Newbie I-PAC VE questions

[jcroach]

Hi, newbie here with some questions.

I received an I-PAC VE for christmas and I'm stoked to start building an arcade controller and maybe in the future a full cabinet. I e-mailed these questions to Ultimarc but I thought I'd also try here for some help. Please note that I have not yet plugged in my I-PAC VE or tested it.

The Ultimarc web site states that if a custom codeset is used, it is stored in RAM instead of EEPROM.  Can anyone elaborate on this for me? Does this mean that the code set must be recreated every time the I-PAC VE is unplugged or the PC is turned off? Can the code set be saved on my PC and then reloaded or refreshed?  Where is it saved and what would the file name be?

I noticed that there are some extra inputs on the I-PAC VE, labeled 1A, 1B, 1C, 1D, 2A, 2B, 2C, 2D.  Does anyone know what the default mapping is for these inputs?

The Ultimarc web site also states that the I-PAC VE will support caps/num/scroll LEDs but that they must be 

[jcroach]

.....bump.......

Can anyone help me with this?

[zabrin]

I hope someone can answer....I have the same questions...

I finished wiring my control panel and it works great...I hope someone can tell us about the extra inputs...

Z.

[jcroach]

Well, I loaded up WinPAC IPD yesturday.  nice software.  It appears that the extra inputs are mapped as follows:

1A = C
1B = V
1C = '
1D = X
2A = J
2B = L
2C = 5
2D = ENTER

Which is weird, becuase 5 is the Mame coin-up button and C is Player 1 Button 7, I think.

I'm still tryint to figure out how to get MameWah to automatically reprogram the I-PAC VE based on custom code sets when a certain emulator is loaded.  Do I just put the codeset file name and location into the .ini for the emulator in the "ipc_file_or_path" location?

[mcdo15]

why dont u just program emultors to match existing controls you have?

[jcroach]

why dont u just program emultors to match existing controls you have?

Isn't that just 6 of one, 1/2 dozen of the other? (sorry, that's the mid-westerner in me)

I've figured out how to alter the controls on all my emulators except for Z26.  I use an older version of Z26 that's compatible with my RedOctane USB joysticks.  And I want to be able to map some of the cabinet buttons to function as the game select and reset Atari 2600 buttons.  After using the WinPAC Interactive Panel Designer, I think it's going to be fairly easy.  If anyone has experience with this, please let me know.

mcdo15, which emulators do you use? Are they easy to alter the controller settings?

[mcdo15]

why dont u just program emultors to match existing controls you have?

Isn't that just 6 of one, 1/2 dozen of the other? (sorry, that's the mid-westerner in me)

I've figured out how to alter the controls on all my emulators except for Z26.

[Grasshopper]

The caps/scroll/num lock LED outputs are shared with three of the Ipac's button inputs. I suggest you look on Tiger-Heli's site for further details of this.

http://www.mameworld.net/tigerheli/

Standard Ipac boards have header pins for connecting the LEDs. Presumably on the Ipac VE you simply connect them to the appropriate screw terminals.

It's interesting that the VE board has eight extra inputs. Andy announced a year ago that he would be producing a 36 input version of the Minipac but it never materialised. Maybe the VE board shares the same basic design but without ps/2 support.

[jcroach]

The caps/scroll/num lock LED outputs are shared with three of the Ipac's button inputs. I suggest you look on Tiger-Heli's site for further details of this.

http://www.mameworld.net/tigerheli/

Standard Ipac boards have header pins for connecting the LEDs. Presumably on the Ipac VE you simply connect them to the appropriate screw terminals.

It's interesting that the VE board has eight extra inputs. Andy announced a year ago that he would be producing a 36 input version of the Minipac but it never materialised. Maybe the VE board shares the same basic design but without ps/2 support.

Thanks for the response.  That web site looks good.  I'll have to dive further into it later today.

One thing I found interesting about the extra inputs in the I-PAC VE is that there are 8 connectors, but the IPAC Interactive Panel Desinger only recognizes 4 in the panel design mode.  It recognizes all 8 in the keycodes mode.  Maybe I should check and see if it's looking at 1A and 1B as 1SW7 and 1SW8? Interesting......

[Tiger-Heli]

One thing I found interesting about the extra inputs in the I-PAC VE is that there are 8 connectors, but the IPAC Interactive Panel Desinger only recognizes 4 in the panel design mode.  It recognizes all 8 in the keycodes mode.  Maybe I should check and see if it's looking at 1A and 1B as 1SW7 and 1SW8? Interesting......

