How to get working Player 2 Controller in this Homemade Arcade?

[Selxion]

 This is a Homemade Arcade that my brother bought a time ago, they gave it to my sister recently. The coins Slot Machine doesn't work but I don't care that we can use a keyboard and that fixes the problem.

But we need the Player 2 Buttons and Joystick, they donīt do anything and this is the information I have:

-They worked before by pressing the top button at the back of the machine (Photo) but I took the cables out cause it was sometimes that it worked, so they connected the right way to the USB Interface cause I tested it when they were working.

-The entire machine power on when connected to the electricity without doing any extra steps.

-Is a Homemade machine with a Windows-based computer as a core, bad quality and slow but works perfectly with the arcade games.

-I cannot go to settings cause the startup is blocked, even with a keyboard and mouse I cannot do anything, a format method would be appreciated.

This button was to activate it or connect it to the power source?

What can I do or connect to make it work permanently without pressing the back button?

What core hardware can I buy to connect those buttons and joysticks that are small, faster, and cheap for N64 and PS1 games?

[PL1]

It can be very difficult to do remote troubleshooting on an unknown setup built by a 3rd party.

One thing that makes it easier is if there is a common baseline of terms and concepts, so you may want to read through the FAQ.

https://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/FAQ

we need the Player 2 Buttons and Joystick, they donīt do anything

Looks like the last photo is of a 2 player Xin-Mo gamepad encoder.

That board translates the joystick and button presses into USB gamepad commands.
- The 18-pin connector on the left is for Player 1 controls.
- The 18-pin connector on the right is for Player 2 controls.

The Xin-Mo board is seen by the computer as two gamepads.

If P2's controls only work when the button on the back is pressed, there is probably a problem with the wiring path between P2's daisy-chain ground wire and ground. (details below)

-They worked before by pressing the top button at the back of the machine (Photo) but I took the cables out cause it was sometimes that it worked, so they connected the right way to the USB Interface cause I tested it when they were working.

You lost me on this part.      

-Is a Homemade machine with a Windows-based computer as a core, bad quality and slow but works perfectly with the arcade games.

What core hardware can I buy to connect those buttons and joysticks that are small, faster, and cheap for N64 and PS1 games?

As long as you're happy with the current selection of arcade games and gameplay, there's no need to upgrade to a new computer and emulation software.

If you want to add N64 and PS1 games, you will probably want to upgrade to a new computer and emulation software.
- There has been a lot of progress in emulating these systems lately and the newer emulation software requires a lot more computing power.
- Also check the controls for the games you want to add.  Do they require analog thumbstick or analog trigger button inputs?  IIRC the Xin-Mo doesn't have any analog inputs.

-I cannot go to settings cause the startup is blocked, even with a keyboard and mouse I cannot do anything, a format method would be appreciated.

You should be able to get into the MAME menu system using the TAB key while you're running an arcade game.

Not sure what Front End program you're running so no idea how to exit the game selection menu to access Windows.

You can run a USB cable from the Xin-Mo to a laptop or other PC's USB if you want to troubleshoot the controls separate from the rest of the system.

This button was to activate it or connect it to the power source?

Given the location of that button at the top/back of the machine, it was probably either connected to the power switch pins on the motherboard (press the button to safely shut down the system without corrupting Windows) or maybe it was connected to one of the Xin-Mo encoder inputs and there was a shutdown script triggered by the output of that Xin-Mo input.

If that button is causing P2's controls to work or not work, there is some sort of wiring error.  It probably involves the daisy-chain ground for Player 2's controls being supplied through that switch.   

What can I do or connect to make it work permanently without pressing the back button?

If that button doesn't trigger a shutdown, P2 controls work when that button pressed, and P2 controls don't work when it isn't, then here's a workaround:

On that button, leave one wire on the COM (Common) tab of the microswitch and swap the other wire from NO (Normally Open) to NC (Normally Closed) or from NC to NO.


When the red microswitch nub isn't pressed, COM connects to NC.
When the red microswitch nub is pressed, COM connects to NO.


Scott

[Selxion]

It can be very difficult to do remote troubleshooting on an unknown setup built by a 3rd party.

One thing that makes it easier is if there is a common baseline of terms and concepts, so you may want to read through the FAQ.

https://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/FAQ

we need the Player 2 Buttons and Joystick, they donīt do anything

Looks like the last photo is of a 2 player Xin-Mo gamepad encoder.

That board translates the joystick and button presses into USB gamepad commands.
- The 18-pin connector on the left is for Player 1 controls.
- The 18-pin connector on the right is for Player 2 controls.

