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Author Topic: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )  (Read 9135 times)

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coin_door

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Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« on: October 28, 2004, 09:40:29 am »
I am looking to making a interface similar to Ipac.
I have established that the actual ipac board would cost $5
in parts to make. I wish to distribute a generic version of the ipac board at cost price to fellow Mamers.

My hiccup is that I dont know how to write a program for the main Cypress CY7C63413 chip.

I am wondering if there is anyone who would help me with this project that could write a similar program to what is on the Ipac board. I wouldnt want to copy the residual program that is on the ipac board, but to just get the board to function the same

Any ideas ?
« Last Edit: October 29, 2004, 12:32:23 am by coin_door »

lokki

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2004, 10:05:18 am »
I'm not sure I understand what you are saying.
Are you suggesting to pirate the Ipac. And create a cheap knock off?

I'm pretty sure that the most Hardware that you buy is made cheaper that what it is sold to the consumers for. part of it is profit, but a huge part is getting payed back for all the Research & Development that went into creating the item.
Andy has spent hundered of hours creating (and improving) the ipac. Not sure it is right for you to steal his hard work.


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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2004, 10:09:32 am »
Well I could supply some code....
While we are at it, I have had this long-standing idea for a car which will do 250 MPH and only cost $.0.05 per mile to run.
It's only in the idea stage at the moment, I need someone to develop it....

Andy Warne
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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2004, 10:23:23 am »
   

Hehe.  I think someone is just having some fun.  (note newbie status and smiley as post Icon)


RandyT

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2004, 10:59:03 am »
well there is a project with documentation on how to build your own encoder from scratch using amtel chips.  you can even program it with an lpt cable..
http://surf.to/buttonbox

lokki

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2004, 02:23:58 pm »
   

Hehe.  I think someone is just having some fun.  (note newbie status and smiley as post Icon)


RandyT

He posted also on mame.net and was told to check here for info.


Mame.net URL

« Last Edit: December 07, 2004, 09:26:39 am by Peale »

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2004, 02:55:40 pm »
Bad idea, very bad idea.  And not the best place to come asking this kind of question considering Andy's well deserved following in this community.

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2004, 03:12:57 pm »
if you are serious and not just fishing...

i agree with andy, sounds like you've got more than just a hiccup.

i don't think you'll get much love from this community.  andy and randy produce innovative products at affordable prices that most here have embraced and relied upon.  competition is a good thing, but not by stealing others hard work.  

"don't bite the hand that feeds you"

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2004, 04:16:19 pm »
Bad idea, very bad idea.  And not the best place to come asking this kind of question considering Andy's well deserved following in this community.

i agree that the approach is a bit incorrect.  i have heard of several people building and programming their own encoders.  if you feel that you can make a quality product at a reduced price, i wouldnt be the one to stop you.  we all have the utmost respect for andyw and randyt but viable competition benefits the consumer.. ;)  just dont go trying to pull a hong-kong bootleg on us..

coin_door

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2004, 09:06:06 pm »
No its not a joke, and I certanly are not promoting piracy.
 I thought I mentioned that in my original post.
Quote
I wouldnt want to copy the residual program that is on the ipac board, but to just get the board to function the same

I must say that I hope those who are acusing me of piracy, own all the roms that they play. :P

Is it wrong to have another brand of a similar product? Ford, Chev, Mercedes, etc, they all have four wheel and carry passengers. Did they all pirate from the first car ?

Maybe we should all drive chevy cars and ban the rest, because only one player should have the market. Hey I got an idea, why doesnt the government just issue us all with blue overalls to wear.

Thanks Andy for your comments. I guess if I help you with your car it will become an open source project, like I am proposing this to be. I did mention that the kits would be sold at cost didnt I. ( That means no profit ) I didnt realsie the cypress chip was made for just one customer? I wasnt asking for someone to do the whole job, I am prepared to design the circuit board and source the componenents and get them built up. I was just asking for programming help. A small portion of the job.

