Obligatory Orange T-Molding

[Bitnerd]

Hey y'all,

I am getting ready order some orange T-molding for a pacman upright I am restoring.  Can someone tell me what is the best way to afix the t-molding?  Do I use some sort of adhesive?

Thank you,

Bitnerd.

[DYNAGOD]

if anything i would imagine plain old wood glue would do the trick just fine.

[DrewKaree]

Use the search and look for T-molding - I've seen several examples of this question and the answer for it.

[NoOne=NBA=]

Usually, it just gets whacked into place on the routed groove.
For a pac cab, you really shouldn't HAVE to use anything.
If  you run into problems getting it to stay on an older machine like you have, THEN you can use a LITTLE bit of adhesive to keep it in place on the trouble areas.

I had to glue the inside curves on my cab; but that was due to the router blowing out an entire layer of the plywood on my cab while cutting the slot.
The router bit I had worked perfect on the solid wood I tested it on; but was so close to the thickness of the middle layer of plywood that it took the entire layer out.

I personally used 90 second epoxy to glue mine because I didn't want to have to wait for a longer setting adhesive.

[Bitnerd]

Hey NoOne,

That is exactly what I was afraid of.  The machine being as old as it is and has probably had 3 different sets of t-molding on there over the years, I figured I would have to use some sort of adhesive.  I will try to get get it to stay on it's own but if not, I will try the stuff you suggest.  Thanx again bro.

Bitnerd.

[DrewKaree]

STOP RIGHT WHERE YOU ARE!

I figured from your original question you just didn't know how to put this stuff on!

You can use adhesives to do this (NoOne NBA enjoys the fumes, I think!  or the Tim Taylor fixit methods ).

If you do NOT want to use adhesives, what I am about to tell you will actualy strengthen the edges of your cab as well as eliminate the adhesive need.  You MUST re-route a slot, though.  

Find wood putty (water-soluble is easiest to work with) that is sandable/stainable and take a putty knife to fill in the slot.  (This will take time and effort.  Is it worth your time and effort for the benefits I listed above?)  Re-route the t-slot and hammer the molding in.

I have some pre-conceived notions......don't know how involved you want to get, but you're restoring, so...

[Bitnerd]

Thanx for the tips drew.  I am not sure I am ready to route just yet.  Not sure I know how to keep it straight and all. If you could direct me to a faq or page that gives details on how to do this successfully I wouldn't mind checking it out.  I may have to go with adhesives this time around until i can find an old cabinet I can practive routing on.

Bitnerd

[NoOne=NBA=]

I hate routing the T-molding slots, so I only use the "putty/rerout" method when ABSOLUTELY necessary.
(Read--I messed up another slot, and can't fix it any other way).

Another method I have had luck with is to put a piece of double sided tape over the spline in the trouble spots before hammering it into place.
The adhesive gives it just a little extra grab, and the backing part of the tape makes the spline just a hair wider.

I don't think I'd try that method on an inside curve, but for a Pac cab I think it would probably work as well as adhesive.

[Stingray]

NoOne=NBA= has a better idea IMO. The putty/ re-routing idea sounds too much like work to me, and I'm generally pretty opposed to work.  

-S

[General Zod]

When applying t-mold to older cabs, I usually need to use the good ol' hot glue gun. You'll find it's easy to use, and will save the aggrivation of putty and routing.

[NoOne=NBA=]

Did anyone catch the fact that Drew was accusing ME of supporting the "Tim Taylor" method, while HE was the one suggesting that you whip out the power tools and remake a groove that was already there to begin with?

That sounds an awful lot like the pot calling the kettle black, don't you think?

[DrewKaree]

Hey kettle, you're black!

Actually, I always seem to read about epoxy and I see your sig with the duct tape.  I recall reading something about you epoxying and having to open all orifices in the house to clear the stink out....don't remember all of it, but had a good laugh picturing you gettin' all loopy from the fumes!  LOL

nerd, if you're not comfortable with a router, then take the adhesive method (or if you're allergic to work like stingray  ) because not only can you screw it up, but you might even take a whack at killing yourself.  

I actually hate using a router to do that slot, and quit doing it that way.  I use a biscuit cutter to do it, instead, as it's got a plate to fold down against your workpiece and makes it almost fool-proof (unless you're adetermined fool) as there's no skill needed to do it that way.  Set it up, test on a piece of scrap, fine-tune if necessary, and fire away when dead-on.  

If you have a router, get a router table.  Use this in the same fashion.  

Less work IS preferable, but if there's already a gaping chasm to put your T-molding in, I'm pretty confident that you'll find it hard to get a satisfactory result with just using adhesive.  

I can't see your cab, so I'm going on your description, and I picture you having to glob so much adhesive in there to keep it  1)in place, 2)centered, and 3)neat/clean.

If all else fails, slap a 350 with some headers in there, 4 barrel carb and....whoops, sorry Al.  

[Gideon]

I actually hate using a router to do that slot, and quit doing it that way.  I use a biscuit cutter to do it, instead, as it's got a plate to fold down against your workpiece and makes it almost fool-proof (unless you're adetermined fool) as there's no skill needed to do it that way.  Set it up, test on a piece of scrap, fine-tune if necessary, and fire away when dead-on.  some headers in there, 4 barrel carb and....whoops, sorry Al.

If this is true, why do most people use a router?

[DougHillman]

No offense meant, as each of us have our own difficulties at tasks that others may find simple, but I can't see how using a router with a proper groove cutting bit is problematic.