The Xin-Mo board is seen by the computer as two gamepads.

If P2's controls only work when the button on the back is pressed, there is probably a problem with the wiring path between P2's daisy-chain ground wire and ground. (details below)

-They worked before by pressing the top button at the back of the machine (Photo) but I took the cables out cause it was sometimes that it worked, so they connected the right way to the USB Interface cause I tested it when they were working.

You lost me on this part.      

-Is a Homemade machine with a Windows-based computer as a core, bad quality and slow but works perfectly with the arcade games.

What core hardware can I buy to connect those buttons and joysticks that are small, faster, and cheap for N64 and PS1 games?

As long as you're happy with the current selection of arcade games and gameplay, there's no need to upgrade to a new computer and emulation software.

If you want to add N64 and PS1 games, you will probably want to upgrade to a new computer and emulation software.
- There has been a lot of progress in emulating these systems lately and the newer emulation software requires a lot more computing power.
- Also check the controls for the games you want to add.  Do they require analog thumbstick or analog trigger button inputs?  IIRC the Xin-Mo doesn't have any analog inputs.

-I cannot go to settings cause the startup is blocked, even with a keyboard and mouse I cannot do anything, a format method would be appreciated.

You should be able to get into the MAME menu system using the TAB key while you're running an arcade game.

Not sure what Front End program you're running so no idea how to exit the game selection menu to access Windows.

You can run a USB cable from the Xin-Mo to a laptop or other PC's USB if you want to troubleshoot the controls separate from the rest of the system.

This button was to activate it or connect it to the power source?

Given the location of that button at the top/back of the machine, it was probably either connected to the power switch pins on the motherboard (press the button to safely shut down the system without corrupting Windows) or maybe it was connected to one of the Xin-Mo encoder inputs and there was a shutdown script triggered by the output of that Xin-Mo input.

If that button is causing P2's controls to work or not work, there is some sort of wiring error.  It probably involves the daisy-chain ground for Player 2's controls being supplied through that switch.   

What can I do or connect to make it work permanently without pressing the back button?

If that button doesn't trigger a shutdown, P2 controls work when that button pressed, and P2 controls don't work when it isn't, then here's a workaround:

On that button, leave one wire on the COM (Common) tab of the microswitch and swap the other wire from NO (Normally Open) to NC (Normally Closed) or from NC to NO.


When the red microswitch nub isn't pressed, COM connects to NC.
When the red microswitch nub is pressed, COM connects to NO.


Scott

I will try that, if you need any specific photos or information I will provide it to you. Sorry for my bad English. I am keeping this same hardware.
What can I install on this computer that can use the same inputs?
I can use normal emulators without any front end?
What Front end can I install to avoid all the configuration and configure the buttons?

Supposing all the cables are correctly connected to the USB Interface; knowing that the Arcade does work entirely without any other issue, what needs that USB Interface to register Player 2 inputs?
Thinking outside the USB interface pins, just considering the cables that connect to Ground and the CPU through this Blue box I don't know what it is. (Image Below)
One of these cables goes to Player 1 Start Button COM (Based on the image you sent me) and the other to the Player 1 USB Interface.
The other two cables that are connected to the back buttons; one is divided in two; one goes to Player 2 Joystick Left COM and the other one goes to Player 2 Button A COM, and the other cable that does not divide goes to Player 2 USB Interface.

If I connect both that go to the USB interface and both that go to COM, will work? (I think no cause the USB already has power for both of the players and they worked without doing that)

[PL1]

this Blue box I don't know what it is. (Image Below)

The "blue box" appears to be a solid-state relay like the ones used in this DIY "smart power strip" thread.

https://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,128892.0.html

-------------------------------------

The daisy-chain ground (#3) for Player 2's controls should only be connected to one Quick Disconnect (QD) tab on each button/joystick microswitch and the ground pin on the Xin-Mo board, not to anything connected to or going through the relay.



A daisy-chain ground looks like this.



The QDs in this daisy-chain ground should be connected to one tab (usually COM) of each microswitch in P2's controls.

The single wire on the right should be connected to a ground pin in the 18-pin connector on the right side of your Xin-Mo in this pic.

The "blue box" relay shouldn't be connected to ground on the Xin-Mo.

Am I right that you have just one of these boards -- the wire bundle on the left goes to P1's controls and the wire bundle on the right goes to P2's controls?  I ask because Xin-Mo also makes an encoder that has control input pins on one side and output pins for button LEDs on the other side.



To troubleshoot the whole system, you'll need to test parts of the system separately.