It was said I wont get much love from the community, I dont want thier love, I just want to be able to provide us all with a viable alternative to ipac. I dont know if you know , but to buy an ipac in Australia costs $80 + 10% tax
I find this hard to accept when you can go out and buy a fully working USB gamepad for $15  (Brand new, out of the box). I would guess there isnt much difference ?
There is an irony when you can buy a secondhand computer (capable of running MAME) for less than the cost of an ipac  ???

While I know Randy would not welcome any competition, I am sure he would also understand that we live in a open market society where we are free to compete against each other. ( So long as we dont contravene any copyright laws.)

I STESS STRONGLY THAT I AM NOT PROMOTING PIRACY, JUST COMPETITION


EDIT: When I look at the spirit of MAME I get the idea that we are a support group for each other. MAME is free, there are countless cabinet plans to download free, there are many support front end software downloads for free, most of the components are very cheap or at reasonable prices. It was my thinking to join in and provide yet another component in the spirit of MAME. Not to be sold at profit, just at cost.
So whats so bad about that ? (Genuine question)

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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #10 on: October 28, 2004, 09:32:21 pm »
I see where you are going with this. I think maybe the title of your post is probably misleading. Maybe if it was "Keyboard Encoder Programming" so something different it would not have raised some hackles in here. I personally bought both the Opti-pac and the I-Pac (T-Sticks, etc) mostly from reviews and feedback on this forum. Did not really know of the RandyT's product back then.

I personally believe that competition is always good for all, the buyer and the seller.

Anyways, my .02 cents...

Edit: Typo
« Last Edit: October 28, 2004, 09:34:05 pm by Jabba »
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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #11 on: October 28, 2004, 10:08:43 pm »
Disclaimer:  I'm new here so my comments don't necessarily reflect those of the community.  (I should have included that before.)

Your initial post said "the actual ipac board would cost $5 in parts to make".  This implies to me that you would be making an exact copy of the hardware (noted that you would not be pirating the software).  I'm all for competition as I stated, but this seems a bit like cheating.  To follow the car analogy it seems more like copying an existing car exactly (Corvette for example) but putting a different motor in it.

Providing alternatives is great.  Getting help from others and offering to provide your time and effort at no cost is what BYO is all about.  Lots of developers have donated countless hours to provide MAME, front ends, etc. for free.  The difference I see is that these projects aren't duplicating existing commercial products.  The "spirit" of MAME is to keep classic arcade games alive without taking away from existing products that are still generating revenue for the rights holders.  Are MAME roms illegal?  I think so.  But can you go buy a brand new Crystal Castles arcade machine from the manufacturer?

$80 does sound a bit steep for an encoder.  If you can do better and want to donate your work to others that's great.  If you do it by taking design work from others it hurts them and in turn the rest of us.  Making a copy isn't exactly competition and if I felt like my R&D effort for something was just going to be borrowed from somebody else I would be less inclined to spend the time and money.

I don't know what your exact plans are so maybe you are proposing a legitimate competitive product.  To me (and others apparently) it sounds like you are just looking to copy someone else's hard work.

coin_door

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2004, 12:04:54 am »
A few good points,

 Maybe the title of my thread was missleading. ( An unitentional mistake )
I have changed the title as suggested.

I dont intend to copy any parts of the Ipac. But because I intend to use the same chip as Ipac I expect the circuit to be similar, but not a copy.
Getting back to the old car analogy, unfortunaletly they all need four wheels and a steering wheel etc. So it is very hard to make a car with square wheels just avoid people saying it is a copy. The card I intend to make will quite possibly look similar, just because that is the nature of designing around such a chip. One of the alterations i intend to do with the board is have spade lugs on it instead of screw terminals. I want to do this, not for the purpose of change for change sake but I feel it would be easier to chop and change controls.

I guess the only thing I am copying is the concept of Ipac. But we must realise that this is not a new concept. There are countless  interfaces in the market today. The only other thing I am copying is using the cypress chip. But I guess I would have eventualy worked out about using that for myself anyway. This chip is ideally suited for such a job.

