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Author Topic: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters  (Read 502 times)

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mph000

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GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« on: November 18, 2022, 10:33:32 am »
Hey all,

I'm trying to get the GRS yoke to work with RoadBlasters on a Raspberry Pi setup in a custom CRT bartop cab. I've tried an arpicade, pi2jamma, and RGBPi. I've read that a yoke isn't the ideal way to control Roadblasters but I've already spent so much time/money/energy building the cab thinking the GRS yoke would be an easy plug and play solution and its too late to turn back now! I'm hoping someone can help!

Thanks in advance!!
« Last Edit: November 21, 2022, 10:31:54 am by mph000 »

leapinlew

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2022, 09:35:01 pm »
Sorry buddy! It's a totally different type of control and I've never been able to get it to work.

Roadblasters basically wants to use a spinner, so while it looks like it's using the same type control, it's not. It'll always be jittery.

mph000

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2022, 10:30:55 am »
Sorry buddy! It's a totally different type of control and I've never been able to get it to work.

Roadblasters basically wants to use a spinner, so while it looks like it's using the same type control, it's not. It'll always be jittery.

Ugh!! That's what I'm afraid of! Its so jittery right now. I'm hoping there is a setting I can change in mame to fix it...

PL1

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2022, 01:21:51 pm »
Its so jittery right now. I'm hoping there is a setting I can change in mame to fix it...
Since you're using a RasPi, you're probably using an ancient version of MAME -- try upgrading to a newer version.
I'll give Road Blasters another try. It seemed to play fine with my analog joysticks last I checked. *Edit* It was fixed in MAME: "0.222: Fixed Road Blasters steering wheel does not auto center. The RoadBlasters steering wheel is very much like the Star Wars yoke, without the vertical (Y) axis [Curseur, Tafoid]. Replaced Dial controller with Stick."

In the MAME menu system (TAB) go to the "Analog Controls" menu.
- In older versions of MAME,  turn "Dial Sensitivity" way down.
-- This setting won't fix it, but it will make it a little easier to play with your setup.

- In newer versions of MAME, try adjusting "AD Stick X Sensitivity".
-- You may also need to adjust deadzone and other analog-related settings.
-- Your yoke acts like the 270 degree steering wheels covered in the thread here.


Scott

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2022, 02:38:59 pm »
You're going to need something better than a Pi because RoadBlasters was fixed only relatively recently in MAME:

"0.222: Fixed Road Blasters steering wheel does not auto center. The RoadBlasters steering wheel is very much like the Star Wars yoke, without the vertical (Y) axis [Curseur, Tafoid]. Replaced Dial controller with Stick."

*Whoops, I see that PL1 already quoted me on this.  :cheers:

Hopefully, you can test the yoke out on a newer version of Mame and report back. I don't own a yoke and I'd like to know if it works well or not because it should.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2022, 02:41:17 pm by KenToad »

leapinlew

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2022, 06:46:19 pm »
Well then! That's news to me, and pretty exciting. I'm going to fire up my Star Wars and figure out what version of Mame I'm using and see about adding this game.

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2022, 06:54:45 pm »
I recently bought one of their spinners and was impressed by the quality.   Btw you've clearly spent a lot on this build so why in the world would you put a crappy pi in there?   Throw an old laptop in and it'll be 10 times more powerful for the same cost. 

leapinlew

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2022, 09:33:26 pm »
I recently bought one of their spinners and was impressed by the quality.   Btw you've clearly spent a lot on this build so why in the world would you put a crappy pi in there?   Throw an old laptop in and it'll be 10 times more powerful for the same cost.

The spinner is good! Only complaint is it uses a larger shaft than a tempest knob, so I ended up having to buy a GGG spinner so I could use a Tempest knob with it.

mph000

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2022, 12:55:50 pm »
Its so jittery right now. I'm hoping there is a setting I can change in mame to fix it...
Since you're using a RasPi, you're probably using an ancient version of MAME -- try upgrading to a newer version.
I'll give Road Blasters another try. It seemed to play fine with my analog joysticks last I checked. *Edit* It was fixed in MAME: "0.222: Fixed Road Blasters steering wheel does not auto center. The RoadBlasters steering wheel is very much like the Star Wars yoke, without the vertical (Y) axis [Curseur, Tafoid]. Replaced Dial controller with Stick."

In the MAME menu system (TAB) go to the "Analog Controls" menu.
- In older versions of MAME,  turn "Dial Sensitivity" way down.
-- This setting won't fix it, but it will make it a little easier to play with your setup.

- In newer versions of MAME, try adjusting "AD Stick X Sensitivity".
-- You may also need to adjust deadzone and other analog-related settings.
-- Your yoke acts like the 270 degree steering wheels covered in the thread here.


