So I've been building an ultralight

[danny_galaga]

This has taken away virtually all my gaming time, including C64 projects I had going.

But if I ever finish this thing, it will make for some fun aerial 'road trips' 

[wp34]

That's really cool Danny.  I've always been fascinated with Ultralites as well.  Keep us posted on your progress.

[danny_galaga]

Yeah like I say I've been fascinated with ultralights since I was about 15. Longer really, because I loved the movie 'Those magnificent men in their flying machines' and at least one of those aircraft (Demoiselle) would now be considered an ultralight.

The Bushcat is not like the ultralights I used to dream of but it will be a hell of a lot more practical

[pbj]

I used to see a guy flying around in a go kart strapped to a parachute.  Looked fun.

Do they make an ultra lite that can fly with a 400lb passenger?

[danny_galaga]

Yes and no. If this 400lb person learns to fly they can fly in a Bushcat with a 75lb passenger

[Howard_Casto]

What if we only put one butt cheek in the seat?   

[whammoed]

Very exciting and ambitious.  I see one issue though.  That garage is too clean.

[DaOld Man]

Good side project there Danny_galaga. Looks like it will be a lot of fun.

[danny_galaga]

Good side project there Danny_galaga. Looks like it will be a lot of fun.

It will be fun when it's finished 

I really haven't enjoyed building it as much as I thought I would. Right now being the exception, because I am working on the control panel, err instrument panel 

[Howard_Casto]

You are using airplane grade screws and stuff aren't you?  We'd prefer it if you don't die. 

[danny_galaga]

I'm using what's supplied in the kit. The most critical bits are aircraft grade and the rest is whatever. For instance the brakes are from Matco who have been making aircraft parts for maybe 100 years. But the choke lever is a bicycle gear shifter.

Anyway, I'll put a four leaf clover in it somewhere. What could go wrong 

[pbj]

Have you flown it yet?

 I think about this project from time to time, and what I’d do in case of a malfunction.  I suppose panic just enough to make it look like I half heartedly cared whether or not it crashed. 

I’m hopeful this isn’t a suicidal mission in slow motion....

 

[nitrogen_widget]

He's amongst the big boys now

https://dannygalaga.blogspot.com/2020/08/21-big-move.html?m=0

Damn.
You built an airplane faster than I tiled my shower.

[bobbyb13]

He's amongst the big boys now

https://dannygalaga.blogspot.com/2020/08/21-big-move.html?m=0

Damn.
You built an airplane faster than I tiled my shower.

The girls just asked me what I'm laughing so hard about.

This project is awesome.
There is a small airstrip 3 miles down the road from me and I see a lot of small airtraffic as a result.

Really looks fun!

[danny_galaga]

Have you flown it yet?

 I think about this project from time to time, and what I’d do in case of a malfunction.  I suppose panic just enough to make it look like I half heartedly cared whether or not it crashed. 

I’m hopeful this isn’t a suicidal mission in slow motion....

 

 

The main things that would give me the willies is a structural malfunction. Engine failure is not so bad. I read a good article once about what to do in unusual situations (engine failure is pretty straight forward) like what if the ailerons got stuck while you were rolling. Sharper people than me have gotten out of situations where I'd just think 'oh, well. This is how it ends'...

[Vocalitus]

Looks like a nice project.

Just don't end up like James Horner.

[danny_galaga]

Looks like a nice project.

Just don't end up like James Horner.

Had to look that up. He was flying a pretty powerful aircraft. Power is not a thing I'm going to have to wrestle with in my ultralight 

[Grasshopper]

Danny, I realise this might sound silly, but can you fly?

[Stingray]

You rule, Dan.

[danny_galaga]

Danny, I realise this might sound silly, but can you fly?

I believe I can fly 

[danny_galaga]

Still working on it 

[Vocalitus]

Still working on it 

Still working on what? - lets see some progress pictures.

I hear horse glue is better than goat glue so use that on the wings.

[danny_galaga]

Well I put the hinges on the sub door frames. So there's that.. Also starting to think about buying the engine now. Just as well because I've been saving rubber bands but I think it would be a PITA to wind up

[bobbyb13]

What exactly do you put in one of these for an engine anyway?

I would imagine you won't get enough altitude to have major issues with oxygen percentages...
Or will you?

Now I'm thinking about it, what type/octane fuel (assuming no need for a turbocharger-)

I love this project

[Vocalitus]

Well I put the hinges on the sub door frames. So there's that.. Also starting to think about buying the engine now. Just as well because I've been saving rubber bands but I think it would be a PITA to wind up

Electric engines perhaps?

https://aerospace.honeywell.com/us/en/learn/products/electric-power

[danny_galaga]

There are now some electric options, And a company named Pipistrel actually sell electric aircraft, but it's all way beyond my price range. And the range is not enough since we plan on doing a bit of touring in this thing if I ever finish it.

Most popular engine for ultralights now (as opposed to microlights, which are smaller and are what ultralights were in the 80's) is the Rotax 912. It's about 1.2 litres. 100 HP. Twin carb or fuel injected. You can also get a turbo charged version. But why make it more complicated. Bobby, most ultralights are capable of going over ten thousand feet. But the licence I converted to actually restricts ME to ten thousand 😄 highest I've ever flown was 8000, which was easy. But low and slow is more fun 😎

[bobbyb13]

Gets chilly at 10k ft I bet!

Thanks for sharing this project here.

Stoked to learn some about this stuff through your efforts!

[danny_galaga]

Fitting windscreen and left door. Damn hard to see out that screen though 

[danny_galaga]

What exactly do you put in one of these for an engine anyway?

I would imagine you won't get enough altitude to have major issues with oxygen percentages...
Or will you?

Now I'm thinking about it, what type/octane fuel (assuming no need for a turbocharger-)

I love this project

Picked up last weekend. It's from the plane I hire to keep my skills up. Which is cool because it means I have 15-20 hours on this engine already 🙂

[bobbyb13]

Very cool.
Looks remarkably like an old Beetle engine!

And if this came out of the plane you were flying previously... what happened to THAT plane then...?!

[danny_galaga]

Funny story 😄

There were two planes at the place I hire from. This engine's hours were nearly up. The engine in the other plane had a lot longer to go. But THAT plane was damaged in a rough landing. Airframe was written off but engine was fine. Hire aircraft engines can't go over 2000 hours. But private can. These Rotax engines are good for over 4000 hours. So I get the engine that was nearly ready to be replaced, and the hire plane I was flying continues on with the lower hours engine

The funny story continues though. They 'borrowed' back my carbies because the butterfly valve shaft in the other engine got bent in the rough landing. So today I hired the plane and I'm STILL flying it with bits of the engine inow own 😄

[nitrogen_widget]

so what is the difference between and plane engine and say an engine used for a ground vehicle?
i've got a 20HP engine in a lawn tractor.
I don't think you can put it in an airplane.

intake and exhaust manifolds along with carbs are different i assume?

[danny_galaga]

You could definitely put that engine in a small ultralight. How reliable it would be is a different matter. Rotax got into the aircraft game because in the 80's when ultralights we're still a new thing people were using whatever they could get their hands on. From go kart motors to largechsinsaw engines. Rotax made two strokes for snow mobiles etc which turned out to be a good match.

People often say 'that motors not very powerful, my car engine would be much better'. But there are several really important differences that make car engines not as useful as it would first seem. First of all, propellers are most efficient at around 2500 rpm. So a lot of plane engines are designed to develop power around that speed. Rotax design their engines more like a car engine, and then add a reduction gearbox, roughly 2:1. Propellers might be more efficient around 2500 rpm, but it turns out petrol engines are most efficient around 5000rpm.

The other major thing a car engine spends most of its time at a fairly low power setting. To drive on the highway might take 20 per cent of its power for instance. But an airplane might be cruising at maybe 75-85 per cent power, ALL DAY. Not just that, on smaller aircraft especially, on take off you are using 100 per cent power until you level out. That could be five minutes. Imagine a drag race that was five minutes long!

To illustrate how seemingly under rated an aircraft motor seems, I learnt to fly in a Piper Warrior. I think from memory it had a Lycoming 0320 in it. That's pretty close in capacity to a Chevy 327. But the Lycoming only developed 150hp, AND only 4 cylinders! Like I say though, it could run all day near the top of its range.

[RandyT]

You could definitely put that engine in a small ultralight. How reliable it would be is a different matter. Rotax got into the aircraft game because in the 80's when ultralights we're still a new thing people were using whatever they could get their hands on. From go kart motors to largechsinsaw engines. Rotax made two strokes for snow mobiles etc which turned out to be a good match.

Not sure if it's true, but I also heard that some Rotax engines were shown to be so reliable that they were actually approved by the FAA for ultralight use.  I had a couple of rough looking sleds I planned to fix up which had good running Rotax engines.  When I decided that I didn't like cold, I seriously considered pulling and selling just the motors because, to the right person, they were worth more than the sleds. 

So, has anyone heard of someone crazy enough to use one of the HF Predator 20hp 2-cyl engines in an ultralight?  Being a Honda clone, they are surprisingly decent.  But you wouldn't catch me leaving the ground with one.  I think geared-down 2-strokes would be better.  Not much to talk about on the low-end, but when they get up into their power band, they can be insane relative to size and weight.  I had a 2-stroke, 3-cyl Kawasaki bike in my younger days, that I wish I kept.  Then again, if I did, I might not still be here to talk about it

[nitrogen_widget]

You could definitely put that engine in a small ultralight. How reliable it would be is a different matter. Rotax got into the aircraft game because in the 80's when ultralights we're still a new thing people were using whatever they could get their hands on. From go kart motors to largechsinsaw engines. Rotax made two strokes for snow mobiles etc which turned out to be a good match.

People often say 'that motors not very powerful, my car engine would be much better'. But there are several really important differences that make car engines not as useful as it would first seem. First of all, propellers are most efficient at around 2500 rpm. So a lot of plane engines are designed to develop power around that speed. Rotax design their engines more like a car engine, and then add a reduction gearbox, roughly 2:1. Propellers might be more efficient around 2500 rpm, but it turns out petrol engines are most efficient around 5000rpm.

The other major thing a car engine spends most of its time at a fairly low power setting. To drive on the highway might take 20 per cent of its power for instance. But an airplane might be cruising at maybe 75-85 per cent power, ALL DAY. Not just that, on smaller aircraft especially, on take off you are using 100 per cent power until you level out. That could be five minutes. Imagine a drag race that was five minutes long!

To illustrate how seemingly under rated an aircraft motor seems, I learnt to fly in a Piper Warrior. I think from memory it had a Lycoming 0320 in it. That's pretty close in capacity to a Chevy 327. But the Lycoming only developed 150hp, AND only 4 cylinders! Like I say though, it could run all day near the top of its range.

running all day is probably top of the list of things you want your personal aircraft to do.

[danny_galaga]

You could definitely put that engine in a small ultralight. How reliable it would be is a different matter. Rotax got into the aircraft game because in the 80's when ultralights we're still a new thing people were using whatever they could get their hands on. From go kart motors to largechsinsaw engines. Rotax made two strokes for snow mobiles etc which turned out to be a good match.

Not sure if it's true, but I also heard that some Rotax engines were shown to be so reliable that they were actually approved by the FAA for ultralight use.  I had a couple of rough looking sleds I planned to fix up which had good running Rotax engines.  When I decided that I didn't like cold, I seriously considered pulling and selling just the motors because, to the right person, they were worth more than the sleds. 

So, has anyone heard of someone crazy enough to use one of the HF Predator 20hp 2-cyl engines in an ultralight?  Being a Honda clone, they are surprisingly decent.  But you wouldn't catch me leaving the ground with one.  I think geared-down 2-strokes would be better.  Not much to talk about on the low-end, but when they get up into their power band, they can be insane relative to size and weight.  I had a 2-stroke, 3-cyl Kawasaki bike in my younger days, that I wish I kept.  Then again, if I did, I might not still be here to talk about it

Because it's in a different class of rules, I'm pretty sure the FAA have nothing to say about choice of engine. In fact, Rotax stopped making their 2 stroke airplane motors recently, which always had the disclaimer that they didn't meet regulations and it was up to you what you did with it.