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2004, 07:09:42 am »
I stayed out of this thread earlier, but let me add a few comments:
Quote
I dont intend to copy any parts of the Ipac. But because I intend to use the same chip as Ipac I expect the circuit to be similar, but not a copy.
Getting back to the old car analogy, unfortunaletly they all need four wheels and a steering wheel etc. So it is very hard to make a car with square wheels just avoid people saying it is a copy. The card I intend to make will quite possibly look similar, just because that is the nature of designing around such a chip.
Okay, this has been extensively covered in other filelds.  As it relates to circuitry, the best example would be something like a computer motherboard.  If you have the same components connected to the same traces, (even if the traces run to different locations), it's a copy.
Quote
One of the alterations i intend to do with the board is have spade lugs on it instead of screw terminals. I want to do this, not for the purpose of change for change sake but I feel it would be easier to chop and change controls.
Bad idea, IMHO.  Not only are spade lugs likely to break off with repeated use, but they require you to crimp terminals onto all of your input wires which requires additional time.

While I don't mind competition or seeing alternative products on the market, many of your statements make me less than excited about your ability to carry this out.  Feel free to prove me wrong . . .

For example:

Quote
I guess the only thing I am copying is the concept of Ipac. But we must realise that this is not a new concept. There are countless  interfaces in the market today.
If you define an "interface" as a device which accepts a button press and sends a code to make a keypress to the computer, then I count about 23 products, (including discontinued and keyboard hacks).  I don't include the AKI as this is basically a gamepad encoder, and I suppose I missed Druin's interface, but the number is not countless . . . (ref.  http://www.mameworld.net/tigerheli/encoder/index.htm)
Quote
The only other thing I am copying is using the cypress chip. But I guess I would have eventualy worked out about using that for myself anyway. This chip is ideally suited for such a job.
Interesting to me that you can judge that the chip is ideal for the job when you have no idea how to program it.  Seems like the buttonbox did fine with Atmel and PIC chips.  And I think the MK series used a different chip as well.  For that matter, I imagine the HotRod and X-Arcade encoders use a different chip as well.  Probably the KeyWiz does also.
Quote
I am wondering if there is anyone who would help me with this project that could write a similar program to what is on the Ipac board. I wouldnt want to copy the residual program that is on the ipac board, but to just get the board to function the same.
This is probably the part that bothers me the most.  Your only intent is to make the board function the same - - - .  The MK64 and KeyWiz both added and removed features that the I-PAC supports (and took shots b/c of them).  If you said "I just want the board to take a button press to an input (with no shift function), but to be programmable." or "I want features A, B, and C of the I-PAC along with features D, E, and F of the KeyWiz." I would give you some credibility.  But wanting the board to function the same smacks of piracy and/or a lack of creativity in being able to determine which features are useful and not useful.

Now that I'm done with criticism, my advice would be to do an internet search and see if that explains how to program it.  Or contact Cypress tech support and see if they can suggest any resources.
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Re:Ipac programing
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2004, 08:48:27 am »
I dont know if you know , but to buy an ipac in Australia costs $80 + 10% tax
I find this hard to accept when you can go out and buy a fully working USB gamepad for $15  (Brand new, out of the box). I would guess there isnt much difference ?

On the Ozstick site, the IPAC2 sells for $80 INCLUDING GST.  Delivery will cost you $8.40

Ordering directly through Andy in US dollars, you pay $39 for the IPAC2 and $12 delivery, which roughly converts to $69AUD in total based on the dollars current worth.  NO GST applies as it is a imported good!

Don't recall any of my arcade favorites having logitech USB gamepads attached when I was growing up.

I own two JPACS and AVGAs, and they are worth every cent when compared to the time it allowed me to save when making my Arcade Cabinets MAME capable...

