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Author Topic: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?  (Read 2306 times)

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badhairday

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Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« on: October 20, 2019, 07:47:56 am »
https://www.ebay.com/itm/123823470277?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&fromMakeTrack=true

Link leads to a SONY 36" FD Trinitron WEGA Flat Screen.   For sale for $150. 

I would like my monitor to have the same look as those from 1980-1982.  Think: Galaxian, Defender, Dig Dug, Joust, Tron, Zaxxon. 

Weight isn't a factor (the cabinet will never move after it's built) and I have a gimbal that will allow me to rotate the screen from horizontal to vertical orientation.  It is meant for a CRT between 35 and 40 inches, and I don't see why I shouldn't use it.  My budget allows a few to several hundred on the monitor.  Naturally, I want to buy something in good working condition, but I have a good back up plan- my dad was a technician for IBM in the 70's, 80's and 90's.  He can repair pretty much any issue on any CRT monitor.  I'm not going to buy a cheap monitor and then ask him to refurbish it, but if I buy a good working monitor and some component fails, he will be able to fix it.  He can also help me with any technical issues in setting up a new computer issuing a video signal to a 15KHz monitor. 

I don't have his knowledge, but I understand some (most?) of the specifications for monitors.  But my question is pretty straightforward at this point: 

Is that KV-36HS500 the right monitor for what I am looking for?  If not, why not and what should I be looking for? 

Thanks.  BHD

Finding the RIGHT monitor will be one of the hardest parts.  38" plus/minus 3", 4:3,  giving the same look as a 1982 video arcade monitor.    I already have a gimbal to mount it into a (heavy duty) cabinet.

Mike A

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2019, 08:40:58 am »
If you are building a cab to play arcade games from the early 80's, that is the wrong choice. Go get a 19 inch arcade CRT. The games you listed were all played on an arcade monitor. If you need a bigger screen then go with a 25 inch arcade CRT.

The TV you linked to weighs 230 pounds. That weight IS a factor. I can't imagine a practical way to build a cab with a 230 pound rotating monitor.

badhairday

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2019, 10:28:49 am »
I have the gimbal.  I can take the shell off the TV and assemble the gimbal around the TV before mounting it into the (heavy duty) cabinet.  I didn't say it was going to be easy, but I can assure you: weight isn't an issue. 

I want a thirty-some inch screen for another reason as well.  Scaling.  A twelve year old in 1983 was only 80% the height of the cabinet.  When I finish this (hopefully the summer of 2020, but if it's the summer of 2021 I'm okay with that) then I should still be 80% of the height of the cabinet.  And since I have the gimbal, it's just inviting me to scale up the size of the monitor as well. 
Finding the RIGHT monitor will be one of the hardest parts.  38" plus/minus 3", 4:3,  giving the same look as a 1982 video arcade monitor.    I already have a gimbal to mount it into a (heavy duty) cabinet.

pbj

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2019, 10:38:47 am »
Offer him $50, He’ll take it
This forum needs more threads about Arcade 1Up cabinets.

Mike A

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2019, 11:40:43 am »
Good luck with your build.

wp34

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2019, 01:52:48 pm »
If I recall we had that same TV.  It is HD but doesn't have HDMI.  I considered using it for my first cabinet.  We hooked MAME up to it (using RCA inputs) and the kids and I tested it in the living room.  It was way too big for what I wanted and I ended up going with a 27" arcade monitor instead.  It seems like it did produce a nice picture though.

I want a thirty-some inch screen for another reason as well.  Scaling.  A twelve year old in 1983 was only 80% the height of the cabinet.  When I finish this (hopefully the summer of 2020, but if it's the summer of 2021 I'm okay with that) then I should still be 80% of the height of the cabinet.  And since I have the gimbal, it's just inviting me to scale up the size of the monitor as well. 

This is an interesting goal.  Whenever someone mentions they are trying to recreate the feeling of being in an arcade BITD the issue of scale pops into my head for the same reasons you mention.  Seems like you would have to have buttons and joysticks that were slightly larger as well.  Dunno.  Interesting thought exercise anyway.

Good luck and make sure you post your build here.   :cheers:







badhairday

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2019, 02:22:34 pm »
Large buttons, LOL.  You're right, that would add to it. 

When I stand in front of a Defender game nowadays, I have to wear a ballcap so the glare from the marquee isn't directly into my eyes.  All my memories of games are of me having my head a little into the cabinet to minimize the light and noise distractions.  Galaga and Pac Man were the best for that, as the monitor was closer to being flat with the ground. 

I'm not worried whether the seller of that particular TV will sell it for any particular price. 

I want to know what monitors that are in the size of 35 to 40 inches will faithfully reproduce the look of a 1982 video game monitor. 


Finding the RIGHT monitor will be one of the hardest parts.  38" plus/minus 3", 4:3,  giving the same look as a 1982 video arcade monitor.    I already have a gimbal to mount it into a (heavy duty) cabinet.