I think the rules are simpler for ultralights because you can't cause as much havoc in an accident and also to encourage new ideas.

Just had a look at that Predator engine. That would work well in a microlight for sure. I think the class in the USA is called Part 103. You might use a belt drive to reduce the propeller speed 🙂

https://www.eaa.org/eaa/aviation-interests/ultralights/getting-started-in-ultralight-flying/about-faa-part-103-for-ultralights

[RandyT]

I think the rules are simpler for ultralights because you can't cause as much havoc in an accident and also to encourage new ideas.

Just had a look at that Predator engine. That would work well in a microlight for sure. I think the class in the USA is called Part 103. You might use a belt drive to reduce the propeller speed 🙂

https://www.eaa.org/eaa/aviation-interests/ultralights/getting-started-in-ultralight-flying/about-faa-part-103-for-ultralights

I guess so!  There's more rules for flying a $50 drone than an ultralight 

[danny_galaga]

I think the rules are simpler for ultralights because you can't cause as much havoc in an accident and also to encourage new ideas.

Just had a look at that Predator engine. That would work well in a microlight for sure. I think the class in the USA is called Part 103. You might use a belt drive to reduce the propeller speed 🙂

https://www.eaa.org/eaa/aviation-interests/ultralights/getting-started-in-ultralight-flying/about-faa-part-103-for-ultralights

I guess so!  There's more rules for flying a $50 drone than an ultralight 

Yep, for part 103 microlights you don't even need a licence 😲

There's no such category in Australia, so to fly that same microlight here needs and ultralight licence, which is similar to GA (general aviation) but with some restrictions- only one passenger, much lower weight, no aerobatics or night flying etc.

[danny_galaga]

The 'control panel' is nearly done 🙂

[pbj]

If you crash and die can I have your didgeridoo?

[danny_galaga]

Forgot the close up of the switch holes. Ignore the shaggy vinyl, that will clean up and be covered anyway.

[Howard_Casto]

So I'm excited for you, I really am, but at some point are we going to get some go-pro footage of you actually flying the thing?  Also please don't die. 

[pbj]

3 ---smurfing--- years and it ain’t left the ground yet.

 

[danny_galaga]

3 ---smurfing--- years and it ain’t left the ground yet.

 

More like 4 years. It's been a freakin albatross around my neck...

So no one likes my 'chem trails ' switch? Thought I'd provide some 'proof' for the conspiracy theorists 😃

[danny_galaga]

CP

[Mike A]

4 years seems like a long time to build your own coffin.

[nipsmg]

CP

You have balls of steel -- I'm in the midst of getting my PPL right now-- and I love the ultralights, but I can't imagine leaving the ground in something I built myself-- I don't have nearly enough faith in my fabrication skills.

I'll fly my flight club's 172 and Archer around and burn my money that way

[danny_galaga]

Mike A . Two things have slowed me down. One was that there were a lot of things wrong with the kit, missing parts etc. So you'd be settling into a good 12 hour building session and within 30 minutes you'd find two left hand wing brackets or whatever. Now that epic 12 hour session is 30 minutes plus a ten day wait while they send you the part.
Second problem is that I started building it in our garage. But once it came time to attach the wings it was time to move it to a hanger. So now instead of just wandering out to the garage, it's a 80 minute drive to the hangar. Ennui sets in.

Nipsmg. I did my ppl in a Piper Warrior. I believe that's the model before the Archer. Good planes the Piper's, but virtually impossible to spin. That should be a good thing, but it means I've never done any spin training.

The bulk of the aircraft is just bolting stuff together. Not much fabrication involved. 

[pbj]

Nothing inspires confidence like an airplane kit that comes with the wrong parts.

 

[RandyT]

4 years seems like a long time to build your own coffin.

It would take me 4 years just to convince myself that my mechanical skills were sufficient to even start building an Utra-light.  Probably another 4 to get up the nerve to test-fly it afterward.

[danny_galaga]

Nothing inspires confidence like an airplane kit that comes with the wrong parts.

 

And yet I have so many nuts and bolts left over 😃

Randy, if you can turn a spanner, you can build an ultralight. If all metal, you need to be able to pop rivets 🙂

Just looking at my CP,  it's a veritable United nations. Instruments from Spain, Slovakia, USA, south Africa Germany and a dodgy USB charger from China 😄

[nitrogen_widget]

4 years seems like a long time to build your own coffin.

It would take me 4 years just to convince myself that my mechanical skills were sufficient to even start building an Utra-light.  Probably another 4 to get up the nerve to test-fly it afterward.

I have the skills but i also always seem to have spare parts after. 

[danny_galaga]

Backside. Still have to tidy and secure the wiring. Also, haven't done the radio yet.

[pbj]

Does it all run on that weird airplane voltage?

[RandyT]

Also, haven't done the radio yet.

Or the RGB lighting.

[danny_galaga]

Does it all run on that weird airplane voltage?

You mean 12v? Yes.

The weirdness here is the wire. It's MIL spec aircraft wire. Has a higher temperature rating and won't produce smoke if burning. Is also lighter than automotive wire. But it only comes in white and is stiff as hell. That's why you see it in those lovely curls.

[danny_galaga]

Also, haven't done the radio yet.

Or the RGB lighting.

 

[nitrogen_widget]

CP

so an actual airplane control panel is smaller than this?
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,167434.0/topicseen.html

[Howard_Casto]

I've seen cows smaller than that.

[danny_galaga]

CP

so an actual airplane control panel is smaller than this?
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,167434.0/topicseen.html

Just a smidge

[bobbyb13]

She has quite the sexy backside.

Backside. Still have to tidy and secure the wiring. Also, haven't done the radio yet.

[danny_galaga]

I'm hoping to put the engine in on Wednesday. Then it will look more like a real one 😊

[nitrogen_widget]

I'm hoping to put the engine in on Wednesday. Then it will look more like a real one 😊

have you fired the engine up yet?

[danny_galaga]

It's in, but still a ways to go

[danny_galaga]

So what do you do when the radiator hoses that come with the kit are the wrong size? Turn to that venerable classic- the Datsun 120Y 

[Zebidee]

Funny that you mention the venerable Datsun 120Y, and previously bits both missing and left over.

I used to drive around Canberra in a Datsun 120Y, and had developed a few mechanic skills by that time. I've changed the very radiator hoses that you've used. I've also pulled apart, cleaned, and rebuilt the carburetor (the bit that feeds fuel from a cup) because it was chugging a bit at times.

As an aside, most modern engines got rid of carburetors and use DFI, direct fuel injection, more reliable... especially for airplanes lol. In WWII the famous Spitfire Merlin engine was limited by carburetors that failed when in inverse G maneuvers ... the ME109 had DFI and thus an advantage in some situations. So +1 for fuel injection.

Anyways, back to now, if you've never pulled apart and rebuilt a carburetor before, I recommend you keep it that way. wasn't fun.

There were like 110 tiny parts for that 120Y carby. No service or workshop manual tracked them all. It was in the days before digital cameras and smartphones, so no before or progress pics. Over about two days I got it apart. I cleaned it. I reassembled it, reinstalled it, all worked well and better than before.

But there were still like 4 parts left over! 

EDIT: Been following your project, very impressive, make sure you post before taking off

 

[danny_galaga]

Hehe. Carbies are still very common on aircraft. Mine has twin carbies, but there is a fuel injected version. My sister's first car was a 120y. Dad and I rebuilt the engine as it was blowing a lot of smoke . We actually tied the engine to a pole and lifted it out by hand 😄

[pbj]

Still hasn’t left the ground.

 

[danny_galaga]

Still hasn’t left the ground.

 

Much safer that way

[Zebidee]

Yeah, the 120Y engines are tiny and the bay is very roomy. Good one to learn on!

If you have a big enough hill, and a ramp, you can make a Datsun 120Y fly.

I did once get my Holden HJ ute to fly. That was due to a series of hilarious but disastrous events, starting with the throttle suddenly stuck ON (rusty throttle cable) at 110km/h, leaving the road to avoid another car, then into a ditch (it appeared out of nowhere) and then bouncing out again on the crappy suspension (I wisely chose, in that split second, to NOT brake), and ending with us flying through the air for some indeterminate distance (it was very dark) before finally stopping landing.

After that Dukes-of-Hazzard moment, my friend and I looked at each other with that look of understanding... that we are both somehow miraculously alive. Even better, the throttle had somehow become unstuck   WD40 on that sucker for next time.

Afterwards was tempted to paint red flying kangaroos near the rear tail lights (reference to Qantas).

[RandyT]

Still hasn’t left the ground.

 

Much safer that way

Are mechanically deployed parachutes a thing for these, in the event the gliding parts stop working?

[danny_galaga]

Still hasn’t left the ground.

 

Much safer that way

Are mechanically deployed parachutes a thing for these, in the event the gliding parts stop working?

Ballistic. Costs quite a lot. I think about 10k USD. I just have to hope the gliding bits (the wings) don't fall off I guess 😀

[danny_galaga]

Was going to bolt the propeller on today, but it seems the prop spacer that came with the kit doesn't suit wooden props. So I'll need to machine a simple aligner, basically a tube.

Next big thing is to sort out the brakes. They are freakin awful. I hate the design. I wish I'd gotten a tricycle undercarriage just so I can convert it into a simple handbrake. But I've been told doing that on a tail dragger means it will be almost impossible to taxi in crosswinds.

[bobbyb13]

Holy ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- is that cool.
I love it even if it never leaves the ground.

And that prop is a work of art.
Where the hell did you get something someone cared enough to make that beautiful?!

I would think that brakes only matter if you are trying to land in a small amount of space.
 

[Zebidee]

That prop is keeping everyone UP, so why not beautiful?

I love bright yellow - makes it easy to spot the plane when you crash

Looks fantastic, don't let my jibes bring you down (pun intended).

[danny_galaga]

Thanks guys!

There are still a few wooden prop makers around. A Tiger moth would just look wrong with a carbon fibre prop up the front 😄

It's actually pretty high tech. The leading edge is carbon fibre and the whole thing is covered in fibreglass.

I had the fibreglass parts of the aircraft painted at the factory. So I had a good look around at cars on the road. Needed to be something that was made in one place. No good picking a Toyota colour when there's maybe ten factories around the world. The plane kit is made in South Africa so whatever car colour I picked had to be the same there as in Australia.Likewise no point looking at pictures online because that's not a true Representation. I settled on 2018  ford mustang yellow 🙂

Yes brakes are great for short field landings, but sure are handy on start up too 😄. Also short field take offs because you can have full thrust before you roll. Gains a few precious metres

[nitrogen_widget]

Was going to bolt the propeller on today, but it seems the prop spacer that came with the kit doesn't suit wooden props. So I'll need to machine a simple aligner, basically a tube.

Next big thing is to sort out the brakes. They are freakin awful. I hate the design. I wish I'd gotten a tricycle undercarriage just so I can convert it into a simple handbrake. But I've been told doing that on a tail dragger means it will be almost impossible to taxi in crosswinds.

nice propeller.

also


$20.

[danny_galaga]

Was going to bolt the propeller on today, but it seems the prop spacer that came with the kit doesn't suit wooden props. So I'll need to machine a simple aligner, basically a tube.

Next big thing is to sort out the brakes. They are freakin awful. I hate the design. I wish I'd gotten a tricycle undercarriage just so I can convert it into a simple handbrake. But I've been told doing that on a tail dragger means it will be almost impossible to taxi in crosswinds.

nice propeller.

also


$20.

I'll need two for differential braking...

[pbj]

Nice color, it'll be easy to find and bring your family peace some day.   

How much left to do before it leaves the ground?

[danny_galaga]

Nice color, it'll be easy to find and bring your family peace some day.   

How much left to do before it leaves the ground?

