The SquareVision Max cabinet

[leapinlew]

I love the re-purposed monitor/marquee in the "sort of japanese" style cabinet. We had talked about this years ago. See here: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,70626.msg723874.html I think a tempest shaped cabinet would look good, but may look kinda funny with a multi-control panel deck.

My 2 cents.... you should verify that the screen size you are considering isn't too big when you are standing close to it. I love a big screen, but I don't want to pan my head to see everything on the screen. Your designs all look good.

[markiej]

My 2 cents.... you should verify that the screen size you are considering isn't too big when you are standing close to it. I love a big screen, but I don't want to pan my head to see everything on the screen. Your designs all look good.

Thanks!!

Actually, I decided to start doing a detailed design specifically because of my testing of the screen/resolution in question - it looked really really really good - thanks to HLSL and the good blacks of the TV.  The result is (roughly) like a 25" diagonal CRT (in both vertical and horizontal mode.  I took some pictures which hardly do it justice.

[leapinlew]

My 2 cents.... you should verify that the screen size you are considering isn't too big when you are standing close to it. I love a big screen, but I don't want to pan my head to see everything on the screen. Your designs all look good.

Thanks!!

Actually, I decided to start doing a detailed design specifically because of my testing of the screen/resolution in question - it looked really really really good - thanks to HLSL and the good blacks of the TV.  The result is (roughly) like a 25" diagonal CRT (in both vertical and horizontal mode.  I took some pictures which hardly do it justice.

Awesome! I really like how the classics looked. I'm a big fan of using flat panels and if we can get it to look like the real deal, that's sweeeet.

[Laythe]

Leapinlew -

If the display does end up any larger than you want, ergonomically, a square field does bezels *awesomely* well.  And with a 4k one, keeping the instruction text readable will be a cinch.  So, you can set the screensize to whatever is comfortable - per game if you like.

[zestyphresh]

This is good timing - i've been a (very!) long time lurker and have been picking up the various components I need to build something similar to this having been inspired by all the other amazing square screen projects.

I've got a similarly sized screen but it has to be as shallow as reasonably possible (keeping comfort in mind) as I want to put it on our dining room (British house so not a huge amount of ft2). I haven't made a sketchup model yet but i've settled (subject to some 3d modelling) on a shallow floor and wall mount design that means the wall won't have to take all the weight but is required to stop it falling forward. In the end I settled on a marquee shape like the original Missile Command that has it on the face adjacent to the screen at a slightly shallower angle. On every design I tried a 'normal' marquee, it just looked out of proportion with such a shallow depth. Likewise the base looked equally strange perpendicular to the floor so I angled it back to the wall (not too dissimilar to some pure wall mount designs).

[markiej]

Leapinlew -

If the display does end up any larger than you want, ergonomically, a square field does bezels *awesomely* well.  And with a 4k one, keeping the instruction text readable will be a cinch.  So, you can set the screensize to whatever is comfortable - per game if you like.

Exactly!  And it's along those lines that I redesigned the cabinet from scratch (being sure to use the tips I've gleaned from this thread).  It plays my strengths as a software guy and minimize the damage I could do as "carpenter".  This cab is sit-down and slim, but most importantly, everything but the side panels is diagonal-free.  So it only has two truly challenging parts: creating side panels, and aligning the monitor just so.  Also uses a ton less materials so should be far more luggable.
.
Minor edit -  Rearranged the CP a bit for symmetry.

[yamatetsu]

Now THAT does look rather plain (ugly). It's a bit too boxy, and you went back to a very slim cab. If this was my cab, I would make it slim, but a bit more curvy, something like brlove's Marvel Cab. This shouldn't be too hard to replicate.

[markiej]

Now THAT does look rather plain (ugly).

Fair enough . I gave it a lot of thought - and Rev E wasn't going to happen - I'm all too aware of my limitations, and even though technically I could have pulled it off, in reality there were just too many kookie angles to deal with, and I know how I get when it comes to the nitty gritty - I do ok design and planning, good "heavy lifting" execution, and get super impatient on the details, especially as things drag on.  I once finished a basement almost single-handedly (from dungeon to livable), the electrical was impeccable, because it was first and most critical not to screw up.  The walls and ceiling were pretty good, all the finish stuff was really bad up close - crown molding, painting etc.  I'm the same at work .  I designed a cabinet around that, and around the monitor.  The sides will require some care, but those will be first.  Everything else is simple measurements and 90-degree angles.