You are correct, 1A and 1B (and 2A and 2B) correspond to SW7 and SW8, it is only 4 added inputs.  (32 vs. 28).  C and D inputs can only be programmed in the keycodes section of the software.  I thought they were programmed to nothing by default, but apparently not.

[jcroach]

Thanks for your help Tiger-Heli.  Your web site was very useful also. 

Do you have any experience using multiple custom code sets with diferent emulators and MameWah?  Can I simply save the different code sets and load them in the appropriate .ini file in MameWah and the I-Pac will be reprogramed?

Thanks again.

[Tiger-Heli]

Thanks for your help Tiger-Heli.  Your web site was very useful also. 

Do you have any experience using multiple custom code sets with diferent emulators and MameWah?  Can I simply save the different code sets and load them in the appropriate .ini file in MameWah and the I-Pac will be reprogramed?

Thanks again.

Never used MAMEwah, but the author is a regular on this forum.

I know you can run "winipac mame.ipc" and the I-PAC will be re-programmed (maybe not exactly as typed), and you could add this to a batch file, but beyond that . . .

As mentioned earlier, I would recommend setting you emulator settings to match the defaults.

[Grasshopper]

One thing I found interesting about the extra inputs in the I-PAC VE is that there are 8 connectors, but the IPAC Interactive Panel Desinger only recognizes 4 in the panel design mode.  It recognizes all 8 in the keycodes mode.  Maybe I should check and see if it's looking at 1A and 1B as 1SW7 and 1SW8? Interesting......

You are correct, 1A and 1B (and 2A and 2B) correspond to SW7 and SW8, it is only 4 added inputs.  (32 vs. 28).  C and D inputs can only be programmed in the keycodes section of the software.  I thought they were programmed to nothing by default, but apparently not.

Interesting.

I remember speaking to Andy some time ago, and one of the reasons he gave for the delay in launching the 36 input Minipac was that the current Ipac software could only program up to 32 inputs. Your observations seem to confirm what he was saying.

I actually think that 32 inputs is probably enough for most two player panels. However, I don't see why the Ipac couldn't be redesigned so that the Keyboard LEDs are assinged to 3 of the 4 unused inputs. This would avoid the LEDS flashing when you hit the shared buttons, and also the erratic behaviour you apparently get over long cables.

It would also be nice if the 4 extra buttons could be used to switch between different programmable codesets.

[Tiger-Heli]

I remember speaking to Andy some time ago, and one of the reasons he gave for the delay in launching the 36 input Minipac was that the current Ipac software could only program up to 32 inputs. Your observations seem to confirm what he was saying.

Okay, some truth, and some half-truth here.  The minipac uses a different chip than the I-PAC and it will get the 36-input version.  The software can't program more than 32 inputs, but I don't think that's actually the holdup, I think the firmware needs to be modified, and that is a substantial cost outlay and that will delay introduction, at least until the regular mini-pac's are depleted.

I actually think that 32 inputs is probably enough for most two player panels. However, I don't see why the Ipac couldn't be redesigned so that the Keyboard LEDs are assinged to 3 of the 4 unused inputs.

Well, depends what you mean by unused inputs.  You can choose to not use 1B7, 1B8 and 2B7 inputs and make do with a 25 input encoder.  You can not use these inputs on a VE and replace them with the C and D inputs and have a 29 input encoder.  or a 33 input encoder with the new minipac.  But most people buy a 36-input encoder b/c they want 36-inputs.  It really doesn't make sense to move them to different inputs (say 1C, 2C and 2D on the VE), b/c then your support documentation has to specify the differences, etc.

This would avoid the LEDS flashing when you hit the shared buttons, and also the erratic behaviour you apparently get over long cables.

It would avoid the LED's flashing, not sure about the erratic behaviour over long cables.

It would also be nice if the 4 extra buttons could be used to switch between different programmable codesets.

You can switch between the default and one programmed codeset with a KeyWiz, but the ability to switch between several with a button press would be interesting.

[Grasshopper]

By unused inputs, I mean inputs that cannot be programmed using current software.

The erratic behaviour over long cables only applies to the three inputs that are shared with an LED. I should point out that I don't actually have any personal experience of this behaviour (I avoided the problem altogether by simply not using the three shared inputs and made do with 25 inputs in total). But I've heard from others on this board and from Andy himself that it can be a problem.

I'm not an electronics expert, and I'm sure someone else here can give a better explanation, but I believe it has something to do with capacitance building up in the wires.

When an input is read the corresponding LED has to be momentarily switched off (or is it switched on I can't remember?). Capacitance in a long wire can cause the off state to not register fast enough and fools the Ipac into thinking the button has been pressed.