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2004, 09:15:04 am »
I personally think that it would be great to see some more compition..

but I don't know if you will be able to sell them for much cheaper the ipacs or keywiz.  Sure the parts are cheap... the time putting them together will kill you.  Make sure (if you really want to do it) you find a company to make them and check their price... Otherwise you will probably stop selling them in a week.

Next... the R&D for the first one WILL take ages.  Its not a 2 day project unless its for yourself only.  You need the abiltity to change all the key codes outside of programming.

Next... You probably wont get many people interested unless you sell a full version.  chip Programmers are $15-100s and that will eat anything you save from buying a full built one.  So it will only be interested in people who already have access to the chip programmers.



If you ARE planning on it... 1st, do the programming yourself (at least start).  This will probably be the most interesting part.

Next... Find a new angle.  

I would like to see one that allows a ton of configurations set on the board myself with easy changes.  I personally have 15+ controlpanels...

Or maybe one that can send commands to more then just a keyboard... maybe a dreamcast, ps2, xbox, ect.  Similar to a XArcade encoder... Just another idea...

Next...  Do it for the love... because you will probably be able to get a job at burgerking and make more money (initially anyway)... Remember you will probably spend more time working on the encoders then playing games.  

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #16 on: October 29, 2004, 09:26:15 am »
Some follow-up to my earlier comments -

I think the majority of the customers for this are going to be in the USA, so shipping from Australia may eat up any savings for the majority of your customers.

Also, keep in mind that at the time it was first introduced, the KeyWiz was less expensive than the I-PAC/2, offered four more inputs, a different shift method, and the ability to swap codesets on the fly, while losing an automatic keyboard pass-thru, LED support, and the ability to retain a codeset in EEPROM.

And the KeyWiz received a lukewarm to cold response on the board here from the I-PAC faithful.  Basically, an "The I-PAC does everything I want and Andy's a great guy, so why should I buy anything else" mentality.

So if you want to compete, your product had better be significantly better or significantly cheaper (or both) and so far, you are not starting out that well with the members here.
It's not what you take when you leave this world behind you, it's what you leave behind you when you go. - R. Travis.
When all is said and done, generally much more is SAID than DONE.

coin_door

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2004, 09:52:13 am »
Thanks for your replies guys. It is obvious that there are some of you that have a great loyalty to Ipac and Andy.
Quote
Basically, an "The I-PAC does everything I want and Andy's a great guy, so why should I buy anything else" mentality.
I just hope this doesnt get distorted. Will the next post feed off this one and interpret that I actually spoke out against Andy ? --BINGO! Either that, or I was attempting to say "before" but it was too many letters to type-- this thread I never even new of the guy.
I can see in some instances the thread degrading into an "us and them" conflict.

There have been a few good points made, and many I dissagree with. I am so sorry Tiger but I dont agree with many of your points. I am not sure if you read all of my posts here properly, or I didnt explain myself well.

The main thrust of my thread was, if someone could help me to write a program. Since I made this post I have had two other possibilities put to me from another location. I will look more closely at these options.

Thanks again for your input guys.  ;)


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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #18 on: October 29, 2004, 10:04:04 am »
Thanks for your replies guys. It is obvious that there are some of you that have a great loyalty to Ipac and Andy.
Quote
Basically, an "The I-PAC does everything I want and Andy's a great guy, so why should I buy anything else" mentality.
I just hope this doesnt get distorted. Will the next post feed off this one and interpret that I actually spoke out against Andy ? --BINGO! Either that, or I was attempting to say "before" but it was too many letters to type-- this thread I never even new of the guy.
I can see in some instances the thread degrading into an "us and them" conflict.
That wasn't my intent, just trying to give you some past history.
Quote
There have been a few good points made, and many I dissagree with. I am so sorry Tiger but I dont agree with many of your points. I am not sure if you read all of my posts here properly, or I didnt explain myself well.
Me either, since you don't specifically address your disagreements, but as I initially said, feel free to prove me wrong. . .
It's not what you take when you leave this world behind you, it's what you leave behind you when you go. - R. Travis.
When all is said and done, generally much more is SAID than DONE.

