How bad is my CP layout??

[oldsage]

OK, so I'm starting a showcase cab (based roughly on jakobud's dimensions), and i wanted to have my plans as precise as possible before i start work, and that includes my CP layout... So here it is, with, and without the intended CPO art... Be mean, i need every kind of feedback i can get...

BTW, joysticks are two T-Stiks and an E-Stik, the orange buttons on top are credit 1 and 2, and the green buttons are pause, red buttons are exit...

But seriously, be MEAN...

[AmericanDemon]

You have so much space on a Showcase CP.  Space out the two players.  They are definitely too close.  As for everything else.  I'll look more into it, but the spacing is what hit me immediately. 

[tommy]

I agree the spacing is too close on the 1 and 2 player controles , but he cant spread them apart more with out moving them up, that might not be a good idea.

[oldsage]

I agree the spacing is too close on the 1 and 2 player controles , but he cant spread them apart more with out moving them up, that might not be a good idea.

That's exactly what i thought... I hate those CPs where you need to bend over to access the main set of controls...
Any idea how to solve that would be nice though ...

[Paul Olson]

I would flip the controls to the other side, that would give you a wider space to spread out the p1 and p2 controls.  I would also move them off the edge 1 or 2 inches, more room to rest your hands.


I really like the artwork!

Paul

PS - You're ugly and your Mama dresses you funny!!!  (I forgot to be mean  )

[Paul Olson]

Here is what I was talking about. Hopefully I interpreted your controls right.

Paul

[oldsage]

Hopefully I interpreted your controls right.

Whoops.. Was i so unclear? On your example, the trackball is a 4-way stick, the spinner is a pushbutton, and the second joy for each player is actually a second "4" button for neo-geo games... Sorry for being so unclear... Here is the same pic with some labels... Hope it's clear now...

[oldsage]

PS - You're ugly and your Mama dresses you funny!!!

[tommy]

Would that new layout mount ok, here is mine in an early stage, but i have less buttons and joys this is not a mame cab

[AmericanDemon]

Honestly, you can make any size CP you want.  Any shape or anything.  So that means that you can create a layout that will meet your needs.

Don't just rely upon a design that has already been laid out because you are afraid to break from the mold.  Make it custom to your needs.  After all it is the BYOAC way. 

[Paul Olson]

What is the 4way stick for?  The t-stick plus switches from 4/8way.  If you are using those, I don't see a reason for a seperate stick.

The extra neo geo button is usually done more like this, it is more like the originals.

     o o o
  o o o o


Paul

[TOK]

It looks pretty functional, people have different needs.

The main thing I'd change is that 7th button. If you take that from the outside center and put in on the stick side slightly below the bottom row, it can be used as the "low" 4th button for Neo Geo games and also a thumb button for Defender/Stargates reverse. It also works well for games that have twin sticks + a bomb button like Smash TV.

I'd also get all the admin buttons off the panel, but that's a thing with me. Most of them aren't even necessary, just use the MAME shortcuts for the admin stuff.
I also prefer the coin button to be near the coin door area, or at least off the panel -on the side or something.

Edit to add that pcolson and I were typing the same thing about the Neo Geo button at the same time! 

[DaveJ-UK]

I have my function buttons (pause, credit, exit, etc.) under the CP tucked out of view.

[oldsage]

What is the 4way stick for?

[oldsage]

I'd also get all the admin buttons off the panel, but that's a thing with me. Most of them aren't even necessary, just use the MAME shortcuts for the admin stuff.

I want my cab to be "dumb-visitor friendly", so i want the "exit game", "coin up", and "pause" buttons very accessible, though hard to push accidentally. Most my other admin buttons would be in the coin door, out of dumb hands reach. I'm not sure i know what are those shortcuts though, please enlighten me...

[oldsage]

Honestly, you can make any size CP you want.

[Paul Olson]

And about the neo geo button... I know that's how people do it, and aside from aesthetics, i never understood why... I mean, why would you want to change the settings in mame every time you change a game??? (kinda relates to the first thing i wrote...) This way, i just wire it up as button "4" along with the left bottom button and viola! I don't need to do anything when i change a game... (i do agree it doesn't look that good though...)

You can set up the controls for each game seperately in MAME.  You would still wire it to button 4, then change the mapping of the neo geo games in MAME.  If 1=h, 2=j, 3=k, 4=l, then you would remap the neo geo games to l, h, j, k.  It's a little more work to set up in the beginning, but I think it would be worth it.  You definately don't have to reconfigure it everytime you want to play a neo geo game.  In the end, I think the asthetics are more important, we are all trying to recreate the arcade experience as close as possible. 

Do it however works best for you.  You asked for opinions, and that is all you are getting.   


The 4way makes sense now, I was thinking you were using the T-stick plus, which switches between 4/8 way from the handle.

Paul

[oldsage]

And about the neo geo button... I know that's how people do it, and aside from aesthetics, i never understood why... I mean, why would you want to change the settings in mame every time you change a game??? (kinda relates to the first thing i wrote...) This way, i just wire it up as button "4" along with the left bottom button and viola! I don't need to do anything when i change a game... (i do agree it doesn't look that good though...)

You can set up the controls for each game seperately in MAME.

[TOK]

I'd also get all the admin buttons off the panel, but that's a thing with me. Most of them aren't even necessary, just use the MAME shortcuts for the admin stuff.