Next major thing is those wretched brakes. I will do some investigating on the weekend. The toe brakes hit the firewall, preventing them from working when you are pressing full right rudder. I'm a little scared there's something fundamentally wrong that I can't fix (like maybe the firewall is further back than it should be) but that doesn't seem likely. So it's a conundrum. My only other thing to try is check the deflection. Maybe it goes much further than it needs to. The rudder was updated and there are instructions to measure the deflection. But there doesn't seem to be a system to limit the deflection. So maybe what I have to do is make a bracket that will limit the deflection, thus stopping the pedals hitting the firewall. I will also the kit engineer contact guy person. He's been pretty helpful.

I also need to finish off the electrical, which is quite funny I dragged my feet on that seeing as how I used to be an auto electrician 😂

[Zebidee]

I also need to finish off the electrical, which is quite funny I dragged my feet on that seeing as how I used to be an auto electrician 😂

I think I understand this reluctance.

It is a funny thing, but if I've ever done something professionally I hate doing it on my own time. Feels too much like work. Like, I spent many years until my mid-30's in all kinds of accounting roles, I'm good at it, but hate tasks like tracking costing for my own projects. I won't even do my own tax returns though they are simple enough.

[danny_galaga]

I also need to finish off the electrical, which is quite funny I dragged my feet on that seeing as how I used to be an auto electrician 😂

I think I understand this reluctance.

It is a funny thing, but if I've ever done something professionally I hate doing it on my own time. Feels too much like work. Like, I spent many years until my mid-30's in all kinds of accounting roles, I'm good at it, but hate tasks like tracking costing for my own projects. I won't even do my own tax returns though they are simple enough.

We call it 'plumbers tap' 😄

[bobbyb13]

"The cobblers children have no shoes..."
 

[danny_galaga]

So there's been a difference of opinion on what comes with the second hand engine I bought. There are some parts s missing off the carbies. Would cost over $300 landed for a few bits of metal that aren't even made for aircraft. Well one piece is but it's just a flat bit of steel. So I got some scrap metal for that piece, and AliExpress and a Go kart spare parts shop for the other bits. More like $50 and the satisfaction of not paying the Ro-tax 😄

[Zebidee]

Love how dodgy it seems at first glance: used motors with missing parts, bit n pieces from Aliexpress and go-karts. Yet I am optimistically confident you are doing it right (interpret as: I have no idea  ).

Work a little WD40 or similar into that throttle cable sheath and check it occasionally for corrosion - I got my 1975 Holden HZ ute airborne thanks to a stuck throttle, somehow survived, hate to think what it'd be like for someone airborne already.

[danny_galaga]

Love how dodgy it seems at first glance: used motors with missing parts, bit n pieces from Aliexpress and go-karts. Yet I am optimistically confident you are doing it right (interpret as: I have no idea  ).

Work a little WD40 or similar into that throttle cable sheath and check it occasionally for corrosion - I got my 1975 Holden HZ ute airborne thanks to a stuck throttle, somehow survived, hate to think what it'd be like for someone airborne already.

😄

First car I ever drove was a HQ. Tanks 😊

Interestingly, the Rotax carbies are full throttle as a default.springs hold them wide open. The idea being if a cable breaks you can still where you are going. If it broke and went to idle, you're gonna have to land. Only thing is that the engine is only rated to full power for a number of minutes. I think if it happened to me, I would switch off one of the ignition switches. You lose maybe 150 rpm. Would still be NEARLY full power but not totally wringing it's neck. Then alternate the switches every 5 minutes or so the plugs don't foul.

This weekend, I think I have everything I need to put in some oil and coolant and start him up. Of course nothing is ever easy. Imma guess you know how to change the oil on a car. Well forget all that on the Rotax! It's a dry sump engine. Basically to fill it up, you take off the return line on the oil tank. Point that into a container. Plug up the hole in the tank. Pressurise the tank to 10psi via the vent line. Take out the top spark plugs. Now spin the propeller around by hand maybe 100 turns 😜

Even most other aircraft enginesis roughly the same procedure as a car. Grrrr. Lucky there's a compressor in the hangar...

[nitrogen_widget]

so what is the difference between a rotax and a rotary engine or are they basically the same thing?

[danny_galaga]

Rotax is a brand, not a type. They make engines for motorcycles, jet skis, go karts aircraft.

A rotary engine is similar to a radial. So the cylinders are in a star formation. But CRANKSHAFT is bolted to the firewall and the propeller is bolted to the crankcase. The whole engine spins. Good cooling, HUGE torque (a 110hp rotary had more torque than a GT40!). but you can imagine a large unwanted gyroscopic effect. They were pretty much history after WWI.

The Rotax engine I'm running is a 4 cylinder 'boxer', like Subaru or Porsche etc.

[danny_galaga]

Milestone for the millstone


https://youtu.be/cPObCLKcieQ?si=Wp_gPVCQ2n4YtV4l

[nitrogen_widget]

is that how it's supposed to sound?
or does it need tuning?

[pbj]

I’ve told this story here before but it bears repeating.

So, I drove a home built car once.  It weighed 1400lbs and had 168 horse power.  It was the fastest vehicle I have ever driven.  But the guy that originally built it never drove it more than around the block. He was some kind of engineer that worked on satellites and had the guys in the shop assemble it after hours.  It was modeled after a BMW concept roadster that never went into production.

My dad bought it and let my wife and I take it down the highway.  And I’m not joking, you farted on the gas pedal and you were over 100mph.

Everything was great until it was time to go back home and we had to sit while a gate opened.

The genius had used an oil temperature gauge with rubber hosing.  While you were moving; there was enough air flow to keep things cool.  Have I mentioned the engine was open air and mounted directly behind the driver and passenger?  Gas tank was right beside it.

Anyway, long story short, the hose melted and sprayed oil all over the engine block.  I used to have hair halfway my back.  It caught fire.  I am thankful every day that a young girl came running out from the neighborhood pool with a fire extinguisher and saved me and kept the car from exploding.  I had second degree burns on my neck and back and got a clipper cut.  The haircut lady  was apologizing the entire time.

Quadruple check everything, Danny.  No weird ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- shortcuts. 

[danny_galaga]

Nitrogen widget, yeah notice it was fine to start and then went really rough? First I thought the carbs might simply be unbalanced, but I'm pretty sure now there's a blocked jet or cracked O ring etc in one or both carbies. I was able to easily get the bowls off to have a look. First glance looked good but then noticed the petrol 'varnish' that can build up. Cleaned all that out and checked the pilot jets but nothing out of the ordinary . So this weekend I'm taking them off completely and giving them a more thorough inspection at home. Mat need overhaul kits, which are over 200 USD each carbie. Ouch!

PBL, oil and fuel pressure lines in the cab give me the Willie's, for exactly your unfortunate experience. Electrical for me.
And yes, I'll be double quadruple checking everything. The aircraft mechanic at the field will also get his boys to go over it too. He will do the first hour flying. I'd love to be the first but it's not recommended. This guy has tested probably hundreds of aircraft in his time.

[danny_galaga]

Carbie. Notice the choke is quite a complicated beastie. Carbie also compensates for altitude so that it leans out the higher it goes. Not perfect, but acceptable

Edit: LEANS, not MEANS. stupid auto correct

[Zebidee]

Yikes, that does not look like fun.

I think I've already related how I once pulled apart the carbie from my Datsun 120Y, cleaned it, reassembled it, and everything worked 100%... but there were 4 parts left over!

Something like that clock we've probably all pulled apart as a kid.

Then there is the challenge of balancing twin carbs

Good luck! Give yourself a good clean space to work in. Take lots of photos (so you know how everything goes back together).

[danny_galaga]

Also, I'll completely do one carbie at a time, so I can also reference the other one

[nitrogen_widget]

is throttle body out of the question?
for an old car those things are great.
so easy to tune.

not sure if planes can even use them since more stuff can go wrong with them.
what about fuel injection?
or same reliability issues?

my dad has an old triumph that needs a full restore.
it was a straight 4 with dual carbs and if one had an issue he wasn't going anywhere enjoyably because two cylinders were getting more gas than the other 2.
Imagine it's like that?

yes i have not much of an idea so curious.

[danny_galaga]

There is a fuel injected version of this engine. Fuel injection is fairly popular in aircraft now, but not ubiquitous like in the auto world. Too expensive and too much mucking around for me to convert.

[danny_galaga]

Apparently the weight of the carby floats can increase over time. Something to do with it retaining too much fuel or summink. It's a big enough deal that I was going to just replace them regardless. But surprise, surprise- they ain't cheap! Luckily I found my little set of weights I made over 30 years ago when I had access to a really accurate set of digital scales. Smallest weight is 0.05 grams (50 milligrams ). So I knocked up a simple beam balance scale ⚖️ and weighed the floats. They come in pairs and can't weigh over 7 grams. Both sets came out at 3.2 and 3.15 😎

Yes, I could buy a set of accurate digital scales quite cheaply, but where's the fun in that? Building the scales was probably the most fun I've had with this airplane for months 😄

[nitrogen_widget]

sounds like the floats are not water or fuel tight right?
what about new floats?
IDK my small engine experience is my old log splitter with a pull start you have to wind manually and a magneto stopped providing spark and after futzing with magneto and about an hr of yanking on it with no luck total, my solution was to go look for a newer engine. which i found. it was so old it has a belt drive electric start, but it does have a coil. so newer!

i just have to wire it up properly now because it was on an old dead mower someone apparently stole the wiring from?.

[danny_galaga]

sounds like the floats are not water or fuel tight right?
what about new floats?

You need two pairs of these.

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/tempest_ms80-430.php?clickkey=409219

[Zebidee]

Wow, you could probably buy a new log splitter for the cost of those floats!

I'm somewhat fascinated with why the floats get heavier over time, and if so, why the heck Rotax (or Marvel/Schebler) make them out of whatever material allows this to happen.

[danny_galaga]

Wow, you could probably buy a new log splitter for the cost of those floats!

I'm somewhat fascinated with why the floats get heavier over time, and if so, why the heck Rotax (or Marvel/Schebler) make them out of whatever material allows this to happen.

So they can sell you new ones 😁

The link I pointed to is an aftermarket one. They guarantee they won't soak up fuel.

[Zebidee]

Perhaps the aftermarket are worth it, but still seems like they are gouging.

I'm wondering, can you dry the old ones out? Like, wash them then leave then in the sun for an afternoon?

[danny_galaga]

Perhaps the aftermarket are worth it, but still seems like they are gouging.

I'm wondering, can you dry the old ones out? Like, wash them then leave then in the sun for an afternoon?

It's all academic. You might have missed the bit where I weighed them and they were well within spec.

I don't think 'drying' them out will achieve anything. In normal operation, the floats are in the fuel 24/7

[Zebidee]

Didn't miss anything, and agree. Just curious about the processes involved (chemical I assume) to make them heavier.

[danny_galaga]

Yeah, I'd never heard of such a problem before. Any other fuel float I'd seen was either stamped soldered brass or plastic. Apparently the older type of floats can spring a leak though so it's not simply a matter of 'they made 'em better in the old days'

[danny_galaga]

Well, it turned out I had the fuel IN line mixed up with the fuel RETURN line. It meant the carbies were only getting a small flow of fuel 😄

Well at least I know more about Bing carbies now I guess...

https://youtube.com/shorts/TQjM3ppLkf4?si=uFY5rDSDK6ggkx_7

[danny_galaga]

Progress. Brakes still suck though.

https://youtube.com/shorts/HykMX5Zuwoc?si=oqlwhcOXLNMEqSZ

[pbj]

Is 19-2010 when you started building this?

[Zebidee]

He's doing well, considering this was his first prototype

Power is 100% renewable, no carbies, no lithium battery to burn down your house, and you can recharge in seconds.

https://youtube.com/shorts/SyB1-iq5EBE?si=Xf8NBXdRZTjCmGel

[danny_galaga]

Is 19-2010 when you started building this?