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2004, 10:09:01 am »
Ok... how do you plan on actually programming your chips once someone rights you a program?  Aren't chip-programmers expensive?

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #20 on: October 29, 2004, 10:31:59 am »
screw loyalty.  Show me a quality product for a quality price and im all there.  Thats why i bought the Keywiz.

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #21 on: October 29, 2004, 10:50:38 am »
I think there is branch missing in the encoder evolution tree.  I have been waiting for a 12 input encoder with no programming/shift/special functions.  I know there is the keyboard hack but honestly I'm too lazy to do it.  And a gamepad hack requires a gameport which the really cheap old computers don't have.  I have a lot of friends with toddlers and they would all like a bartop or a mini for their house but are unwilling to pay what is required to make one (the encoder is the most expensive piece of the cabinet).  If you can make a super stripped encoder for $5-15 I'll order 10 today.  I have been using the Keywiz (which is fantastic btw) but it would be nice to have a lower cost alternative for the small projects.  
« Last Edit: October 29, 2004, 11:19:19 am by Nannuu »
Next I'll be on fries, and that's when the big money starts rolling in.

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #22 on: October 29, 2004, 11:06:32 am »
yeah, id be interested in a 12 input, cheap encoder as well.

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #23 on: October 29, 2004, 11:06:58 am »
Now I like that idea a lot, Nannuu.  An encoder with a smaller number of inputs would be awesome for the smaller projects.  Price it right (sub $12) and I'd definately be interested.  But I'll be honest and say a new product that mimics the I-pac will not make any sales to me.  

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2004, 11:21:27 am »
And a gamepad hack requires a gameport which the really cheap old computers don't have.

What about USB gamepads?  You can get them real cheap and even old P2's (& before) have USB ports.

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2004, 11:49:54 am »
And a gamepad hack requires a gameport which the really cheap old computers don't have.

What about USB gamepads?  You can get them real cheap and even old P2's (& before) have USB ports.
I have been using DOS for speed but don't know how to get USB to work in there (program/drivers?).  If it is reliable it would be worth a try.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2004, 11:50:36 am by Nannuu »
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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #26 on: October 29, 2004, 11:50:39 am »
And a gamepad hack requires a gameport which the really cheap old computers don't have.

What about USB gamepads?  You can get them real cheap and even old P2's (& before) have USB ports.

Doesn't do much when you are wanting to just make a simple cab with a stick and a few buttons, running DOS on an old cheap PC.  I also want to make cabs for family that will play the old classics that don't need simultaneous 2-player 6-buttons each and a bunch of control buttons.  But I balk at paying $40 for a keywiz/ipac for these projects as I won't even be using a 1/4th of the inputs available.  I love the keywiz but it is more than I need in most cases.  I'd love to see a PS2 encoder with 12 inputs, no passthrough and based on the MAME defaults (P1 joystick, P1 buttons 1-3, Coin 1 & 2, P1/P2 Start and Escape).  If there was an option like that for no more than $20 shipped, I'd be all over it.
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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #27 on: October 29, 2004, 12:51:28 pm »
I have been away for a few days and just gut here.
I must say I think some of you were a bit harsh. I read the first post and I knew right off what he/she wanted to do.
BYOAC.  he wants to build his own encoder, and offer his works at cost.
I think its great. I wish all the luck. I would love one of Andy's encoders but he only takes credit cards. I do not have one nor do I want one. ( I always get in trouble with one)  I only use money orders
I went the game pad hacks. one arcade has 2 usb / playstations soon to be 4 pads
the other has 2 sidewinders

I have tried a keyboard hack 3 times and gave up.
If I knew how to program the chips I would help
as far as the cost of programing the chip I could burn the chips at work. ( I work 3rd shift) The supervisers owe me some favers.
No harm at all ment to Andy at all. There is nothing rong with wanting to build another version of a product unless you ask Bill Gates  :D

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #28 on: October 29, 2004, 03:28:48 pm »
No harm at all ment to Andy at all. There is nothing rong with wanting to build another version of a product unless you ask Bill Gates  :D
If nothing else the wording could have been better.

