Competition joysticks are very... stiff....

[Trebeck]

Hey all,


I bought the Suzo Happ competition sticks and they are very stiff in some of the diagonal directions.  Player 1 Up right and Up left and Player 2 Up left are working but you really have to push it.  How can I make these controls smooth like butter?  Any tips?


https://na.suzohapp.com/products/joysticks/50-6070-120


Thanks!

[Beretta]

don't have any new production sticks, have some oldies I pulled from cabinets I bought..

I hear they moved the production to china and quality went down... can't confirm just what I heard.

comps was used heavily in the American arcades.. NeoGeo cabs used Supers (I hate supers)

Comps was used on a lot of 90's midway games like MK, NBA jam, KI, etc

The sticks should have plenty of spring to them but should not be stiff (as in binding) in any direction)

stiff in strength,k sure.. ya.. they're known for that Japanese sticks use much weaker springs.

[Trebeck]

Well, let me explain it this way.  The mechanics feel fine, the switches and hardware look good.  Here:


Down Right = perfect
Up Left = hard to do every time.


I do not need to think about going DR but it seems like I need to travel farther to get to UL.  Both up and Left work fine by themselves but combining I need to horse it in position to make it work.  I'm goin to take it apart this weekend and see if I can find any obvious issues.  Maybe I should position the black "button presser" in a better location or wrap electrical tape around it to reduce travel.
Is it possible the joystick just needs to be played to work it in?


Any ideas/comments are welcome.


Beck

[MartyKong]

I have two IL Competition joysticks which aren't stiff at all. I think these were made in Spain after Industrias-Lorenzo split from Suzo Happ, so much better quality. I did have a PAC Reunion stick that was way too stiff. What I did was disassemble the stick to get to the spring. Slid a bolt with large washers at each end and very slowly compressed the spring. Use a tape measure as you go - a little goes a long way. Plays great now:).

[offset]

Maybe include a picture of the bottom of your joystick to show comparisons of the switches/actuator.

No personal experience, but I was considering buying IL joysticks instead of Happ as I also heard that manufacturing isn't the same.

For example, the IL joysticks from Paradise Arcade, part of the item description provides some history of Happ/IL competition joysticks

https://paradisearcadeshop.com/collections/il-industrias-lorenzo-1/products/il-eurojoystick-black

"""
The iL Eurojoystick may be better known as the original HAPP Competition
"""

found video on youtube with comparison

[MartyKong]

Interesting reading the IL history. Mine doesn't feel stiff and has good centering. If in game you let go and the joystick centers it will go slightly past center but not a lot. The square actuator makes diagonals easy.

[Beretta]

Well, let me explain it this way.  The mechanics feel fine, the switches and hardware look good.  Here:


Down Right = perfect
Up Left = hard to do every time.

okay ya.. that doesn't sound right.. did you assemble it correctly?
Im not trying to insult you but the joystick scan be put together wrong.. did you maybe forget the spacer (iirc they have a spacer on top that goes on the shaft) I remember when I was trying to make franken-sticks trying different parts and it was possible to get into a situation similar with, poor centering and binding, etc

maybe post some pictures of your complete stick if you can, a short video showing the switches and actuator on the bottom when hitting corners might also help.. im not a stick guru but i bet someone here who is would be able to spot the problem.

[RandyT]

Aside from the possibility for incorrect assembly (I've seen it many a time), the answer is probably as simple as just start actually using it...mercilessly.  The ratings for a spring are what that spring tension is when it is first produced.   Spring wear is based on the number of cycles and the extent of travel.  A new stick meant for commercial use, is inherently a bit "stiff" because it's designed to go through hell in a machine somewhere for as long a time as possible before needing to be replaced.   Plastic is also malleable, so working it will help wear away any high spots and flex things into a position where the parts want to go.

A new commercial stick is like a thick pair of leather work boots.  Rough to use for a few days, but after that they should serve you well for a long time.

[Zebidee]

I have two IL Competition joysticks which aren't stiff at all. I think these were made in Spain after Industrias-Lorenzo split from Suzo Happ, so much better quality. I did have a PAC Reunion stick that was way too stiff. What I did was disassemble the stick to get to the spring. Slid a bolt with large washers at each end and very slowly compressed the spring. Use a tape measure as you go - a little goes a long way. Plays great now:).

I did something very similar to this with some Happ competition joysticks, though it was a long time ago now. I found that the joystick springs were so bouncy that the joystick would often (not always) register in the opposite direction as well, so if you tapped LEFT you'd go LEFT and then  spin back to the RIGHT!

Maybe one solution is to abuse the bouncy springs for a bit, but the way it was made games unplayable.

I also used some large washers of appropriate size (maybe 18-22mm? something like that) and a thin slice of neoprene hot water pipe insulation to shorten the spring and absorb the extra vibration (stop the bounce).

You can buy the foamed neoprene insulation in long tubes from the hardware store (plumbing section), and it is pretty cheap. Just buy a long piece and experiment with different size slices until you find what works. You have to make sure you cut neat and even slices, otherwise you'll distort the joystick movements.

I took some pics, but was a long time ago. if I can find I will post them.