😎

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,159241.msg1674921.html#msg1674921

[danny_galaga]

Well, I finally fixed the brakes. I can now turn left AND right when taxiing now 😀

[Zebidee]

  Whenever anybody talks about brakes on an aeroplane, I *always* think about Bugs Bunny saving the day with "air brakes" in the classic HB cartoon "Hare Lift".

Here's a link for your benefit - it is a shortened version of the cartoon, only 3 minutes with beginning and end, the air brakes bit is right near then end. Love it, classic nonsense!

[RandyT]

Well, I finally fixed the brakes. I can now turn left AND right when taxiing now 😀

Meh, waste of time.  You could have just made a circular runway and traveled it counter-clockwise

[danny_galaga]

Zebidee- love it!

RandyT. Even with a circular runway, a tail dragger is hard to keep under control on the ground with just one brake working 😄

[CheffoJeffo]

Posting here so that I receive notifications. All I ever see on FB are postings about food. 

[danny_galaga]

Posting here so that I receive notifications. All I ever see on FB are postings about food. 

That was just a phase...

[danny_galaga]

Decided I should put a battery isolator in.

[Zebidee]

You should also add some switches/buttons for the stinger missiles, bunker-bombs, self-guiding torpedoes and .50 cal machine guns.

It's the only way to be sure.

[danny_galaga]

You should also add some switches/buttons for the stinger missiles, bunker-bombs, self-guiding torpedoes and .50 cal machine guns.

It's the only way to be sure.

Have I mentioned the right hand toggle switch?

[Zebidee]

Have I mentioned the right hand toggle switch?

I do have a vague memory about chem trails, or was it a dream? Am too old to know the difference.

One would assume the "chem" tanks are loaded with something socially responsible like mustard gas.

[danny_galaga]

Of course! What could be more natural than mustard 😀

[danny_galaga]

I'm making a little duct for the cowl.I wanted to attach some pics but they failed a 'security check'.

Rest assured they were the most amazing pictures ever taken 

[Zebidee]

Don't be this guy - maiden flight of his home-made light plane:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-03-05/bunbury-airport-plane-crash-pilot-dies-in-hospital/103545882

[danny_galaga]

Yes..very sad. For some reason he was trying to fly it in some pretty ordinary conditions. First flights- dead calm or nothing. There was a bit of a kerfuffle on a flying forum I'm on. This crash was being discussed and somehow someone had latched onto a name and pretty soon it was assumed he was the deceased. The guy, joined up just to say the reports of his death were greatly exaggerated.

[danny_galaga]

Great, I've taken so long to build it, the factory has gone bust.

[pbj]

There’s your sign.

Also, watch the Simon Riggs crash footage.  The little rescue parachute deploying after his plane has exploded will give you great insight to the indifference of the universe.

[danny_galaga]

There’s your sign.

Also, watch the Simon Riggs crash footage.  The little rescue parachute deploying after his plane has exploded will give you great insight to the indifference of the universe.

 I dont know what I'm looking at on youtube. Link?

[pbj]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/kSRcmjLllHY

[Howard_Casto]

Great, I've taken so long to build it, the factory has gone bust.

I'm no expert but when an airplane factory goes out of business there's probably a reason.  Probably best to throw it away and consider it a learning experience. 

[danny_galaga]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/kSRcmjLllHY

That would be comical if it weren't for the fact we probably just watched someone die. Looks like a spin. Pilot error. Cirrus is a very safe, but very expensive light aircraft. Those chutes have arguably saved a number of lives. I think just searching Cirrus parachute on YouTube should net some results

Howard, people can have great products and still go broke. I've had my issues with them but the aircraft itself isa sound design.

It happens in the aircraft world from time to time. Unfortunately, me and Mr Murphy Law are close friends 😄

[Zebidee]

To put things into better perspective, in Queensland during 2022:

- 72 Motorcycle riders died due to transport accidents
- 12 Aircraft occupants died due to powered aircraft accidents

Maybe flying is the safer option.

[Australian Bureau of Statistics, 3303.0 Causes of Death, Queensland, 2022, V20-29, V95]

[danny_galaga]

To put things into better perspective, in Queensland during 2022:

- 72 Motorcycle riders died due to transport accidents
- 12 Aircraft occupants died due to powered aircraft accidents

Maybe flying is the safer option.

[Australian Bureau of Statistics, 3303.0 Causes of Death, Queensland, 2022, V20-29, V95]

Yes, they used to say its safer than driving a car. But I dont think thats the case anymore. But, I was thinking the other day that its much safer than riding a motorbike, since you don't have drunk drivers and geriatrics gunning for you when you're in a plane

[danny_galaga]

I've been diligently double checking everything by starting from page 1 in the build manual, methodically checking every bolt and cable etc. I found a loose bolt 😲. Dismaying there was one, but good to know the methodical check picked it up. I'm just over half way through the manual now. I bought a cheap borescope to get to the hard to see places. Definitely worth buying even if it just gets used once a year.

[RandyT]

To put things into better perspective, in Queensland during 2022:

- 72 Motorcycle riders died due to transport accidents
- 12 Aircraft occupants died due to powered aircraft accidents

Maybe flying is the safer option.

[Australian Bureau of Statistics, 3303.0 Causes of Death, Queensland, 2022, V20-29, V95]

Yes, they used to say its safer than driving a car. But I dont think thats the case anymore. But, I was thinking the other day that its much safer than riding a motorbike, since you don't have drunk drivers and geriatrics gunning for you when you're in a plane

I've had a couple of close calls on a cycle with drivers pulling right in front of me.  One time with a passenger and I had to take the bike sideways and still stopped only inches from the vehicle.  Caused me to keep my eyes glued on vehicles stopped at on-roads from then on.

But statistics will be statistics.  It's not the total number of fatalities which are important, but the overall percentage of fatalities for the number of active operators.  I would suspect that there are a LOT more cycles on the roads than hobbyists buzzing around the skies. 

This discussion reminds me of a saying about the old days on the autobahn where there was no speed-limit.  As a whole, you were very unlikely to get in an accident on the Autobahn.  But if you did, it would almost certainly mean that someone was going to die in the most gruesome of ways.  This is how I view personal aircraft, except maybe with an increased chance of something bad happening.

Everyone has to go at some point.  It might as well be while doing what you love.

[Zebidee]

But statistics will be statistics.  It's not the total number of fatalities which are important, but the overall percentage of fatalities for the number of active operators.  I would suspect that there are a LOT more cycles on the roads than hobbyists buzzing around the skies. 

You are correct to point this out. However, those statistics compare JUST motorcycle rider fatalities with ALL power aircraft occupant fatalities - which means it includes everything from large commercial aircraft to things like helicopters and light planes and ultralights (but not gliders). There is no further breakdown, and that category covers a lot of people doing a lot of stuff, not just ultralight hobbyists. Queensland is BIG, people fly there a lot and for many reasons.

No doubt, motorcycles can be quite dangerous even if you are careful. A lot of what makes them dangerous is other drivers with poor awareness.

For the curious, there were a total of 324 transport accident related deaths in Queensland for 2022 (V01-V99).

Interestingly 11 people died due to "Sleep disorders (G47)"   Even sleeping is dangerous. A further 4 people died from falling off chairs (W07), so sitting can be dangerous too.

Life is short, don't worry too much, do what makes you happy, just please try to be as safe as reasonably possible.

[danny_galaga]

2.6 times the size of Texas

[RandyT]

That is pretty large.  Land mass really isn't that much if an indicator though.  People don't travel on long trips like they used to before Skype, Covid, etc. But people do still commute, go to the store and visit friends locally.

If you really want to know how safe an activity is, you have to do what insurance companies attempt to do, which is determine the number of hours on the road/ in the sky and compare that to the fatality record.  Good luck coming up with accurate numbers though.  Flight logs probably make this easy for aircraft, but there are no accurate records of that nature for cycles.

[danny_galaga]

Actuaries have their methods. And it's reflected in the premiums- a light plane costs a lot more to insure than a motorbike, so I guess really riding a bike is safer. But PERSONALLY I feel safer in the air than on a motorbike.
Incidentally, what type of plane it is effects your premium too. Mines not quite ready to insure but I know that because my plane is a tail dragger, the premium is roughly $1000 a year ON TOP of premium. If I had built the tricycle version of my kit, I'd save $1000 a year on insurance. Why?They fly exactly the same. But tail draggers are more likely to have accidents on the ground when taking off or landing. Usually a ground loop. Not normally resulting in any injury, but can cause damage to the plane.

[RandyT]

Trying not to sound too grim here, but caskets are a lot cheaper than extended medical stays.  And aircraft are much more costly than cycles.  Two things which probably get factored into the premiums in a substantial way.  So insurance costs probably aren't really great indicators of safety either, regardless of how good their estimations of use happen to be. 

IOW, insurance companies are MUCH more concerned with the fiscal aspects than human life and limb. You'd probably need to get ahold of some of those closely guarded internal numbers to get a real feel for what they believe with regard to actual safety of the activity.

[danny_galaga]

Trying not to sound too grim here, but caskets are a lot cheaper than extended medical stays.  And aircraft are much more costly than cycles.  Two things which probably get factored into the premiums in a substantial way.  So insurance costs probably aren't really great indicators of safety either, regardless of how good their estimations of use happen to be. 

IOW, insurance companies are MUCH more concerned with the fiscal aspects than human life and limb. You'd probably need to get ahold of some of those closely guarded internal numbers to get a real feel for what they believe with regard to actual safety of the activity.

Agreed. Insurance companies use very complicated math to come to their conclusions. In fact, if you are an actuary, high level physics is no big deal. Certainly is interesting that my insurance will cost about $1000 more than the exact same plane that has a wheel at the front, instead of the back. Makes sense of course, had I thought harder about it when buying the kit, I might have gone tricycle. But tail draggers just LOOK cooler 😀 . And of course have a little less drag. And keep your rudder skills sharp.

[Zebidee]

You're right about death being cheaper in general. Say you accidentally hit someone with your car. Often you'd be better off killing the person than causing a major injury like spinal damage, for which you could be liable for a lot more (medical & recuperation, pain & suffering, etc).

Insurance companies know this.

But yeah, Queensland is bigger than it looks on a map and has a lot of remote areas that are (realistically) only accessible by plane or helicopter. Especially in the far north and west, but coastal regions too (there are many islands). It takes about 3 days driving to get from Brisbane to Cairns, 2 days only if you really push it. In addition to going from A to B, people use helicopters to herd cattle and track crocodiles, visit islands and perform rescues, and hundreds of other things.

There was a famous crocodile wrangler that died in a helicopter accident in 2022, has a court case attached, but unfortunately and inconveniently for us, that happened in the Northern Territory (next door).

Most of the data actuaries use is in public domain if you care to look for it (in one of my hats I am a data analyst, but have better things to do unless someone wants to pay me). But going on my gut feeling, as I also grew up in Queensland and know motorbikes, is that ultralights seem a lot safer. Even tail-draggers.

[danny_galaga]

But going on my gut feeling, as I also grew up in Queensland and know motorbikes, is that ultralights seem a lot safer. Even tail-draggers.

😁

As an aside, I grew up in the Northern Territory. Even in the NT, we looked on at QLD like you were all rednecks 😂. Once Joh was gone, a lot of us realised 'Hey, its a nice place, and not EVERYONE from QLD is a fascist ' 😀

[Zebidee]

Unfortunately I know exactly what you mean lol. Yeah it is true. Lots of "rednecks", at least in Central Qld. Far from everyone obviously, many great folks too and I have some good friends from those days, but yeah.

I lived in Qld from roughly ages 9 to 17 - before that I was riding motorbikes n other stuff around a farm in NSW. We only went there because my old man got a great job at Rocky Grammar (Central Qld). Even though I'd come from a rural area already, Queenslanders were a shock to my innocent nine year-old southern self. Bullying at the schools was rife, so I survived by joining a nerd gang (played D&D). Luckily I eventually escaped by getting into Uni in Canberra. Was like breathing fresh air again.

