UPDATE - TURNING BAD! found orig. side art under paint - now what?

[megashock5]

UPDATE AT THE BOTTOM - SCROLL DOWN
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Okay, I'm getting started converting this into a MAME cabinet. It knew it was originally a Pac-Man machine, but it was converted to Galaga 3 somewhere along the line. But, all they did was swap out the board and marquee, add a couple fire buttons, and paint the sides black (badly at that) - so I didn't think it was salvagable. Plus, it wouldn't turn on any more.

I was just trying to smooth it out (the stuff you see all over it is wood filler) and there was a hunk of gum or something on it, so I tried to scrape it off with a razor blade. It took a little of the paint off and I saw yellow underneath. I kept going to see if the art was actually intact and it looks like it's in pretty good shape.

So I'm not sure what to do. I don't have the mother board, marquee, or correct control panel or bezel for Pac-Man (again, it was Galaga 3). I couldn't get it working the way it was anyway, so I had taken all of the insides out, including the monitor. Also, I don't want just one game anyway - I'm planning on having many many games on here. However, I don't have it in me to paint over this art since it looks like it can be restored pretty easily.

How much am I going to offend purists if I restore the side art, but still make this a MAME cabinet with multiple sticks, track ball, and spinner? Again, I don't have the PM board or marquee anyway.

Also, what should I try to take the black paint off with?

thanks in advance for any suggestions!

[menace]

so far the general consensus has been the 3M safe stripper --not sure where to get it--safest thing to do would be to ask the paint guys at home depot--what will strip latex but leave everything else untouched.  I see no problem with having a mame machine inside an original cab so long as you don't hack up the original to do so.  Although pacman's and ms. pacman due tend to bring in some bucks when they are sold complete.

Just say no to the frankenpanel!!

[Magnet_Eye]

Oh crap..here we go again!

Well, this would NOT be the choice cabinet to make into a MAME machine by most of us here. I don't know what type of MAME cab you are looking to build, but you have a one player cabinet here...so if you are looking to build a 2 player "frankenpanel" cab, this is useless to you.

First,  see how well you can restore the pacman artwork, then go from there.

I kinda think it would be cool if you could copnvert it BACK to a pac-man, and it would be worth MUCH MORE that way than as a MAME'd machine, IMO.

[maraxle]

so far the general consensus has been the 3M safe stripper --not sure where to get it

Lowe's carries it.  It works like a charm.

[Lilwolf]

Its a GREAT cabinet to mame..

As long as it only has a 4way controller, and with a vertical arcade monitor.

And while your doing it... make it so you use the original wiring..

IE, if you make it into a great vertical classic cab... The refinish it up back to original... But make sure you can put the pac back into it without any trouble.

MUCH better then not doing anything to it.  

btw, I hear the safe stripper is good... Let us know how it comes out!

[APFelon]

I have had four Pac-Man machines come through my door in the last year. Each time I was optomistic about salvaging the sideart under the formica/paint, and each time I was sorely disappointed.

Unless you feel like dropping a bundle on stencils, a bezel, a PCB, a CP, a marquee, various paints and spending a whole lot of time working on the cab just to return it to it's "former glory", I'd say MAME it. It is also very unlikely, unless you restore a lot Pac-Man machines, that you would ever turn profit should you decide to sell it.

I went through this (the politics of MAMEing a Pac machine) on this forum a year or so ago. Some will say go for it, some will wring their hands and lament the passing of a Pac machine into MAMEland. Ultimately, it's up to you and how you want to spend your time and money.

APf

[SirPeale]

I will say that Pac-Man cabinets are extremely common.  If you Mame it, just don't bolt a four player CP on to it.  

[megashock5]

My plan is for a 2-player panel - so not original by any means, but not an enormous 4-player one either.

The problem with making it a 'real' Pac-Man machine (like I mentioned before) is that I don't have the mother board, the marquee, the bezel or the control panel for it. This had a Galaga 3 board and marquee and some generic control panel overlay with mismatched fire buttons. So, I don't have the stuff to do it. Beyond that, I don't know *how* to do it. It took me a couple of months to work up the nerve to take the monitor out because I was afraid I was going to shock myself.

