Help...thinking about buying a Sega Model 3 game.

[Isamu]

Hi guys, I am interested in playing Sega's arcade racing game Daytona USA 2: Power Edition in the comfort of my own home. I own a Super Gun...a "home console" if you will, that allows you to play arcade JAMMA pcb boards on your regualar TV using either an S-Video signal or composite.

The problem is, from what I've heard, Sega's model 3 games require a dedicated harness that is NOT JAMMA compatible and is only feasible when used inside their decicated cabinets. I also hear that Daytona 2, Super GT and other model 3 games use a dedicated medium resolution (24.83kHz
scan rate) monitors to display the games, and that this cannot be converted to S-video, composite or VGA. Is this true?

Even if I bought the inside or "guts" of the arcade cabinet, isn't there a way I can build my own cabinet by mounting the wheel, stick shift and pedals where I want, while using the video signal's output with some sort of video scan converter?

I realize that it would be easier buying the cabinet whole and just playing the game on that, but you must realize I don't have the room to fit it in my home, and prefer to just own the cabinet's "inside" parts and mount the wheel, pedals, etc on some sort of sturdy table or something. That way, I save room. But, like I said, the biggest issue I'm concerned about involves whether an arcade game such as Daytona 2, that requires a medium resolution arcade analog rgb montor with a 24.83kHz scan rate, can be converted to either VGA, S-video or even component video. This is the biggest issue because I want to save money on buying the monitor and would like to play it on my 65" widescreen Toshiba rear projection TV instead.

I currently own a little device called TView Gold, and it converts VGA to S-video and I use it to play my PC games on my big screen.

http://www.focusinfo.com/products/tview_goldplus/tview_goldplus.htm

But I don't think it'll take a signal directly from an arcade video harness and convert it raw just like that, since the harness doesn't contain a 15pin VGA  out jack.

Here is a product that I found online that does some kind of scan converting but I haven't the faintest idea if this involves converting arcade rgb signals or not. Would this do the trick?

http://www.ptv-gmbh.de/catalog/analogway/vhx740.htm

Here's some info about the Model 3 board...

http://www.system16.com/sega/hrdw_model3step2_1.html

So, since I know little to nothing about video signal conversions and arcade pcb boards in general, I thought I'd ask you guys. I really want to be able to buy just inside cabinet parts and play this game on my big screen TV. I don't see how I can't be at all possible, even if a little wiring work is involved(which I would have my buddy take care of). Please point me in the right direction and tell me what you think about this idea. Can the video signal be converted or am I just SOL?

[isamu]

bump

[StephenH]

I have heard reports that 24Khz Medium Res monitors (EGA), can be hooked up to PCs.     I know a J-Pac will do it, but if your game is non-Jamma, you need to make your own adapter.

I have also heard reports that Windows can load on a 24Khz display, and ends up looking nice if done right.

[Isamu]

I have heard reports that 24Khz Medium Res monitors (EGA), can be hooked up to PCs.

[Superboss]

http://www.ultimarc.com/jpac.html

[Dave_K.]

Isamu, sorry if this is a lame response, but why bother paying huge dollars for the boards, when you can buy a $39 dreamcast and $19 Daytona 2 cd (outputs at VGA) and compatible with dc racing wheels also very cheap?

-Dave
(sorry I just can't get off this Dreamcast thing )

[Isamu]

Isamu, sorry if this is a lame response, but why bother paying huge dollars for the boards, when you can buy a $39 dreamcast and $19 Daytona 2 cd (outputs at VGA) and compatible with dc racing wheels also very cheap?

-Dave
(sorry I just can't get off this Dreamcast thing )

Don't worry Dave I'll forgive you:D

There are two simple reasons really...

1) Daytona USA 2: The Power Edition is NOT available for the DC...Daytona USA 1, with remixed Champion Edition tracks is.

2) The DC version doesn't have Force Feedback support.

[Dave_K.]

Ahh....I haven't seen this version before (I thought the one in the arcade was exactly the same as the dreamcast version...in fact I herd both are online compatible (play online with a DC v.s. arcade cab).  Anyway, knowing Sega, they will probably come out with this version for the PS2 or Xbox soon.