Nowadays, I'd maybe like it there again but maybe a bit closer to Brisvegas. Rocky is too hot & humid, so somewhere south from there.

[danny_galaga]

Just so happens the latest issue of Sport Pilot Magazine has safety stats for dec23-mar24. So these stats are only for aircraft in my category, which is ultralight/LSA

3 fatal accidents
4 aircraft destroyed
14 aircraft damaged
7 injuries
17 flight training occurrences
30 private operation occurrences

Not actually sure what they mean by 'occurences', unless it's the same as 'incidents'.

Sadly one of those fatal accidents was at my airfield, in January. Two deaths, my flying instructor and a new owner of an aircraft that my instructor was giving conversion training to.

[Zebidee]

Are those stats for Australia or just for Queensland?

Sorry to hear about the fatalities. Deaths are never good

[danny_galaga]

That's the whole of Australia. RA-AUS, which is a licensing organisation for ultralights, LSA etc. I have a regular licence, but it was a hassle to keep it current. The RA-AUS license is easier to maintain, but has some limitations. Weight limit is the big one. My GA (general aviation ) licence allows up to 5400kg mtow. A DC3 is roughly twice that, so some pretty big planes. My rpc (recreational pilot certificate) has a maximum of 600kg mtow. Also only one passenger,no aerobatics, no night flying. It's a good compromise if you just want to fly for fun 🙂

[danny_galaga]

.

[Zebidee]

Beautiful

[RandyT]

If she flies as good as she looks, you'll be the envy of the airfield.  Great work!

[danny_galaga]

Instrument panel is finally completely installed.it was just hanging on one bolt and some tape for the longest time, just in case I had to take it out to modify etc. now it's in, it's never coming out again as it will be a PITA to remove.

It looks great, but apparently the photo failed security checks 🤷‍♂️

[Zebidee]

Might be just the pic is too large - try resizing it, save as a jpg etc

[danny_galaga]

.

[bobbyb13]

WOW is that impressive.
Beautiful even if it never left the ground.

The prop alone looks like a work of art.

 

[danny_galaga]

.

[Zebidee]

Lol

Do the cute little pictograms actually mean anything, or are they just for decoration? The graph has two obvious axes (age, death probability), so is there a third dataset? I guess not, no attribution either. I'm being too fussy.

Must be just for fun as I see two cyclists in very different spots (and both seem to be wearing helmets too)! Looking at it in a different way, seems to suggest that people over 100 must like skydiving a lot   

How is the plane coming along?

[danny_galaga]

Yeah, unfortunately it's part of a bigger 'picture", the age context doesn't make much sense there does it  😄

Basically, it was showing your chances of dying in the next 1000 hours of continuing with a particular activity. Baseline is commercial jet airline travel, 0.01%. driving a car is four times more deadly at 0.04% but clearly still pretty safe . I think motorcycling was something like 0.6%, which is over a magnitude higher than cars. Flying light aircraft gets you into the 'climby' part of the graph at something like 1.6%. looks a small number, but 160 times more dangerous than airline travel!

The top dude is climbing Mt Everest! The two bikes are regular cycling and downhill mountain biking.

Way off the charts is basejumping and F1 racing. I think base jumping had you at 94% change of dying in the next 1000 hours of activity which made it 9400 times as dangerous as airline travel 😄. F1 racing was only about half as dangerous as base jumping!

[Zebidee]

The top dude is climbing Mt Everest! The two bikes are regular cycling and downhill mountain biking.

Oh, that makes sense! You can see the difference between the bikes if you look closely (road bike vs offroad).



 

[PL1]

Way off the charts is basejumping and F1 racing. I think base jumping had you at 94% change of dying in the next 1000 hours of activity which made it 9400 times as dangerous as airline travel 😄. F1 racing was only about half as dangerous as base jumping!

The important context here is "the next 1000 hours of activity".

Pretty sure there are many F1 drivers who have racked up over 1000 hours of racing time.

Assuming that the average BASE jump lasts less than one minute from jump to touchdown, it would take over 60,000 jumps to rack up 1000 hours of actual jump time.  AFAIK the record number of BASE jumps is 4008 by Miles Daisher.  (ref)

Even if the chart makers assumed an average jump took 15 minutes to pack the chute, 4 minutes to gear up, 10 minutes to climb/move into position, and 1 minute of jump time, it would take 2000 jumps to rack up 1000 hours of activity.

Short duration + severe consequences for mistakes is what makes the numerical rating for BASE jumping so insanely high on this chart.

Two parting thoughts:






Scott

[danny_galaga]

I think this might go a long way to explaining why base jumpers have a shorter life expectancy (clue, the term is 'self entitlement' 😄 )

Language warning

https://youtu.be/TLsf7PjW11A?si=i4TJeUF8NuTETahw

[pbj]

You’re spending an awful lot of time trying to convince us this isn’t dangerous.

Wheels left the ground yet?

[danny_galaga]

You’re spending an awful lot of time trying to convince us this isn’t dangerous.

Wheels left the ground yet?

Yes. One at a time- I had to replace some parts in the undercarriage already 😄

[danny_galaga]

Most important part went on yesterday - a cartoon of its pilot as Axel

[danny_galaga]

Well, it's down to paperwork now. Weight and balance logging is the next step.

I now haven't flown for 7 months in anything, and a number of YEARS in a tail dragger, so I'm going to do a refresher course. Not cheap of course...

[pbj]

[danny_galaga]

GERRY DOWN!

[danny_galaga]

This is what $900 of weighing looks like

[bobbyb13]

I like the technique here!
What was the final number?

[RandyT]

This is what $900 of weighing looks like

I would have been tempted to find the center of balance and put a bottle jack on a scale

[danny_galaga]

This is what $900 of weighing looks like

I would have been tempted to find the center of balance and put a bottle jack on a scale

😄

There's a standard procedure for all this. You start with a datum point and then measure back from there..in this case  it's 100mm out from the wing strut attachment, plumb bob down to the ground. With the correct info, you can plug in the weights for each flight, in my case it would normally be pilot/passenger, how much fuel and two different luggage locations. Then you can see if it sits within the flight envelope. There can be situations where it's within the envelope when taking off, but if the fuel is nearly empty, it will be out of balance.

Now imagine how complicated that is for a jet airliner!  I'm going to bet that whenever you have whole rugby teams etc in board, they'll be in the front 😃

[RandyT]

That's why I don't fly.  I'm lucky if I take a minute to kick the tires on my vehicle before piling in and driving off. 

But on the large jet airliners, I get the feeling that the engines are so powerful and the passengers/cargo make up such a small percentage of the overall weight distribution, it only becomes an issue if they get overloaded.  I could be wrong, but I have never seen passengers moved around on a half-booked flight or the luggage guys do anything other than just toss the baggage into the hull of the craft "willy-nilly".

[danny_galaga]

The further away from the centre of gravity, the more effect it will have. Trust me, you may never see them ever have to move people around, but they have to do those calculations by law. If you think about it, 100 passengers is maybe 8000kg. That's not insignificant.. pretty much any wing stalls at about 14° angle of attack. If that's exceeded it doesn't matter how powerful the engine is, you've stalled. And if you are tail heavy, you may not have enough elevator to unstall it. In fact being tail heavy probably caused the stall in the first place.
Here's the basics of what happens with weight and balance

https://aerocorner.com/blog/aircraft-weight-and-balance/

https://youtube.com/shorts/nkYgznZLgyo?si=VvVBVoSdhWv6SpX3

[RandyT]

The further away from the centre of gravity, the more effect it will have. Trust me, you may never see them ever have to move people around, but they have to do those calculations by law. If you think about it, 100 passengers is maybe 8000kg. That's not insignificant.. pretty much any wing stalls at about 14° angle of attack. If that's exceeded it doesn't matter how powerful the engine is, you've stalled. And if you are tail heavy, you may not have enough elevator to unstall it. In fact being tail heavy probably caused the stall in the first place.
Here's the basics of what happens with weight and balance

https://aerocorner.com/blog/aircraft-weight-and-balance/

https://youtube.com/shorts/nkYgznZLgyo?si=VvVBVoSdhWv6SpX3

I think the thing that makes commercial airlines a bit more forgiving is that the wings (and engines) are pretty much centered with the cargo.  I'm not sure it's possible for the positioning of people to throw that off beyond what the flaps, etc. are rated for, unless for some reason 1st class and half of coach is empty and everyone else is sitting together.  But on the luggage side of things, I can see them weighing the carts full of luggage, and doing their best to distribute that as evenly as possible in multiple holds.

But like you said, in the case of a rugby team, they would flock together.  Everyone else would find a new seat and naturally disperse if allowed to (from personal experience.)  Although, I'm not sure that is permitted anymore.

On the flip side, I wonder how all of that changes when the craft is empty.  I know they are loathe to move them in that state, but I imagine it must be done on occasion.

[pbj]

Yeah, I’ve been asked to move before for weight distribution.  Can’t recall having to do it on anything like a 737, but it’s happened several times on smaller ones.  Hooray obesity.

[danny_galaga]

As long as you are under 160, we can fly in my plane 🙂Although at 160, I do t think we can carry any fuel...

[pbj]

So, it turns out the US Postal Service has a museum.  It’s actually fairly interesting and apparently nobody goes to it.  It is also impossible to buy stamps or mail anything there on Sundays - they sent me across the street to Walgreens.  I think if there’s one place in the world that you’d at least have a stamp machine and a Mail Drop is the US Postal Service museum but apparently not.

Anyway, TL:DR - saw these, thought of you

 

[danny_galaga]

I have a pair of cheap retro flying goggles. I bought it to ride in The Distinguished Gentleman's Ride one year. I think I might wear them in my plane. Thanks for the idea 🙂

[danny_galaga]

Ghetto jack ftw

[pbj]

I got in a hot air balloon last weekend.  Pure, unadulterated terror.  Godspeed, Danny.

[nipsmg]

I just got my PPL recently and have been toying with building an ultralight-- then completely scrapped the idea because I'm an idiot who takes on too many projects but never finishes any of them.

This looks spectacular!  What did you end up with as useful load after the W&B?   And did you go with the 912?  And are you PPL or sport pilot? Are you even in the US? so many questions.

[danny_galaga]

so many questions.

😄

I got my ppl in the 90's and then let it go. About 6 years ago I converted it to what I guess you call a sports licence. I'm in Australia.

I've regretted starting this almost from the beginning. If you start too many projects, which I do, then starting this sort of project may kill you psychologically. It has me.

But some tips if you are think about it:


Don't believe the manufacturers BS - they will say you can build it in six weeks and that there's nothing extra you need to get. They all say this. And all kits have things missing or wrong or both in my case. Even as it was at sea on the way to me, they issued an AD on it! They were grounded for a short while in the US I believe. So once I got it I had to build it knowing that the whole empennage would have to be replaced. The updated parts took over a year to be produce. I actually had to replace a lot of the rear end of the fuselage. But you couldn't really know until you got to that point. Very, very unsatisfying having to pull apart what you've only just built. Then there's all the missing/incorrect parts you come across as you're building.

I get disappointed easily. This has been the most unfun thing I've ever done.but it's way too expensive to ditch like you could with a mame cab that didn't quite work out.

Don't get me wrong, it's not something I DONT recommend doing. But if you have traits not dissimilar to mine, think twice.

Think- if there are hurdles like that, do I have the personality to rise to the occasion and get on with, never looking back. Think about other projects you've done that you have unfinished and why.

All kit manufacturers act like it's a box of Lego with everything there and perfectly designed. If you have a strong personality, and ignore the BS, knowing there are going to be exasperating moments then you'll probably be fine.

Me, around the time I bought the kit, I was toying with buying a T bucket or similar. I would have had MUCH more fun in those years I've been building this thing.

Anyway, the most joy I get with this kit now is complaining about it 😄

There's about 240kg total usable load.

Oh and the kit manufacturer? They've gone broke ..