So what I want is a 2-player MAME machine with a regular monitor so I can play old console games as well. I have the old vertical monitor, and I think it works, but it doesn't really fit what I want to do and I have no idea how to wire this old stuff.

I guess my choices are - go ahead with my plan or see if anyone is interested in buying this to restore it the right way and build my own from scratch.

[APFelon]

I'd be interested in buying or trading for the monitor chassis if you feel like shipping it to Minnesota. (the chassis is the circuitry on the monitor--- essentially everything but the tube). Let me know if you want or are looking for or if you are interested at all.

And as for offending the purists- sounds like your plan for the cabinet is a nice clean design. I wouldn't worry about it.

APf
 

[megashock5]

AP,

Is the tube just the very back piece? Sorry, I don't know much about this stuff.

As far as my plan - while I am looking to have two 8-way sticks, one 4-way, trackball and spinner, I am going to do everything I can to make this look nice and tasteful.

I'm a designer for a living (unfortunately, not a craftsman) and I really do care what it ends up looking like. But I don't have any idea how to correctly restore something like this to it's original state, and I want a machine that plays a lot of games.

If there is anyone out there who is really interested in returning this thing to it's 'former glory' I'd be willing to sell it to someone who would do right by it and use the money to build my own cabinet.

[SirPeale]

Why don't you use the original monitor?

[pointdablame]

The problem that many people (including myself) will have with this, is that there is NO way to fit all those controls on a PacMan control panel.  You'll be forced to build an oversized CP which IMHO looks terrible on a classic cab.

If you can figure out a way to mount this oversized CP without affecting the cabinet at all, you could at least avoid some "you destroyed a pac!" comments, but it still destroys the overall feel of the pacman (again, just IMO).

I personally would put some ads up on other forums and RGVAC etc etc and see if anyone would be willing to trade you a generic 25" conversion cabinet for your MAME machine.  That way, someone can restore the pac (although like Peale said, they are pretty common) and you'll get a nice cab to start off with for your MAME cab.  You could also use a bigger TV/monitor if you can get a 25" cab of course.

Just my .02

[megashock5]

Peale, my problem with using the original monitor is that I want to run console emulators which would be tiny on a vertical monitor.

Plus, as I mentioned originally, this cabinet wasn't working when I started gutting it. I don't know enough to know why. I think the monitor works, the tube at the back glows when plugged in, but I don't even know how to hook up this kind of monitor.

I'm a *major* newbie here and not really mechanically inclined, I'm afraid.

Thanks for the suggestion, I think I'll post a 'for sale/trade' thread. I'd be willing to let someone restore it if I could get another cab to work on. I'm just not the guy to restore it, I simply don't know enough.

[APFelon]

Since you are going to sell the cab in its entirety, you'll probably want to sell the monitor and chassis along with it. I won't press you any more on it, but for future reference:

The tube is the glass- the actual part of the monitor you look at and everything behind it. It is a single piece, and the heaviest.

The neckboard is the electronics directly behind (and attached to) the tube. It attaches to the skinniestpart of the tube, which controls the images on the screen (a bit vague, but I think you get my meaning)

The other piece is the chassis. It sits in a metal tray either under the tube or to the right of it (since you have a vert. monitor, yours should be to the right)... or is it left? My memory is crappy in the morning.

More detailed (and probably more accurate) monitor information is available on this forum and elsewhere if you are interested.

APf

[megashock5]

AP, let me see if anyone is interested in it with the cabinet first. But if I don't get any bites, I'd certainly be willing to talk more about it. I just wonder how much shipping would be.

thanks for your help

[pointdablame]

Just a note since you said you are new to this... don't go poking around near the monitor.  If you say the monitor is glowing, there is a charge in the monitor at least.  That suction cup that is attached to the tube (glass part) in the back has enough electricity to potentially kill you.  Steer clear unless you know what you're doing.