"The I-PAC only uses $5 worth of parts, and I want to build and distribute them at cost, but I don't know how to program the Cypress chip that he uses", sure sounds like outright theft of the product, rather than another version, and doesn't respect the thought, time, R&D, beta-testing and all that went into the initial design.

"I plan to make a keyboard encoder.  It is my own design, and I have decided to use the Cypress microprocessor, but I would like some guidance on how to program the chip to send keycodes when a button is pressed", doesn't sound nearly as bad, even though the basic result is the same.
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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #29 on: October 29, 2004, 05:23:46 pm »
I have to say that I meant no disrespect in my thinking that this was an attempt at humour.

Sometimes when something is absurd enough, it's difficult to think that the person saying it is doing so in sincerity.  The parts that got me were the $5 parts total, and the notion that the programming was a minor portion of the work involved.     For a point of reference, there is almost $5 in the cost of the KeyWiz's screw-connectors alone!

And, I spent a good 3 full months of several hours a night and weekends developing firmware and support software.  Sourcing parts and designing the PCB was the easiest and least expensive part of the effort (good dev tools= $$$$.)

These are the things that many, without intimate knowledge of the process,  don't realize go into developing what seems like a simple device from the outside.  But if you're up to the task and have the investment capital, you are certainly free to risk it as others before you have.

Risk is a major portion of the free-market you speak of.  If you intend to work for free, you've already resigned yourself to a net loss of more than your capital investment (even if it is a donation to the community.)  That is, unless you place little value on your time.

Perhaps a more effective way to donate to the community is to do what I (and others) try to do and use the proceeds from one project to fund the development of other useful items.  This is a niche market if there ever was one, and some of the things people ask for just aren't out there.  And because of the small market potential, never will be unless a person dedicated to the "cause" uses their personal resources to develop it.  I hate to say it, but by not patronizing vendors of your favorite goodies, you are all but ensuring that there will be fewer new goodies out there when you desire them.  

This is not meant to discourage anyone from doing what they want to do, but you asked for a real reason so I thought I would try to give you one.  :)

RandyT
« Last Edit: October 30, 2004, 10:08:38 am by RandyT »

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #30 on: October 29, 2004, 05:33:24 pm »
I know exactly what he is intending on doing, and I think it's great. He won't be copying the program (most likely it's encrypted on the chip), he'd have to write it from scratch. Coindoor has no knowledge of the Cypress chip, and if he's never programmed a chip before, this is a rather monumental project for a newbie.

For anyone that's interested, Professor Dr. Anderson has a website and provides various electronic components and kits for very low prices, he encourages 'tinkering'. I haven't bought anything from him yet, but would like to. He has all sorts of information, files and things to purchase based on the PIC, Basic STAMP, Picaxe, etc. There is free software available to encode the chips, free compilers/interpreters, the hardware required to encode a chip can be cheap and the chips themselves can cost <$4 for a 20 Mhz chip with a/d converters, timers, etc. Linky: http://www.phanderson.com

Definately doable -- if you have the time and patience to write the code. Good luck man.  ;D

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Re:Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2004, 12:40:39 am »
I would love one of Andy's encoders but he only takes credit cards. I do not have one nor do I want one. ( I always get in trouble with one)
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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #32 on: December 07, 2004, 08:31:34 am »
Well, just to chuck in my two cents . . .

As an Australian, its expensive to get overseas parts. I have a Key Wiz max 1.5 (rock on randyT!!!) and love it. I tried to buy an Ipac from andy, but couldnt due to probs getting the money to him (couldn't do pay pal, as I dont have a US bank account), but Andy was very nice and replied with great emails triying to help.

My Key Wiz cost $79.95 (Including GST) with free postage and PCB mounting kit from Arcade games Australia.