[RandyT]

All kit manufacturers act like it's a box of Lego with everything there and perfectly designed. If you have a strong personality, and ignore the BS, knowing there are going to be exasperating moments then you'll probably be fine.

Sounds like every Chinese scooter/ATV (and quite a number of other things from that corner of the world) I have ever purchased.  But it usually ends up ok at the end...usually.

[danny_galaga]

All kit manufacturers act like it's a box of Lego with everything there and perfectly designed. If you have a strong personality, and ignore the BS, knowing there are going to be exasperating moments then you'll probably be fine.

Sounds like every Chinese scooter/ATV (and quite a number of other things from that corner of the world) I have ever purchased.  But it usually ends up ok at the end...usually.

😄

There were actually two kit manufacturers (out of hundreds) that were 100% complete for EVERY kit .the first was the Christensen Eagle. Pretty much the father of the modern kit. The other was the Quicksilver MX. They both utilised a simple fool proof system. It's boggling that no one else seems to use it. Basically you would have sheets of cardboard printed with everything single part shadowed and described. Now you have a guy place all those parts on the shadow. Then he covers it in heat seal vacuum clear plastic. Very very easy to see something is amiss. For instance a missing part would stand out. Also say a bolt that is too long or short will stand out. The person packing those sheets just has to go off a checklist but if they are just numbered say 1-50 you don't even need that.

As you build your plane, only when the manual asks for it, you cut the part out with a single edged razor. Maybe factories don't do it now because it might take up more space. But where's the savings if you have to keep sending parts out to your increasingly irate customer? I reckon my guys spent over $1000 on DHL freight sending me missing parts. Right at the beginning, the engine mount had some corrosion on it. Something went wrong with the plating process. So they sent me another mount IN A CARDBOARD BOX!  Yep, when I got it, it was bent. So then they had to send me another, this time in a small wooden crate

[danny_galaga]

The only two manufacturers in mind that could guarantee a quality product were at extreme ends of the scale. The Eagle was a fully aerobatic plane powered by usually a Continental 0360. About 200hp. The MX was an early ultralight powered by something like a 30hp single cylinder two stroke.

[nitrogen_widget]

As long as you are under 160, we can fly in my plane 🙂Although at 160, I do t think we can carry any fuel...

KG's or LB's?

[bobbyb13]

That Eagle is one badass looking machine!

Everybody can keep the gocarts with wings that look like kites I used to fly as a kid.

[danny_galaga]

As long as you are under 160, we can fly in my plane 🙂Although at 160, I do t think we can carry any fuel...

TV
KG's or LB's?

KG's. Lbs is from the olden days. We are now in the future 🙂

[danny_galaga]

That Eagle is one badass looking machine!

Everybody can keep the gocarts with wings that look like kites I used to fly as a kid.

Fantastic isn't it? It's not for beginners though. You need to have an aerobatic endorsement ideally to fly this, and be proficient. And it's probably thousands of hours to build, as opposed to probably less than 100 for the Quicksilver.

[pbj]

How about a gokart with a parachute and fan?

https://www.easyflight.com/

You could have been in the air five years ago with one of these.

[danny_galaga]

How about a gokart with a parachute and fan?

https://www.easyflight.com/

You could have been in the air five years ago with one of these.

I know, dammit. One time I was flying over a lake and saw one just pootling along a few hundred feet above the trees. And I thought 'now THAT'S flying'. And if something goes wrong, you've already got a parachute 😃

Mind you, you are very limited in what you can do. Same with the Quicksilver. Best for crack of dawn, or late afternoon when the air is more likely to be calm. And no passenger.

[bobbyb13]

Looks like there are two person versions of those powered parachutes to be had for $50k.
Could be really fun in the right place/time.

[danny_galaga]

Looks like there are two person versions of those powered parachutes to be had for $50k.
Could be really fun in the right place/time.

😲

50k USD is probably about what I've spent on a real airplane. Seems to me theyve missed the point of what a powered parachute should be about

[bobbyb13]

It is impressive that you have only spent that much to be able to build such a cool machine.

I would think that for group float activity ballooning would be far more fun than dangling from a parachute with somebody..

[danny_galaga]

Ballooning is something else again. I did it once..very tranquil. It blows mind that balloonists basically steer by going up and down to find the right direction of wind. An understanding of weather far beyond the average pilot I reckon.

Mines still not flying yet, but I did taxi it around the airfield on the weekend..it looks really nice on the ground 😊

[pbj]

The balloon also has a rudder flap on the side of it that they can use to steer some. Sort of.  I think he was also tugging in the sides with ropes to accomplish something. Fellow passengers were flight attendants and they asked about 10,000 questions.

 

[danny_galaga]

Inspection is happening in a week or so, then if all goes well, test flying.
Before the inspection, I had to have a stainless steel identity plate made. I hunted around for someone to make one. Oh cool, there's a place only a few hundred metres from work. I go there and and am immediately treated like I'm a door to door salesman or summink. I tell them what I need. Oh, you'll need to email us the details. But I'm right here! No mind, I go outside and then email them 🙄

They send me back a quote and a PDF mockup. $89. It looks ---smurfing--- RETARDED. Faaark, how hard could it be? I email them back to say the C's look like G's, can we just go with a simple sans serif? Next sample almost looked worse! I get the picture, I thought to myself. They don't want to do business with me. If it were me I would say so, or st least say there's a minimum order.

So I hunt around online. Find a place, $55. But it's a long way away so I'd miss a weekend. Then I think hey, I deliver mail to a sign writer, maybe they can help? I go see them. They say they've got a guy. She opens an email from them . It's my --missioncontrols-- from before! We agree it would be funny if I ordered through the sign writer. They would know it's me. Sign writer would play dumb. We go ahead. Then I get a quote from the sign writer. $150! Too late now, I don't want to reneg on them since they helped me with other stuff on the plane. But THEN they say it won't be ready until next Monday. I tell them Monday might as well be Friday since I can get it express post from the other guys for half the price. Suddenly it is possible. But can I go pick it up.

Sigh... So I swallow my pride and pick it up. We don't say a word to each other

These are the sorts of fun times I've had over the years with this stupid plane.

I tell people now, if they want to take up project management as a hobby, build a kit plane 😄

[danny_galaga]

Oh, and the reason the original quote looked retarded?.turns out there was some sort of translational problem between their PC and my android phone. The original artwork was fine 😄

[nitrogen_widget]

Ballooning is something else again. I did it once..very tranquil. It blows mind that balloonists basically steer by going up and down to find the right direction of wind. An understanding of weather far beyond the average pilot I reckon.

Mines still not flying yet, but I did taxi it around the airfield on the weekend..it looks really nice on the ground 😊

does look good.

[pbj]

It’s current year.  Stop using retarded as an insult.  Don’t look through my comment history - I’ve evolved.

[danny_galaga]

It’s current year.  Stop using retarded as an insult.  Don’t look through the my comment history - I’ve evolved.

Differently abled 🤷‍♂️

[RandyT]

It’s current year.  Stop using retarded as an insult.  Don’t look through my comment history - I’ve evolved.

Only in America is someone using a word, as intended by it's textbook definition, considered to be insulting.

In the sense that the quote was not fully developed or held back from it's full potential by an incompatibility, it is quite proper to consider it to be "retarded". 

Therefore, you have in your calling out of the word, devolved, regardless of the current year.  Are bakers next to be scolded for retarding the rise of their dough through refrigeration? 

[pbj]

It was meant to be humorous you mongoloid.

 

[RandyT]

It was meant to be humorous you mongoloid.

 

I suspected as much.  The reason I dissected your comment was to A: give you a hard time and B: infer that it would have landed better and casted less doubt about your intentions had you left out the "I've evolved" part.  That made it look like you weren't fully committed to the bit...just in case. 

Differently abled 🤷‍♂️

Now THAT is a humorous response when referring to a mangled file. 

[danny_galaga]

So the plane was supposed to get an inspection today, but the airstrip was hit with a huge storm yesterday, so it's going to our of commission for a few days. It's a grass strip. Could do it next week but since I have a week's leave the week after its going to be done then.

Once it's inspected and gets a test flight permit, I'll need to insure it. More money..who knew owning your own airplane would be so expensive...

[Zebidee]

---fudgesicle--- me, if whatsi can evolve then maybe there is hope for the rest of us.

I am *trying* to evolve but seem to keep getting stuck commenting on posts like this.

Looking forward to seeing pics of the test flight! Wooooo!

[RandyT]

Once it's inspected and gets a test flight permit, I'll need to insure it. More money..who knew owning your own airplane would be so expensive...

Are you keeping a tally of the total so far, or is it one of those "stopped counting after X" situations?  And out of curiosity, what does it cost to insure something like that?  My gut is telling me that it's costly, but I thought the same thing about motorcycle insurance the first time I bought some and was surprised at how cheap it was.

[pbj]

Motorcycle insurance is cheap because you usually don't survive.   

[danny_galaga]

Motorcycle insurance is cheap because you usually don't survive.   

😄

[danny_galaga]

Once it's inspected and gets a test flight permit, I'll need to insure it. More money..who knew owning your own airplane would be so expensive...

Are you keeping a tally of the total so far, or is it one of those "stopped counting after X" situations?  And out of curiosity, what does it cost to insure something like that?  My gut is telling me that it's costly, but I thought the same thing about motorcycle insurance the first time I bought some and was surprised at how cheap it was.

Yeah, lost count ages ago. I'll quote in USD. And I'll add 5% because our dollar was a bit stronger some years back

The kit was roughly 30,000 USD . Propeller roughly $1100. These two things both came from Sert Efrikah so even more exchange rate obfuscation there. Engine was about $4000 ON CONDITION. Basically that's airplane talk for second hand 😄I bought it off my mechanic, out of one of his hire planes. You can only go to 2000 hours if used commercially. Mine is actually at about 1850 hours so could go longer but he had an opportunity to replace it earlier. These engines have been known to go up to 4000 hours. What's cool about this particular engine is I've already got maybe 20 hours on it from when I was hiring his plane 😊. It was the best call in retrospect. Most private pilots don't even rack up 100 hours a year. And I'm not even sure I'm going to keep the plane long. For reference I think the Rotax 912 ULS is now over $20,000 new.

I was having such a hard time with the QA of this kit I managed to sweet talk them into sending me approximately $3000 worth of free avionics. Some of it was nearly worthless to me. For instance a transponder that didn't match Australian regulations anymore and that I wasn't going to use anyway. And an ASI (air speed indicator) that was in mph instead of knots. I sold the transponder for about $300 (made in Texas, worth about $1800) to someone who happened to still have that model in his plane. In general the rules are you can replace like for like during repairs as long as it's exactly the same model. Also sold the crappy compass for about $100. Main thing I ended up with was the radio, which was a medium level one. Roughly $1500. It works well so happy with that.
I can't remember how much I paid for the rest of the instruments. Maybe $1500 plus more recently $650 for a correct ASI.

LOTS of odds and ends, like an aerial for instance. and I knew right at the beginning I should have kept tabs on it all. Who knows, maybe $2000 all up including the vinyl graphics which obviously isn't necessary for flight.

Insurance is very roughly $2000 a year for a tricycle undercarriage, and maybe $2500 for a tail dragger like mine. Even though it's otherwise exactly the same plane, tail draggers tend to have more incidents on the runway with groundloops. Normally no biggie (see video, same plane I first tried tailwheel flying in coincidentally) but its easy to see there's a chance of some sort of damage.

https://youtu.be/N6jSruMW84Q?si=THupIW1YHsjng3x0

[nitrogen_widget]

so what happens when it hits 4k hours?
what has to be done to it?
strip to block and overhaul, scrap, or sell it to someone making a dune buggy or air boat?

[danny_galaga]

You just keep.measuring cylinder pressures. If they start to drop off, you could rebuild. But to do a full rebuild is over 20k, which is why flying schools just sell them 'on condition ' at 2000 and buy a new engine. I have thought with the right kind of adaptor, it would make a bitchin replacement for air-cooled VW engines. You'll need a radiator, but they cool so well you could just have the radiator in the engine bay

[RandyT]

Taking to the air is a costly undertaking.  I think I'll stick to flight sims.

