Mini-CP Questions

[javeryh]

I posted some of this somewhere else but I probably would have more luck getting an answer here...

1.  If I am building a bar top machine to play only 4-way games how many action buttons should I include on the CP so I can play them all (or most of them anyway)?  Would 6 be overkill?  By 'action' buttons I mean the ones used during gameplay, not player 1/2 start, insert coin, pause, exit, etc...  Most of the mini-cabs I see have 3-4 'action' buttons on them...

2.  Do the switchable 4-way to 8-way sticks work well or would I be better off with dedicated sticks?  The reason I ask this is because I could try to do a switchable stick with the neo geo button set up to maximize the games I will be able to play on the mini-cab but if the control is going to be not as responsive, I'd rather not - I will probably be playing mostly pac-man, donkey kong, tapper and the like anyway...

3.  Would it be practical to include a trackball (my wife loves Centipede)? The CP will probably be about 16" x 5" or smaller depending on the monitor I choose.

This is going to be my first cab.  The wife just won't agree to a full sized 2P cabinet.  We have no where to put it, unfortunately.    If this comes out nice though I could always convince her otherwise...  Thanks!!

[Matjo]

I'm thinking about building the same thing. I like the CP on this tabletop cab:

http://www.zone76.com/Arcade_Projects/Mini_Arcade_Cabinet/Mini_Arcade_Cabinet_7.htm

[Jakobud]

1. six buttons is overkill.  4 max.  Most likely 3 will work great.

2. The only point of having a switchable is so... you can switch it.  If you are not planning on switching at all, I'd just stick with a dedicated.

3. Sure.

[neuromancer]

It all depends on the games you wanna play.

Bob

[Witchboard]

1.  Unless you play fighting games on Neo-Geo, you'll only need 3.  If you're a big KOF freak or something then put 4.

2.  A switchable joy would increase the amount of games you could play by a lot.

3.  Shouldn't be a problem.

If you haven't got your encoder yet, I would suggest pretty much getting everything from Ultimarc.  He's got switchable joys, buttons, the smaller trackballs and keyboard encoders.  That way you'll only have to pay shipping once and you'll have all you need.

Question about the above mini-cab... why would you need a top-fire joystick with just 1 joystick?  I thought the reason to have top fire joysticks is when you use 2 joysticks and need to push a button.  

[Tiger-Heli]

If you haven't got your encoder yet, I would suggest pretty much getting everything from Ultimarc.  He's got switchable joys, buttons, the smaller trackballs and keyboard encoders.  That way you'll only have to pay shipping once and you'll have all you need.

www.groovygamegear.com also has encoders, switchable joysticks, and buttons, no trackballs (yet?) though.

Question about the above mini-cab... why would you need a top-fire joystick with just 1 joystick?  I thought the reason to have top fire joysticks is when you use 2 joysticks and need to push a button.  

Only thing I could think of is maybe Tron or Mad Planets, using the trackball as a spinner . . .

[Witchboard]

www.groovygamegear.com also has encoders, switchable joysticks, and buttons, no trackballs (yet?) though.

That's why I didn't mention them.  I also didn't know how large the mounting plate is for the Omni-Stick Prodigy is.  All I could find is that it came with a paper template but no info on the dimensions of the plate.  Since he mentioned a 5" or smaller CP depth, I had concerns it may not fit.

[Tiger-Heli]

www.groovygamegear.com also has encoders, switchable joysticks, and buttons, no trackballs (yet?) though.

That's why I didn't mention them.  I also didn't know how large the mounting plate is for the Omni-Stick Prodigy is.  All I could find is that it came with a paper template but no info on the dimensions of the plate.  Since he mentioned a 5" or smaller CP depth, I had concerns it may not fit.

I missed that - it's 5" square, so that might be a problem.

[Witchboard]

Ah.  At least now I know for future reference.  He could probably still shoe-horn it in there if he didn't go smaller, but the main reason I mentioned Ultimarc was because of the trackball and savings on shipping.

[javeryh]

Thanks for the responses...  eh, 5" was just ball park - I could go bigger if it will benefit me in the long run.  Has anyone here tried the Omni-Stik Prodigy?  It seems like the perfect solution to what I'm looking to do...  

Also, I like the CP of the mini-cab posted above but I would probably layout the buttons a little differently - probably like the SF layout.  Also, I think I would move the trackball over to the left a little so I could use my left hand when I'm controlling it - I'd probably have to add a button or two on the right then to play trackball games then...  I'm going to lay it all out when I get home tonight to see if it would be too cluttered...

[Witchboard]

I'm thinking you may be running out of room pretty quickly.  You've just doubled the buttons your were talking about before.  Not to mention, you'll need space for your admin buttons.  You probably won't know how much space you'll have until you decide on a monitor size.  Let's look at what we got...

Omnistick Prodigy = 5"
Trackball Mounting Plate = 6"
Street Fighter button setup = around another 6" depending on how you like to space your buttons.

You're pushing your 16" width already.  I know it's hard to keep down the buttons when you think of all the games you'll be missing out on.  I tore my hair out thinking about this.  My decision?  I'm going to build two cabs. LOL  My first one is going to be a classic much like what you're working on.  My second is going to be different.

