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Author Topic: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?  (Read 1998 times)

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renatopdalencar

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[Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« on: November 15, 2019, 04:38:30 pm »
Hello there!

I need indications for the best options available at the moment to connect my PC using CRT Emudriver and a graphics card with VGA output to my consumer Sony CRT with component input. By best I mean the ones with superior video quality. Lots of people talk about the Retrotek VGACTV1, but I can't find it anywhere. I saw people praising the Audio Authority 9A60 as an even better option, but it has been discontinued and the only one I could find on eBay is in the UK and doesn't seem to ship to Brazil.

I ask this because I got a Jasnet (brazilian company) VGA to Component transcoder which was made with CRT Emudriver in mind, but something is very wrong with it. When the transcoder is plugged to a power outlet, I get a very purple tint on the screen even with the PC turned off, instead of the usual black. And when I turn the PC on, things get worse, as you can see by the images attached.

Thank you in advance!



« Last Edit: November 15, 2019, 05:07:02 pm by renatopdalencar »

buttersoft

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2019, 10:03:48 pm »
Ok, a purple tint can be an indication that a device has been set to component input and you’re feeding it VGA input. A green tint is the reverse.

Your second pic might be the main problem though. If this screen is stable, not rolling either vertically or horizontally, then three side-by-side images indicates a 45kHz input to a 15kHz screen. Three horizontal sync circuitry is only fast enough to catch every third sync pulse at that rate. Two side-by-side images would be 31kHz.

You should follow Calamity’s guide to installing crt_emudriver to the letter, first making sure to find the right version of crt_emudriver for your OS and video card, and then the right guide because there are two.

I’m not sure if this is affecting the colours, but I would try to fix this first. The guy who makes the retrotek stuff is reputedly a bit crabby. I would suggest looking on the shmups hardware forums as there are lots more listed there, like Mike Chi’s unit, Lunxbot3000’s unit, or the J-rok, to get you started. I’ve never heard anything against the Jasnet one though, so I’d say get a single stable image up on the screen first, and the email whoever sold you the jasnet transcoder for tech support if you can’t get it to work.

To that end, what cable are you using, have you swapped some of the inputs around?
« Last Edit: November 17, 2019, 10:07:42 pm by buttersoft »

fuchi_jeg

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2019, 11:48:11 am »
https://www.retrotekshop.com/products?pn=VGACTV2
Vgactv1 is now vgactv2, and no longer on Ebay. As far as I know they are only available through his website now. I have the vgactv1 and have had no issues with it. I've read some criticism that it has some power issues, and some other complaints, but it has been solid for me.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 11:52:11 am by fuchi_jeg »

renatopdalencar

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2019, 12:23:16 pm »
Ok, a purple tint can be an indication that a device has been set to component input and youíre feeding it VGA input. A green tint is the reverse.

Your second pic might be the main problem though. If this screen is stable, not rolling either vertically or horizontally, then three side-by-side images indicates a 45kHz input to a 15kHz screen. Three horizontal sync circuitry is only fast enough to catch every third sync pulse at that rate. Two side-by-side images would be 31kHz.

You should follow Calamityís guide to installing crt_emudriver to the letter, first making sure to find the right version of crt_emudriver for your OS and video card, and then the right guide because there are two.

Iím not sure if this is affecting the colours, but I would try to fix this first. The guy who makes the retrotek stuff is reputedly a bit crabby. I would suggest looking on the shmups hardware forums as there are lots more listed there, like Mike Chiís unit, Lunxbot3000ís unit, or the J-rok, to get you started. Iíve never heard anything against the Jasnet one though, so Iíd say get a single stable image up on the screen first, and the email whoever sold you the jasnet transcoder for tech support if you canít get it to work.

To that end, what cable are you using, have you swapped some of the inputs around?

I was following a different tutorial. Now having followed Calamity's tutorial as you said for HD5000+ cards (mine is a R7 350) the problems are almost gone: no more purple tint or tripled image. The thing is now when I boot up and up until the login screen the image looks fine, but after I login to Windows, the image starts to shake a lot. Why could that be?

Please take a look:

« Last Edit: November 19, 2019, 12:31:53 pm by renatopdalencar »

buttersoft

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2019, 11:22:57 pm »
When you plug a different video source into the TV, a game console or whatever, is the picture perfectly stable? Have you tried both enabling and disabling composite sync in crt_emudriver? Have you tried going into the TV's service menu and adjusting... I don't know what the horizontal hold adjustment on these is called. Maybe phase? (if you're going to go into the service menu, be careful, and write down all the settings before you change them, and make sure you can go back.)

renatopdalencar

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2019, 07:13:31 pm »
When you plug a different video source into the TV, a game console or whatever, is the picture perfectly stable? Have you tried both enabling and disabling composite sync in crt_emudriver? Have you tried going into the TV's service menu and adjusting... I don't know what the horizontal hold adjustment on these is called. Maybe phase? (if you're going to go into the service menu, be careful, and write down all the settings before you change them, and make sure you can go back.)

Hi buttersoft. As I'm writing this, I'm using a PlayStation 3 on the same TV,  same component in and component cables for 1 hour straight and absolutely no problems whatsoever. The only difference is that I'm using the PS3 with a SCART to Component converter instead of the VGA to Component with the PC. The image is perfectly stable.

When using the PC with crt_emudriver and VGA to Component trancoder, enabling composite sync caused the image to slowly roll up, nonstop. If I disable it again, it stops rolling but goes back to the usual distortion. I tried a new VGA to Component trancoder but the everything stays the same.