20k is crazy for engine, but I guess if you were a sledding enthusiast, you could recycle an EOL engine to one of those machines.  I'd imagine it would be a drop in replacement for a standard 912 with an extra 20 HP for those who like to go fast.  I know a guy who put a similar sled engine on a RZR 800 4x4 and that thing was just stupid.

[bobbyb13]

I like this concept of repurposing a spent engine.
Gives me hope for a power plant for the 550 Spyder project I hope to get to before I'm dust!

You just keep.measuring cylinder pressures. If they start to drop off, you could rebuild. But to do a full rebuild is over 20k, which is why flying schools just sell them 'on condition ' at 2000 and buy a new engine. I have thought with the right kind of adaptor, it would make a bitchin replacement for air-cooled VW engines. You'll need a radiator, but they cool so well you could just have the radiator in the engine bay

[danny_galaga]

Taking to the air is a costly undertaking.  I think I'll stick to flight sims.

20k is crazy for engine, but I guess if you were a sledding enthusiast, you could recycle an EOL engine to one of those machines.  I'd imagine it would be a drop in replacement for a standard 912 with an extra 20 HP for those who like to go fast.  I know a guy who put a similar sled engine on a RZR 800 4x4 and that thing was just stupid.

Rotax 912 is completely different to things like snowmobile engines. It's much more akin to the air-cooled VW,  so MIGHT be useful in a VW project like Bobby's 550 Spyder. It's an honest 100hp. You can get that from VW engines but it'll cost a lot more and be less reliable. The big snag is the reduction gearbox for the propeller. This is the end which you would probably attach the clutch to. But even right now I  can't think if it'll be spinning the right way or not without that gearbox. My thought is that if it's spinning the wrong way without the gearbox, which only has two gears in it, you could get 1:1 gears made to replace them. Not ideal, but still probably more reliable and powerful than most air-cooled VW engines

[RandyT]

Yeah, I don't doubt that there are aircraft specific mods made to them.  But when it comes to engine retrofits, as long as it has an output shaft of some nature, it could be made to work on just about anything, one way or another.  The air-cooling presents the biggest challenge, which probably makes them more suitable to winter motorsports, where the cold air and a simple cooling fan at idle would probably be enough to keep it from self-immolating. 

[danny_galaga]

Yeah, I don't doubt that there are aircraft specific mods made to them.  But when it comes to engine retrofits, as long as it has an output shaft of some nature, it could be made to work on just about anything, one way or another.  The air-cooling presents the biggest challenge, which probably makes them more suitable to winter motorsports, where the cold air and a simple cooling fan at idle would probably be enough to keep it from self-immolating.

I mean the general format is not conducive..things like snowmobiles and jet skis tend to have inline engines because they are quite narrow..flat fours are quite wide and I'm.not sure you would fit this inside the bodywork. If going for crazy modified snowmobiles I would think a better fit would be an online four motorcycle engine like for instance the Suzuki GS 1000. Cheaper and more powerful than the Rotax 912 and potentially much easier to fit. It's a win/win/win 🙂

[RandyT]

I mean the general format is not conducive..things like snowmobiles and jet skis tend to have inline engines because they are quite narrow..flat fours are quite wide and I'm.not sure you would fit this inside the bodywork. If going for crazy modified snowmobiles I would think a better fit would be an online four motorcycle engine like for instance the Suzuki GS 1000. Cheaper and more powerful than the Rotax 912 and potentially much easier to fit. It's a win/win/win 🙂

My thoughts were along the lines of an ultra-modified machine.  After seeing it, it's clear that a drop in replacement would probably not be a thing.  Hell, I have seen some YT videos of people running farm vehicles and full-sized cars with the Predator twin cylinder from Harbor Freight.  I put one of these in my Terramite as well.  There were several challenges to overcome, like mounting layout, the output shaft location and direction, exhaust, etc. but the end result was a more powerful and cheaper engine that has outperformed the original.  Where there is a will, there is a way.

My only point was that a high-reliability, performant engine past it's prime for air use could still have a long and useful life for other applications where these qualities are sought and where failure won't equate to plummeting a few thousand feet to the ground .    For what these cost, it would make sense to re-purpose them in order to reclaim some value.  That is, of course, if complete rebuilds costing considerably less than new weren't an option.

[danny_galaga]

Agreed..like I say, I think there's great potential for air-cooled VW cars. Once the engineering is sorted out, it could well be a drop in replacement. Adapting it looks simple, but would need a well thought out system. The 912 is more like a car engine than an aircraft engine, in that it operates in similar rev range. But it is still built from the ground up for aircraft. My thought is to drive the clutch where the prop is driven, and have a pair of 1:1 ratio gears to replace the existing approximately 1:2 ratio gears . The carbies can probably stay. Even though in general aircraft have different carbie requirements, the 912 uses Bing carbies, same as BMW motorbikes used to use.
Regarding cooling, the 912 has air cooled cylinders, oil cooling and liquid cooled heads. The cooling tends to work so well that in many European countries, they are flying with tape covering some of the radiator. In say a Beetle I reckon you could just put a radiator in the engine bay, without even a direct air flow and it would still be fine.

[RandyT]

Cooling:  Ok, that opens a lot more possibilities.  When I hear "Air-cooled" I think of the older engines which had no radiators, oil-coolers, etc. whatsoever.   That, of course, has changed over time, with most bikes, 4-wheelers and SxSs having at minimum oil coolers, with the latter even having actual radiators like a car.  One of my 250cc scooters actually has two radiators in-line just to keep the heat down.  I remember when I first got the machine, it had an overheating problem that I couldn't identify because I didn't know about the second radiator buried way down under the seat.  Turns out that one had a dead electric fan out of the gate.  Replaced it and no more overheating condition. 

Carbs:  They sound like nice carbs.  The only thing which might be fun is getting them adjusted properly for thicker air at ground level.  Which leads me to another question:  Do those engines tend to run lean on the ground, or is the air-fuel mix something which is controlled by some device or by the operator as necessary?  I never really considered this before, but I would think something would need to happen to account for the difference.

[danny_galaga]

The Bings, either by design or happy accident, lean out at altitude. 'Real' aircraft engines have a manual mixture control. Generally, below 5000 feet you just leave it on full rich. Above that you start leaning it, from memory in reference to an exhaust gas temperature gauge.
The other thing with aircraft is carby icing. At just the right altitude and humidity, ice will start to build up in the carby throat. You can imagine that wouldn't be good. On 'real' aircraft, if the engine starts to run rough and you suspect carby icing, you can pull a carby heat lever. That just bypasses the air filter and pulls air past the exhaust manifold. De ices pretty quickly, but you lose about 5% power. On my aircraft, and many others with a Rotax, there is a little water jacket around the throats. This means it's getting hot water from the cooling system and the throat is always warmer than otherwise. Because it's not feeding hot air into the engine, thus losing power, it's on permanently. The only drawback I see is that if your engine starts to run rough, you don't have that simple check of turning on the carby heat. Is it icing? Or something else? All you can do is drop altitude and see if it clears up.

Anyway, NONE of that matters for our hypothetical terrestrial uses, just thought you might find it interesting ☺️

[danny_galaga]

Plane was inspected yesterday. No big surprises, relatively speaking. Will tidy up a couple of small, but potentially problematic that the mechanic picked up on. One of them being a bolt from the seat back pressing against the fuel thank, potentially it would wear a hole through it eventually 😲

[RandyT]

Anyway, NONE of that matters for our hypothetical terrestrial uses, just thought you might find it interesting ☺️

Thanks for the insights on how this works.  I absolutely find this stuff interesting.  I can imagine that quite a few bad endings have come about from inexperienced pilots who lose their cool when something stops working properly and they fail to identify the causes quickly to enough to recover.  As much as it isn't for everyone, that's probably one major advantage to building things yourself and fully understanding all of the machine's intricacies.

She's looking really nice!  Good catch by the inspector.  Probably not the first time they have seen that kind of thing

[danny_galaga]

Latest hurdle I can't blame on the kit manufacturer. The authorities have never heard of the brand of propeller I'm using and are giving us a hard time. I mean, they COULD google it if they liked

http://www.p-propeller.co.za/

It's a good indication of how innovation has fallen behind in Australia...

[Zebidee]

Oh, Australia has plenty of innovation. What it lacks is a culture of support for innovation, entrepreneurialism and capability.

Australia also lacks is a thriving manufacturing sector to support that innovation - used to have it, but we've been letting it rot on the vine for the last 40-50 years. For example, remember when Australia had three local car manufacturers? Three! Now none (since 2017). An automotive industry supports all kinds of spinoff industries and SMEs that are then in a good position to adapt to new innovative needs - unfortunately that base just isn't there any more.

20 - 30 years ago, Australia led the work with solar panel tech. But because nobody cared to invest locally, now we buy them from China. Australia used to lead the world in photonics (e.g. optical fibre, broadband etc), now that expertise is overseas. Did you know that wifi, as we know it today, was originally developed in Australia? I personally remember back in the mid-1990's, marvelling at the guys from CSIRO and Uni of Western Sydney running LANs *without cables*! I could go on.

People have started re-thinking about Australia's manufacturing sector woes, especially since Scomo's "Bull in a China shop" diplomatic crisis in about 2020 and the broader dawning realisation that the world may be heading towards a new era of conflicts worldwide, and that Australia should be thinking more about self-sufficiency and capabilities rather than outsourcing all our manufacturing and expertise to countries with cheaper labour and laxer environmental laws.

OK, rant over

[danny_galaga]

I meant there is a distinct lack of encouragement of innovation. All people in all countries innovate. Some encourage it more than others. Anyway, I'm going to get the propeller manufacturer to send the bureaucrats a dissertation, plus list things like their star sign and favourite beer. Hopefully that gets me over the line...

[nitrogen_widget]

Latest hurdle I can't blame on the kit manufacturer. The authorities have never heard of the brand of propeller I'm using and are giving us a hard time. I mean, they COULD google it if they liked

http://www.p-propeller.co.za/

It's a good indication of how innovation has fallen behind in Australia...

is yours made of wood?

[Zebidee]

I meant there is a distinct lack of encouragement of innovation.

That's right and I agree. Maybe better than most!

All people in all countries innovate. Some encourage it more than others. Anyway, I'm going to get the propeller manufacturer to send the bureaucrats a dissertation, plus list things like their star sign and favourite beer. Hopefully that gets me over the line...

lol, I fully understand and appreciate. I've always been on the innovators side.

I formerly worked as one of the bureaurocrats who might have been reading, analysing and prepping briefing/responses to your correspondence ("ministerials", if addressed to the minister). For a couple of decades at all kinds of levels, mostly towards science education and innovation policy community/industry development work. Ultimately high level stuff, though not for aviation, but in other areas like general science, IT and digital economy. Apart from the technicals, is all the same though.

Responding to "ministerials" was generally considered a chore, to be farmed out. Just like washing dishes, everyone got their share. It was very rare that such correspondence, on its own, resulted in any significant action. A well targeted ministerial might be enough to get a propeller cleared past regulations, with some other work, but you need more than this to get anything significant done.

So summary is, the beers (or some coffees) can help   Getting bureaucrats onside isn't the endgame, but sure can help grease the wheels. When they see your correspondence they'll know what to do with it, and any appropriate recommendations to make to decision makers. I've had many great free lunches in service of a better understanding of emerging technologies and social and industry development needs   

All joking aside, forwarding them that link might help, but I'm guessing you've done that already  http://www.p-propeller.co.za/

[danny_galaga]

Oh yes, I re-watch Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister from time to time. Apparently it's a pretty good insight into how bureaucracy works 😄

It is curious though that the organisation responsible for my aircraft, who aren't a government organisation, seem to be filled with in-curious types. If I wss in that position and saw a propeller brand I'd never heard of, out of my own interest in the subject I'd google it. But then again,I've lost interest in my own project so I can't really be upset if others aren't ecstatic about it 😄

[danny_galaga]

Latest hurdle I can't blame on the kit manufacturer. The authorities have never heard of the brand of propeller I'm using and are giving us a hard time. I mean, they COULD google it if they liked

http://www.p-propeller.co.za/

It's a good indication of how innovation has fallen behind in Australia...

is yours made of wood?