I would welcome helping to develop an Australian encoder, but im not a programer, but my brother is. I can talk to him and see if he's interested.

Even if this encoder does get off the ground, I will buy one. But, on my main cab I will still continue to use my Key Wiz, and if the oportunity arrises, i'll buy a IPAC for my cocktail cab . . .
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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #33 on: December 07, 2004, 09:05:52 am »
As an Australian, its expensive to get overseas parts. I have a Key Wiz max 1.5 (rock on randyT!!!) and love it. I tried to buy an Ipac from andy, but couldnt due to probs getting the money to him (couldn't do pay pal, as I dont have a US bank account), but Andy was very nice and replied with great emails triying to help.
My Key Wiz cost $79.95 (Including GST) with free postage and PCB mounting kit from Arcade games Australia.
I didn't know RandyT had a distributor in Australia.

I'm pretty sure you could have gotten an I-PAC from OzStick  Chris at OzStick is very good to deal with.
Quote
Even if this encoder does get off the ground, I will buy one. But, on my main cab I will still continue to use my Key Wiz, and if the oportunity arrises, i'll buy a IPAC for my cocktail cab . . .
Just out of curiousity, why would you prefer the I-PAC over the KeyWiz for the cocktail cab?
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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #34 on: December 07, 2004, 09:35:00 am »
Well, the only reason I wanted to use the IPAC for my cocktail cab was just to "give it a lash".

Arcade Gaming Australia http://www.arcadegamingaustralia.com.au/home.php is really great to deal with, you should check 'em out.

I looked at OZ-Stick.I went there to look for buttons. When I saw prices of $5.95 for buttons, I came to the conclusion that they were too expencive. I bought Happ's from 123gumby123 on ebay for AU$1.90. He's in the US, so it cost $15 for P&H, but that was for 4 day delivery. In the end, for 21 buttons, it was wel worth it.

My hat if of to OZ-Stick for what they are trying to do, but there prices are just too high . . .
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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #35 on: December 07, 2004, 09:42:58 am »
>Well, the only reason I wanted to use the IPAC for my cocktail cab was just to >"give it a lash".

Okay, that makes sense.

>Arcade Gaming Australia http://www.arcadegamingaustralia.com.au/home.php >is really great to deal with, you should check 'em out.

I'm in the US, just trying to help you out.

>I looked at OZ-Stick.I went there to look for buttons. When I saw prices of >$5.95 for buttons, I came to the conclusion that they were too expencive.

For the I-PAC/2 they want $80 AUD, which seems reasonable, but shipping would be extra.  I agree on the other items being a little pricey.

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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #36 on: December 07, 2004, 10:27:24 am »
Hmmmmm, 80 bucks AUD is ok, but Arcade gaming australia is offering free shipping. When I ordered my key wiz from him, the first one he sent got lot in the mail.
So, he resent one at no extra charge. I had the tracking number, and tracked it till it left Melbourne, then it dissapered into the ether. Thanks for your help though, its always very much appreciated. The only reason I didnt order part from Ultimarc (keep up the great work andy!) was cause I couldnt use paypal, which was a shame. anyone got a spare IPAC laying around??? LOL
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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #37 on: December 07, 2004, 10:32:38 am »
Just for the record, arcadegamingaustralia is now selling the KeyWiz Max 1.5 for $69.99 AUD, although I don't know if the shipping is still free.
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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #38 on: December 08, 2004, 08:05:23 am »
yeah, thats what I got - key wiz rocks! (big u to randy t) - shipping was free, and I also got the PCB mounting kit free. :D
Im going to buy from him in the future . . .
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Re: Keyboard Encoder Programming ( Similar to Ipac )
« Reply #39 on: December 08, 2004, 08:12:19 pm »
What would you sell it for?  I often wonder if opensource developers have a sense of economics.  I've known several that spend their full time developing opensource projects and then complain they don't have money to live on.  The cost of a product is more than the parts.  More techies need to take economics courses.