But yeah, it's a simpy, but I dig it.

I love some elements of that marvel cab - especially the crazy duck leg sides.

[yamatetsu]

Going with that design, I would

- widen the sides so that the sides are consistently bigger than the insides, not just at the TV and at the front of the CP

- make a frame for the 'game screen' and the marquee so that it looks like each is a separate monitor

- round the edges of the CP front and the upper edge of the marquee (not included in the pic)



Also, since this cab is really slim, I would be worried about it tipping over.

[markc74]

I've bounced this idea around a lot before and it's definitely doable. Layout files make it a breeze too.

I'll chuck this up here - it's a similar idea but wallhanging. Could easily add a base if preferred.

[Laythe]

I am here with, just, like, my opinions, man.     I hope to give feedback without being too much of a downer.

This version against the brick wall reminds me of Monolith.

I quite liked revision E.

The square form would certainly function, and it's true that it is without a miter cut to be seen which does simplify building it, but it doesn't feel like an arcade cabinet to me.  I found E appealing, I'd want to walk up and play it.

I don't think a miter cut should be a dealbreaker - but it's up to you if it is.  It might be.  Your project is about building something you like, and this is all a hobby. 

I think a poorly made revision E with bad miters cut out by angling a jigsaw and wavily tracing the lines by hand, filled in with jointing compound after assembly and sanded, would look better than a perfectly executed build of the simplified design.  To be fair, though, I don't know how bad your carpentry is, so I can't really give you good advice.  You might be being realistic about your limitations here.

If I got a vote, and I don't, I'd say even a bad job at E is better.  But I don't get a vote, and you are the one this thing is to please.  Thanks for sharing your design process, it's been interesting reading.

I like markc74's design a lot, but I'm not sure it's easier to build than revision E was.  (That said, I like it a lot.)

[markiej]

I've bounced this idea around a lot before and it's definitely doable. Layout files make it a breeze too.

I'll chuck this up here - it's a similar idea but wallhanging. Could easily add a base if preferred.

I like it - I would have been tempted, but the 4K screen requires a PC to drive it, so it would have been hard to stuff a PC in a wall mount.  I think they're a great idea, especially because you pop a slick bar stool underneath (or a book shelf or whatever - or it's just cool as is.

I've figured out most of the secret formula for layout files - it is a breeze to do for any one game - and on progretto's snaps, I found a very good set of marquee files named after the romnames.  The challenge will be scaling it up to the thousands of games (or couple of hundred I don't hate).  Having a fallback is very handy - can just put a generic "my-boxy-mamebox" marquee for anything not bespoke.  I was thinking og some sort of script which would generate a bunch of zips based upon romnames, and insert the appropriate marquee etc.

EDITED: scratch that, I love this - it's a killer material design all around, and I just noticed you made a third "screen" where you'll have the button assignments, but perfectly aligned to your CP layout and art - brilliant!

[markiej]

I am here with, just, like, my opinions, man.     I hope to give feedback without being too much of a downer.

No worries at all - I knew it wasn't going to be a crowd-pleaser - it's a boxy little runt with a gigantic screen - reminds of toy piano.  I could really feel myself drifting into "never mind" territory once I started breaking out all the pieces of E, plus I got all excited about using the extra screen for marquee space.  I still have the sketchup model, so it might be a next cabinet if Runty McGee goes well.  And who knows - maybe with a decent paint job and some t-molding, it'll at least look like "something"

[markiej]

- widen the sides so that the sides are consistently bigger than the insides, not just at the TV and at the front of the CP
- make a frame for the 'game screen' and the marquee so that it looks like each is a separate monitor
- round the edges of the CP front and the upper edge of the marquee (not included in the pic)
- Also, since this cab is really slim, I would be worried about it tipping over.

Thanks for the tips! 