Yes. I bought it because it looks so pretty in a clear finish ☺️. Funnily enough, if I bought a propeller from one of the biggest manufacturers - Sensenich, for this size it would also be made of wood, but it's painted so you wouldn't know. Or should I say you WOODEN know 😃

[Zebidee]

Oh yes, I re-watch Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister from time to time. Apparently it's a pretty good insight into how bureaucracy works 😄

Essential viewing for all graduate trainees

Most of us would cheer on Bernard. His look of bewilderment is quite familiar lol.

It is curious though that the organisation responsible for my aircraft, who aren't a government organisation, seem to be filled with in-curious types. If I wss in that position and saw a propeller brand I'd never heard of, out of my own interest in the subject I'd google it. But then again,I've lost interest in my own project so I can't really be upset if others aren't ecstatic about it 😄

Government's don't have a monopoly on dull folk, administrators are rarely adventurers, and a job is a job. Bet few of the admin staff even own a plane. This might be a good thing - you probably don't want people with strong imaginations in relatively boring jobs.

[danny_galaga]

Yes, poor Bernard! 

Mind you, one of the things I appreciate about the series, that maybe some people don't see is that it reveals how much the Westminster system operates in 'grey' areas, not black and white. And that in fact, is a good thing because it has quite a remarkable flexibility. The absurdity is the comedy, but it is also about as good as it gets in a fair democracy.
Oh, and by god, watching it again and seeing how Jim Hacker becomes Prime Minister, it really predicts Scott Morrison doesn't it? How they both 'Steven Bradbury-d' into power 

[danny_galaga]

I now have a test flight certificate 🙂

[bobbyb13]

Congrats!
So the saga may continue...
Given that holiday mayhem is about to reach a crescendo in many places, what are prospects for getting her off the ground?

[nitrogen_widget]

I now have a test flight certificate 🙂

you need to live stream that.

[danny_galaga]

Congrats!
So the saga may continue...
Given that holiday mayhem is about to reach a crescendo in many places, what are prospects for getting her off the ground?

Approximately zero to none.

[danny_galaga]

I have quotes from several insurers now. At today's rates, it's approximately 2700 USD

[Zebidee]

For a year? What does that cover (comprehensive, third party, etc)? If the hanger burns down do you get enough for a new plane? What if it floods out? There is often a distinction between storm and flood coverage. Premiums for natural disasters seem to have gone through the roof.

What do you require legally?

[danny_galaga]

So my plane is registered with RA AUS. They have their own system..you pay yearly rego, like a car. Civil aviation you only pay (once) to get the call sign and then the rest is up to you. Same with licence. In civil aviation, once you have the licence, you have it forever. With Ra Aus, it's a yearly renewal.

Like a car, there is third party liability. I think it's 20 million . BUT, only 250k for passenger injury/death. As you can imagine that's not much at all. So the generally recommended thing is to get 5 million to cover the passenger, and then also cover the cost of the plane. One guy I talked to said his plane is maybe 250k, he has it 40% insured, enough to get him.a cheaper plane if his gets written off. I've insured mine for 70k AUD, which is like 53 cents American 😄

Plane cover is for any circumstance as far as I can tell.i understand that insurance are effing a holes when it comes to your house and floods versus flooding. That was really driven home after the floods here in Brisbane. But for an airplane, much like a car it can be damaged in so many different ways. It's just covered.

[Zebidee]

Well, this is topical. Hopefully he had his insurance paid-up. Won't make much difference to him of course (pilot dead), but at least the surviving passenger can make a claim on it:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-12-29/plane-crash-mcintyres-airfield-palmers-island-yamba-nsw/104769362

[danny_galaga]

Yes, heard about it. I believe he was flying a Bearhawk, similar style of aircraft as mine, but bigger. Was probably on the civil register so don't know about insurance in case.

[danny_galaga]

https://youtube.com/shorts/zpo6QiACkg0?si=zxWHDobw1gQNNw_r

[Zebidee]

It lives!

[pbj]

Didn’t think I would live to see it.  Congrats!

 

[nitrogen_widget]

https://youtube.com/shorts/zpo6QiACkg0?si=zxWHDobw1gQNNw_r

You built an airplane and flew it.
that's very cool.
If i knew you in person you would be right next to my HS friend with art in the Disney museum when it comes to coolest people i know.

[danny_galaga]

Not me flying it. But soon I hope

[nitrogen_widget]

Not me flying it. But soon I hope

then you are only partially cool until you fly it. 

[danny_galaga]

Not me flying it. But soon I hope

then you are only partially cool until you fly it. 

 

[pbj]

Why aren’t you flying it?

[danny_galaga]

The convention for inexperienced pilots is to get say the first five hours flown by an experienced test pilot, then he shows you the ropes and you fly the rest..it needs 25 hours test flying before it gets full certification.

The kicker is, I just totally gave up on everything last year. my licence just expired. But I just did a flight with an instructor so I can get current again.

[whammoed]

Dang mang!  Who do you get that's crazy enough to fly some plane someone else built!  Is his nickname Crash?

[pbj]

Dang mang!  Who do you get that's crazy enough to fly some plane someone else built!  Is his nickname Crash?

Randy Quaid?

[danny_galaga]

😄

He owns a workshop. After I went through every page in the build manual to check for errors, I taxied it over to his hangar and two of his guys spent pretty much the whole day going through it.

Remember, all aircraft are built by 'someone'. Although I get what you mean. They found almost nothing wrong. The main guy said he's seen worse on factory built aircraft 😯

So that was nice 🙂

[danny_galaga]

.

[Zebidee]

Very handsome! The plane I mean

[RandyT]

That had to be an exciting day for you.  Congrats!

[danny_galaga]

Thanks! Hopefully I get to fly my own aircraft soon!

[danny_galaga]

Well, today I got to fly in my plane, as a passenger. It wasn't scary at all ☺️

This is the only photo of today. Too busy learning and enjoying for pics in the air

[whammoed]

Well, today I got to fly in my plane, as a passenger. It wasn't scary at all ☺️

This is the only photo of today. Too busy learning and enjoying for pics in the air

Did some harvesting on the landing eh?

[Zebidee]

Flying low to avoid radar while lining up the bouncing bomb

Well, today I got to fly in my plane, as a passenger. It wasn't scary at all ☺️

This is the only photo of today. Too busy learning and enjoying for pics in the air

Did some harvesting on the landing eh?

[danny_galaga]

Flying low to avoid radar while lining up the bouncing bomb

Well, today I got to fly in my plane, as a passenger. It wasn't scary at all ☺️

This is the only photo of today. Too busy learning and enjoying for pics in the air

Did some harvesting on the landing eh?

Actually it's a similar plane, and same engine as those Ukrainian planes theyve been turning into one way bomb drones. So under Ruskie radar is the name of the game 😄

[Santoro]

Back here for the first time in a long time, this is really cool Danny!

[danny_galaga]

Thanks 🙂

Sadly I'm thinking I might sell it. I feel I may have lost my nerve flying in general.

[pbj]

Glad to see you aren't dead.  I was beginning to wonder.  What happened?

[danny_galaga]

I had to get back up to speed with my flying. Went to a flying  school. Did six hours and feel I barely scraped through . To put it in perspective, when I started flying again about 7 years ago, I hadn't flown in over 15 years. It took me six hours to 're solo'. I feel I've kinda painted myself into a corner with my plane.

[nipsmg]

It's amazing how quickly flying skills degrade.  I've got like 200 hours now, but when I was at about 150 I didn't fly for like a month, then got back up for some pattern work and was completely out of whack -- sensations felt foreign, was anxious about landing.. etc..   

I love that at least in the US, you can drop it for a while and just get a new flight review and pick it back up -- it's a lifetime cert.  The medical certification on the other hand.... that can ground you.

[Zebidee]

Is always hard getting back into things, and is natural for enthusiasm levels to feel a little low at times.

I've always wanted to fly, surely would have loved it, but never took the steps (money, time) to learn. So I get some vicarious enjoyment following your efforts. I'm just impressed that you did another six hours re-familiarising   

Good things require dedication, discipline and effort.

[danny_galaga]

It's amazing how quickly flying skills degrade.  I've got like 200 hours now, but when I was at about 150 I didn't fly for like a month, then got back up for some pattern work and was completely out of whack -- sensations felt foreign, was anxious about landing.. etc..   

I love that at least in the US, you can drop it for a while and just get a new flight review and pick it back up -- it's a lifetime cert.  The medical certification on the other hand.... that can ground you.

There are a number of licences nowadays. Yours is probably GA. Which I used to have. The licence is forever and if you haven't done X number of take offs and landings in the last 90 days you need to have a check flight with an instructor.
I converted to an ultralight licence. I think internationally it might be called 'light sports '. Only small differences around the world. For instance in Australia you are allowed constant speed propellers, but not in the US.

With this licence you only need a biannual flight review. This is where it all fell apart for me. I hadn't flown for about five weeks when my instructor died. I was getting rusty. I was going to fly with him the following week. Then I got depressed about it and didn't fly for another six months. I went to a different airfield because after my instructors crash the school closed down. Different airfield, TOTALLY different aircraft, different instructor of course. And because of new noise abatement rules at that airfield, really tight right hand circuits. I did two flights and felt like I'd never flown before! That left me even more depressed.

Then finally my plane was finished and ready for test flying. My BFR was due and in essence I hadn't flown for a year. I found a different school, with better aircraft, and a less ---smurfy--- airfield. Why I didn't pick that first I don't know. I did six flights with this guy. I barely scraped through. He passed me and I should have been happy, but it was hollow because I was struggling with something I should have breezed through.

BUT GOOD NEWS!

I finally went for a flight with the mechanic in my plane again, and it's going to be fine. I was worried I wasn't going to be able to log hours on my plane while flying with the test pilot. He said you can, and he will recommend putting me on the test schedule. So hopefully within a few weeks I will be able to fly on my own, in my own airplane ☺️

Yesterdays flight was good. I did all the flying. Pretty much touch and goes, bearing in mind other than the previous two brief flights with him where I was in the passenger seat, I hadn't flown a tail dragger for about five years! Last landing got messy though, because he pointed out the head temperature gauge had climbed rapidly and we should get down as soon as possible. So that put a bit of a panic into the situation. Afterwards I found the sensor wire was intermittently grounding. Which I've fixed. A good lesson to learn with an expert next to me. ALWAYS fly the plane! It'll still fly if the engine stops.

So I think the emotional rollercoaster has finally stopped and I'm looking forward to getting the 25 hours  test flight period out of the way 🙂

[nitrogen_widget]

Well allright.

[Howard_Casto]

So we keep hearing about these flights via a forum post.   Since they aren't any pics, video or visual evidence of any kind the law of the internet says it didn't happen.   

[danny_galaga]

So we keep hearing about these flights via a forum post.   Since they aren't any pics, video or visual evidence of any kind the law of the internet says it didn't happen.

😄

[danny_galaga]

Urghhh. This is the third weekend we couldn't fly. Weather has been all over the place. Today was nice weather for it, but there's been so much rain the field was too waterlogged. That's the problem with grass strips.

Very frustrating.

[danny_galaga]

Finally got another flight in with the mechanic. He's recommending my name be put on the test paperwork. Then I'm officially a test pilot 😀

[danny_galaga]

I am now flying this on my own. So far I've put around 9 hours on it on my own. Mechanic put an hour or so on it initially, and several hours with me. So there's about ten hours minimum left before we can submit the test paperwork to make the plane fully registered.

So you can now tell people you know a test pilot 😁

[CheffoJeffo]

 
Awesomesauce Danny!

[whammoed]

righteous