Mike A

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2019, 03:09:53 pm »
That is a flat screen. The games you listed were played on arcade monitors with curved screens. It will not faithfully reproduce the look of a 1982 video game monitor.

buttersoft

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2019, 07:17:51 pm »
If that thing really is capable of 1080i then it's going to upscale your 240p/15kHz input. It might look ok, but it won't look as nice as an older, curved 15kHZ only model - a standard definition model, in other words. A big old panasonic, NEC, mitsubishi or JVC might be a better bet, will be cheaper, and will also have a simpler chassis to work on when it comes to repairs. And will probably fit your gimbal better.

Upscaling also adds a bit of lag - you might not notice, but then again you might. I would suggest getting the monitor working and set up and first and trying a few games on it before buying, building or modifying anything else. What were you planning to run games from? A PC, a console, a multiboard like a Pandora, original hardware? And how were you planning to connect it to the CRT?

badhairday

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2019, 10:40:03 pm »
Yes, I would want the 15KHz only model, then.  Thanks Buttersoft. 

I figure to have a computer run MAME.  I am still trying to learn what kind of hardware and software I would need to connect the PC to the monitor. 

 This forum seems to deal mostly with troubleshooting and repairing monitors.  Where can I go to get a more basic education on what the technology is behind different monitors and the TV signal.  I'm 50 years old and my dad was a tech for IBM so we had computers in the home before anyone else.  But my memory is so fuzzy on the details.  I remember CGA, EGA and VGA being important, but I just can't place where those acronyms (and SO many others) all fit into helping me find the best picture and monitor for my cabinet. 

For instance, I realize that a 19" monitor in use in 1982 produces an image that covers 440 square inches.  If I buy a 40" monitor,  that will have just under 2,000 square inches of screen.  There will have to be a lot of...  I forget.  Is it overscan/underscan, magnification, or what? 
« Last Edit: October 21, 2019, 10:53:21 pm by badhairday »
Finding the RIGHT monitor will be one of the hardest parts.  38" plus/minus 3", 4:3,  giving the same look as a 1982 video arcade monitor.    I already have a gimbal to mount it into a (heavy duty) cabinet.

Mr. Peabody

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2019, 04:05:04 pm »
A twelve year old in 1983 was only 80% the height of the cabinet.  When I finish this (hopefully the summer of 2020, but if it's the summer of 2021 I'm okay with that) then I should still be 80% of the height of the cabinet.

Haven't heard that in a while.....

Anyways....
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 05:38:28 pm by Mr. Peabody »

buttersoft

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2019, 07:05:51 pm »
To be clear about my post above, 1080i or HD CRT's are great for certain uses, but if you're planning to run 15kHz 240p games (which basically covers 99% of arcade games made before the year 2000) then you can't beat an old 15kHz SD display.

As for a more information about what you're doing:
https://www.aussiearcade.com/showthread.php/87668-A-guide-to-connecting-your-Windows-PC-to-an-SD-CRT-TV-PVM-or-Arcade-Monitor

Nothing wrong with a little shameless promotion, right?

And my word that ArcadeControls wiki is really slipping out of date! The convergence guide is great, about the best i've seen, but the rest of it, hoo boy. It's still recommending soft15kHz and ArcadeVGA's without any caveats and with no mention of anything newer. I mean come on, crt_emudriver and GroovyMAME have their own subforum on here for Pete's sake.

« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 08:53:31 pm by buttersoft »

Mr. Peabody

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2019, 03:10:31 pm »
@buttersoft: apparently few visit the Wiki, and no one writes for it.

Vigo

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2019, 03:21:57 pm »
I think because it was down for a while.  :dunno

Arroyo

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Re: Buy this TV? Or one just like it?
« Reply #14 on: October 25, 2019, 08:22:30 am »
Buttersoft’s write up on the Aussie Arcade is really helpful in starting out (one of my first reads on the subject).  Gives you a great overview of the connections and hardware needed to get a good clean picture.

I would also parrot MikeA’s comment.  Part of reason to consider a smaller tube is:

1.). Almost no arcade cabinets had screens larger than 25” (there are some exceptions of course).  This affects the esthetics and design if you are trying to build something closer to what original arcades looked like.  Once the screen gets too big you have to more dramatically alter the look.  Rotating it introduce all other kinds of problems including needing to degauss the screen on rotation.

2.) Maybe most important, those games from the 80’s were lower resolution and when you blowing them up onto a larger screen you start noticing it a lot more.  Also most of those games were about speed of gameplay and once the screen becomes large enough it gets harder for your eyes to track everything when you have to scan the screen as opposed to being able to see the whole picture in your field of vision.  Try playing some Williams games like Defender or Robotron and you’ll see what I mean.

I get where you are coming from.  I long maintained that bigger is better, but have come to understand that really these games were designed for certain screen sizes and of course controls, and deviating from that introduces problems.  Also while I understand a 19” sounds small, might even look small if you set it up at home, when you are playing it in a cabinet and your eyes are only 24” from it, all of the sudden it doesn’t feel so small.