New Encoder on the block!

[MameMaster!]

WOW...I just saw this on the XArcade website...

http://www.xgaming.com/byoarcade.shtml

Apparently they

[brained]

I think they used to sell this encoder before, but I dunno.

Pretty cool, for those people that are planning on a cab for console game / pc at the same time

[rjarcade]

If they are as junky as the two single-player X-arcade controllers that I used to own then I would avoid them like the plague.

[MameMaster!]

If they are as junky as the two single-player X-arcade controllers that I used to own then I would avoid them like the plague.

....what issues did you have? I know some Mamer's don't like the parts (buttons/joystick) but I've personally never had any issues with the interface. Have you?   Just curious!

[Sephroth57]

wow thats awesome, and why would the quality be bad? were talking about the electronics here not the buttons, you would be using whatever joys/buttons you want. I think it looks awesome

so MameMaster, can you keep multiple systems hooked up at once? like can i have it wired to my PC for MAME, to my PS2, and my DC, all at once without ever having to switch anything?

[Hoagie_one]

price dependant...i may check it out

[MameMaster!]

wow thats awesome, and why would the quality be bad? were talking about the electronics here not the buttons, you would be using whatever joys/buttons you want. I think it looks awesome

so MameMaster, can you keep multiple systems hooked up at once? like can i have it wired to my PC for MAME, to my PS2, and my DC, all at once without ever having to switch anything?

....HMMM....that's a good question (regarding multi-hook up). To be honest I'm sure that can be worked out with some sort of a switcher interface (I imagine it would have have to be a custom switch box)....but, since the interface is essentially a keyboard PS2 plug....are there any keyboard switchers out there for multi keyboards to one PC?.....that may work I would guess.

......but ultimately you're talking about a simple plug into the correct adaptor kinda' situation. I just open my coin door and change plugs from the PC to my XBox or Dreamcast....it only takes a second. Works perfectly everytime.

Also, you can  program the encoder. Another major perk.

[Hoagie_one]

Also, you can  program the encoder. Another major perk.

PC only

[MameMaster!]

Also, you can  program the encoder. Another major perk.

PC only

yeah...good point...but it's still cool. You don't have to remap for consoles anyways as by default the console adaptor is already set up for the specific consoles you attach it to.

I wonder what they're going to sell this thing for? I'm guessing about $50. bucks or so.....(since it comes with virtually everything you need).

[Hoagie_one]

From email i just got

Dear:mike

Thank you for your registration for the X-Arcade Build Your Own Arcade Kit
update list.

We hope you are excited as we are about this new X-Arcade bundle for enthusiasts
like yourself to create your own arcade machine or project in your home. We
expect to have these kits available shortly, so please be patient.

We'll keep you updated with any pricing, news or features, so please be sure to
add our email to your approved senders list in your email program.

Tentatively, we are hopeful for product availability mid November with target
pricing of $59.95. We expect this to be the best priced, highest quality DIY kit
on the market.  

In the meantime, here are some other important links you may want to check out:

Arcade Playing Software For Your PC
(http://www.x-arcade.com/arcade-games.shtml?DCMP=EMC-diy)

Play Arcade Games On Your XBOX
(http://www.x-arcade.com/htm/emulators.shtml?DCMP=EMC-diy )

Great Add-On Trackball For Your X-Arcade

[MameMaster!]

LOL....that's funny. I got an email from them (after registering for more info) that I didn't open yet....obviously I was on target with my $50. pricing guess.

Personally I think that's a bargain for what you're getting.

Totally cool.

 

[Hoagie_one]

$60 +$20 for each additional adapter....im hesitant to agree with it being a bargain.

[MameMaster!]

well...I can see your point. I guess it comes down to how much you're willing to spend for an "easy" way to get this done. Fortunately the cost for me isn't an issue as I already own all of the adaptors (except for gamecube).

Maybe they'll come up with a bundle for all 4 adaptors and the encoder gadget. I think $125.00 bucks (plus shipping) would be fair price point. You would then have an instant connection solution to all major consoles (Xbox, Dreamcast, Playstation 1/2, Gamecube) and the default PC interface.

I wonder what it would cost for a single switcher box with all console adaptors built in by default? I can't imagine that would be hard for them to create.