• I tried all kinds of designs where I tried to mask the boxiness by flaring the sides - and to my eyes it just shouted "I'm trying to hide the boxiness" - and I kept coming back to the subtly embracing the boxiness, for better or worse . Plus I want to be relatively flush the CP (outside of t-molding), so it's not too limiting.  My CP layout is something I'm going to do later - I think I have plenty of room to spread out.  Also as a sit-down cabinet, I'm aware of my knobby knees (the reasons the CP is short).
• I originally designed a 3/4" frame, but I know my cutting at that level of detail would make it look a little too DIY, so I opted for vesa-mounted solution, and will mask it via acrylic with a spraypainted interior frame - should look nicely separated.  And in the future, if I choose to decorate with vinyl, I could attach to posterboard and put clear acrylic over the lot.
• not sure what you mean by round in this case - I am going to put t-molding on all three surfaces, in addition to the sides, I think,  I'll see how it looks.
• I'm going rig a little something, a canvas strap or whatever, so the top is secured to a joist but I can rotate it to get to the back if I need to.  I think the only risk is if someone put a lot of weight on that part of the CP which sticks out a few inches.

[zestyphresh]

Here is the badly drawn sketch of the shape i'm looking at (The sides will scoop down to the control panel, they won't square as shown here).

[yamatetsu]

- round the edges of the CP front and the upper edge of the marquee (not included in the pic)

• not sure what you mean by round in this case - I am going to put t-molding on all three surfaces, in addition to the sides, I think,  I'll see how it looks.

The circled edges have a round shape, the edges the pointers are pointing at are at a 90 degrees angle, which looks a bit jarring side by side. Hence my advice to make those edges round, too.

Regarding the overlay board for the screen: This would add some depth to the screen, instead of looking at one huge flat area, you would have two clearly separated areas.
Cutting out the rectangles would be very easy to do using a sawboard and a jigsaw.

- mark the rectangles on the wood

- drill holes into the corners so that you have a starting point for the jigsaw

- align the sawboard with the lines

- push the jigsaw along the sawboard to cut a line

- repeat until all lines are cut

[markiej]

two minor mods, incorporating suggestions. While B has a cool look on profile, it looks dopey from other angles.  leaning toward C

[markiej]

Also - thanks to markc74 for the 3rd screen inspiration, I Mocked up a potential third screen with button information - easy to implement with MAME layouts and retroarch overlays (for things like console buttons)

[yamatetsu]

C looks best, but would benefit from a paint job like A has.

[markiej]

Here's a the official final version - just finished turning it into a cut plan.  Thanks!

[yamatetsu]

Looking good.

One question though: It looks like the CP is flat. It has been suggested a while a go to tilt it at five degrees or so, I would heartily recommend that, too. This is not only for looks, playing on a flat CP will hurt your wrists real fast. I have done a flat CP on my first cab and went to a tilted one on my second cab for this reason.

[javeryh]

Here's a gallery of pictures I took of my testing of the square resolution with MAME and HLSL.  In some of them I put in a lego guy for scale (it's really large).  I also popped in a bezel to show the actual resolution.  Worth zooming in to native resolution to see how well HLSL works with that many pixels.  (it would also probably look great with 1080x1080)
https://imgur.com/a/gGtv5JO

It is really neat to see actual pictures of this in action.  You really do get a good size playfield in both vertical and horizontal orientation.  I'm filing this away...   

[markiej]

Hi all - while I wait for the last of my tools to arrive, and still pouring over building tips and safety materials, I've made some tweaks.

• Am going with an open-frame solution.  Exposing the top ~80% of the monitor as a single screen that I'll divide up with MAME artwork.  It just allows more flexibility, and I can always attach screen borders if it doesn't look great.
  
• spent quit a bit of time concocting a modular artwork scheme, so I can pop in different marquees/bezels/control-panel-layouts.  By dimming the control panel and bezel, it makes the marquee and screen appear to glow.
  

Going to start building this weekend or next.

[Mike A]

You lost me with the open frame. Its not an arcade machine anymore. I have seen vertical cabs like that. They look like ass. You had a really good design several iterations back. It is not too late to go back.

[opt2not]

I have seen vertical cabs like that. They look like ass.

They sure do:


I'm with Mike on this one, this design is fuuuuuugly.  I get that you're trying to use the rest of the widescreen monitor as a marquee, but is the design really worth compromising for this?

[Mike A]

Bring back revision e.

[markiej]

You lost me with the open frame. Its not an arcade machine anymore. I have seen vertical cabs like that. They look like ass. You had a really good design several iterations back. It is not too late to go back.