-Dave

[Isamu]

8-player Daytona 2 in my house wood RAWK!!

[Dave_K.]

You must have a pretty big living room to fit an 8 player daytona 2 setup in your house :-)

[isamu]

Hi guys

Just letting you know that I never got around to buying any model 3 PCB boards,  since I've been occupied with other things in the past couple of years.

However, my interest has been rekindled and I would like to pursue this project sometime between November and the end of the year. My main concern is trying to find out if I will be able to run the Daytona 2 and Super GT game boards from a USB PC  Force feedback wheel. I have discovered that there now appears to be Sega Model 3 to JAMMA conversion kits available. I am curious if anyone knows whether these kits...after being hooked up to a Super Gun.... will allow a standard PC FF steering wheel to work on the game.

Also regarding the video signal...I would like to know if these Model 3>JAMMA kits will convert the scan frequency of the video signal? Or will I need to obtain a seperate video scan converter? If so, will the iPAC do the trick?


Any advice, comments, etc are greatly appreciated.

[Wade]

I can't help you with using a PC wheel and pedals.  They aren't directly compatible, but there may be some unit like you are talking about which could use a PC wheel.  I would think it would be much better, and definitely easier, to just use the real controls.  What is the purpose of using a PC wheel instead of the real deal?

The M3->Jamma converters won't do a scan rate conversion.  You will need either an EGA/25mhz monitor, or you will need a device to convert the 25khz signal to something you can use.  This is really the sticking point of the whole idea - the EGA output from the M3 boards.  I'm sure such converters are available though, because I have seen other EGA and VGA games played on large screen TV's in the arcade, and I doubt all those large screen TV's take EGA or VGA natively.

Wade

[isamu]

I can't help you with using a PC wheel and pedals.  They aren't directly compatible, but there may be some unit like you are talking about which could use a PC wheel.  I would think it would be much better, and definitely easier, to just use the real controls.  What is the purpose of using a PC wheel instead of the real deal?

The M3->Jamma converters won't do a scan rate conversion.  You will need either an EGA/25mhz monitor, or you will need a device to convert the 25khz signal to something you can use.  This is really the sticking point of the whole idea - the EGA output from the M3 boards.  I'm sure such converters are available though, because I have seen other EGA and VGA games played on large screen TV's in the arcade, and I doubt all those large screen TV's take EGA or VGA natively.

Wade

Hello and thank you for the reply Wade

Regarding the PC wheel....after reading about Mark's Happ wheel to PS2 experiment, I am having second thoughts about using the PC wheel. Now...let me explain the reason that I originally had the PC wheel in mind.

There is a new PC Force Feedback steering wheel coming out called the *Speed 7 FF Wheel* from a company called "BRD"(Ball Racing Development). It is supposed to be the end all be all wheel of all wheels. The force feedback is supposed to be nothing short of superb.  I have been planning on buying this wheel for years, but BRD keeps delaying it. They now say it is coming out in November, but this is like the 10th time they've pushed the release back. It's getting frustrating waiting to say the least, and only encourages me to look for alternatives.

Now...after thinking about it, I realize that the Happ wheel could very well deliver the kind of "industrial" feel and force I am looking for(perhaps Mark can confirm this ), for a fraction of the price. Guess how much the BRD wheel is going to cost? Together with the pedals, I am looking at around $2000!!!!. Now, I wouldn't mind spending this much on a good quality FF wheel, but compared to the Happ wheel, which costs around $250 new, and the pedals around $100, we're talking about a HUUUGE savings!

Also, because it's a USB PC wheel, getting the Speed 7 wheel to work with Sega arcade M3 games seems like it's going to cost quite a bit more than getting a Happ wheel to work with it. After all, the Happ wheel *is* an arcade wheel, and practically the same arcade wheel used on the Midway/Atari and other cabs if I'm not mistaken.

As far as the video scan converter goes, I believe you're right...the M3>JAMMA converter does NOT convert the frequency. However, I found something that might do the trick. It's the *RGB to DVI Converter* from Scene Double. This will accept an EGA signal and convert it to DVI!!!!!!!!! I will look around for other alternatives but if you guys come up with anything else please let me know

Anyway it's still a couple months off so I will continue to look into my options and ask around.