Again...I guess it comes down to how much time a person wants to spend trying to hack a controller. It's can be fun and challenging and of course much cheaper....but if you're not technically proficient (Me!)....this is much easier and fun!  

[Lilwolf]

But is this a NEW page or the old ones?

I would have bought one in a sec...  I would love to have easy access to dreamcast/ps2/xbox/ect...  would be worth the extra 15 bucks on an encoder.

but 28 inputs isnt enought for a 4 player control panel... unless you play with buttons... 4x (4(joy)+4(buttons)) = 4*8 = 32...  So without internal controls...  Would have been nice for a few others..

[MameMaster!]

according to XArcade this is being released mid-Nov. of this year.

[MameMaster!]

but 28 inputs isnt enought for a 4 player control panel... unless you play with buttons... 4x (4(joy)+4(buttons)) = 4*8 = 32...  So without internal controls...  Would have been nice for a few others..

....I'm pretty sure (OK I'm 100%) sure that these can be daisychained. POOF....4 player inputs.  

[Hoagie_one]

daisey chained.....2 encoders + adapter = Darn expensive.

[MameMaster!]

daisey chained.....2 encoders + adapter = Darn expensive.

daisey chained.....2 encoders + adapter = priceless.  

[mcdo15]

intresting

[Bgnome]

I think they used to sell this encoder before, but I dunno.

Pretty cool, for those people that are planning on a cab for console game / pc at the same time

they used to be sold before.  tiger-heli has them on his encoder comparison page.  from what I understand, the card is the exact same thing as the one used in the retail controllers.  this means that you get the exact same, somewhat buggy, capabilities.  they all use that serial interface, so if you wanted to have multiple adapters connected, you would probably need a db-9 splitter or switch.  daisy chaining is somewhat sketchy -- there have been a couple posts recently about keyboard pass-thru issues so i would go with seperate connections, ie usb and ps/2.  i personally think the required adapters make this one somewhat cost prohibitive for 28 inputs..

[Dekelia]

I saw this a little while ago.  I am already planning on pulling apart my 2 player X-Arcade to do exactly this, so I may just buy this kit and leave the x-arcade the way it is to pull out for 4 player games.

I think it is absolutely genious and I don't know why anyone wouldn't do this for any 2 player cab.  The ability to add ANY console (which have some great arcade style games) for a meager $20 is just fantasty flexibility.

[zaphod]

They used to sell this a while ago but pulled it from their store for some reason.  They wisely have chosen to reintroduce it.  My opinion is that is offers another alternative that, while definately not for everyone,  will satisfy some people's requirements.  I get questions sent to me on a somewhat frequent basis about person's wanting to build controllers that hooked to the PC and could be, easily, used with a DC, PS2, or Xbox.  Those persons would be the market.

As far as the X-arcade's encoder being buggy, I never once had a problem in the six months I used mine, and it saw a ton of gameplay.  Once I built my custom CP and used Andy's product, I could tell there was a definate difference in response (the I-pac being superior, obviously), but I don't consider the X-arcade's encoder crap by any stretch.  

[Hoagie_one]

its brilliant, in so far as it is the only good alternative for the console solution.

now with competition, prices may drop.

imagine if Randy or Andy got in on this action?

[rchadd]

i think an xbox adaptor for the ipac is in the pipeline

[MameMaster!]

....you know I have no idea what some people feel is bad with the encoder. I admit, I've never taken my XArcade apart to use the encoder on it's own...but factory "fresh" from XArcade...I've never once had a problem with either of my two solo's. They have worked perfectly every time with the PC or a console.

What sort of issues have some of you had? Are you talking about using the encoder on it's own? (ex. taking apart the XArcade for parts). Considering that the XArcade was never meant to be taken apart to be used for parts I would imagine that if there are encoder issues...could it be "operator error" and not a problem w/the encoder?

[rampy]

They did used to offer the encoder a la carte, but stopped...

The fricken trackball has been on pre-order pre-release for at least a year...
(I personally think that item would be a big hit with the pc golf crowd, if they'd get off their arse and release it)

The x-arcade's main benefit as pointed out before, is the interopability with different console systems in addition to PC.