[javeryh]

yeah, I thought about this so I probably will end up making 2 cabs (at least - I have plans for a cocktail somewhere down the line).  I think I will get a lot of enjoyment out of the whole process because I like building things to begin with.  I'll probably build this one as a 4-way dedicated cab with 4 buttons and leave it at that.  The trackball, spinner and 8-way can be on my next (larger) cab.  It is tough though because I don't want to leave anything out but I guess that's the way it goes...

[javeryh]

OK, I think I've decided to go with the T-Stik Plus and a six button SF layout on the left and a 2-1/4" trackball on the right of the CP - I love fighting games...

1.  Do you think I could fit this comfortably in a 6" x 16" CP?
2.  If so, would there be room for two buttons (stacked vertically) to the right of the trackball for mouse buttons?

I'm trying to do the math but I don't know how far away the joystick and the 6 buttons have to be to be comfortable.  if this is going to be way too much clutter I will just have to get used to the idea of a simpler design that will play a very limited amount of games...  Thanks!

[pointdablame]

I would download the stencils available on the site at http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade.htm  They are at teh bottom of the page.

I'm not sure if there is a Tstick stencil out there, but it will at least give you a better idea.  Print them out and lay out the controls like you want.  Measure that and "play" with the controls to see if you think it'd be comfortable.

[Bgnome]

i think it is safe to assume that you can set up a joystick with a sf button layout within a 4"x9" space.  the trackball will require 6"x6".  you are looking at 15" right there.  the only space left to put more buttons is that 2" give above the joy/buttons for admin/start/coin..  now remember, this is REALLY tight and many people complain if they dont have space to lay their wrists when playing for extended periods of time..

if you look at the example pic, he fits 6 buttons in an ergonomic layout, which means that you could fit a standard sf layout there.  you may also consider forgoing the admin/start/coin buttons by using shift/key combos, (or get smaller buttons), to allow for wrist space or to look less cluttered..

this is a quick and dirty example i threw together with the online icpd at http://www.move360media.com/mame/icpd/Launch.htm

[javeryh]

Thanks!  That program is very useful.  The two additional mouse buttons are not admin buttons - I'm putting all of those on the front of the CP to save valuable space.  I thought it might be awkward to use the trackball with my right hand...  Maybe the trackball is a pipe dream for my mini-CP but I'm still going to try.  I'll route the crap out of the top panel if I have to!!  

[Witchboard]

Don't forget to give yourself room to mount start buttons from the front as well.  You could end up hitting buttons mounted from the top if your not careful with such a small space.

[javeryh]

I'm going to base the front off of bishmasterb's mini-Tron cabinet.  He used 8 buttons on the front of the CP (1P, 2P, coin, pause, exit, power, reset, and menu)...  it's a very nice design IMO...

[Witchboard]

Okay.  I didn't know how tall you planned on making your CP.  Mine will be only 5" at the front so I had to do some dodging with my front buttons to avoid hitting buttons mounted from the top.

[Lilwolf]

btw, if you don't have much room for a trackball, you might consider a spinner instead.

mainly, many trackball games you need some room to spin it, and need some space to wack it.

But my favorite trackball games, it doesn't matter (play centipede more then any other trackball game)

[Gunstar Hero]

Question about the above mini-cab... why would you need a top-fire joystick with just 1 joystick?  I thought the reason to have top fire joysticks is when you use 2 joysticks and need to push a button.  

You could also use a top fire stick for games like Ninja Gaiden and Silk Worm.

[Witchboard]

Oh yeah.  I forgot about Ninja Gaiden.  I can honestly say I've never played Silk Worm.

[javeryh]

OK, I'm ready to order.... Here's the list of stuff I think I need to get started from Ultimarc for my CP - if I'm missing anything let me know!

(1) MiniPac (I can wire everything to this, correct?)
(1) T-Stick Plus - 4/8 switchable
(12) action buttons
(1) P1 button
(1) P2 button
(1) 2-1/4" Trackball
(1) Trackball mounting plate
assorted wires
Router (for flush mount of TB plate)
1-1/8" forstner bit (for drilling button and joystick holes)

Anything else I need for the CP?  It's going to look almost exactly like the one bgnome posted above (minus the black and white mouse buttons - I'm just going to wire those to the action buttons)...

[Gumby]

Why not do a switchable control panel?

Have one CP with your joystick and 6-7 buttons, centered and all so that there is plenty of room on the left and the right for wrists...

and a second CP with a trackball and other buttons, or a spinner, etc...

Since its so small, would be easy to switch between the two using molex connectors and such, maybe even quick releases on the sides.  And, since they are small and not too heavy, you could have a way that the nonused CP could sit on the back of the unit, some kind of holder that still looks cool.

Just an idea.

-G

[Xiaou2]

or, you could make the thing have 3 or 4 sides worth of control panels.  The monitor top or  the control panel base could rotate 350 degrees.

 Trackball idea:   Because you need about a  foot of  runway for your hand to use this well... it may be possible to make a pull out drawer like exteneder - that locks in place  when fully  extended.

  Would be cool if mini controls were available : )    I recall Rtype had the smallest balltop joy Id ever seen (like 1.5" tall)   however... I do not recall the footprint size from the underside.

  Needs a spinner for sure tho.  No tempest, arkanoid, star trek, turbo, supersprint?