Can you connect a USB cable from the Xin-Mo USB B connector to a laptop or other PC to see if the P1 and P2 controls are working properly?
(Windows Control Panel -- Devices and Printers -- [Xin-Mo device] -- Game controller settings -- Properties)


Scott

[Selxion]

this Blue box I don't know what it is. (Image Below)

The "blue box" appears to be a solid-state relay like the ones used in this DIY "smart power strip" thread.

https://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,128892.0.html

-------------------------------------

The daisy-chain ground (#3) for Player 2's controls should only be connected to one Quick Disconnect (QD) tab on each button/joystick microswitch and the ground pin on the Xin-Mo board, not to anything connected to or going through the relay.



A daisy-chain ground looks like this.



The QDs in this daisy-chain ground should be connected to one tab (usually COM) of each microswitch in P2's controls.

The single wire on the right should be connected to a ground pin in the 18-pin connector on the right side of your Xin-Mo in this pic.

The "blue box" relay shouldn't be connected to ground on the Xin-Mo.

Am I right that you have just one of these boards -- the wire bundle on the left goes to P1's controls and the wire bundle on the right goes to P2's controls?  I ask because Xin-Mo also makes an encoder that has control input pins on one side and output pins for button LEDs on the other side.



To troubleshoot the whole system, you'll need to test parts of the system separately.

Can you connect a USB cable from the Xin-Mo USB B connector to a laptop or other PC to see if the P1 and P2 controls are working properly?
(Windows Control Panel -- Devices and Printers -- [Xin-Mo device] -- Game controller settings -- Properties)


Scott

I connected it to a windows 10 based Laptop, it worked perfectly for both controllers, what does this means?

The name appearing is THT Arcade Console 2 USB Player, using a standard USB controller driver from Microsoft.

[PL1]

I connected it to a windows 10 based Laptop, it worked perfectly for both controllers, what does this means?

The good news is that the Xin-Mo encoder is working correctly.   

That means that the problem you describe is probably either with MAME configuration or it is with the relay circuit tapping into one or both of the Xin-Mo's daisy-chain grounds.

Let's start with MAME configuration.

1. Launch a game in MAME where both players can play at the same time and many (preferrably all) of the buttons are used -- maybe something like Street Fighter 2 which has two players with a "Joy + 6 buttons" layout.

           1   2   3
   Joy
           4   5   6

2. Press TAB to open the MAME menu.

3. Use the arrow buttons to navigate to the "Input (general)"--"Player 2 Controls" menu.
- This menu sets the MAME defaults for Player 2.
- These defaults can be overridden for individual games in the "Input (this game)" menu.

4. Highlight "P2 Up".
- It should show the input currently mapped to something like "Joy 2 Up"

5. Press ENTER. (The input goes into mapping mode -- shows "<>" while waiting for a control to be pressed/moved.)

5. Press Up on P2 Joystick. (Maps that control to that input.)
- Did the Joy # change?  If it did, remap the rest of the joystick inputs, the button inputs, Coin, and Start. (You'll need to scroll down a bit to get to them.)
- P2B5 and P2B6 aren't mapped in MAME by default so map them if they show up as "none" or "n/a".
- If you make a mistake, press DELETE to clear the current mapping and press DELETE again to return the input to the MAME default mapping.
- If MAME won't map joystick or button presses to these inputs, something is causing problems with your Xin-Mo encoder -- probably the odd wiring.  Skip down to that part of troubleshooting below.

6. Check if the Player 1 controls are mapped properly.  Remap as needed.

7. Try the various games on the system.  Remap controls as desired for the current game in the "Input (this game)" menu.

-------------------------
If something went wrong with mapping inputs in MAME, it's time to check wiring and fix whatever is causing the encoder to not work.

See if there are any wires connecting the relay to the Xin-Mo and what voltages are on them.
- I think you described here that there are some connections to the Xin-Mo's daisy-chain grounds.

One of these cables goes to Player 1 Start Button COM (Based on the image you sent me) and the other to the Player 1 USB Interface.
The other two cables that are connected to the back buttons; one is divided in two; one goes to Player 2 Joystick Left COM and the other one goes to Player 2 Button A COM, and the other cable that does not divide goes to Player 2 USB Interface.

If I connect both that go to the USB interface and both that go to COM, will work? (I think no cause the USB already has power for both of the players and they worked without doing that)

Scott

[Selxion]

I connected it to a windows 10 based Laptop, it worked perfectly for both controllers, what does this means?

The good news is that the Xin-Mo encoder is working correctly.   

That means that the problem you describe is probably either with MAME configuration or it is with the relay circuit tapping into one or both of the Xin-Mo's daisy-chain grounds.

Let's start with MAME configuration.