It is a little pricey for my tastes if that 60 buck price was accurate someone quoted above...

The big issue with the xarcade (dual) is that the two sticks are two close together for two adults to play side by side comfortably...  also, the buttons are a little clickier and cheezier than true happs... but I use the x-arcade buttons and "super" clones on my cabinet and they function/feel fine and were uber cheap.  (although eventually i'll replace them with happs i think or at the least the switches to cherry brand)

I do want to integrate my dreamcast into my cabinet without hacking 2 sticks and a billion diodes, so I may consider this option...

*shrug*  YMMV

rampy

[Grasshopper]

At first glance this looks a very attractive (if expensive) option.

However, I was very disappointed when I contacted X-Arcade some time ago to find out whether their converters could be used with an Ipac. Basically I was fobbed off.

In my experience this is not a company run by enthusiasts. If you contact them the chances are they'll pass your query on to a salesman with no technical knowledge.

[Sephroth57]

I want Andy from Ipac to study this, make his own, and make it better. Cause i love all the i-pac products and i think with small improvements like being able to hook up to all systems without switching and maybe a deluxe model that comes with every adapter for a decent price would be awesome and its very doable

[arcadegamerz]

Hi guys,

I thought I'd take the time to address some of your unanswered questions, concerns and comments.

First off, I

[Gunstar Hero]

I gotta say, I likes the sound of this idea.

Does the X-Arcade hookup via USB, ps2 port or gameport tho?

[rjarcade]

....what issues did you have? I know some Mamer's don't like the parts (buttons/joystick) but I've personally never had any issues with the interface. Have you?   Just curious!

The interfaces never worked right in either unit.  One had a nonfunctional button, the other had two.  Key mapping was intermittent as well.  I tested each of them alone on two different PCs with and without keyboards connected.  I achieved partial functionality with each one, but even so they were occasionally glitchy.  I had assumed the nonfunctional buttons were due to a loose wire or two, so I opened them up, but the wiring looked okay.  The t-molding kept digging into my wrist to the point that it was painful so I decided to cut my loss and threw them in a landfill.  I have heard good things about x-arcade's service.  Clearly they have many satisfied customers.  I assume it was a fluke that I received two dog units, but since I was 0-2 and disappointed with the feel of the stick and t-molding, it seemed like a good excuse to start over and DIY.  If I come across as bitter, I apologize.

[Tiger-Heli]

I think they used to sell this encoder before, but I dunno.

Pretty cool, for those people that are planning on a cab for console game / pc at the same time

they used to be sold before.  tiger-heli has them on his encoder comparison page.  from what I understand, the card is the exact same thing as the one used in the retail controllers.  this means that you get the exact same, somewhat buggy, capabilities.  they all use that serial interface, so if you wanted to have multiple adapters connected, you would probably need a db-9 splitter or switch.  daisy chaining is somewhat sketchy -- there have been a couple posts recently about keyboard pass-thru issues so i would go with seperate connections, ie usb and ps/2.  i personally think the required adapters make this one somewhat cost prohibitive for 28 inputs..

What Bgnome said is correct.

I think (but not sure) a DB-9 switchbox could be hacked and made to work.

Not sure if this is what they were offering before or not.  From what I can see on the site (general layout and look and feel, also the mention of a programming switch and LED), I would say it is, but would like confirmation.

Would recommend going with all USB or PS/2 - USB rather than daisy-chaining.

Also - the previous units were similar to a positive gnd car electronics system - i.e. instead of individual +5V lines and a common gnd, you have individual GND line and a common +5V line.  Not a problem for standard joys and buttons, but it means you basically can't use it with P360 joysticks, FWIW!!!!

BTW, (not much) more info at http://www.mameworld.net/tigerheli/encoder/

[Grasshopper]

Hi guys,

I thought I'd take the time to address some of your unanswered questions, concerns and comments.

First off, I

[Tiger-Heli]

However, I'm a bit concerned when you say your adapters won't work with other encoders such as the Ipac. If there is a genuine technical reason for the incompatibility then fair enough, and I'd be interested to hear the explanation. However, if as you imply, your adapters have been deliberately designed not to work with competitors' products then I'm afraid you're going to alienate a lot of potential customers with that attitude.