Scott

I'll give this a try - Thanks!

mph000

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2022, 12:59:55 pm »
I recently bought one of their spinners and was impressed by the quality.   Btw you've clearly spent a lot on this build so why in the world would you put a crappy pi in there?   Throw an old laptop in and it'll be 10 times more powerful for the same cost.

Thanks! What is the best way to use a laptop with a CRT jamma setup with the correct resolution that uses a more recent version of mame?

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2022, 02:50:20 am »
lots of options both hardware and software.   You'll have to google search to figure out which will best work for you based on your hardware and what you are wanting to do.   Not sure how jamma would enter into the equation.... it's just a connector style and you can by a breakout board or just cut the wires.   The mame version isn't particularly relevant either.   I mean sure, it's nice to run the latest version but you were about to install a pi, which won't run the latest version either as every new version of mame requires more system resources, thus why people running a pi typically use mame 2003 or something ancient like that.  Worst case scenario you'll stilll be able to run something much more recent than that. 

Xiaou2

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2022, 05:23:25 pm »
You're going to need something better than a Pi because RoadBlasters was fixed only relatively recently in MAME:

"0.222: Fixed Road Blasters steering wheel does not auto center. The RoadBlasters steering wheel is very much like the Star Wars yoke, without the vertical (Y) axis [Curseur, Tafoid]. Replaced Dial controller with Stick."

*Whoops, I see that PL1 already quoted me on this.  :cheers:

Hopefully, you can test the yoke out on a newer version of Mame and report back. I don't own a yoke and I'd like to know if it works well or not because it should.


 The real Arcade controller for that game, is a Dial / Spinner (Optical).
(It looks like a standard Pot driven wheel in the front... but its Optically read in the back of the assembly)

 If mame changed it, to appease to the general masses..  Then Im surprised,  as they have always been very strict about being accurate.

 That said, there should be an  "Arcade"  mode,   or the ability to select  "Optical"  or  "Pot"
Because someone might want to used the actual hardware, or a replica remake of the original hardware.


 A games control is often tied to its Challenge / Difficulty.   And if you alter this,  you often drastically change the way that the game
is experienced.    For example... if your analog settings are too high,  when you play Marble Madness... you wont have to work
half as hard, to get the ball to Accelerate out of danger,  or to stop your momentum in time.. before flying off the edges.  It then
becomes way too Easy,  and is not representing the true challenge that the designers intended (and spent a LOT of time balancing out).

PL1

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2022, 08:33:34 pm »
The real Arcade controller for that game, is a Dial / Spinner (Optical).
(It looks like a standard Pot driven wheel in the front... but its Optically read in the back of the assembly)
It is true that the Road Blasters yoke uses optical inputs like a spinner for steering, however this controller has a feature that spinners do not have -- bumpers that limit the rotation.

AFAIK this is the only game controller that has spinner/mouse-like optical (relative) inputs with physical (absolute) limits.

The game code and controller combine to provide a type of autocentering.
- If you turn the yoke all the way one way, then all the way the other, then return it to the spring-loaded center, the car's wheels should be straight ahead.

If mame changed it, to appease to the general masses..  Then Im surprised,  as they have always been very strict about being accurate.

 That said, there should be an  "Arcade"  mode,   or the ability to select  "Optical"  or  "Pot"
Because someone might want to used the actual hardware, or a replica remake of the original hardware.
You could argue that:
1. There is a specific, limited number of optical steps between the stops, just like there is a specific, limited number of steps between the stops of a 270 degree wheel after the analog voltage from the pot has been digitally sampled by an analog encoder.
2. The stops on the yoke make it behave more like a 270 wheel than a 360 wheel or spinner.
3. Defining the input as "AD Stick X Analog" instead of "Dial" allows users (and devs) to use MAME's analog auto-centering code with non-standard controls.
4. Many devs don't have specialized controllers like the RB yoke so it makes sense for them to make the game also work well with non-standard controls.  It's hard to squash bugs if you can't get to the stage of gameplay where the bugs appear.

If MAME 0.222 or newer sees an optical control when you launch Road Blasters, it will map "mouse X" to "AD Stick X Analog" for steering.

This works fine with a trackball or spinner so it should be accurate with an original controller (or remake) once you set the sensitivity.
- As an added bonus, the game also works well with non-standard controls like an analog joystick.   ;D


Scott

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2022, 05:24:22 pm »
Quote
AFAIK this is the only game controller that has spinner/mouse-like optical (relative) inputs with physical (absolute) limits.

 TX-1  has dual pedals, that are both Optical discs, with physical limit bumpers.

 Sega's  Turbo,  also uses an Optical Pedal.

 I used to own both of these machines.  Sadly, they had to go.


 Id guess there are more that Ive not ran into,  or cant remember at this time.

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Re: GRS Yoke for RoadBlasters
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2022, 11:23:17 pm »
So itís very similar to the Atari 2600 paddle controllers but with an optical encoder instead of the potentiometer used in the paddle controller.