[megashock5]

^ thanks for the warning. I'd actually read that on here a few months ago and, as a result, didn't take the monitor out for the longest time.

I finally got it out though. I laid the cab on it's side and slid some styrofoam under the monitor. Then I undid all the screws/bolts (avoiding touching anything on the back of the monitor) so that the weight just transferred onto the styrofoam. Then I drug the whole thing out by the metal frame.

I'm glad I read that here though. Otherwise I would very likely have injured myself.

[SirPoonga]

If you try and get the original art back you might have some trouble with this cabinet.  The artwork is painted on.  If you end up "going to far" with whatever method you can always get official repo art from www.twobits.com

[RayB]

I don't think this guy will plunk down $285 for repro side-art.

My two cents (taing into consideration what a NOOB he is): Clean off all that black paint as best as you can. If the original artwork looks nice. Then leave it as is.

Next, does the control panel already have extra holes in it? It must at least have a couple holes in it for fire buttons. MAME it and run what games you can with those limited controls. And keep the original "guts" for if you sell the cab.

Now the thing is, someone mentioned you're INTENDING to sell this? In which case I'd say, don't bother wasting your time hacking up this cab, especially if you are a NOOB, if all you're going to do is sell it. Find someone who WANTS to restore it to a Pacman and then get yourself another stripped cab (which as we all know, can be easily found for free or $50 tops).

[fredster]

He could try to make stencils.  There's a couple of examples of stencils that helped restore a cab.

It would take some time, but the end result would be great.

[megashock5]

Just to clear some things up:

It wasn't originally my intent to sell anything.

I had an old Galaga 3 that stopped working (and never looked very nice - I won it years ago and it looked like this).

Since I don't know how to fix these old machines, I thought I'd convert it to a MAME cabinet. HOWEVER, now that I've found this art underneath I just want to see if anyone wants to buy it or trade me for another cab so I can make my MAME machine.

What I want is a 2-play cabinet to run MAME as well as the NES, SNES, Genesis & TG16 console emulators. That's all, I want to build something where I can play the games I remember so fondly. That's it. Not to try and sell anything.

I was going to use this cabinet since I have it. If someone wants to try to restore this, however, I'm willing to do another cabinet instead. I just don't have another one.

And yes, I am a NOOB. Just a guy who loves these old games and wanted to build something to play them on. A true restoration is beyond what I can do.


ps. tried Lowe's and Home Depot for the 3M Safe Stripper with no luck. Has anyone used Goof Off? They had that both places. If I can get the rest of the paint off, I'll post another pic.

[spriggy]

Don't you love mild mamepolitical opinion-based banter?  

Anyway..... Just a quick side note for reference!

In relation to the 'safe stripper', go to my reply on another thread for a brief glimpse of what this stuff can do.  I'm not complaining!!  

http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=21121;start=msg170837#msg170837

This 'Cosmic Guerilla' resto is a little bit different to your job, as your Pac sideart was originally stenciled, unlike the 'Guerilla's', so increased care and more frequent paint testing would have to apply.

[Magnet_Eye]

As far as my plan - while I am looking to have two 8-way sticks, one 4-way, trackball and spinner, I am going to do everything I can to make this look nice and tasteful.

Yeah, this just won't be possible with this cabinet. It would be best to let someone else have a go at it and get yourself a more suitable cab.

Best of luck to ya!  

[Todd H]

I'd restore all of the Pac-Man artwork, marquee, etc. but still use MAME to play as many vertical 4-way games as I could on it.  I'd put one 4-way joystick with one or two buttons and leave it at that.

[SaiNRuB]

ps. tried Lowe's and Home Depot for the 3M Safe Stripper with no luck. Has anyone used Goof Off? They had that both places. If I can get the rest of the paint off, I'll post another pic.

The lowes in my area didnt have it either , I ended up finding it at Menards.