I've never used them, but I don't see how it could NOT work with an I-PAC.

Both devices look like a keyboard to the computer.  If a daisy-chained keyboard will work with it, then a daisy-chained I-PAC will also.  It's possible that the X-Arcade disables the pass-thru for a small delay whenever an X-Arcade input is depressed.  In this case, you would either want to use the Macintosh adapter with the X-Arcade and the I-PAC as either USB or PS/2, or use the PC (PS/2) adapter with the X-Arcade and use the I-PAC in USB mode.  But I would think either solution should work.  The computer just thinks it has two keyboards connected. . .

[AndyWarne]

I am just guessing here but I suspect that the pins used on the 9-pin D plug which connects from the X-Arcade to a PC are not the same pins which are used by the adaptors. So when using adaptors the signal is not the same as a keyboard. This does make the design simpler because the adaptor does not need to be able to "read" PS/2 keyboard protocol which is rather quirky to say the least.
Our X-Box adaptor is totally keyboard compatible so will work with an I-PAC or any other PS/2 keyboard type of device. www.ultimarc.com/xbox_adap.html
It will be on sale in a couple of weeks. We had a delay on this because I wanted to sell it "cased" but the prototype casing I have just rejected and asked for a re-design as it was not very neat. So I'll be selling them uncased for now, with an optional casing later on. The price will be $35.
Andy

[zaphod]

YES!  Andy, you are the man!  I have at least one friend that will be making use of your newest product, once it is released.

[Tiger-Heli]

I am just guessing here but I suspect that the pins used on the 9-pin D plug which connects from the X-Arcade to a PC are not the same pins which are used by the adaptors. So when using adaptors the signal is not the same as a keyboard. This does make the design simpler because the adaptor does not need to be able to "read" PS/2 keyboard protocol which is rather quirky to say the least.
Our X-Box adaptor is totally keyboard compatible so will work with an I-PAC or any other PS/2 keyboard type of device. www.ultimarc.com/xbox_adap.html
It will be on sale in a couple of weeks. We had a delay on this because I wanted to sell it "cased" but the prototype casing I have just rejected and asked for a re-design as it was not very neat. So I'll be selling them uncased for now, with an optional casing later on. The price will be $35.
Andy

Someone correct me if I'm wrong (never used an X-Arcade), but I didn't think the 9-pin adapter connected directly to the PC.  I thought you connected a PS/2 or USB adapter to the 9-pin adapter which then went to the X-Arcade PCB.  So the device is functioning as PS/2 or USB regardless of the presence of the 9-pin adapter, which is basically just a disconnect.  Corrections?

[arcadegamerz]

To address the question, our X-Arcade connects to a PS/2 "connector" which changes the physical connection of the X-Arcade to connect directly into a keyboard's PS/2 port.

Our USB Adapter converts PS/2 based devices to USB connection, however we do not actively market the Adapter as anything more than an "X-Arcade USB Adapter."  

It's not the same for our game adapters----There is a genuine technical reason for the incompatibility; our adapters DO NOT CONVERT PS/2 Keyboard signals to game console signals.  

Hope this addresses your comments.

[Tiger-Heli]

To address the question, our X-Arcade connects to a PS/2 "connector" which changes the physical connection of the X-Arcade to connect directly into a keyboard's PS/2 port.

Our USB Adapter converts PS/2 based devices to USB connection, however we do not actively market the Adapter as anything more than an "X-Arcade USB Adapter."  

It's not the same for our game adapters----There is a genuine technical reason for the incompatibility; our adapters DO NOT CONVERT PS/2 Keyboard signals to game console signals.  

Hope this addresses your comments.

Okay, so to summarize (unless I understood incorrectly), the I-PAC, etc. should work fine alongside the X-Arcade DIY kit PCB for PC apps (MAME) but there is probably no way to use an I-PAC with a PS/2 or Nintendo connected to the X-Arcade PCB.

[arcadegamerz]

You would likely need to be using our  USB adapter and the I-PAC in PS/2 (other way around, or both in USB).  

There is no way to use OUR GAME CONSOLE ADAPTERS to let the I-PAC run on a game console.