1. Launch a game in MAME where both players can play at the same time and many (preferrably all) of the buttons are used -- maybe something like Street Fighter 2 which has two players with a "Joy + 6 buttons" layout.

           1   2   3
   Joy
           4   5   6

2. Press TAB to open the MAME menu.

3. Use the arrow buttons to navigate to the "Input (general)"--"Player 2 Controls" menu.
- This menu sets the MAME defaults for Player 2.
- These defaults can be overridden for individual games in the "Input (this game)" menu.

4. Highlight "P2 Up".
- It should show the input currently mapped to something like "Joy 2 Up"

5. Press ENTER. (The input goes into mapping mode -- shows "<>" while waiting for a control to be pressed/moved.)

5. Press Up on P2 Joystick. (Maps that control to that input.)
- Did the Joy # change?  If it did, remap the rest of the joystick inputs, the button inputs, Coin, and Start. (You'll need to scroll down a bit to get to them.)
- P2B5 and P2B6 aren't mapped in MAME by default so map them if they show up as "none" or "n/a".
- If you make a mistake, press DELETE to clear the current mapping and press DELETE again to return the input to the MAME default mapping.
- If MAME won't map joystick or button presses to these inputs, something is causing problems with your Xin-Mo encoder -- probably the odd wiring.  Skip down to that part of troubleshooting below.

6. Check if the Player 1 controls are mapped properly.  Remap as needed.

7. Try the various games on the system.  Remap controls as desired for the current game in the "Input (this game)" menu.

-------------------------
If something went wrong with mapping inputs in MAME, it's time to check wiring and fix whatever is causing the encoder to not work.

See if there are any wires connecting the relay to the Xin-Mo and what voltages are on them.
- I think you described here that there are some connections to the Xin-Mo's daisy-chain grounds.

One of these cables goes to Player 1 Start Button COM (Based on the image you sent me) and the other to the Player 1 USB Interface.
The other two cables that are connected to the back buttons; one is divided in two; one goes to Player 2 Joystick Left COM and the other one goes to Player 2 Button A COM, and the other cable that does not divide goes to Player 2 USB Interface.

If I connect both that go to the USB interface and both that go to COM, will work? (I think no cause the USB already has power for both of the players and they worked without doing that)

Scott

Got it, I will try that, if I want to reinstall the whole system (Software) I just need to search for MAME tutorials and files?

[PL1]

if I want to reinstall the whole system (Software) I just need to search for MAME tutorials and files?

Before you consider that, make sure you've got the hardware working right and that there isn't some minor tweak you can do to the current setup to make things work better.

There's quite a bit more to a full system install than just a quick-and-easy reload of the OS and MAME.
- It's a steep learning curve and a big time investment.
- You may want to consider keeping the current system as-is while you set up a fresh system on a new computer. (newer OS, newer MAME/ROMset, N64 and PS1 emulators like you mentioned in the OP, your choice of Front End programs)  Once you get the new system working the way you want, transplant it into the cab.

Most users prefer using a Front End program for selecting games instead of MAME's built-in game selection menu.
- Configuring and tweaking the Front End can be a major time investment, depending on the program and how picky you are about how it looks and operates.
- PROTIP: Get MAME running correctly BEFORE you mess with any Front End programs.

If you're re-using the old computer, it's better to stick with the same version of MAME.
- Newer versions of MAME require more computing power so you might run into performance issues during gameplay.
- ROMsets change over time (better dumps, name changes, device driver improvements, etc.) so you need to have a ROMset version that matches the MAME version.  Finding a ROMset for a specific old version of MAME can be quite difficult.  Many people find it easier to get the ROMset first then download the matching version of MAME.

If you want to do a fresh re-install of the same version of MAME, try an approach like this:

- Figure out what version of MAME is on your system.

- Download that version of MAME from https://www.mamedev.org/oldrel.html.

- Rename your current MAME directory from "mame" to something like "mame_original" so you can reuse key files from your old install like ROMs, BIOSes, drivers, etc.

- Install MAME.

- Generate a mame.ini file by running "mame.exe -cc" (create config) one time.  Every time you run MAME with the "-cc" software switch, it will create a default mame.ini file that will overwrite any edits you've done to mame.ini.

- Copy all of the ROMs from "mame_original\roms\" to "mame\roms\".

- Copy the sound samples from "mame_original\samples\" to "mame\samples\".

- Run MAME and check configuration as covered in the earlier post.  At a minimum, you'll need to map P2B5 and P2B6 since they are not mapped by default.

- If you try to run a game and it tells you a file is missing, copy it from "mame_original".


Scott