[paigeoliver]

That is the worlds most common cabinet. Sand it down, paint it nice, and then get the multicade artwork from www.arcadeshop.com (bezel, marquee, and CPO), it will look awesome. Pac artwork is not the most salvageable artwork around.

Also people, they are ALL classic cabinets, every last one of them. Conversion cabinets of dedicated games outnumber generic dynamos like 25 to one. Almost any cabinet you buy will have originally been Pac-Man, Defender, Berzerk, Scramble, or Time Pilot or something originally.

[maraxle]

ps. tried Lowe's and Home Depot for the 3M Safe Stripper with no luck. Has anyone used Goof Off? They had that both places. If I can get the rest of the paint off, I'll post another pic.

Goof Off will eat the Pac-Man art as well as the black stuff.  Keep looking for the 3M Safest Stripper.  It's weak enough to where it's your best bet.

[megashock5]

My plan was alway to do the mulitcade thing - so I already worked up a marquee and everything. Scott at MameMarquees.com was going to print it up for me.

I'm hearing people say that this cabinet won't make a good 2-player machine. I'd gladly trade this one for one that would be a better candidate.

Not to complain, as everytime I ask for help at this site the people have been incredibly helpful, but it seems like I'm getting a lot of responses that are ignoring what I'm saying. I appreciate the suggestions, but I'm not going to restore this cabinet and I don't want a 1-player vertical monitor machine.

I'm almost to the point where I'll trade it for a sheet of MDF. I just want to build a multiple game machine. I'd love to swap this for a dynamo cab or something, but I haven't gotten any offers.

If I can ever find the 3M Safe Stripper I'll try to get all the black paint off and post a new pic.

[RayB]

I've read elsewhere that Goof Off is good too.

Strip the black off, then sell the cab.

And to that other guy: There have been alot more companies making generic cabs than just Dynamo...

~Ray B

[pointdablame]

I don't think people aren't listening to you, its just your plans and your cab don't match up very well.

A pacman cab won't make a great 2 player do-all CP machine.  There simply isn't enough room to cram 2 players plus spinner and trackball without creating some ghastly oversized CP that IMO destroys the look of the cab.  We (at least I) understand what you're going for, but a vertical 1p Pac cab is not a great choice for a horizontal 2player MAME machine, at least in my opinion.

Hopefully you'll be able to find a cab better suited for what you want.  You're too far away from me or I might consider trading you my Midway cab for it.  

[megashock5]

Yeah, I know what you're saying - and I'm glad that I know that now before I get too far along. I'd really like to swap this for one more suitable, but haven't had any offers.

In reference to not listening, I was talking about being told to restore it or make it a one-player, vertical monitor cab. I've tried to be very clear about my end goal.

Please don't get me wrong though. I really do appreciate all of the input. I'm just frustrated that what I have won't work well, and I don't know how to get a new one or get rid of this one.

[APFelon]

Most people probably just read your first entry and clicked "reply". There are no shortage of lazy readers and skimmers on the Internet.

I will give you some options, and I will try and paint this as realistically as possible for you (along with a healthy dose of opinion).

Look to buy a new cab that will fit your needs. A lot of people will be put off with a straight-up trade for a CP with a little real estate for one with a lot of real estate.

Big cabs are not expensive. I just bought a dedicated NBA Hangtime with no monitor for 75$. What you may save in money buying and building with MDF, you will be spending time... which I think has a little more value than a few dollars.

Don't get frustrated of a cab doesn't come tumbling from the sky. Good deals are out there if you wait... and it probably won't be a very ong wait.

Buy a can and sell the Pac for what you paid for it.... or give it away. I think you are going to have to start from scratch.

Or just part it out and trade the stuff (bezel, chassis, monitor, CP and the like) and you will be well on your way.

My offer on the chassis still stands. Just let me know what you are looking for (something shippable) and I'll see if I can come up with it... or pay you 20$ or whatever.

Good luck. This is a fun hobby, and while you may be frustrated at the beginning, the rewards are worth it. My son and I enjoy playing TMNT before bedtime, and my guests love it.

