

Yeppers!!  We all remember running around an arcade with these old style tokens in hand.

[Santoro]

For those that want to be involved this year and were not around last year, I suggest reading the thread from last year:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,19172.0.html

I know it is really long, but it is very interesting and will help us learn from our past experiences without having all the same conversations we had last year.   

Dave

[DrewKaree]

No offense intended to anyone, as I feel the exact same about it, but constantly reading the "I'd be in for X amount depending on the design" is WAY tiresome to read.  I mean, NATURALLY we aren't gonna be inclined to buy something we think looks like ass, and heck, some of us won't buy it for some pedantic reason, but to generalize like that isn't particularly helpful nor, in the end, will it really matter.  The design will be that which Dave will feel assured he can sell the most of.

This, coming from someone who DOES share that sentiment

[Pixelhugger]

Hehe... I forgot how fun it was to follow a thread that updated faster than I could type in a response.

I really like the idea of the "design submissions only" thread, separate from the discussion thread. Great idea.

One thing I felt badly about last year was the "inequity of bling." In retrospect I don't think it was fair to all the designs to have some blinged and some not. I would suggest black and white submissions only. This forces the voting to be based solely on the quality of the design and not on the quality (or lack thereof) of bling. Any design that looks good in B+W will look good blinged, and I don't think anyone should have their design sidelined because it doesn't have the same level of metal like realism as someone elses... Now that we know what the tokens look like and how well details resolve I think we should focus on black and white submissions only. If it comes down to deciding on the old "to stipple or not to stipple" issue for the final contenders, we could easily add identical bling the last few to be voted on. Just my 2 cents.

Regarding the rerunning of last years on one side, I vote for something entirely new. If anyone is interested in the old BYOAC/Mame designs, we could easily put together a special "limited edition" at cost, since there are no die fees. I've been thinking for some time about a BYOAC/MAME Hybrid like what Chris suggested, so even if the polling indicates no rerun of last years, those who missed out could still get some.

[tetsujin]

No offense intended to anyone, as I feel the exact same about it, but constantly reading the "I'd be in for X amount depending on the design" is WAY tiresome to read.

True, and I can understand there's little need for any post that can be summarized as "me too"...  But public interest is a factor in whether these get made.  I think there's a little value in indicating that the interest is there - at least if the speaker is serious about wanting to buy some tokens.  Those interested will get some say in the design, too (though I think it's good that the final decisions are being more tightly controlled this time.)

On the other hand, maybe it's not necessary at this point.  I don't know.  But I'm excited!  So I post anyway. 

[Timoe]

hehe, I wanna buy some

[DrewKaree]

I don't wanna see no friggen stipple, just like the new quarters.  Just design, all bright and shiny....something I can flash in front of Zakk's eyes and mesmerize him and lure him into shaving that dumb bushy mustache buying me a Ferrarri too!


Oh for Pete's sake, START THE DESIGN AND IDEA THREADS ALREADY WOULDJA?

[phildo77]

Oh for Pete's sake, START THE DESIGN AND IDEA THREADS ALREADY WOULDJA?

Yeah!  I'm down!  I'll be buying a bunch.

So lets get it rollin'!

[RayB]

True, and I can understand there's little need for any post that can be summarized as "me too"...

[Santoro]

Me too.  I hate 'me too' posts.

I will post the design threads tonight.

[DreamWeb]

This is a bit off-topic so flame away if you must... but...

I know there are a lot of Canadian BYOAC'ers that would love to get some coinage... but, hate the fact that they're considered International purchasers.  It only costs minimally more to ship to Canada than it does within the U.S...   So, hopefully we can figure something out for the Canucks other than just grouping us along with Europe?

d.

[DarkKobold]

Please make sure during voting for Brass or Nickel, you leave open an option, "I really only want Brass and Nickel" I really can't see myself waiting my collection of tokens with one over the other.

I'm still curious how many MAME tokens are left.

[saint]

I vote for nickel with an all new design, and I'll be buying no matter what they look like

Uh.... Nothing from the X-Box Grid Girls thread I think.

--- saint

[Santoro]

[quote author=DreamWeb

[monkeybomb]

I think the date is very important.  There needs to be some change in the token from last year.  I really love these things and I'm in (as I have been), but I would be sad to see only the date change.

As for voting there is an alternative to 3 votes.  Why not unlimited?  This would be classified as "approval voting", where people either would or wouldn't buy a particular design if it were the winner.  Rather than a - "do you prefer" vote.  It could be a "would you buy" vote.  I would guess that this method would acctually prodce the most follow through on purchases.

[Flinkly]

monkeybomb, i think there might be too much room for eror in that kind of vote.  while most of us aren't idiots, i'm sure there are a few.

i have to jump in and say that i'm interested in 200 of the old byoac tokens in brass, if we can get a limited run done for minimal costs.  and as for this years design, i'm up for changing half of it or all of it, but keeping it the same doesn't make sense.  the prices would be lower, but it wouldn't be as cool.  most of the reason i'm getting them is to have a bunch of assorted tokens made for and by the community.

[Timstuff]

If Pac-Man on the coin would present legal challenges, then perhaps an alien from Space Invaders could be a good "heads" image for the coin? IANAL, but I don't think anyone could sue someone for having a pixelated monster on a token.

[Chris]

If Pac-Man on the coin would present legal challenges, then perhaps an alien from Space Invaders could be a good "heads" image for the coin? IANAL, but I don't think anyone could sue someone for having a pixelated monster on a token.

Not true.  Pixelhugger tried to get a T-shirt with an invader made up and their legal guys jumped all over him.  Remember, a Space Invaders/Qix dual cabinet was just re-released.

--Chris

[Pixelhugger]

Aw Chris, you beat me to it!! 

"...Thank you for your e-mail. 
We are really sorry, we cannot permit our Space Invader logo
even personal use because of the copy right. 
Thank you for your inquiring and understanding.

Sincerely yours,

Taito Corporation"

This was after inquiring with Midway and getting a personal letter from their VP of Licensing directing me to Namco.

Hehe... go figure. 

[Timstuff]

Wow, I guess there's nothing you can't copyright these days. Heck, I'll bet even the little arrow shaped spaceship from Asteroids is copywritten. :\

I guess that this means Electronic Gaming Monthly had to pay a royalty to use that little "alien" logo that they have at the end of each article. It's really strange though, considering how many knockoffs of Space Invaders there have been over the years.

[quarterback]

Here's mine: Zenny coins! I want a picture of the store clerk from Black Tiger. And the phrase "1 Zenny".

[Kev-in DFW]

I am down for 500, nickel or brass, ugly or cool, date or no date.... just send me a bill!

[Santoro]

Nickel MAME tokens are still available.  Use the link in my sig.