You set it up with the guide bearing and zip zip, you're done.  Doesn't really take any particular skill.  Essentially the same as using a biscuit cutter.

[19rjs99]

Lightly use some Clear silicone adhesive in the slot. Let it dry This acts a a filler and also the rubbery texture adds grip.

RS

[DeathDealer]

I use hot glue for T-molding that does not want to stay in the groove.  It works exellent and its pretty hard to get out.Hope it helps!!

[DrewKaree]

If this is true, why do most people use a router?

Lemme explain; I do LOTS of cabinet work and require a dedicated biscuit cutter.  It does one thing, and does that one thing easier than anything else.  

Picture the difference between using a brace & bit and a drill/bit combo.  They both do the same thing, one does it easier.  Check a biscuit cutter out.  The fence allows you to keep a hand on that to keep it in contact with the workpiece while the other operates the tool.  In use, I find it easier (therefore better).  

Doug IS correct in saying it isn't problematic to use a router, however, a quick search of this board will show you multiple examples of router mistakes.  I would stake tall cash on the biscuit cutter giving excellent results while being easier to use.

To further answer the question of why most people use a router, let me take a quick poll.  

Everyone who would spend $100+ dollars on a tool that can ONLY do one thing (and you will probably NEVER use it again) instead of a tool that could do multiple things, raise your hand.  

See, no one raised their hand.  (btw, try running that same question by a wife.  Bet she has a problem with the router too!)

That's the REAL reason most people use a router.  Building a cab is expensive enough without buying single-use power tools they'll never need again.  I happen to possess BOTH tools, including a slot-cutting bit for my router; without fail I reach for the biscuit cutter.

If they made biscuit cutters in the $20 range, I state without reservation that it would FAST become the "recommended" way on this forum to cut t-molding slots.  A dedicated biscuit cutter is easier to keep in contact with your workpiece and adjusts easily, thereby making it easier to get a better final product, which is all anyone is trying to achieve with their cab.  

I posted that info IN CASE he had one, but also for others who DO have one and may have never thought to use it for this purpose, and for someone who may have been able to talk their wife into letting them spend that much on a single-use tool.

[Gideon]

I see.  Thanks for clearing that up.

[NoOne=NBA=]

I'd never thought about using a biscuit cutter for T-molding.
That would solve the "rollover" problems on corners, which I think are the most common "oops" made.

And, for the record, opening all the windows was NOT because I was getting loopy on the epoxy fumes.
It was actually to prevent my wife from throwing me through one when she got home.

[Bitnerd]

Damn guys, I didn't think this question was going to lead to an all out ground war!    I do appreciate everyones input though.  I am ordering the T-molding this Friday.  I have a sneaking suspicion that my new dremel is going to become my best friend on projects like this.



P.S.  Hmmmmmmm maybe the term "ground war" was too strong here.  Y'all kept it pretty civil.

[NoOne=NBA=]

I would classify it as friendly banter.
The end result of that friendly banter is that you now have several different options available to solve your problem.

[DrewKaree]

yah, the minute I start taking myself too seriously is the moment I start a downward spiral, eventually leading to a 9-5 job in a cubicle, pushing papers, wondering what meaning my life would have....wait a minute, I WOULD be needed in that scenario!  Those papers don't push themselves, you know!

Like NoOneNBA said, now you know several ways to do it.  IMO, it'd be criminal to post around here asking for help over and over without adding to something in an area which you have lots of experience and might have an easier/better/more stable way to do things.  

Look around the internet.  99% of ANY other message boards you read are nothing but derogatory towards those who DON'T know, rather than helping them get to be someone who DOES know!  Now compare it to here.  OSCAR makes MONEY selling his products, and yet, he'll be one of the most helpful/useful people regarding setting up a hack for something, even though he's sorta "givin' the milk away for free".  

You now have enough info to make a choice in one of several directions.  Others might do it differently; doesn't make them wrong, just makes them different.  If I asked and they gave me a way I never thought of, if possible, I'd give it a go just to see if it's better than my way.  That's how most "established methods" come about, trial and error.  I look at it as "I just learned something".  See -->HERE<-- for another take on it.

[Bitnerd]

I couldn't agree with you all enough.  I like the feel of this board.  Definantly a good place to learn.  I guess if I had to go back and say it all over again, (not going to erase my original post) I should have said, I am suprised that t-molding generated so much debate.  It is nice to have so many choices to choose from.  Thank you all again for your help.


Bitnerd

[DougHillman]

You now have enough info to make a choice in one of several directions.  Others might do it differently; doesn't make them wrong, just makes them different.  If I asked and they gave me a way I never thought of, if possible, I'd give it a go just to see if it's better than my way.  That's how most "established methods" come about, trial and error.  I look at it as "I just learned something".  See -->HERE<-- for another take on it.

Exactly.  The thread I started on modular control panels is another example of the same.  Multiple approaches to the same problem and similar approaches to different problems.  Seeing how others are tackling a modular CP is useful for everyone who's doing it.  The ideas presented germinated some new thoughts in my head and I've since redesigned the way I'm building mine.

D

[Wade]

When applying t-mold to older cabs, I usually need to use the good ol' hot glue gun. You'll find it's easy to use, and will save the aggrivation of putty and routing.

FWIW, I have tried the hot glue method twice and it didn't work well for me.  It dries too fast for me to get it situated in the slot just right.  Since then I have just used some standard Elmer's glue and used some tape to hold it in while it dried overnight.  Been real happy with this method so far.

Wade