I really don't know what to do, this is so frustrating...

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2019, 07:21:29 pm »
I'm using - "CRT Emudriver & CRT Tools 2.0 beta 15 (Adrenalin 18.5.1 for GCN* cards) for Windows 10 64-bits" with a R7 350 and Windows 10 64-bits. Maybe if I try - "CRT Emudriver & CRT Tools 2.0 beta 15 (Crimson 16.2.1 for GCN* cards) for Windows 7/8/10 64-bits" it could help in some way? In that case, how could I change versions?

renatopdalencar

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2019, 08:17:06 pm »
After having the PS3 on for about 3 hours, I noticed that the distortion occurs for very brief moments and very rarely, as opposed to when I use the PC, where they occur right after I turn it on and all the time. I don't know what the difference is. I'll take the TV to a repair shop to have a check, but anyway there's a clear difference between the PC and PS3, so maybe there's still something related to software.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2019, 09:12:04 pm by renatopdalencar »

buttersoft

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2019, 10:21:58 pm »
Hmmm, you might try the service menu first. do you have a model number for the set?

renatopdalencar

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2019, 11:28:07 pm »
Yes. It's a Sony Wega Trinitron KV-29FA210, it uses the BA-5D chassis. I found the service manual but only in portuguese and Spanish, so I imagine they're of no use to you. I know how to get to the service menu.

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2019, 05:11:58 pm »
Try these parameters, slowly, one at a time, making sure not to save anything until you're 100% sure any adjustment is ok:
HBLK
LBLK
RBLK
HDW
HOSC
HSS
HTSW

and maybe some of the settings in the VP2 category as well.

The theory here is that horizontal blanking adjustment can affect how black levels and colour are captured or seen by the set. This might be the problem, but it's a long shot.

renatopdalencar

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2020, 01:32:59 pm »
Hello again! So, I messed with those parameters to no luck. I left a Super Nintendo plugged through component to the TV for 4 hours and got no distortion at all. Do you think maybe my graphics card (Sapphire R7 350), is the problem? I mean, it's on the compatibility list but who knows. Maybe changing the crt_emudriver version (there are 2 available for the R7 350) would give some result?

What I find odd is that when plugged to a LG CRT, the same setup produces no distortion. And as I said before, the Sony CRT with a Super Nintendo also produces no distortion. Only when I use the PC with the Sony CRT.

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2020, 11:32:42 pm »
Hmmm, some consumer Sonys are known to be a bit picky with Sync, mostly older ones, but i can't think of anything else it could be. You could buy a different converter, but there's no guarantee it would work any better. Maybe something like an Extron, those tend to clean things up pretty nicely in the sync department. Don't ask me which Extron though, there are tons, and all slightly different. You'd need to figure out what you could cable to what to plug everything in. And even then, it's not a guaranteed fix.

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2020, 10:59:46 am »
Yeah, I will try everything I can. In case I want to change my R7 350 (never heard of anyone using crt_emudriver with it) for a HD5450, what process should I go through to change the crt_emudriver version?

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2020, 11:54:30 pm »
I wouldn't expect shifting to a 5450 would make much change. But they are cheap.

You might not need to reinstall anything, save Atom15 on the new card. The driver might just find the 5450 and work. Otherwise read the compatibility lists on calamity's forum - http://geedorah.com/eiusdemmodi/forum/index.php

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2020, 10:55:45 pm »
I just noticed CRT Emudriver identifies my R7 350 card as a M375X, which is a mobile/notebook card. Do you think this may have something to do with it?

I guess just installing an HD5450 won't work, since I'm using "Beta 15 (Adrenalin 18.5.1 for GCN* cards)", which isn't compatible with the HD5450. The most recent version available for the HD5450 is "Beta 15 (Crimson 16.2.1 non-GCN* cards)".

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2020, 12:25:32 am »
Buttersoft has far more wisdom to offer here than I ever will but I can say I had real problems trying to get a Sapphire 5450 to work properly myself.

Multiple drive wipes and new windows OS and drivers installs and still- desktop resolution issues or plain old blank screens.
Never worked it out with that card in fact.  Not great on the Philips CRT in one cabinet and useless for any of my Trinitrons in another.

It's important to realize that EVERY setup winds up different and there are no guarantees unless you run EXACTLY the same thing someone else has success with in exactly the same way I think.

Trial and error (with a fair amount of patience) appears to be the only other way.

I've had great luck however with an ATI HD 7670 (4gb one) using CRTemudriver which runs through an Extron VSC 500 with component out.
On a Windows 10 pc.
That Extron has a lot of adjustment to help get things right.
Although not absolutely perfect it is pretty good for using a consumer TV that isn't rgb modded.

The Retrotek mentioned before might be even easier to use than the Extron.
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renatopdalencar

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2020, 12:57:01 am »
Buttersoft has far more wisdom to offer here than I ever will but I can say I had real problems trying to get a Sapphire 5450 to work properly myself.

Funny you should say that, because my graphics card is also made by Sapphire. I will try an HD 5450 from a different manufacturer and see what happens.

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Re: [Please Help] Best VGA to Component option?
« Reply #18 on: March 11, 2020, 08:33:57 pm »
I have a 4350 once that was really ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---. It's output was just dim and blurry wish dull colours. I switched to a 5450 and the change was massive. I've since changed again to more powerful cards, but that difference was all about that one ---smurfy--- 4350. So i guess some cards might be a bit rubbish.