Fair enough - to each their own .  I guess I'm focusing on making something kind of personal vs universal, built around my tastes and strengths.

[opt2not]

"build what you dig"  --Yotsuya

In the end, that's all that matters. We just try to give our advice and comments to help people consider their options. If that advice doesn't stick, oh well, it's your cab, you're stuck with it! 

[pbj]

I saw some reasonably attractive woman drop like $3-4k on one of those VPCabs at ZapCon.  I wanted to intervene so bad.

[yotsuya]

I saw some reasonably attractive woman drop like $3-4k on one of those VPCabs at ZapCon.  I wanted to intervene so bad.

God, I hate those cabs.

[lettuce]

Could you not sure mirrors position in such a way to reflect the marque and keep your original design whilst still using the top part of the LCD as a marquee?

[markiej]

Actually I contemplated testing a fresnel lens solution, which would zoom in the marquee portion of the monitor - it might have been kind of cool, or unworkable.  In the end though, I decided against the nicer-looking build only because it's too outside my expertise - nearly every edge cut is precisely angled, so it's out entirely.  I'm actually going to start building a fairly different design (let's say I was scared straight by those pictures of those horrendous vp vertical cabs - if I even remind someone slightly of those - yikes), hopefully starting tomorrow.  At least I'm picking up the lumber tomorrow.  I will post pics of it when it's underway.

[markiej]

So, the build has started...  Went a nearly completely different direction.  Figured I'd start cutting before presenting it - so I don't keep second-guessing myself and never get to it.  Presenting the "no-name sitdown cabinet with a giant 4K tv and no marquee 2000" - it does stick to the "square" bit a little - I''ll presenting the game screen in a virtual 2160x2160 square for orientation parity.  I've spent some time testing it and various artwork treatments - it really looks great, even up close (tested the screen height and viewing distance as well) - this thing will barely graze the nostalgia nerve, but it will be playable as heck, if all goes well...


bout 4' tall, 40" wide, 15" deep at base and 18" at CP

Thanks to you fine folks, I even managed to get the sides cut far better than I would have thought possible (couple very minor dings I'll try to touch up).

[Mike A]

Your control panel is still flat. That impacts playability. Angle it a few degrees.

[opt2not]

I actually prefer flat CP's to angled. It's especially necessary for sit-down cabs.  For stand-ups, especially Dynamo's, prolonged play on angled CP's always gave me wrist ache. It might be because I'm tall.

But if you're going with a sit-down style cabinet, definitely keep the CP flat.  You don't need to induce carpel tunnel if you can help it.

[Mike A]

Maybe I should pay attention. Yeah. Sit down cab should be flat. Why change to a sit down?

[markiej]

Maybe I should pay attention. Yeah. Sit down cab should be flat. Why change to a sit down

Though I have a detached house, the spaces are pretty small, and the ceilings low, and I honestly have a huge affection for japanese sitdown cabs, having been to a few arcades over there.  Plus, in the place where this will sit, it can double as a toddler "Paw Patrol" player, and allow my mantle and fireplace to look fancy. 

[Mike A]

Good reasons. I look forward to seeing this completed.

[markiej]

Good reasons. I look forward to seeing this completed.

Thanks! Me too... got everything cut out - including the bezel.  and some speaker slots.  Unlike the side-panels, they'll probably only look good in a thumbnail, but I'm still pleased - I'm easy to please these days.  Anyhow... For anyone who cares to answer...

How far from the front of the CP should the controls start - I got a lot of space to work with - it's like 14" deep, minus a little curve in front (not nearly as much as the sketchup - don't have the bit, and no more $20 bits for me just yet).  I'm not married to any particular layout - maybe this one:

[yamatetsu]

How far from the front of the CP should the controls start - I got a lot of space to work with - it's like 14" deep, minus a little curve in front (not nearly as much as the sketchup - don't have the bit, and no more $20 bits for me just yet).  I'm not married to any particular layout - maybe this one:

If you have the joysticks and the buttons: Just cut a piece of cardboard to CP-size, place your hands on the cardboard, mark the positions of your fingers of your right hand for the buttons and for the joystick, cut out the holes, put the controls in, see if it's comfortable.

If you don't have the joysticks and the buttons: Don't worry about the CP until you have them. You have plenty of things to build, you can literally put the controls in as a finishing touch.