[Tiger-Heli]

By unused inputs, I mean inputs that cannot be programmed using current software.

There aren't any.  The C and D inputs on the VE can't be programmed in panel designer, but can be in keycodes mode.  I am fairly sure the software will be updated when the 36-input encoder is introduced.

[Grasshopper]

One further thing, even if new software enables all 36 inputs to be programmed, it would still make sense for the shared inputs to be assigned to the buttons that are least likely to be used.

IIRC on standards Ipacs, one of the LEDs is shared with player 1 button 7, and many panels use that button.

OK, you can ignore Ultimarc's button labelling system (as I did) but it's nice to stick with it if possible.

[Grasshopper]

By unused inputs, I mean inputs that cannot be programmed using current software.

There aren't any.  The C and D inputs on the VE can't be programmed in panel designer, but can be in keycodes mode.  I am fairly sure the software will be updated when the 36-input encoder is introduced.

Am I misunderstanding the previous posts?

I thought you said the A & B inputs correspond to SW7 and SW8. I assumed by this you were saying that they could not be programmed independently of the SW7 and SW8 inputs using current software but from the hardware perspective are actually separate inputs. Or are you actually saying they are electronically equivalent to the SW7 and SW8 inputs?

[Tiger-Heli]

Am I misunderstanding the previous posts?

I thought you said the A & B inputs correspond to SW7 and SW8. I assumed by this you were saying that they could not be programmed independently of the SW7 and SW8 inputs using current software but from the hardware perspective are actually separate inputs. Or are you actually saying they are electronically equivalent to the SW7 and SW8 inputs?

They are electronically equivalent.  The I-pac/2 is 28 inputs - 2 joysticks, 16 buttons and four admin buttons.  The VE adds inputs C and D (four more inputs for 32 total), but also re-names buttons 7 and 8 as A and B.

[Grasshopper]

I see. That's a pity.

It's odd though that Andy has changed the labelling system.

[jcroach]

Tiger-Heli and Grasshopper

Thanks for the help!

[Grasshopper]

Yes, if the Ipac VE doesn't have a +5v connector, you can take +5v from the USB connector.

LEDs only require a miniscule amount of power so there shouldn't be any problems. If there was an issue then USB keyboards wouldn't have LEDs.

[Tiger-Heli]

I'll also have to draw +5v of power from somewhere.  Do you recommend using the USB port power?  I'd read that some people are cautious of this.

Then I can wire everything up as shown on the Ultimarc page, right?:

Right, and the first screw terminal on each side nearest the keyboard port should be +5V, judging by the pic on the www.ultimarc.com website.

[Kobex]

I have an I-PAC VE and have successfully hooked up LEDs to flash my player 1 and player 2 start buttons.  The input assignments are as follows:

Num lock = 2P-D
Caps lock = 1P-D
Scroll lock = 1P-A (I think, this one always lit the LED)

I didn't use the scroll lock LED for anything, so I use this for player 1's button #7 as you normally would.  I actually like these assignments, as the two LEDs I was interested in are hooked up to the D inputs.

I wanted to use superbright LEDs, so the +5 on the I-PAC didn't have enough juice.  I followed the guide here to drive them with an external 5 Volts taken from my computer's power supply:

http://www.oscarcontrols.com/led/index.shtml

You can use the same control board for the VE, just remember that the inputs are different.

I used superbrights because I was sticking these LEDs inside happs buttons.  I saw the idea here:

http://www.arcadeparadise.org/arcade/ap3/lighting.html

If you're using standard LEDs, then the +5 on the VE works fine.  I tested them to make sure.  If that accomplishes your goal, then it greatly simplifies the process!


And last but not least, make sure the "led_mode" setting in your mame.ini is set to "usb" instead of "ps/2" or it won't work.

[jcroach]

I have an I-PAC VE and have successfully hooked up LEDs to flash my player 1 and player 2 start buttons.

[Tiger-Heli]

Hey thanks for the advice! Were these the default key assignments or did you have to reprogram the I-Pac?

When I'm shopping for LEDs, is there a particular type I should look for? How are these labeled?  Is ther a maximum voltage listed on them?

I would assume those are the default, as far as I know, you can't reprogram the LED assignments.

LED's -  Standard LED's are sold as either 2.1V (most common), 5V, or 12V.  High intensity LED's require more currend and will need a driver circuit.  If you use 2.1V LED's, you need a dropping resistor, as shown above.  5V LED's have the resistor built-in, but might be more expensive.  ($1 instead of $0.10).