APf

[megashock5]

Thanks, Felon.

I'm completely with you. I can't wait to do this. Ever since I found this site it's all I can think about. I just thought I could get started and now feel like I've taken a step back.

I bought the Project:Arcade book a couple of months ago. Maybe I should look into the plans that came with it.

[ForKChop]

Just keep your eyes and ears open, there are cabs out there, even when you think there's nothing in your area.  When I started I couldn't find anything around me, eventally after calling about 25 people I came up with a good cab.  Since then?  It's been another couple months and they're all over, just have to know where to look I guess.  Give it some time, one will come to you.

Plus, it's usually a lot cheaper to buy a stripped cab than build one.  Just speaking of materials, not even tool cost.

Maybe work on the control panel first and get that going while you wait for the cab?

[paigeoliver]

Pacs make perfectly fine 2 player cabinets, they are 24" wide just like darn near every other 19" monitor cabinet ever made, and many of them were eventually converted to two player games.

Not gonna fit a spinner or trackball, but a 2 player streetfighter layout fits with room to spare.

[RayB]

There's limited room, but I think the reason most people say it's no good is because it's the kind of cabinet where the sides come all the way to the front of the control panel, which means when 2 people are standing side by side, there's bound to be a scraped fore-arm on the side of the cab! Whereas cabs with the panel that sticks out a bit from the sides, is better suited to 2 people side by side.

Mega: I'd buy that Pac but I live in Ontario Canada.

[paigeoliver]

Hmm, I have had Top Gunner and Clutch Hitter in Pac cabs, and both got plenty of two player action. Only seems cramped if you are way too used to pedestal cabinets.

[megashock5]

Arrrrrgggghhh!!

I FINALLY found the 3M Safest Stripper stuff and followed the directions  - but most of the black paint still isn't coming off, and where it is the PacMan art is coming off with it!

I'm frustrated and depressed. I'm just making this thing worse. If anyone wants to rescue this thing, please come and get it. Like I said, I have the monitor too. I'd just like a few bucks to go buy some MDF. It's either build something or stick a frankenpanel on this thing, as I apparently lack the skill to save it.

[spriggy]

Let's see if I can change your mind with my opinion.

~ Firstly, you have in your possession the orginal 'Game of the Century', as declared at a past, fairly recent 'Tokyo Game Show'.

~ Your not the monkey who painted over this classic in the first place.  At least your trying to correct someones grave mistake, especially if the artwork was fine before it was painted over.  Damn..experienced restorers have made comments about the difficulty of recovering Pacman sideart from being painted over, for the SAME REASONS AS YOU ARE EXPERIENCING.  Don't be to hard on yourself.

~ You stated that you 'lack the skill to save it'.  I will bet my left nut that almost all of the home arcade cabinet nutters/builders/restorers didn't learn their skills at 'Andy Fromms Arcade School' or similar classes/seminars.  They learnt the same way you are.  THE HARD WAY!.
How about you use the cabinet as a resource to LEARN to restore an original cabinet.  You have some parts.  You will have no problems sourcing clapped out brackets, panels and other small items that pretty much just need a strip back and paint or simple rewire.  Obviously, money becomes an issue for some people (no fault of their own) when you start buying pcbs/working or repaired monitors/artwork.   Giving the cabinet a nice paint job and bringing her generally back to life is relatively cheap.  Even without a spray gun, I've seen great finishes with a cheap foam roller (you only have to browse this forum to see that).  Original marquees and bezels are relatively cheap and can be found in very usable condition.  Keep this as an ongoing restoration and you'll learn everything you need to build cabinets from scratch.   Now you just have to decide whether you really want to spend the money at a later date to finish her (pcb/sideart etc.).

~ At the end of it all,  you can stand back and see the before and after restoration pictures and wonder why you ever thought of selling her!!

That's my opinion anyway.

Game On.. Not Over!!

[RayB]

I'm tempted to flip-flop at this point and say that if the original art is now getting wrecked, then just sand it and mame the damn thing. :-D