I want my cab to be "dumb-visitor friendly", so i want the "exit game", "coin up", and "pause" buttons very accessible, though hard to push accidentally. Most my other admin buttons would be in the coin door, out of dumb hands reach. I'm not sure i know what are those shortcuts though, please enlighten me...

I actually screwed up there, I meant to type I-PAC shortcuts. Basically you hold down one of the start keys and push the stick up, left, right or down and it registers as ESC, Enter, etc... Not sure what you're using for a keyboard encoder. Sorry about that.

One quick comment on visitor friendly... When I first finished my machine, my brother-in-law and niece were over playing Mortal Kombat. All of a sudden everything shut down and the screen went black. I had wired a power button clear up at the far front corner of the CP to power it up. It was literally a foot and a half from the player one controls. She got excited and was smacking at it. That button is now hidden behind the coin door. 
Make it idiot proof before visitor friendlly. LOL. It was silly of me to put the power button on the panel, but I figured it'd always be me at the Player 1 position.
Once I started getting the extraneous buttons off the panel, I really liked the simple, authentic look.

On the Neo Geo games, you don't have to change settings every time you play a game. You just hit TAB and map them for that game once. It's saved after that.

[oldsage]

I actually screwed up there, I meant to type I-PAC shortcuts. Basically you hold down one of the start keys and push the stick up, left, right or down and it registers as ESC, Enter, etc... Not sure what you're using for a keyboard encoder. Sorry about that.

I'm using an I-PAC and I'm proud of it (probably the only good thing i ordered from Ultimarc, the Opti-PAC too). And i know about the shift key, it just kinda ruins the whole visitor friendly thing if you need to explain to them they need to press the start button and move the joystick to change a game... I might even go so far with the "visitor-friendliness" that I'll place labels next to every button (and i hate labels - i think too much text ruins any piece of art)...

One quick comment on visitor friendly... When I first finished my machine, my brother-in-law and niece were over playing Mortal Kombat. All of a sudden everything shut down and the screen went black. I had wired a power button clear up at the far front corner of the CP to power it up. It was literally a foot and a half from the player one controls. She got excited and was smacking at it. That button is now hidden behind the coin door.
Make it idiot proof before visitor friendlly. LOL. It was silly of me to put the power button on the panel, but I figured it'd always be me at the Player 1 position.
Once I started getting the extraneous buttons off the panel, I really liked the simple, authentic look.

I'm gonna lock my power button in the coin door, as far as I'm concerned, it can stay on forever (Muwhahahaha!) . Although i do agree about the authentic look thing, it made me think about putting labeled poker buttons as the admin buttons... Gave that up for some reason...

On the Neo Geo games, you don't have to change settings every time you play a game. You just hit TAB and map them for that game once. It's saved after that.

I know, but i don't want to go over every neo geo game each time i update mame... I dunno, i guess I'm just really lazy...

[oldsage]

If I'm allready at it, here's my second CP (going for swappable CP's)...
The trackballs are both Ultimarc 2 1/4", and the admin buttons are color coded the same as the first panel... I also intended on using the same artwork for the second one (although at the moment I'm not too sure I'd be able to get it at high enough resolution...)...
Again, be brutal!

[Trimoor]

Try to incorporate the art into the layout.  Why bother designing a nice overlay just to cut random holes in it?
Maybe you could align some red buttons with the eyes, then put LEDs in them.  Put LEDs under the overlay anyway.  They will be invisible when unlit, and will really add to it when lit.

For the credit button, I wired a switch to the reject button on the coin door.  You can put a label on it that says "push for credit"
The exit button looks dangerously close to buttons that get smacked pretty often.

Is it a wood panel?  I suggest using T-nuts instead of carridge bolts.  No ugly bolt heads ruining the art.

If you want the two players farther apart, consider rotating their controls along the sides.  Then you can move the 4-way down.  And it interferes less with the art.
Edit: Second panel
The buttons are at an unnatural position for the left hand.  Rotate them 45-90

[oldsage]

Try to incorporate the art into the layout.

[Trimoor]

The reject credit switch is very reliable.  I use it in all three of my cabs.  Very simple and invisible.

T-nuts are essentially nuts that are embedded in the wood.  They are recessed under the overlay, and are screwed into from underneath.

But then you'd be watching the screen at an angle, wouldn't that be really annoying???

It depends on where the screen is.  If the player is naturally staring directly at the center of the screen, the angle makes no difference.  (Really)

For the trackball buttons, the green hand on the right is the natural position of the hand.  The fingers really don't meet any of the buttons.  If they are rotated like the left side, they almost perfectly match up with the fingers.  It also gives you room to slide all the player 1 controls over to the left.

For the mounting plate, route the top of the panel, and recess it into the wood.  Then cover it with the overlay.  That's probable the easiest way to do it, although I would route the bottom of the panel and drill a hole just for the protruding ball and skip the mounting plate altogether.

BTW, thanks for the feedback, you guys are awesome...

Indeed I am...

[oldsage]

The reject credit switch is very reliable.

[Trimoor]

Make it a black button, and add a couple lines to make it look like an eye patch.
That, or a demented terminator eye.

[oldsage]

Make it a black button, and add a couple lines to make it look like an eye patch.
That, or a demented terminator eye.

Lol... I'm not yet sure if you're serious or not...
Just in case you are, i don't really want (or am talented enough) to mess around with the artwork...

[tommy]

Somebody tell me why the buttons are on the left , and how can you play that way.   

[quarterstringer]

Somebody tell me why the buttons are on the left , and how can you play that way.

[oldsage]

Somebody tell me why the buttons are on the left , and how can you play that way.